Canon (and Nikon) Box Sony In

Astrophotographer 10 said:

Thoughts R Us said:

Canon and Nikon have effectively boxed Sony in. By both going with larger and more technologically advanced mounts for mirrorless, they have left Sony the odd man out with the small mount. I bet Panasonic's FF mirrorless also features a larger mount. When all is said and done Sony will be left with the most primitive mount.

Canon will have faster lenses and Sony won't be able to compete in that area. Canon already flexed its muscle by releasing 2 of those faster lenses with the new R.

Also, whenever Sony releases new models, they will be compared with the superior ergonomics of Canon and Nikon. Unless Sony does a major redesign, they will look and feel worse.

And anyone going into a camera store to handle the Canon and the Sony, will mostly choose the Canon because it feels so much better and offers the superior user experience.

Click to expand...

The original post started off fine but then degenerated into the usual Sony is about to die etc.

The facts are Sony is the number 1 FF camera by sales. How do you account for that if its about to die?

I also do not see hardly anyone posting in the Sony forum about how they are going to sell their Sony gear to take up the Canon EOS R or the Nikon Z.

The fact is both the EOS R and the Z (arguably the more interesting camera) are both very solid entries to the FF market but neither at this stage offer anything substantial to better the Sony equivalents and neither have an A9 or A7S competitor nor an APSc equivalent performer.

I would say Sony's best bet is to continue to throw everything into the new models which they usually do (in contrast to Canon) and continue to offer the older models at a lower price (which they do you can still buy all the earlier models like A6000 for a song).

Canon and Nikon will make Sony try harder which is only good for Sony.

By the way there is a Mitagon F0.95 that fits onto Emount - how do you account for that?

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1072733-REG/mitakon_mtk50mf095bk_50mm_for_0_95_lens.html

Oh look its only $799 and you said it couldn't be done.

Click to expand...

Well yes the Mitagon is F/0.95 but unfortunately its light transmission is not quite so impressive at about T1.4

Part of the problem of a narrow lens mount is the mechanical restriction of the limited diameter opening. Some very fast lenses can be made to fit with an adapter but can not deliver their stated maximum aperture because of mechanical vignetting.

Sony may well have given themselves some optical difficulties because of their narrow mount.

Astrophotographer 10 said:

I also have an older but quite compact and nicely made Minolta MD 50 F1.2 lens that works on my Sony's with an adapter.

I am sure the monster Canon 50 1.2 will be in a totally different league but to say emount won't allow fast lenses is already not true.

A possibly more accurate statement would be it may make fast lenses more difficult and the wider mount should allow the optical engineers to provide better corner performance and even brighter lenses - that is true. How Sony addresses this is unkown but I imagine they won't do anything about it at this stage (its unlikely to be an issue for a while).

Greg.

Click to expand...

Thoughts R Us said:

Canon and Nikon have effectively boxed Sony in. By both going with larger and more technologically advanced mounts for mirrorless, they have left Sony the odd man out with the small mount. I bet Panasonic's FF mirrorless also features a larger mount. When all is said and done Sony will be left with the most primitive mount.

Canon will have faster lenses and Sony won't be able to compete in that area. Canon already flexed its muscle by releasing 2 of those faster lenses with the new R.

Also, whenever Sony releases new models, they will be compared with the superior ergonomics of Canon and Nikon. Unless Sony does a major redesign, they will look and feel worse.

And anyone going into a camera store to handle the Canon and the Sony, will mostly choose the Canon because it feels so much better and offers the superior user experience.

Click to expand...

The question I ask you that I have had to ask of many others is this:

Why in God's name do you care?

Buy the system you like and that works for your style of photography and your wallet, whoever produces it. Be glad there is competition for it so you don't get taken for a ride by a monopolistic company with no incentive to advance or charge competitively. That is all there is to consider. All this weird tribalism is just nonsensical.

nzmacro said:

I've been reading your posts in here and one thing becomes fairly clear. You seem worried and insecure for some reason. It's almost like you are under threat. It's actually kind of funny to watch ;-) Keep going though, I'm enjoying it.

Small mount, large mount, what !! Ha.

Click to expand...

Hahaha..let me explain my motives. I will be crystal clear. What I am is annoyed at the Sony trolls who come into the new Canon and Nikon FF mirrorless forums to disparage these devices and brands. If anyone is insecure it is Sony users.

There is no reason for any Sony fan/user to come into these other brand forums just to talk down Canon or Nikon products and tell everyone how Sony is supposedly so superior. I don't go over to the Sony forums and post these thoughts, and remind people how Sony's ergonomics and weather sealing are bad, and now how their mount is going to be left behind.

When Sony comes out with let's say, their A7siii, I won't go to the Sony forums and rant against that machine. (And it will have flaws and shortcomings; all products do.) That's rude and silly.

Yet that is exactly what so many Sony trolls are doing these days to those of us who enjoy Canon and Nikon gear. I use both and love both brands; they have given me great joy with photography and never let me down.

I don't care if someone prefers Sony. I have a few friends who do and we get along great. That's because I don't tell them how their preferred choice sucks, nor do they tell me that about mine.

So what annoys me is how Sony fans/trolls seem determined to take over these Canon and Nikon forums, and spoil it for everyone else. Let us discuss and enjoy our preferred brands.

Bob Janes said:

robblackett said:

Also lenses of moderate apertures can be smaller than lenses designed for reflex cameras because of the above.

Click to expand...

This is an interesting concept.

I've just taken a ruler to the back of an e-mount lens. The space across the diameter from one side of the inside of the metal mount to the other is 36mm, however part of this distance is taken up with electrical contacts, so unless you had a rear element that was 'squared off' to allow for the contacts, you would need to allow 4-6mm for those contacts... which gives a maximum circular rear element for e-mount of 30mm.

I will be interested to see when the first RF lenses are released with a rear element of more than 30mm.

Bob Janes said:

We may not have seen many of those smaller lenses yet but that is simply a conscious decision by Canon to give some indication of the optical possibilities of the system as a priority given the limited number of lenses possible on day one of release.

Click to expand...

..so they have deliberately not released lenses that take advantage of the new mount to demonstrate the optical possibilities of the new mount?

Click to expand...

No, given the option of a limited number of lenses at launch they have chosen to demonstrate some particular advantages of their system, namely speed and optical quality.

They could equally have chosen to demonstrate compact design but already many other systems from APS-c to M4/3 already do that so would that particular characteristic have stood out? Whether you agree with their launch strategy or not is perhaps another issue.

Matt2134 said:

Thoughts R Us said:

Canon and Nikon have effectively boxed Sony in. By both going with larger and more technologically advanced mounts for mirrorless, they have left Sony the odd man out with the small mount. I bet Panasonic's FF mirrorless also features a larger mount. When all is said and done Sony will be left with the most primitive mount.

Canon will have faster lenses and Sony won't be able to compete in that area. Canon already flexed its muscle by releasing 2 of those faster lenses with the new R.

Also, whenever Sony releases new models, they will be compared with the superior ergonomics of Canon and Nikon. Unless Sony does a major redesign, they will look and feel worse.

And anyone going into a camera store to handle the Canon and the Sony, will mostly choose the Canon because it feels so much better and offers the superior user experience.

Click to expand...

The question I ask you that I have had to ask of many others is this:

Why in God's name do you care?

Buy the system you like and that works for your style of photography and your wallet, whoever produces it. Be glad there is competition for it so you don't get taken for a ride by a monopolistic company with no incentive to advance or charge competitively. That is all there is to consider. All this weird tribalism is just nonsensical.

Click to expand...

I agree...but what I would ask is why Sony users and fans try to take over this forum and extol the virtues of their Sony brand in a Canon forum? I don't mind objective and balanced criticism of the Canon device in a Canon forum, but it's obvious that more than that is going on: that Sony trolls/fans/whatever you want to call them, are just consistently and rudely trying to dominate the forum with their talking points. The same happened with the Nikon Z. Peter the admin on Nikon Rumors has made this same point. It is only the Sony trolls who do this.

So I wanted to balance out the trolling with a more complete analysis of the market with this post. And brand loyalties aside, I stand by my analysis.

robblackett said:

Well yes the Mitagon is F/0.95 but unfortunately its light transmission is not quite so impressive at about T1.4

Part of the problem of a narrow lens mount is the mechanical restriction of the limited diameter opening. Some very fast lenses can be made to fit with an adapter but can not deliver their stated maximum aperture because of mechanical vignetting.

Sony may well have given themselves some optical difficulties because of their narrow mount.

Click to expand...

I've read reviews of that lens and there is no suggestion that reduced transmission is due to mechanical vignetting - if it was mechanical vignetting the corners would be dark in comparison to the centre and none of the sample pics I've seen display that.

Then there is the Meyer-Optik Gorlitz 50 f/0.95, which I understand does transmit all the light, fits e-mount and, although it is nearly 4 times the price of the Mikaton, is still half the proposed price of the Nikkor...

..and note, neither of these lenses is chipped, so there is no correction going on in-camera.

The width of the lens mount is not a restriction for these lenses, not is it for the Leitz M-mount f/0.95... If the e-mount does introduce speed restrictions, they certainly don't cut in until you go faster than f/0.95...

Bob Janes said:

robblackett said:

Well yes the Mitagon is F/0.95 but unfortunately its light transmission is not quite so impressive at about T1.4

Part of the problem of a narrow lens mount is the mechanical restriction of the limited diameter opening. Some very fast lenses can be made to fit with an adapter but can not deliver their stated maximum aperture because of mechanical vignetting.

Sony may well have given themselves some optical difficulties because of their narrow mount.

Click to expand...

I've read reviews of that lens and there is no suggestion that reduced transmission is due to mechanical vignetting - if it was mechanical vignetting the corners would be dark in comparison to the centre and none of the sample pics I've seen display that.

Click to expand...

No, that is dependent on the position of the exit pupil.

Bob Janes said:

Then there is the Meyer-Optik Gorlitz 50 f/0.95, which I understand does transmit all the light, fits e-mount and, although it is nearly 4 times the price of the Mikaton, is still half the proposed price of the Nikkor...

..and note, neither of these lenses is chipped, so there is no correction going on in-camera.

The width of the lens mount is not a restriction for these lenses, not is it for the Leitz M-mount f/0.95... If the e-mount does introduce speed restrictions, they certainly don't cut in until you go faster than f/0.95...

Click to expand...

The width of the mount is a restriction for optical performance. In some instances it's possible to get around some of the difficulties with complex optical designs but that can then introduce some other issues, one of which is cost.

Bob Janes said:

robblackett said:

Also lenses of moderate apertures can be smaller than lenses designed for reflex cameras because of the above.

Click to expand...

This is an interesting concept.

I've just taken a ruler to the back of an e-mount lens. The space across the diameter from one side of the inside of the metal mount to the other is 36mm, however part of this distance is taken up with electrical contacts, so unless you had a rear element that was 'squared off' to allow for the contacts, you would need to allow 4-6mm for those contacts... which gives a maximum circular rear element for e-mount of 30mm.

Click to expand...

When I look at the camera mount itself, which is 46.1mm across disregarding the bayonet, and take the contacts block into account, I come to 34mm diameter. I had to use a photo of the mount, as I do not own any E-mount camera.

But I am sure your estimate of 30mm is quite accurate.

Bob Janes said:

I will be interested to see when the first RF lenses are released with a rear element of more than 30mm.

Click to expand...

The RF 50mm f1.2 L USM already has a bigger rear element:





Over 40mm diameter.

The RF 28-70mm f2 L USM already has a bigger rear element:





About 36.8mm diameter.

The RF 35mm f1.8 IS STM Macro already has a bigger rear element:





About 38.5mm diameter.

The Canon RF 24-105mm f4 L IS USM already has a bigger rear element:





About 37mm diameter.

That makes all released RF lenses having a bigger rear element than Sony E mount can take.

Bob Janes said:

Bob Janes said:

We may not have seen many of those smaller lenses yet but that is simply a conscious decision by Canon to give some indication of the optical possibilities of the system as a priority given the limited number of lenses possible on day one of release.

Click to expand...

..so they have deliberately not released lenses that take advantage of the new mount to demonstrate the optical possibilities of the new mount?

Click to expand...

They have deliberately released only lenses that take advantage of the new mount to some extent.

Don Lacy said:

MikeJ9116 said:

It is telling that Canon has released an inferior camera in response the the A7/3 in an effort to keep their indians on the reservation.

Click to expand...

All you look at is a spec sheet to determine a cameras performance which ignores the most important feature of how the camera perform in your hand is it an extension of your body that does not get in the way of taking images or is it a hinderance that your constantly fighting. I get it your a techie who take photographs but have you ever consider that Canon designs cameras for photographer who could care less about tech specs and are more concern about the user experience.

Click to expand...

Yes, that's the key. The pro's I know are the least into tech specs. But they value that user experience greatly.

A BMW doesn't necessarily have all of the bells and whistles of a Hyundai, but I know which brand I'd prefer.

Those who judge any modern tech product on specs are missing the bigger picture. This also holds true with many reviewers, who take the easy way out and just reduce everything to a spec sheet. Reviewers who do that do their audience a disservice.

Thoughts R Us said:

nzmacro said:

I've been reading your posts in here and one thing becomes fairly clear. You seem worried and insecure for some reason. It's almost like you are under threat. It's actually kind of funny to watch ;-) Keep going though, I'm enjoying it.

Small mount, large mount, what !! Ha.

Click to expand...

Hahaha..let me explain my motives. I will be crystal clear. What I am is annoyed at the Sony trolls who come into the new Canon and Nikon FF mirrorless forums to disparage these devices and brands. If anyone is insecure it is Sony users.

There is no reason for any Sony fan/user to come into these other brand forums just to talk down Canon or Nikon products and tell everyone how Sony is supposedly so superior. I don't go over to the Sony forums and post these thoughts, and remind people how Sony's ergonomics and weather sealing are bad, and now how their mount is going to be left behind.`

Click to expand...

The reason you have so many Sony (and m43 and Fuji) people interested in this forum is because we are genuinely interested in mirrorless.

If you move into a new neighborhood and people knock on the door, don't make the instant assumption that they are there to complain or steal from you.

Thoughts R Us said:

When Sony comes out with let's say, their A7siii, I won't go to the Sony forums and rant against that machine. (And it will have flaws and shortcomings; all products do.) That's rude and silly.

Click to expand...

I don't think I've done that. I've tried to persuade some people that they should not be so anti adapters and have pointed out that both Nikon and Canon could improve their native lens problems more quickly by simply sharing their specs and protocols for the new mounts with third parties (and if they did that it would be a big blow to Sony).

I've also seem a bunch of tosh talked about bashing Sony - and if someone is pushing out misinformation, I'm inclined to politely correct.

Thoughts R Us said:

Yet that is exactly what so many Sony trolls are doing these days to those of us who enjoy Canon and Nikon gear. I use both and love both brands; they have given me great joy with photography and never let me down.

I don't care if someone prefers Sony. I have a few friends who do and we get along great. That's because I don't tell them how their preferred choice sucks, nor do they tell me that about mine.

So what annoys me is how Sony fans/trolls seem determined to take over these Canon and Nikon forums, and spoil it for everyone else. Let us discuss and enjoy our preferred brands.

Click to expand...

Titles of active threads appear to the right of the DPR front page and it is from there that you get quite a few people coming in to defend.

If you don't want input from experienced Sony mirrorless users, stop posting topics that attack Sony in the title - then no-one will need to come in to correct false impressions.

Thoughts R Us said:

nzmacro said:

I've been reading your posts in here and one thing becomes fairly clear. You seem worried and insecure for some reason. It's almost like you are under threat. It's actually kind of funny to watch ;-) Keep going though, I'm enjoying it.

Small mount, large mount, what !! Ha.

Click to expand...

Hahaha..let me explain my motives. I will be crystal clear. What I am is annoyed at the Sony trolls who come into the new Canon and Nikon FF mirrorless forums to disparage these devices and brands. If anyone is insecure it is Sony users.

There is no reason for any Sony fan/user to come into these other brand forums just to talk down Canon or Nikon products and tell everyone how Sony is supposedly so superior. I don't go over to the Sony forums and post these thoughts, and remind people how Sony's ergonomics and weather sealing are bad, and now how their mount is going to be left behind.

When Sony comes out with let's say, their A7siii, I won't go to the Sony forums and rant against that machine. (And it will have flaws and shortcomings; all products do.) That's rude and silly.

Yet that is exactly what so many Sony trolls are doing these days to those of us who enjoy Canon and Nikon gear. I use both and love both brands; they have given me great joy with photography and never let me down.

I don't care if someone prefers Sony. I have a few friends who do and we get along great. That's because I don't tell them how their preferred choice sucks, nor do they tell me that about mine.

So what annoys me is how Sony fans/trolls seem determined to take over these Canon and Nikon forums, and spoil it for everyone else. Let us discuss and enjoy our preferred brands.

Click to expand...

You do sound insecure. You mention Sony in the title of the thread and look how many times you mention Sony in your reply to me, that's A LOT !! Then you complain about Sony users coming in, ha, not very clever really is it. Maybe you had another intention in mind.

I'm a Sony FF and APS-C user ....... and Olympus m4/3, but I use Canon and Nikkor lenses on all of them So what sort of fan I am, I'm not really sure

What I do know personally is that if I had to choose, one of the new Nikon's would come first before this Canon R from what I've seen so far. Sony makes superb cameras, simple fact, but so does Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Olympus, Panasonic, etc, etc. If some people can't use any one of them because ...... well because they just can't, then that makes them totally incapable as a photographer. That's where a choice comes into it. Pick the compromise you want and make it go click.

They all have something in common, they all go click, but it's up to the idiot behind it to click what they want and hopefully, it's a good click.

Sony makes more out of insurance than probably what Canon and Nikon make together out of camera gear. Never mind the rest of Sony. No matter how much some people hate them, they don't have much to worry about.

In short, IMO, Nikon wins this round, but it is only one round and it's fun to watch. No one has anything to worry about, it's good for all of us no matter what we use.

All the best and you have to go a long way to find a bad camera, but not too far to find a bad photographer.

Danny.

--
------------
Birds and BIF's https://www.flickr.com/photos/124733969@N06/sets/
Need for speed https://www.flickr.com/photos/130646821@N03/albums

Thoughts R Us said:

I agree...but what I would ask is why Sony users and fans try to take over this forum and extol the virtues of their Sony brand in a Canon forum?

Click to expand...

So to lessen the talk about Sony on the Canon forum you....talk about Sony on the Canon Forum.

brightcolours said:

Bob Janes said:

robblackett said:

Also lenses of moderate apertures can be smaller than lenses designed for reflex cameras because of the above.

Click to expand...

This is an interesting concept.

I've just taken a ruler to the back of an e-mount lens. The space across the diameter from one side of the inside of the metal mount to the other is 36mm, however part of this distance is taken up with electrical contacts, so unless you had a rear element that was 'squared off' to allow for the contacts, you would need to allow 4-6mm for those contacts... which gives a maximum circular rear element for e-mount of 30mm.

Click to expand...

When I look at the camera mount itself, which is 46.1mm across disregarding the bayonet, and take the contacts block into account, I come to 34mm diameter. I had to use a photo of the mount, as I do not own any E-mount camera.

But I am sure your estimate of 30mm is quite accurate.

brightcolours said:

I will be interested to see when the first RF lenses are released with a rear element of more than 30mm.

Click to expand...

The RF 50mm f1.2 L USM already has a bigger rear element:

Over 40mm diameter.

The RF 28-70mm f2 L USM already has a bigger rear element:

About 36.8mm diameter.

The RF 35mm f1.8 IS STM Macro already has a bigger rear element:

About 38.5mm diameter.

The Canon RF 24-105mm f4 L IS USM already has a bigger rear element:

About 37mm diameter.

That makes all released RF lenses having a bigger rear element than Sony E mount can take.

brightcolours said:

brightcolours said:

We may not have seen many of those smaller lenses yet but that is simply a conscious decision by Canon to give some indication of the optical possibilities of the system as a priority given the limited number of lenses possible on day one of release.

Click to expand...

..so they have deliberately not released lenses that take advantage of the new mount to demonstrate the optical possibilities of the new mount?

Click to expand...

They have deliberately released only lenses that take advantage of the new mount to some extent.

Click to expand...

I stand corrected..



--
Save a life, become a stem-cell donor.
Hello to Jason Isaacs!

I still want to see some reviews of the new R but for now will stick to my Canon DSLR and Sony APS-C emount systems. The latter mainly due to my fantastic Zeiss Sonnar 24/1.8 (apsc), Zeiss Touit 32/1.8 (apsc), Sony Zeiss 16-70/4 (apsc) and Sonnar 55/1.8 (full frame). Man, the latter alone is enough to keep me in the Sony family----outstanding bokeh and sharpness and relatively light/small to boot. But then again, I have the iconic 50/1.2 L and 85/1.2LII to keep me in the Canon family.

I toyed the idea of getting the A7III or even the A7RIII using the lenses I have but it will reduce the resolution. Also, I'm not too crazy about Sony standard zooms----the 24-70/2.8 G is too big. Maybe if the Zeiss 24-70/4 have stellar reviews I would have considered it. Thus, I'll stick with what I have and look forward to the upcoming A6700 or A7000.

Cheers,

José

Bob Janes said:

Thoughts R Us said:

nzmacro said:

I've been reading your posts in here and one thing becomes fairly clear. You seem worried and insecure for some reason. It's almost like you are under threat. It's actually kind of funny to watch ;-) Keep going though, I'm enjoying it.

Small mount, large mount, what !! Ha.

Click to expand...

Hahaha..let me explain my motives. I will be crystal clear. What I am is annoyed at the Sony trolls who come into the new Canon and Nikon FF mirrorless forums to disparage these devices and brands. If anyone is insecure it is Sony users.

There is no reason for any Sony fan/user to come into these other brand forums just to talk down Canon or Nikon products and tell everyone how Sony is supposedly so superior. I don't go over to the Sony forums and post these thoughts, and remind people how Sony's ergonomics and weather sealing are bad, and now how their mount is going to be left behind.`

Click to expand...

The reason you have so many Sony (and m43 and Fuji) people interested in this forum is because we are genuinely interested in mirrorless.

If you move into a new neighborhood and people knock on the door, don't make the instant assumption that they are there to complain or steal from you.

Click to expand...

I don't make that assumption. Many who post are just here to be negative towards Canon and promote Sony, with no balance.

Bob Janes said:

Bob Janes said:

When Sony comes out with let's say, their A7siii, I won't go to the Sony forums and rant against that machine. (And it will have flaws and shortcomings; all products do.) That's rude and silly.

Click to expand...

I don't think I've done that. I've tried to persuade some people that they should not be so anti adapters and have pointed out that both Nikon and Canon could improve their native lens problems more quickly by simply sharing their specs and protocols for the new mounts with third parties (and if they did that it would be a big blow to Sony).

I've also seem a bunch of tosh talked about bashing Sony - and if someone is pushing out misinformation, I'm inclined to politely correct.

Click to expand...

It is not your role to "correct" everyone. Do you do that on all forums? And I don't follow your particular posts or those of anyone in particular, and so you may be more civilized in the way you post your opinions. But many Sony trolls have not been.

Bob Janes said:

Bob Janes said:

Yet that is exactly what so many Sony trolls are doing these days to those of us who enjoy Canon and Nikon gear. I use both and love both brands; they have given me great joy with photography and never let me down.

I don't care if someone prefers Sony. I have a few friends who do and we get along great. That's because I don't tell them how their preferred choice sucks, nor do they tell me that about mine.

So what annoys me is how Sony fans/trolls seem determined to take over these Canon and Nikon forums, and spoil it for everyone else. Let us discuss and enjoy our preferred brands.

Click to expand...

Titles of active threads appear to the right of the DPR front page and it is from there that you get quite a few people coming in to defend.

Click to expand...

It is obvious that this is a Canon forum, no matter how you got here. You are smarter than that. And why should anyone feel compelled to come into a Canon forum and "defend" Sony? I don't feel compelled to go into a Sony forum and defend Canon or Nikon. I let the Sony users have their fun, as it should be.

Bob Janes said:

If you don't want input from experienced Sony mirrorless users, stop posting topics that attack Sony in the title - then no-one will need to come in to correct false impressions.

Click to expand...

First this is a Canon forum. Nothing wrong with an analysis that elevate Canon over another brand. It's what you would expect. And it is not your role to "correct" people.

If I went to a forum for the fans of the Pittsburgh Steelers football team, I wouldn't begrudge them for saying good things about the Steelers and down talking other teams. Insert whatever sports team/brand you want.

Second the majority of the threads comparing Canon and Sony in this forum have been ones trying to trash talk Canon and hype up Sony. That is what is annoying.

In fact at one point it seemed that every other thread was this theme of Sony over Canon, again in a Canon forum. So I am attempting to balance it out with this thread.

RicksAstro said:

Thoughts R Us said:

I agree...but what I would ask is why Sony users and fans try to take over this forum and extol the virtues of their Sony brand in a Canon forum?

Click to expand...

So to lessen the talk about Sony on the Canon forum you....talk about Sony on the Canon Forum.

Click to expand...

I try to provide a more balanced perspective noting the Canon advantages. Me not posting this would not lessen the activity of the trolls in extolling Sony and trash talking Canon.

And quite frankly, in a Canon forum there is nothing wrong with Canon fans up talking their brand and noting competitive advantages over another.

I don't go into the Sony forum and see how they hype up Sony over Canon.

I don't go into a sports bar with Steeler fans and trash talk them and complain that they are trash talking other teams.

Let Canon users and those interested in Canon have their fun.

Thoughts R Us said:

Canon and Nikon have effectively boxed Sony in. By both going with larger and more technologically advanced mounts for mirrorless, they have left Sony the odd man out with the small mount. I bet Panasonic's FF mirrorless also features a larger mount. When all is said and done Sony will be left with the most primitive mount.

Canon will have faster lenses and Sony won't be able to compete in that area. Canon already flexed its muscle by releasing 2 of those faster lenses with the new R.

Also, whenever Sony releases new models, they will be compared with the superior ergonomics of Canon and Nikon. Unless Sony does a major redesign, they will look and feel worse.

And anyone going into a camera store to handle the Canon and the Sony, will mostly choose the Canon because it feels so much better and offers the superior user experience.

Click to expand...

The scary thing is you probably believe all the tripe you write!

Hillarious, absolutely hillarious.

Thoughts R Us said:

RicksAstro said:

Thoughts R Us said:

I agree...but what I would ask is why Sony users and fans try to take over this forum and extol the virtues of their Sony brand in a Canon forum?

Click to expand...

So to lessen the talk about Sony on the Canon forum you....talk about Sony on the Canon Forum.

Click to expand...

I try to provide a more balanced perspective noting the Canon advantages. Me not posting this would not lessen the activity of the trolls in extolling Sony and trash talking Canon.

And quite frankly, in a Canon forum there is nothing wrong with Canon fans up talking their brand and noting competitive advantages over another.

I don't go into the Sony forum and see how they hype up Sony over Canon.

I don't go into a sports bar with Steeler fans and trash talk them and complain that they are trash talking other teams.

Let Canon users and those interested in Canon have their fun.

Click to expand...

I didn't know we were supposed to by hyping "our" cameras...my bad.

Go...team...I guess?

Whilst the mount improvement will be good long term, the EOS R really won't make Sony worry too much. If Canon had come out all guns blazing then Sony would worry. Sadly Canon came out with the least impressive FF mirrorless camera of the three. Canon still cripple video, still recycle sensors, still leave out big features like IBIS and just use the one SD card slot for good measure (I know this is one Nikon did too).

I have been holding off on jumping ship until I knew what Sony, Nikon and Canon had to offer. Part of me kept the dream alive of Canon competing but sadly it wasn't worth the wait. Same old Canon.

On the plus side, that Fuji X-T3 looks incredible and will meet most of my needs.

You have obviously read Kirk Tuck's comment about the lens mount sizes vis a vis Canon/Nikon and Sony - so the observation is not yours. He makes a point, many points in fact, that you seem incapable of doing in countless posts across DPR.

Your uneducated brand-bashing serves no purpose... One minute your on Nikon Z forum praising everything about it (bashing the haters, ironically), the next it's Canon R (bashing the haters, ironically) and both have one thing in common - you have a go at Sony. Why? As others have stated, are you insecure?

You're on a fool's errand as there's very little meat to any of your 'observations' and even if there was, your presentation of these 'eye opening insights into the future of FF mirrorless' is sadly lacking. You come over as a demented fan boy (but for which brand I'm unsure?). As long as it's Sony you're laughing at...

You remind me of MrHollywood, another know-it-all who can't filter his thoughts into a rational discourse.

I don't mean to offend but I do find your ignorance offensive.

M.