Yes, this does explain the non-stop bashing of the Sony brand by this user.
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DPR Review of EOS R vs Reality
- Thread starter Larawanista
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- nikon d600 nikon d610
A7ii got 82% and the silver award.... the A7iii got the 89% gold award
Maybe they shoukd make a poll and ask, if people find these overall ratings (percentages) useful and if people want them?
I would find more useful if those rating bars were also in %. It would be easier to compare to other cameras. That overall score tells nothing.In conclusion site, above the rating bars, I can read R belongs to "Mid Range Full Frame Camera". Wish I could click it and see the list, which cameras belong to this group, which year they was made and links to their reviews.
So A7ii MUST be better camera than R, because R got only 79% and no silver award.
teh huan loong
Active member
You cant take stevestuff personal preference as a master point. NO all user smart like steve.
My friend who own canon gear for last 2 decade. He is not happy for eos r mainly bcos lack of joystick to control the focusing points. Likewise the direction pad away to bottom side. In additiona he cant adapt to use the screen pad for drag the point. Furthermore the image quality, Dr and iso performance never surprise him. Compare to 6D and 5d4 which is consider 2 yrs back product.
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Correction noted, thanks! I mixed up the ratings for those two.
Based on these ratings (and the Sony's silver award), the R should be overall a little worse than the A7II. :-O
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Yes, it's relevant to my opinions of Sony. I've had great experience with my Canon gear and really appreciate Canon's design choices and value for the money. So my comments about Sony arise from a lot of good experience with Canon and a really bad experience with Sony.
But note that my comments on Sony are in the context of Sony-users non-stop bashing of the Canon brand on the Canon R forum and under articles about the Canon R.
Pretty much everything written about the R has some anti-Canon & pro-Sony comments under it. Oftentimes by the same people, day after day. They seem to have nothing better to do than visit the forum of a brand they don't use, in order to constantly trash that brand, or worse, promote Sony (Sony color, Sony features, Sony etc.). They are dedicated and persistent and repetitive.
Also note that my comments about Sony are not being forced on Sony users in the Sony forum. Contrast that with the constant presence of Sony-using Canon-bashers on the Canon forum. Anytime I want to read about the R, I have to filter through all of the pro-Sony anti-Canon comments.
Also note how Nikon-users don't seem to have this constant Canon-bashing presence that Sony users do. We don't seem to get daily Nikon promotions on the Canon R forum, but we hear all about Sony, every day.
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Thoughts R Us
Veteran Member
Yes, I've noted this several times as well...the fact that it is only Sony users who troll the forums of other brands to bash those competitor brands. It really turns me off of Sony.
And it's not just me...the admins of Nikon Rumors and Canon rumors sites have noticed it as well...it's almost like there's a coordinated effort. Companies have been known to hire troll farms to bash the competition.
Thoughts R Us
Veteran Member
And we should not take your friend as some sort of reference point either.
Ebrahim Saadawi
Leading Member
To anyone claiming the EOS R is ultimately worse than the competetion, can't you even read the specs?
-30mp vs 24mp
-Articulating bigger LCD, with best touch interface
-Best EVF on the line
-Top LCD
-Large better grip
-Lens Control Wheel
-Minus 6 EV AF
-10bit video
-DPAF touch focusing
-ND EF adapter
-480mbps Bit Rate
-The infamously loved Canon Log
-DPRaw
-14bit throughout
You don't get ANY of this on your unicorn perfect A7III. So yes the Sony's have many merits but it's not a oneway street. It's objectively proven by a spec read for god's sake.
And keep telling yourself Sony colours look as good and better than Canon and link TN videos all over the EOS R forum, just don't browse any EOS R images, you'll be disappointed.
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Egyptian 24 year old Dentist loves filmmaking/photos.
-30mp vs 24mp
-Articulating bigger LCD, with best touch interface
-Best EVF on the line
-Top LCD
-Large better grip
-Lens Control Wheel
-Minus 6 EV AF
-10bit video
-DPAF touch focusing
-ND EF adapter
-480mbps Bit Rate
-The infamously loved Canon Log
-DPRaw
-14bit throughout
You don't get ANY of this on your unicorn perfect A7III. So yes the Sony's have many merits but it's not a oneway street. It's objectively proven by a spec read for god's sake.
And keep telling yourself Sony colours look as good and better than Canon and link TN videos all over the EOS R forum, just don't browse any EOS R images, you'll be disappointed.
--
Egyptian 24 year old Dentist loves filmmaking/photos.
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Different times, different competition.
If the A7ii came out as a newly released camera today, I am sure it would score much lower than 82.
I guessed before it even launched it would be below 80% (I figured even lower than the 79% it got, really) and that it would not get an award. This is the approach Canon has been taking the last few years, especially with things that don't have a 5 or 1 in their name. And after specs started coming out, I was certain of it.
So, they throw out a camera that costs more and does less than the competition, skim money from the early-adopters, drop the price dramatically, then crank them out for several years and make loads of profit and happy customers but no respect from people outside the Canon faithful. I really wish it weren't so, but that is how Canon is the one making the profits.
They will eventually offer something more in line with the 5-series, then rake in from the people replacing the R so they have a better camera and something to use with those $2300-$3000 lenses, but in the meantime will extract all they can from the R. They did the right thing dropping a mediocre camera with some killer lenses, now people need to buy the better camera to take maximum advantage of those, and it keeps the R system from being essentially a full-frame M-series.
So, they throw out a camera that costs more and does less than the competition, skim money from the early-adopters, drop the price dramatically, then crank them out for several years and make loads of profit and happy customers but no respect from people outside the Canon faithful. I really wish it weren't so, but that is how Canon is the one making the profits.
They will eventually offer something more in line with the 5-series, then rake in from the people replacing the R so they have a better camera and something to use with those $2300-$3000 lenses, but in the meantime will extract all they can from the R. They did the right thing dropping a mediocre camera with some killer lenses, now people need to buy the better camera to take maximum advantage of those, and it keeps the R system from being essentially a full-frame M-series.
Photomonkey
Veteran Member
We should take ALL reviews in every publication with a grain of salt. As actual users, our needs differ depending on what we are doing. I never shoot video so complaints about video are irrelevant to me. I don't shoot sports so long lenses don't interest me. I DO shoot low light, I DO shoot on a tripod, I DO want better DR. Accurate focus is critical to me .
They are probably shooting images that are representative of the casual snapshooter and scenarios that challenge lenses and sensors.
Important to YOU. Maybe less to others. Full day shooting means one thing to me on a set with lights and a crew and another to a wedding shooter and yet another to one who tramps around outdoors with a backpack full of beer.
Users are always useful sources. Lacking that, DPR delivers relatively uniform and useful information to the bulk of us who haven't even touched the camera yet.
IMO renting for a week is a very useful way to gain insight into the daily use. For a pro, the service issue is paramount. First, a camera line that seems to need a lot of service should be viewed with suspicion. Second assuming a reasonably reliable camera, the service should be prompt and accurate.
As for the R, I think the camera is a decent first effort. I can see firmware updates improving and adding features.
I am waiting for the next models which I believe will show us a better view of where they are going and what we can expect.
I am going to rent one as soon as I get past this busy spot in my job.
Thoughts R Us
Veteran Member
I've asked this before, but does it matter what DPR or any reviewer says, or should it?
DPR is following the narrative dictated by Sony. By that I mean that because Sony was first to mirrorless FF, and I give them credit for that, they defined the narrative of what to expect or not to expect with regards to this category. So if Sony did it, then all brands must be compared to that. If Sony left something out, or did something poorly, well, they were at least being innovative.
We should all know that reviewers have severe flaws and biases, and that really we each need to make up our own minds, by trying equipment out as best we can, and by reading a variety of reviews if we even want to go that route.
IMHO, DPR's criticisms of the ergonomics of the Canon are so off base that it ruins the credibility of the entire review. I own both the EOS R and Nikon Z, and have used the Sony a9, and in my estimation the EOS R feels the best, and has the best ergonomics.
But as with other Canon products, Canon will just outsell the competition anyway. Most people don't read these reviews, and even among those who do, most don't go by them.
Give it a short period of time, and Canon will own about half of the mirrorless FF market. As for Sony, they already are seeing a large market share decline and it will only get worse as the competition intensifies.
In the meantime, I will enjoy the EOS R and those wonderful lenses.
DPR is following the narrative dictated by Sony. By that I mean that because Sony was first to mirrorless FF, and I give them credit for that, they defined the narrative of what to expect or not to expect with regards to this category. So if Sony did it, then all brands must be compared to that. If Sony left something out, or did something poorly, well, they were at least being innovative.
We should all know that reviewers have severe flaws and biases, and that really we each need to make up our own minds, by trying equipment out as best we can, and by reading a variety of reviews if we even want to go that route.
IMHO, DPR's criticisms of the ergonomics of the Canon are so off base that it ruins the credibility of the entire review. I own both the EOS R and Nikon Z, and have used the Sony a9, and in my estimation the EOS R feels the best, and has the best ergonomics.
But as with other Canon products, Canon will just outsell the competition anyway. Most people don't read these reviews, and even among those who do, most don't go by them.
Give it a short period of time, and Canon will own about half of the mirrorless FF market. As for Sony, they already are seeing a large market share decline and it will only get worse as the competition intensifies.
In the meantime, I will enjoy the EOS R and those wonderful lenses.
David Hull
Veteran Member
That's a good deal, that saved you a hundred bucks.
Thoughts R Us
Veteran Member
Yes, the problem with the scoring is that it creates the misimpression of scientific accuracy and precision, which is typically what numbers are used for.
In reality the scoring system is hopelessly arbitrary and subjective, and confusing at that. It really should be abandoned because it's meaningless, even for comparisons, which again, is typically what numbers can be used for.
Occams Razor
Senior Member
Out of curiosity, do you own the R or have extensive experience with it? If not, I’m wondering how you are able to draw these conclusions.
Randy
David Hull
Veteran Member
In some sense though, that gives the review a bit more value because you know that experience is baked into the commentary. If the guy says this is the worst handling camera I have ever seen, you know he has seen quite a few
You can also look at a given reviewer and see what he *did* like and see what his biases are.teh huan loong
Active member
I am absolutely agreed with you.
Perhaps my friend who is in the group of the balance of 21 score mark which unhappy user. Happy user might be inside the group of the score 79..(just to my sense)
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