Anyone done a nightscape shot with their Z6 or Z7?

Astrophotographer 10 · Dec 7, 2018

I am interested in nightscape performance of these 2 new Nikons. I am assuming the Z6 would be a touch better.

I currently use a Sony A7r3 but the star eater issue, whilst less than what it was is still annoying. It makes fainter stars go green.

Some Nikons also do that and others don't but I am hoping the new models don't.

Greg.

beatboxa · Dec 7, 2018

Astrophotographer 10 said:
I am interested in nightscape performance of these 2 new Nikons. I am assuming the Z6 would be a touch better.

I currently use a Sony A7r3 but the star eater issue, whilst less than what it was is still annoying. It makes fainter stars go green.

Some Nikons also do that and others don't but I am hoping the new models don't.

Greg.

I am still testing nightscape performance, but my biggest issue so far with the Z6 is dark frame subtraction & LENR. Even when done manually, there seems to be inconsistency in dark-frames that appears at shutter speeds greater than 1" (though 1" itself works fine).

DezM · Dec 7, 2018

In NYC with Z6:

Z6: Night Pano

10-frame stitched panorama with the Z6, FTZ adapter and 24-70G lens. This was my 1st attempt with this camera for a sunset/night shoot. I usually use a D850. Besides the resolution of the Z6, I don't see a difference in dynamic range or IG. The Z6 is fun to use, especially when you have all of...

www.dpreview.com

Z6: Crispy Night

A few takes this past weekend with the Z6, FTZ & 24-70G lens. -- Dez http://dezsantana.com

www.dpreview.com

--
Dez
http://dezsantana.com

julian in Az · Dec 7, 2018

I saw a great YouTube video on just that

Astrophotographer 10 · Dec 8, 2018

beatboxa said:
Astrophotographer 10 said:

I am interested in nightscape performance of these 2 new Nikons. I am assuming the Z6 would be a touch better.

I currently use a Sony A7r3 but the star eater issue, whilst less than what it was is still annoying. It makes fainter stars go green.

Some Nikons also do that and others don't but I am hoping the new models don't.

Greg.

Click to expand...

I am still testing nightscape performance, but my biggest issue so far with the Z6 is dark frame subtraction & LENR. Even when done manually, there seems to be inconsistency in dark-frames that appears at shutter speeds greater than 1" (though 1" itself works fine).

I personally wouldn't bother with subtracting darks for nightscapes unless you are trying to remove some "amp glow".

Taking several and stacking is the absolute best way to reduce noise. Sequator is a free program that does this.

With Sony A7r3 and probably A7iii the colour speckle noise is somewhat random so darks don't help. It may also be the case with Nikon as they are Sony based sensors.

There was a comparison between A7iii, 6D2 and D750 by David Lane. There he comments on the LENR on the Nikon making the image noisier.

Greg.

Astrophotographer 10 · Dec 8, 2018

DezM said:
In NYC with Z6:

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/62001208

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/62006767

Thanks Dez. I saw those before. Beautiful images but not of a starry night which is what I was hoping for.

Basically want to see how it handles stars, star colours, any green stars, colour noise in the shadows (A7r3 has quite a bit of colour speckle in shadow areas).

Greg.

beatboxa · Dec 8, 2018

Astrophotographer 10 said:
beatboxa said:

Astrophotographer 10 said:

I am interested in nightscape performance of these 2 new Nikons. I am assuming the Z6 would be a touch better.

I currently use a Sony A7r3 but the star eater issue, whilst less than what it was is still annoying. It makes fainter stars go green.

Some Nikons also do that and others don't but I am hoping the new models don't.

Greg.

Click to expand...

I am still testing nightscape performance, but my biggest issue so far with the Z6 is dark frame subtraction & LENR. Even when done manually, there seems to be inconsistency in dark-frames that appears at shutter speeds greater than 1" (though 1" itself works fine).

Click to expand...

I personally wouldn't bother with subtracting darks for nightscapes unless you are trying to remove some "amp glow".

Taking several and stacking is the absolute best way to reduce noise. Sequator is a free program that does this.

With Sony A7r3 and probably A7iii the colour speckle noise is somewhat random so darks don't help. It may also be the case with Nikon as they are Sony based sensors.

There was a comparison between A7iii, 6D2 and D750 by David Lane. There he comments on the LENR on the Nikon making the image noisier.

Greg.

Stacking doesn't remove fixed pattern noise--it actually makes it worse. The key is to find the balance between stacking (or long exposures really) and removal of FPN.

cerj · Dec 8, 2018

Astrophotographer 10 said:
I am interested in nightscape performance of these 2 new Nikons. I am assuming the Z6 would be a touch better.

I currently use a Sony A7r3 but the star eater issue, whilst less than what it was is still annoying. It makes fainter stars go green.

Some Nikons also do that and others don't but I am hoping the new models don't.

Greg.

Here is one from this morning. Got the 35mm 1.8 yesterday and wanted to try it out this morning. Cropped in post.

Carl

New Orleans with the 35mm f/1.8 S

cerj · Dec 8, 2018

cerj said:
Astrophotographer 10 said:

I am interested in nightscape performance of these 2 new Nikons. I am assuming the Z6 would be a touch better.

I currently use a Sony A7r3 but the star eater issue, whilst less than what it was is still annoying. It makes fainter stars go green.

Some Nikons also do that and others don't but I am hoping the new models don't.

Greg.

Click to expand...

Here is one from this morning. Got the 35mm 1.8 yesterday and wanted to try it out this morning. Cropped in post.

Carl

New Orleans with the 35mm f/1.8 S

Saw your response to a previous post that you were looking for stars, sorry.....

Astrophotographer 10 · Dec 8, 2018

beatboxa said:
Astrophotographer 10 said:

beatboxa said:

Astrophotographer 10 said:

I am interested in nightscape performance of these 2 new Nikons. I am assuming the Z6 would be a touch better.

I currently use a Sony A7r3 but the star eater issue, whilst less than what it was is still annoying. It makes fainter stars go green.

Some Nikons also do that and others don't but I am hoping the new models don't.

Greg.

Click to expand...

I am still testing nightscape performance, but my biggest issue so far with the Z6 is dark frame subtraction & LENR. Even when done manually, there seems to be inconsistency in dark-frames that appears at shutter speeds greater than 1" (though 1" itself works fine).

Click to expand...

I personally wouldn't bother with subtracting darks for nightscapes unless you are trying to remove some "amp glow".

Taking several and stacking is the absolute best way to reduce noise. Sequator is a free program that does this.

With Sony A7r3 and probably A7iii the colour speckle noise is somewhat random so darks don't help. It may also be the case with Nikon as they are Sony based sensors.

There was a comparison between A7iii, 6D2 and D750 by David Lane. There he comments on the LENR on the Nikon making the image noisier.

Greg.

Click to expand...

Stacking doesn't remove fixed pattern noise--it actually makes it worse. The key is to find the balance between stacking (or long exposures really) and removal of FPN.

You're unlikely to be plagued with fixed pattern noise with these sorts of cameras.

Greg.

Astrophotographer 10 · Dec 8, 2018

julian in Az said:
I saw a great YouTube video on just that

Great link - thanks. It looks very clean

Greg.

Astrophotographer 10 · Dec 8, 2018

cerj said:
cerj said:

Astrophotographer 10 said:

I am interested in nightscape performance of these 2 new Nikons. I am assuming the Z6 would be a touch better.

I currently use a Sony A7r3 but the star eater issue, whilst less than what it was is still annoying. It makes fainter stars go green.

Some Nikons also do that and others don't but I am hoping the new models don't.

Greg.

Click to expand...

Here is one from this morning. Got the 35mm 1.8 yesterday and wanted to try it out this morning. Cropped in post.

Carl

New Orleans with the 35mm f/1.8 S

Click to expand...

Saw your response to a previous post that you were looking for stars, sorry.....

No that'S fine, thanks for posting.

Are you finding any colour speckle noise in the shadows of long exposures?

Greg.

cerj · Dec 8, 2018

Astrophotographer 10 said:
cerj said:

cerj said:

Astrophotographer 10 said:

I am interested in nightscape performance of these 2 new Nikons. I am assuming the Z6 would be a touch better.

I currently use a Sony A7r3 but the star eater issue, whilst less than what it was is still annoying. It makes fainter stars go green.

Some Nikons also do that and others don't but I am hoping the new models don't.

Greg.

Click to expand...

Here is one from this morning. Got the 35mm 1.8 yesterday and wanted to try it out this morning. Cropped in post.

Carl

New Orleans with the 35mm f/1.8 S

Click to expand...

Saw your response to a previous post that you were looking for stars, sorry.....

Click to expand...

No that'S fine, thanks for posting.

Are you finding any colour speckle noise in the shadows of long exposures?

Greg.

Most of my "longer" exposures (greater than 30 seconds). have been daytime images with filters. In those I have not seen color speckle noise. I'm waiting for a filter adapter ring for this new lens (35mm) and I plan on going back to locations like the one I posted and doing a longer shot (night and day). I'll look then. I'm interested in astronomical images but I was waiting for the Milky Way to show itself before I head to a quite spot to give it a try.

Carl

EricTheAstroJunkie · Dec 8, 2018

Once I get the 50mm f1.8S on wednesday I'll do some testing of that at various apertures to see how sharp and well corrected the lens is for nightscapes, I'll come back and post some examples when I get the testing done.

Astrophotographer 10 · Dec 8, 2018

cerj said:
Astrophotographer 10 said:

cerj said:

cerj said:

Astrophotographer 10 said:

I am interested in nightscape performance of these 2 new Nikons. I am assuming the Z6 would be a touch better.

I currently use a Sony A7r3 but the star eater issue, whilst less than what it was is still annoying. It makes fainter stars go green.

Some Nikons also do that and others don't but I am hoping the new models don't.

Greg.

Click to expand...

Here is one from this morning. Got the 35mm 1.8 yesterday and wanted to try it out this morning. Cropped in post.

Carl

New Orleans with the 35mm f/1.8 S

Click to expand...

Saw your response to a previous post that you were looking for stars, sorry.....

Click to expand...

No that'S fine, thanks for posting.

Are you finding any colour speckle noise in the shadows of long exposures?

Greg.

Click to expand...

Most of my "longer" exposures (greater than 30 seconds). have been daytime images with filters. In those I have not seen color speckle noise. I'm waiting for a filter adapter ring for this new lens (35mm) and I plan on going back to locations like the one I posted and doing a longer shot (night and day). I'll look then. I'm interested in astronomical images but I was waiting for the Milky Way to show itself before I head to a quite spot to give it a try.

Carl

Thanks Carl. I think it would have shown up in daytime filtered long exposures anyway so it should be all good with night long exposures.

In Sony's case the colour speckle noise cleans up best with Capture 1 single pixel noise reduction but its resistive to Lightroom's noise reduction and other noise reduction which are based on blurring.

Greg.

Greg.

Astrophotographer 10 · Dec 8, 2018

EricTheAstroJunkie said:
Once I get the 50mm f1.8S on wednesday I'll do some testing of that at various apertures to see how sharp and well corrected the lens is for nightscapes, I'll come back and post some examples when I get the testing done.

That'd be awesome Eric.

I am interested if there are any green stars in the image. Mainly though from images done with a tracker so the stars are pinpoints. That's where the noise algorithims often mistakenly strike.

The issue with my Sony for nightscapes is I see a lot of stars turned green.

Now you can correct it using HALVG free plug in for Photoshop but that will attack all greens in the image. So if you have a nightscape with green airglow in it (very common for my area) then it gives you a processing challenge. How do you fix the green stars and leave the airglow intact?

I would select the brighter stars and apply it to that only (assuming the plugin will do a selection only which I don't think it will). Or reduce the green channel once the stars are selected. A bit awkward as you can see.

Greg.

beatboxa · Dec 8, 2018

Astrophotographer 10 said:
beatboxa said:

Astrophotographer 10 said:

beatboxa said:

Astrophotographer 10 said:

I am interested in nightscape performance of these 2 new Nikons. I am assuming the Z6 would be a touch better.

I currently use a Sony A7r3 but the star eater issue, whilst less than what it was is still annoying. It makes fainter stars go green.

Some Nikons also do that and others don't but I am hoping the new models don't.

Greg.

Click to expand...

I am still testing nightscape performance, but my biggest issue so far with the Z6 is dark frame subtraction & LENR. Even when done manually, there seems to be inconsistency in dark-frames that appears at shutter speeds greater than 1" (though 1" itself works fine).

Click to expand...

I personally wouldn't bother with subtracting darks for nightscapes unless you are trying to remove some "amp glow".

Taking several and stacking is the absolute best way to reduce noise. Sequator is a free program that does this.

With Sony A7r3 and probably A7iii the colour speckle noise is somewhat random so darks don't help. It may also be the case with Nikon as they are Sony based sensors.

There was a comparison between A7iii, 6D2 and D750 by David Lane. There he comments on the LENR on the Nikon making the image noisier.

Greg.

Click to expand...

Stacking doesn't remove fixed pattern noise--it actually makes it worse. The key is to find the balance between stacking (or long exposures really) and removal of FPN.

Click to expand...

You're unlikely to be plagued with fixed pattern noise with these sorts of cameras.

Greg.

What is this statement based on? You don't ever shoot stars or galaxies?

rick colman · Dec 8, 2018

Try this:

6679d8ef23ed425c8b3b46358b9bead0.jpg.png

The Z6 with just the kit zoom lens looks pretty good to me. F4 is wa slow, but, put it on a portable tracker under dark skies ... well lookis like a STELLAR combination.

Will be try ng some of my other interesting lenses as well.

EricTheAstroJunkie · Dec 8, 2018

Astrophotographer 10 said:
EricTheAstroJunkie said:

Once I get the 50mm f1.8S on wednesday I'll do some testing of that at various apertures to see how sharp and well corrected the lens is for nightscapes, I'll come back and post some examples when I get the testing done.

Click to expand...

That'd be awesome Eric.

I am interested if there are any green stars in the image. Mainly though from images done with a tracker so the stars are pinpoints. That's where the noise algorithims often mistakenly strike.

The issue with my Sony for nightscapes is I see a lot of stars turned green.

Now you can correct it using HALVG free plug in for Photoshop but that will attack all greens in the image. So if you have a nightscape with green airglow in it (very common for my area) then it gives you a processing challenge. How do you fix the green stars and leave the airglow intact?

I would select the brighter stars and apply it to that only (assuming the plugin will do a selection only which I don't think it will). Or reduce the green channel once the stars are selected. A bit awkward as you can see.

Greg.

I've already had Mark Shelley analyze dark frames from the Z7, there's no star eater at work, you can read his posts/findings here:

https://www.cloudynights.com/topic/635441-aa-filter-spatial-filter-and-star-colours/page-4

I have a new lightweight tracker setup I'm excited to use, going to save me over half the weight I was carrying with my Star Adventurer w/counterweight setup and my D800E + Sigma Art lenses. This new 50mm is looking to be absolutely perfect for my setup, hopefully the chromatic aberration is controlled by f2.2, that's my only real concern given Nikon's history with chroma problems at wider apertures.

That's a clever idea to reduce the green fringing caused by star destruction, hadn't seen anyone think of using the plugin/green reduction on selected stars. I even imagine you could use the photoshop color selector tool and zoom in on a green star, select that specific range of green, and bring down that color with curves.

DezM · Dec 8, 2018

Astrophotographer 10 said:
DezM said:

In NYC with Z6:

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/62001208

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/62006767

Click to expand...

Thanks Dez. I saw those before. Beautiful images but not of a starry night which is what I was hoping for.

Basically want to see how it handles stars, star colours, any green stars, colour noise in the shadows (A7r3 has quite a bit of colour speckle in shadow areas).

Greg.

Gotcha. We don't get stars here in the city sky. Only on the streets

Anyone done a nightscape shot with their Z6 or Z7?

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