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Nikon Z 50mm f/1.8 s - bokeh thread
- Thread starter H o g n e
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Check out the photos and tests in this thread:
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4346881
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/62087646
And
Nikon 50/1.8 S, Otus 55 on Z7; Zony 55 on a7RIII - the last word
This is one in a series of posts on the Nikon Z6 and Z7. You should be able to find all the posts about that camera in the Category List on the right sidebar, below the Articles widget. There’s a drop-down menu there that you can use to get to all the posts in this
blog.kasson.com
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I like the OOF areas in those three photosGot my 50S about one week ago, and since then, it has been a love affair
Not being a techie, I can't really "debate" about the OOF areas. At least I like to play with these...
Playing with the OOF background:
In the real world, "street" genre: shots from the hip:
For my use, I don't see what is so wrong/ugly with the "bokeh" of this lens. I find it very usable and fun to play with. As well the lens is really sharp from edge to edge even at f/1.8, and shows a nice subject "isolation" as well as a great subject "modelling and density"...
Cheers
--
I thought that blocking a user was rude but I have recently found that it is becoming a necessity. If I am not responding to some users/posts, now you know why...
anotherMike
Forum Pro
Nikon, more than any other company I can think of, tends to design some lenses that are far more tool-to-specific-task oriented, in that they really are "tuned" to one thing almost specifically, at the expense of others. Case in point of course is the extremely volatile 58/1.4 thread over in the Nikon lens forum that I believe you're in - and this type of heated argument over that particular lens has come up in several threads over the years, with the same things being said, the same people screaming, the same arrogant blowhard posters proclaiming their view is the only one that could be true and posting that view 50 times in one thread, etc, etc, etc. It's what happens when a lens lives outside the "good at many things excellent at none" kind of lines so to speak. And thus, when we talk about some Nikon lenses, we need to be aware of when a lens in consideration is one of those that was purposefully designed to a more narrow set of tasks. There are others in Nikons history - the two "DC" lenses, the 105/2 and 135/2 AF-D DC fall into that category - strongly tuned towards portraiture and "adjustable" bokeh, but not the best options for critical studio or landscape work. For some situations, nothing could be better than a DC lens, and equally so, for other situations, nothing could be more of a mismatch and thus a poor choice.
The 50/1.8S is a high performance for the money lens with a great balance of resolution and decent bokeh. It's quite a bit sharper than the 58/1.4, which while having (IMO) the best bokeh of any 50mm class lens ever made, most definitely under-performs when placed in highly resolution-centric tasks. Two entirely different lenses for two entirely different tasks. We should be glad Nikon offers us a choice (seriously, no other lens manufacturer I know of would even *dare* to do a 58/1.4G and then take the mountains of poor test chart reports/reviews for their efforts) as that means each of us can choose the lens that suits us best. For you - that's probably the 58/1.4G, for me, that would be something a lot sharper as I'm not bokeh centric. Neither of us is right, neither of is wrong in an absolute sense, but we both are right in choosing the correct lens for what we need.
The open, or perhaps, thought provoking question, however, is: what is the eventual 50/1.2 S lens going to be? I imagine it will be a more "bokeh" lens with excellent sharpness, kind of in the manner that I personally feel the 105/1.4E F mount lens is a bit superior to the 58/1.4 because it manages to be BOTH an excellent bokeh lens AND a very highly resolving lens. If someone is on the fence and can wait, the 50/1.2 S might be the lens waiting for if my guess is right, while a bokeh shooter would do with the 58/1.4G now, and a resolution centric shooter do better with the 50S or the Sigma 40 or 50mm F1.4 Art designs in F mount right now. Key again is matching tool to task, particularly when it comes to Nikon glass, since they tend to design to task more often than others.
-m
The 50/1.8S is a high performance for the money lens with a great balance of resolution and decent bokeh. It's quite a bit sharper than the 58/1.4, which while having (IMO) the best bokeh of any 50mm class lens ever made, most definitely under-performs when placed in highly resolution-centric tasks. Two entirely different lenses for two entirely different tasks. We should be glad Nikon offers us a choice (seriously, no other lens manufacturer I know of would even *dare* to do a 58/1.4G and then take the mountains of poor test chart reports/reviews for their efforts) as that means each of us can choose the lens that suits us best. For you - that's probably the 58/1.4G, for me, that would be something a lot sharper as I'm not bokeh centric. Neither of us is right, neither of is wrong in an absolute sense, but we both are right in choosing the correct lens for what we need.
The open, or perhaps, thought provoking question, however, is: what is the eventual 50/1.2 S lens going to be? I imagine it will be a more "bokeh" lens with excellent sharpness, kind of in the manner that I personally feel the 105/1.4E F mount lens is a bit superior to the 58/1.4 because it manages to be BOTH an excellent bokeh lens AND a very highly resolving lens. If someone is on the fence and can wait, the 50/1.2 S might be the lens waiting for if my guess is right, while a bokeh shooter would do with the 58/1.4G now, and a resolution centric shooter do better with the 50S or the Sigma 40 or 50mm F1.4 Art designs in F mount right now. Key again is matching tool to task, particularly when it comes to Nikon glass, since they tend to design to task more often than others.
-m
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Totally agree, that 58 thread I started has turned into a one man d**k contest which I have no interest in entertain. Aside from that, other posters has been very informative and gave me lots of useful info for me to be certain about my decision. End of the day, lens are like cars each person has their preferences.
jeremygreen
Member
I don't have images to post because I don't own the 50mm f:1.8S, but I do own the 35mm f:1.8S and the 58mm f:1.4G. The former is sharp wide open. The 58mm f:1.4G is unsharp until it's stopped down to almost f:2.8. Both look to have pretty bokeh. DP Review dissed the 50S recently based on its bokeh, but I think that's unfair and a bit eccentric.
TQGroup
Senior Member
Yeah... they had a few :-(
My expectation is that the Z 50mm f/1.2s will be sharp wide open, excel at out of focus rendering/transitions but also be just as well corrected as the current f/1.8 s. So yes, similar characteristics as the 105mm f/1.4e.
The main issue I have with the f/1.2 so far is the timing of its release (too late). But, luckily we have the f/1.8 to work with until then.
Obviously the f/1.2 size (and I am afraid also the price) will be quite different. For landscape/travel/hiking it might not be a better option but for people/portraits/events it would surely provide another dimension.
I am still getting to know this new Z 50mm f/1.8 lens but already I can say that it plays in a different league compared to previous 50mm lenses from Nikon. For me it looks to balance very well the different design considerations of such a lens.
I applaud the decision to do f/1.8 and later deliver an f/1.2 option. Even if I would wish for all its optical characteristics in an even smaller package the f/1.8 is still a lot smaller/lighter than its f/1.4 competitors (Otus and Art) and if you need to hike/walk/travel that also accounts for something. Check this image of the Z7 with the 50mm Sigma Art vs. the Z 50mm:
http://j.mp/2VucUs4
The total weight of the Art + FTZ is 945g vs. 415g for the new Z. For Z7/Z6 owners it looks to offer an excellent alternative to the Art (albeit not at f/1.4).
TQGroup
Senior Member
A spot on analysis, well presented. It will be a lens worth waiting for. Lets see, if I cut down on one cup of coffee a day...
Hogne, a single large photo will suffice. I do not understand that.
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Once upon a time, a girl with moonlight in her eyes
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I am not sure I understand what you don't understand. Does this crop help?
It shows the sharpness of the new Z 50mm f/1.8s (below) compared to the F 50mm f/1.4g (above) from the center (on the right side) to the corner (on the left side). Both lenses with apertures set at f/1.8.
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H o g n e
Critique Portfolio Pro International
Critique Portfolio Pro (CPP) is about constructive critiques, discussions, comments and feedback. Here you will interact with experienced photographers - both amateurs and professionals. Key topics are: critiques, critics, discussions, learning, constructive feedback and comments. Critique...
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James Stirling
Forum Pro
The 50Z looks to be an excellent performer . I slightly prefer the 35mm FOV but being a cheapskate the 50mm Z price appeals moreI am not sure I understand what you don't understand. Does this crop help?
It shows the sharpness of the new Z 50mm f/1.8s (below) compared to the F 50mm f/1.4g (above) from the center (on the right side) to the corner (on the left side). Both lenses with apertures set at f/1.8.
Joking aside I have my fingers crossed that the 14-30mm F/4 is a great performer as landscape is my main interest so I am holding off jumping in with the z7 till i see how the 14-30mm does. It covers a lot of the focal range I use most , looks to be compact and from the mock-ups I think it will take filters natively without the hassle of adapters. --
Jim Stirling
“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.” John Adams
Yep, I see now.I am not sure I understand what you don't understand. Does this crop help?
It shows the sharpness of the new Z 50mm f/1.8s (below) compared to the F 50mm f/1.4g (above) from the center (on the right side) to the corner (on the left side). Both lenses with apertures set at f/1.8.
It would be interesting to see how the same scene would show with the 50g on a D850.
Regards
--
Once upon a time, a girl with moonlight in her eyes
This is a 50mm f/1.4g on a sensor for most practical purposes identical to the D850 sensor. You mean the 50mm f/1.8g perhaps? I don't own it.Yep, I see now.I am not sure I understand what you don't understand. Does this crop help?
It shows the sharpness of the new Z 50mm f/1.8s (below) compared to the F 50mm f/1.4g (above) from the center (on the right side) to the corner (on the left side). Both lenses with apertures set at f/1.8.
It would be interesting to see how the same scene would show with the 50g on a D850.
--
H o g n e
Critique Portfolio Pro International
Critique Portfolio Pro (CPP) is about constructive critiques, discussions, comments and feedback. Here you will interact with experienced photographers - both amateurs and professionals. Key topics are: critiques, critics, discussions, learning, constructive feedback and comments. Critique...
www.flickr.com
The 105/1.4E is not particularly well corrected for spherical aberration, probably on purpose.
Z7 with 105/1.4 focus shift, pinpoint and single AF accuracy - the last word
This is one in a series of posts on the Nikon Z7. You should be able to find all the posts about that camera in the Category List on the right sidebar, below the Articles widget. There’s a drop-down menu there that you can use to get to all the posts in this series; just
blog.kasson.com
Can you share the original photos, full size?This is a 50mm f/1.4g on a sensor for most practical purposes identical to the D850 sensor. You mean the 50mm f/1.8g perhaps? I don't own it.Yep, I see now.I am not sure I understand what you don't understand. Does this crop help?
It shows the sharpness of the new Z 50mm f/1.8s (below) compared to the F 50mm f/1.4g (above) from the center (on the right side) to the corner (on the left side). Both lenses with apertures set at f/1.8.
It would be interesting to see how the same scene would show with the 50g on a D850.
--
Once upon a time, a girl with moonlight in her eyes
Matei H
Member
Hi Gozby! Nothing wrong with these images but IMHO the bokeh looks too busy. I'm not sure if it's the 1.8 aperture or just the lens design. Seems like a pretty sharp lens, just doesn't get me excited. I don't find enough 'character' like in the Summicron, or the Sony Zeiss 50mm 1.4 or even the Zeiss 1.8 or less sharper lenses like the 58mm 1.4 Nikon or the 50mm 1.2 Canon. And yes the super sharp Sigma seemed very clinical until I saw these images... sorry just my opinion.
--
www.mateihorvath.com
Got my 50S about one week ago, and since then, it has been a love affair
Not being a techie, I can't really "debate" about the OOF areas. At least I like to play with these...
Playing with the OOF background:
In the real world, "street" genre: shots from the hip:
Just to give an idea of the background at f/5.6, when very close to the subject
For my use, I don't see what is so wrong/ugly with the "bokeh" of this lens. I find it very usable and fun to play with. As well the lens is really sharp from edge to edge even at f/1.8, and shows a nice subject "isolation" as well as a great subject "modelling and density"...
Cheers
--
www.mateihorvath.com
Felipe Rodríguez
Senior Member
I'm really tempted by this lens (currently I only have one native Z lens, the 24-70), but, the more samples I see, the more I'm convinced that bokeh is not its strongest point. For example, I find the Sony Zeiss 55 1.8 bokeh far better, and I don't think it's because of the slightly longer focal length. But bokeh isn't everything (in spite of the sign I've had here many years now and of owning a Noctilux) and it's many times overrated. The 50Z 1.8 lens seems a stellar performer, no matter how good (or bad) bokeh it could deliver...
--
http://www.felipe-rodriguez.com
Bokeh
Dadme un mundo sin contornos,
Un espacio feliz que ignore los perfiles.
Concededme, sí, la dicha redonda
De flotar sin conciencia en el fondo
Desenfocado de mis fotografías.
Give me a world with no edges,
A happy space knowing nothing about outlines.
Grant me, please, the round joy
Of unconsciously floating on the blurred
Background of my photographs.
--
http://www.felipe-rodriguez.com
Bokeh
Dadme un mundo sin contornos,
Un espacio feliz que ignore los perfiles.
Concededme, sí, la dicha redonda
De flotar sin conciencia en el fondo
Desenfocado de mis fotografías.
Give me a world with no edges,
A happy space knowing nothing about outlines.
Grant me, please, the round joy
Of unconsciously floating on the blurred
Background of my photographs.
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Gobzy
Senior Member
Thanks Hogne to come to the rescue. I've no such files in store for a demonstrationI am not sure I understand what you don't understand. Does this crop help?
It shows the sharpness of the new Z 50mm f/1.8s (below) compared to the F 50mm f/1.4g (above) from the center (on the right side) to the corner (on the left side). Both lenses with apertures set at f/1.8.
Though I remember very well your post, and I have to say it helped me to decide to get the 50S...
--
Ray
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