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Saw the Canon 300D today

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Ah, you mean those cheapish, badly cropped, sexist images? Yep, just reported him, for fun I think :-PP

He's a too big personality to fit in only one forum, I believe Phil should dedicate him an entire forum: "Peter's Canon Rant Forum" or should be Phorum??
Jonathan F. said:
AdWiser said:
...and start taking some pictures.
--
regards,
AdWiser
Click to expand...
--
------------------------------



I'm Canadian. I miss ketchup chips.

inhousephoto inc. digital • photography • media
http://www.inhousephoto.com
Click to expand...
--
regards,
AdWiser
 
that is a pathetic reply .. brand worship eh ?
zettlers said:
Julio S said:
Hi all:

I actually saw and held the Digital Rebel today. I know I'm a Nikon
fan, but my gosh... This thing is so light it feels like I'm
holding a Fuji Finepix 2800 (That plastic feel). The D100 feels
like an F5 compared to this Digital Rebel.

I took a few shots with it in the store today. It's definitely been
made "cheaper" in more ways than one.

We all know those nice little "glowing" rectangles in the
viewfinder with our Nikons that indicate focus area of
concentration... This one has little LED lights that look like an
old time pinball LED lights. There is no area focus spot for the
lower part of the viewfinder. All areas are spread to the left,
right and above the center of the viewfinder.

The lens is basically similar to the Nikon 28-85 G lens. It's very
light and the inside of the lens pops in and out as you zoom. The
shutter has a very loud "click" when you snap off a shot. Focusing
is SLOW. Very very slow.

I had to press the shutter a few times to get it to focus properly
in the store when shooting at subjects very near or not as
"defined" in the viewfinder. For example...if someone was standing
very close to a shelf of merchandise, the AF had some trouble. If
they moved forward and away from the shelf, the camera found it's
focus point well.

While I could only review the shots on the viewfinder, they looked
ok... proper color, balance, clarity...etc.. The camera has basic
information in the viewfinder. I really didn't like the LED's in
the viewfinder and found them distracting... I much prefer the
softer shaded light indicator of the Nikon.

CompUSA was selling it at a price of $999.

I'm not sure if it's a show stopper or just a toy. Time will tell.

http://www.pbase.com/loansharkx

Regards,

Julio
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
NSLRT your post
that is a pathetic reply .. brand worship eh ?

Pathetic reply? Brand worship? James, your postings would suggest that you have a pathetic history of comments for the short time that you have been at this forum. Certainly nothing constructive.
--------------------------------------
NSLRT your post

Where are the Canon bashers by the way ? ;-)
--------------------------------------
NSLRT your post with a snide comment pertaining to the D2H.

Baaaahahahahaaaaa…
then why the pics at Imaging Resource were withdrawn ;-)
--------------------------------------

NSLRT your post suggesting a snide challenge to the D2H. The link was provided after your post but no further comment from you.

Could you post the link to the below article ? if you can :-)
---------------------------------------
300DT your post screwed up forgetting to post a link
Hi ..

Just wanted to let you all know .. !
---------------------------------------
300DT you post screwed up corrected. A little 300D brand worship perhaps?

Oops .. here is the link ..
---------------------------------------

300DT your post. A little 300D brand worship perhaps? Even a little snotty with a Canon user I'd say.

No ..Sergart .. the 'happy' people are out taking pictures with their 300D ..
Only the whiners keep the forum busy .. :-)
LOL
--------------------------------------
10D/D60/D30 Forum your post

You provided a link to a Steve’s POTD on a Canon forum. The POTD was taken with a Sony. Your point?
--------------------------------------

Those were all your posts to date. For you being a newbie poster, I’m not impressed. Perhaps you have the makings of a Flame Baiter. Somehow I don't think that even the Canon folks will appreciate your contributions much less the Nikon folks.
james2 said:
zettlers said:
the only real problem with the 300D is that it is a Canon not a
Nikon:)
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Larry Gleason
 
Jim T H said:
Jeff-n-MN said:
I think you have missed the point. The 300D was not intended to
compete with your D100 or the 10D. Or was it intended to be used by
pro's as a primary camera. It is intended to be an entry level DSLR
that can support more than a pop out lens like a PNS where a little
more creativity can be used.
Click to expand...
... because NIkon can also drop the price of the D100, since the
R&D has been amortized. Don't forget that the D100 is an older
camera than the 10D.
Click to expand...
Nikon hasn't been willing to even have the D100 match the 10D's price. I hardly think they'll drop it down to compete with the 300D's price.

In most parts of the world, the D100 is priced higher than the 10D, which is priced higher than the 300D.
Jim T H said:
Nope, the 300D is not driving down the price of pro cameras. It is
Nikon that is driving down down pro prices. Remember the D1 - new
price point and stunning quality. Remember the D100 ($1,999) in
2002. Well the D2H is about to do the same thing. This camera will
be selling at about $3200-$3400 next month, almost the same price
as the Canon D30 back in 2000.
Click to expand...
That's hilarious. Your comparing digital of current cameras to prices from 3 years ago? Come on. That's ridiculous.
Jim T H said:
The point is that Nikon doesn't really need to offer a D75. The
D100 is an excellent and proven camera with custom curves. If Nikon
sells it at $1200, it cannot make enough cameras to meet the demand.
Click to expand...
Again, Nikon hasn't even been willing to match the 10D's price. Doing at least that might add some credence to your argument. But not even that has happened yet. If it were so easy to make such drastic changes to price, they certainly are free to do so. You have to remember that the current D100 price already reflects a price cut in response to the 10D's intro price. If it weren't for the 10D, the D100 would still be selling in the $2000 range.
 
In any given population, you're going to have a certain percentage of every type of opinion, every type of personality, every type of person. That's normal. Nothing is ever 100%, especially when dealing with a population of people, particularly a population of people greatly differing in interests, goals, skill levels, economic levels, etc. But as they say in sales, 100% of nothing is nothing. And that's exactly what you have if you aren't playing in that particular segment.
Jim T H said:
Tim O'Connor said:
Well, having owned a G1, I can tell you that the above is just
stupid. There is NO comparison between the speed and handling of a
compact digital and an SLR, of any sort, IMHO. The only advantage
the compact has is that it is compact (duh), and more self
contained.
Click to expand...
Well, Mr. clever O'Conner this is what I mean.

This 300D guy regrets his G3

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1031&message=6150322

This 300D guy misses his Coolpix spot meter

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1031&message=6150534

This guy is grappling with the complexities of flash exposure

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1031&message=6145725

How's this for a laugh. This 10D owner just discovered the crop factor

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=6150620

--
Jim
Click to expand...
 
Larry...this guy is typical 'Canon' fodder. Nothing good ever comes out of their mouths if it isnt FOR Canon. Basic Troll.

Allen
Larry Gleason said:
Pathetic reply? Brand worship? James, your postings would suggest
that you have a pathetic history of comments for the short time
that you have been at this forum. Certainly nothing constructive.
--------------------------------------
NSLRT your post

Where are the Canon bashers by the way ? ;-)
--------------------------------------
NSLRT your post with a snide comment pertaining to the D2H.

Baaaahahahahaaaaa…
then why the pics at Imaging Resource were withdrawn ;-)
--------------------------------------
NSLRT your post suggesting a snide challenge to the D2H. The link
was provided after your post but no further comment from you.

Could you post the link to the below article ? if you can :-)
---------------------------------------
300DT your post screwed up forgetting to post a link
Hi ..

Just wanted to let you all know .. !
---------------------------------------
300DT you post screwed up corrected. A little 300D brand worship
perhaps?

Oops .. here is the link ..
---------------------------------------
300DT your post. A little 300D brand worship perhaps? Even a little
snotty with a Canon user I'd say.

No ..Sergart .. the 'happy' people are out taking pictures with
their 300D ..
Only the whiners keep the forum busy .. :-)
LOL
--------------------------------------
10D/D60/D30 Forum your post

You provided a link to a Steve’s POTD on a Canon forum. The POTD
was taken with a Sony. Your point?
--------------------------------------
Those were all your posts to date. For you being a newbie poster,
I’m not impressed. Perhaps you have the makings of a Flame Baiter.
Somehow I don't think that even the Canon folks will appreciate
your contributions much less the Nikon folks.
james2 said:
zettlers said:
the only real problem with the 300D is that it is a Canon not a
Nikon:)
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Larry Gleason
Click to expand...
--
Allen DiLiegro
------------------
Equipment list in profile
 
Peter Phan said:
Nikon hasn't been willing to even have the D100 match the 10D's
price. I hardly think they'll drop it down to compete with the
300D's price.
Click to expand...
Once again you are wrong, Mr. Canon.

In Canada, the D100 has been dropping price the past few months. And in some online stores, the D100 has a lower price than the the 10D. And where there has been a price differential in favor of the 10D, it is $50 or less.

Smoke that in your pipe.

--
Richard D.
http://members.aol.com/richdong
http://www.photocritique.net/g/phtg?RICHARD+DONG
 
Peter Phan said:
Jim T H said:
Jeff-n-MN said:
I think you have missed the point. The 300D was not intended to
compete with your D100 or the 10D. Or was it intended to be used by
pro's as a primary camera. It is intended to be an entry level DSLR
that can support more than a pop out lens like a PNS where a little
more creativity can be used.
Click to expand...
... because NIkon can also drop the price of the D100, since the
R&D has been amortized. Don't forget that the D100 is an older
camera than the 10D.
Click to expand...
Nikon hasn't been willing to even have the D100 match the 10D's
price. I hardly think they'll drop it down to compete with the
300D's price.
Click to expand...
Nikon doesn't need to match the 10D price. Buyers are willing to pay a $200 premium over the 10D because the D100 has no AF issues. Nikon can continue to sell D100 even after it launches the D200. The price can be at a $400 premium to the 300D, and it will still sell alot. NIkon is honest and doesn't need to resort to trickery like crippled firmware.
Peter Phan said:
Peter Phan said:
Peter Phan said:
Nope, the 300D is not driving down the price of pro cameras. It is
Click to expand...
Nikon that is driving down down pro prices. Remember the D1 - new
price point and stunning quality. Remember the D100 ($1,999) in
2002. Well the D2H is about to do the same thing. This camera will
be selling at about $3200-$3400 next month, almost the same price
as the Canon D30 back in 2000.
Click to expand...
That's hilarious. Your comparing digital of current cameras to
prices from 3 years ago? Come on. That's ridiculous.
Click to expand...
I am reciting history. Since you have a selectable memory, I remind you that it is Nikon that has relentlessly driven down the DSLR price, AND increased the value.
Peter Phan said:
Peter Phan said:
The point is that Nikon doesn't really need to offer a D75. The
D100 is an excellent and proven camera with custom curves. If Nikon
sells it at $1200, it cannot make enough cameras to meet the demand.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Jim
 
Richard, I think you missed this part of my post:

"In most parts of the world, the D100 is priced higher than the 10D, which is priced higher than the 300D."

And indeed, this statement remains true by a fairly significant price margin. But the added point was that Nikon is unlikely to drop the D100 to compete with the 300D. Most people, I think, would agree that that statement remains true as well.

But please post links to credible vendors that do sell the D100 for less than the 10D, for the benefit of those who might be ready for such a purchase. That would be a nice contribution to the community.
Richard Dong said:
Once again you are wrong, Mr. Canon.

In Canada, the D100 has been dropping price the past few months.
And in some online stores, the D100 has a lower price than the the
10D. And where there has been a price differential in favor of the
10D, it is $50 or less.

Smoke that in your pipe.

--
Richard D.
http://members.aol.com/richdong
http://www.photocritique.net/g/phtg?RICHARD+DONG
Click to expand...
 
Wait a minute. Weren't you the guy who earlier suggested that Nikon could "drop the price of the D100, since the R&D has been amortized. Don't forget that the D100 is an older camera than the 10D."

And now, you just said, "Nikon doesn't need to match the 10D price. Buyers are willing to pay a $200 premium over the 10D because the D100 has no AF issues."

You're talking out of both sides of your mouth here. Remember that the original point is how Nikon is going to address the 300D's price point. Remember? You started by saying that they could lower the D100's price. Then you back-tracked by saying that users want to pay a $200 premium over the 10D's price ($600 to $700 over the 300D's price). Well, that doesn't sound like a very good solution at all, Jim.

First of all, you need to keep track of your thoughts. Concentrate! Secondly, buyers who choose the D100 over the 10D are in the minority, for whatever reason (price, performance, value, lenses, etc, etc.). However, if you are talking about current Nikon users, then yes they are willing to pay a $200 premium because they don't want to have to switch brands. And thirdly, keep in mind that the 10D continues to sell exceptionally well in spite of the big focus hysteria. Most people realize that occassional faulty units can come out of any company, including Nikon. But Canon service is exceptionally good, which seems to smooth things over for most people who do have problems. I would even go so far as to say that Canon service is significantly better than Nikon service.
 
actually that's not what thom said. to quote him, "The surprise here is the return of the F4-like matrix metering with non-CPU lenses (note that you have to be in Aperture-priority or Manual exposure mode with most manual focus lenses). Not necessarily anything exciting, but it does restore a function we lost with the F5 and subsequent cameras."

the d1/h/x (and the f5 i think) will meter in center and spot modes and will expose in manual and aperture-priority modes with AI and AI-S lenses. what they don't do is matrix metering and program or shutter-priority exposure modes. so they are compatible with non-CPU lenses, but with a reduced feature set.

the d2h will give you matrix metering, but you'll still have to be in aperture-priority or manual exposure. i don't know why you can't use program mode since the old fg could do this with AI lenses.

the d100 won't do any of these, but i've found that it will do ttl-flash with AI lenses.

--
http://pbase.com/ottokalata
(equipment list is in my profile)
Jim T H said:
... on your luck. The D2H will use the non-CPU lenses. Ohhh, Thom
Hogan says that Nikon ceased to support the old lenses when they
launched the F5. So, it's not surprising that the first digital
SLRs were not compatible with the old lenses.
Click to expand...
 
but do you ever read what you write? Sometimes your posts shock me. It is Nikon who drives the price of pro-cameras down. They haven't even introduced a camera in years (I meand on the shelf) .... The 300D is the first DSRL unde $1,000 including lens and Nikon is the one driving prices down....

Please, be reasonable. Does it really help to sustain a point just for the sake of it. NIkon is Nikon, CAnon is Canon and each have their merits. At present Nikon needs to catch up. we all hope it will do. But pretending otherwise doesn't help anybody, it only shows we are not rationale for our preference for this brand.

Peter Phan has opinions which many don't like but at least he provides logical arguments. And I think that at present he is right. I hope not for long, I hope Nikon will come back, but hey, they haven't done it yet.

http://www.pbase.com/adriank
 
Adrian Calin said:
but do you ever read what you write? Sometimes your posts shock
me. It is Nikon who drives the price of pro-cameras down. They
haven't even introduced a camera in years (I meand on the shelf)
.... The 300D is the first DSRL unde $1,000 including lens and
Nikon is the one driving prices down....

Please, be reasonable. Does it really help to sustain a point just
for the sake of it. NIkon is Nikon, CAnon is Canon and each have
their merits. At present Nikon needs to catch up. we all hope it
will do. But pretending otherwise doesn't help anybody, it only
shows we are not rationale for our preference for this brand.

Peter Phan has opinions which many don't like but at least he
provides logical arguments. And I think that at present he is
right. I hope not for long, I hope Nikon will come back, but hey,
they haven't done it yet.

http://www.pbase.com/adriank
Click to expand...
--
http://www.pbase.com/adriank
 
AllenD said:
Allen
Larry Gleason said:
Pathetic reply? Brand worship? James, your postings would suggest
that you have a pathetic history of comments for the short time
that you have been at this forum. Certainly nothing constructive.
--------------------------------------
NSLRT your post

Where are the Canon bashers by the way ? ;-)
--------------------------------------
NSLRT your post with a snide comment pertaining to the D2H.

Baaaahahahahaaaaa…
then why the pics at Imaging Resource were withdrawn ;-)
--------------------------------------
NSLRT your post suggesting a snide challenge to the D2H. The link
was provided after your post but no further comment from you.

Could you post the link to the below article ? if you can :-)
---------------------------------------
300DT your post screwed up forgetting to post a link
Hi ..

Just wanted to let you all know .. !
---------------------------------------
300DT you post screwed up corrected. A little 300D brand worship
perhaps?

Oops .. here is the link ..
---------------------------------------
300DT your post. A little 300D brand worship perhaps? Even a little
snotty with a Canon user I'd say.

No ..Sergart .. the 'happy' people are out taking pictures with
their 300D ..
Only the whiners keep the forum busy .. :-)
LOL
--------------------------------------
10D/D60/D30 Forum your post

You provided a link to a Steve’s POTD on a Canon forum. The POTD
was taken with a Sony. Your point?
--------------------------------------
Those were all your posts to date. For you being a newbie poster,
I’m not impressed. Perhaps you have the makings of a Flame Baiter.
Somehow I don't think that even the Canon folks will appreciate
your contributions much less the Nikon folks.
james2 said:
zettlers said:
the only real problem with the 300D is that it is a Canon not a
Nikon:)
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Larry Gleason
Click to expand...
--
Allen DiLiegro
------------------
Equipment list in profile
Click to expand...
i guess no one really knows, at this stage of the game what Nikon
can or wants to do about the 300D situation, I don't think they
can afford to ignore it for long, this may turn out to be the first
real mass migration by heretofore Nikon loyalists.

Yes I will need new lenses either way, but really the standard
kit lens giving me an equivalent 28-90mm, plus the addition of
an equivalent 24mm lens will provde me with all I really need.
I don't think that the "kit" lens is as bad as some ney sayers
want to believe, it certainly doesn't feel that cheap. I think if Canon
is subsidising the price at all, its likely the $100 price of the lens
rather than the cost of the body!

I guess I'll hold out for a while hoping Nikon will soon be
forthcoming with an announcement!
I'm still willing to give Nikon the benefit of the doubt.
But, $1000 US for body and 28-90mm lens !!!
Can Nikon get within range?
 
Nikon needs a Camera that is equal or better than 300D at the same or lower price range. Words along cannot stop people buying 300D.

Percy
s majesk said:
AllenD said:
Allen
Larry Gleason said:
Pathetic reply? Brand worship? James, your postings would suggest
that you have a pathetic history of comments for the short time
that you have been at this forum. Certainly nothing constructive.
--------------------------------------
NSLRT your post

Where are the Canon bashers by the way ? ;-)
--------------------------------------
NSLRT your post with a snide comment pertaining to the D2H.

Baaaahahahahaaaaa…
then why the pics at Imaging Resource were withdrawn ;-)
--------------------------------------
NSLRT your post suggesting a snide challenge to the D2H. The link
was provided after your post but no further comment from you.

Could you post the link to the below article ? if you can :-)
---------------------------------------
300DT your post screwed up forgetting to post a link
Hi ..

Just wanted to let you all know .. !
---------------------------------------
300DT you post screwed up corrected. A little 300D brand worship
perhaps?

Oops .. here is the link ..
---------------------------------------
300DT your post. A little 300D brand worship perhaps? Even a little
snotty with a Canon user I'd say.

No ..Sergart .. the 'happy' people are out taking pictures with
their 300D ..
Only the whiners keep the forum busy .. :-)
LOL
--------------------------------------
10D/D60/D30 Forum your post

You provided a link to a Steve’s POTD on a Canon forum. The POTD
was taken with a Sony. Your point?
--------------------------------------
Those were all your posts to date. For you being a newbie poster,
I’m not impressed. Perhaps you have the makings of a Flame Baiter.
Somehow I don't think that even the Canon folks will appreciate
your contributions much less the Nikon folks.
james2 said:
zettlers said:
the only real problem with the 300D is that it is a Canon not a
Nikon:)
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Larry Gleason
Click to expand...
--
Allen DiLiegro
------------------
Equipment list in profile
Click to expand...
i guess no one really knows, at this stage of the game what Nikon
can or wants to do about the 300D situation, I don't think they
can afford to ignore it for long, this may turn out to be the first
real mass migration by heretofore Nikon loyalists.

Yes I will need new lenses either way, but really the standard
kit lens giving me an equivalent 28-90mm, plus the addition of
an equivalent 24mm lens will provde me with all I really need.
I don't think that the "kit" lens is as bad as some ney sayers
want to believe, it certainly doesn't feel that cheap. I think if
Canon
is subsidising the price at all, its likely the $100 price of the lens
rather than the cost of the body!

I guess I'll hold out for a while hoping Nikon will soon be
forthcoming with an announcement!
I'm still willing to give Nikon the benefit of the doubt.
But, $1000 US for body and 28-90mm lens !!!
Can Nikon get within range?
Click to expand...
 
Richard Dong said:
Peter Phan said:
But please post links to credible vendors that do sell the D100 for
less than the 10D, for the benefit of those who might be ready for
such a purchase. That would be a nice contribution to the
community.
Click to expand...
No after you Mr. Phan. Please post links from around the world.
Click to expand...
Just go to any place that sells the 10D and D100. It's pretty consistent. Why? Ask Nikon. They set their price to vendors. And that price is reflected in the price to customers.
 
... To clear up any confusion in your mind:

1) In the past, Nikon has happily set a premium over the 10D because they can sell every D100 they can make. The buyers include new users and Nikon upgraders. One of the key issues has been the AF problems encountered by users of the D30/D60/10D. Why is the AF problem so persistent? Because Canon uses less sensitive sensors (Canon f/2.8 vs Nikon f/5.6). Read Richard Dong's explanation. Another example of cost cutting by Canon.

2) In the future, Nikon can keep selling the D100 after they introduce the D200 (LBCAST sensor?). Since the R&D costs have been amortized, the D100 could be sold for a low low price. The D100 is proven and well known. A new product would involve a lot of R&D and marketing/PR costs.

3) Why do you attack every point? You obviously have no competency in managerial or financial matters. In fact, you don't really understand technical issues. Look at the way that you have been forced to backtrack on the ISO/noise issue.

Why don't you do yourself favour and zip your mouth. Listen to the people who have experience and intelligence, and actually push the cameras to the limit. Ha!

Jim
Peter Phan said:
Wait a minute. Weren't you the guy who earlier suggested that
Nikon could "drop the price of the D100, since the R&D has been
amortized. Don't forget that the D100 is an older camera than the
10D."

And now, you just said, "Nikon doesn't need to match the 10D price.
Buyers are willing to pay a $200 premium over the 10D because the
D100 has no AF issues."

You're talking out of both sides of your mouth here. Remember that
the original point is how Nikon is going to address the 300D's
price point. Remember? You started by saying that they could
lower the D100's price. Then you back-tracked by saying that users
want to pay a $200 premium over the 10D's price ($600 to $700 over
the 300D's price). Well, that doesn't sound like a very good
solution at all, Jim.

First of all, you need to keep track of your thoughts.
Concentrate! Secondly, buyers who choose the D100 over the 10D are
in the minority, for whatever reason (price, performance, value,
lenses, etc, etc.). However, if you are talking about current
Nikon users, then yes they are willing to pay a $200 premium
because they don't want to have to switch brands. And thirdly,
keep in mind that the 10D continues to sell exceptionally well in
spite of the big focus hysteria. Most people realize that
occassional faulty units can come out of any company, including
Nikon. But Canon service is exceptionally good, which seems to
smooth things over for most people who do have problems. I would
even go so far as to say that Canon service is significantly better
than Nikon service.
Click to expand...
--
Jim
 
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