need some input for D2X

md11171134

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Hi guys,

I am thinking of getting a D2X but I am not a pro, I use to have a F4 with 3 AFD-lens to 2 AF-lens also SB22, SB24 and a Metz 60CT-4. What my question is if I use my old flashs without getting the new SB800 am I going to lose a lot of advatage of using this HT D2X camera?

Why I choose D2X because I just think I should get a Nikon digital camera ISO Fuji S2 well I don't know I think I feel better with Nikon???
Or I should wait for the Fuji S3???
 
I assume that you mean D2H? The D2X has not been announced yet.

Best regards,
Bernard
Hi guys,

I am thinking of getting a D2X but I am not a pro, I use to have a
F4 with 3 AFD-lens to 2 AF-lens also SB22, SB24 and a Metz 60CT-4.
What my question is if I use my old flashs without getting the new
SB800 am I going to lose a lot of advatage of using this HT D2X
camera?
Why I choose D2X because I just think I should get a Nikon digital
camera ISO Fuji S2 well I don't know I think I feel better with
Nikon???
Or I should wait for the Fuji S3???
 
I think he means D2X. Most non professional photographers pass over the D2H because it is not 100MP.

To answer MD11, no those flashes will not work with Nikon's digital SLRs, at least not in TTL mode. However, they will work just fine in auto.

The Fuji S2 will work in TTL mode with nikon (or third party) flashes at also support the feature.

JB
Best regards,
Bernard
Hi guys,

I am thinking of getting a D2X but I am not a pro, I use to have a
F4 with 3 AFD-lens to 2 AF-lens also SB22, SB24 and a Metz 60CT-4.
What my question is if I use my old flashs without getting the new
SB800 am I going to lose a lot of advatage of using this HT D2X
camera?
Why I choose D2X because I just think I should get a Nikon digital
camera ISO Fuji S2 well I don't know I think I feel better with
Nikon???
Or I should wait for the Fuji S3???
--
http://www.pbase.com/jbviajero
 
it doesn't matter if "non-pro" or "pro" 4 mps is nothing for a cam in like the D2H in the year 2003/2004 !
To answer MD11, no those flashes will not work with Nikon's digital
SLRs, at least not in TTL mode. However, they will work just fine
in auto.

The Fuji S2 will work in TTL mode with nikon (or third party)
flashes at also support the feature.

JB
Best regards,
Bernard
Hi guys,

I am thinking of getting a D2X but I am not a pro, I use to have a
F4 with 3 AFD-lens to 2 AF-lens also SB22, SB24 and a Metz 60CT-4.
What my question is if I use my old flashs without getting the new
SB800 am I going to lose a lot of advatage of using this HT D2X
camera?
Why I choose D2X because I just think I should get a Nikon digital
camera ISO Fuji S2 well I don't know I think I feel better with
Nikon???
Or I should wait for the Fuji S3???
--
http://www.pbase.com/jbviajero
 
I disagree. The six megapixels of my D1x or my editor's D100 are vastly more than is needed for a quarter- to half-page color photo in our newspaper. For this reason, professionals like to belittle anyone who says mepapixels are important and bases which camera they chose partially on megapixels. What they mean is "IF YOU'RE A PHOTOJOURNALIST, megapixels aren't particularly important." This is frustrating for those of us who aren't just PJs and are treated like we're silly fools for caring about megapixels.

Here's the problem...if you're taking a group photo of 40 people at a wedding, four megapixels isn't going to allow each of those people to have facial detail. The same is true of expansive landscape shots. SHOCKINGLY, some of the people who pay hundreds of dollars to get professional portraits done are going to want bigger than 8x10 or 11x14 prints!! Some of them are going to want painting-sized framed portraits to hang over the mantle. Even if that's of one person and ESPECIALLY if it's of a family, four to six megapixels just don't have the detail to go that big.

So despite being mocked by 'pros' you just keep caring about megapixels when chosing a camera. Just don't forget that that's not the ONLY thing you need to care about. For example, my 6 megapixel D1x will have much more detail than the new 8 megapixel Sony (sorry I can't recall the model name) because the sensor is several times larger.

--
Lee Saxon, AIAS

Nikon D1x
Nikon FE
Nikkor 17-35mm f/2.8D ED-IF AF-S
Nikkor 28-200mm f/3.5-5.6D IF AF
Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED-IF AF-S VR
Nikkor 50mm f/1.8D AF
micro-Nikkor 55mm f/2.8 AI-s
Sony VAIO GR290K
 
Sotare,

Please forgive me being so frank, but what you write below just isn't correct. 4MP is what the people this camera was designed for need.

I might not meet what you think your needs are, but this is not the camera's problem, that is yours.

Best regards,
Bernard
To answer MD11, no those flashes will not work with Nikon's digital
SLRs, at least not in TTL mode. However, they will work just fine
in auto.

The Fuji S2 will work in TTL mode with nikon (or third party)
flashes at also support the feature.

JB
Best regards,
Bernard
Hi guys,

I am thinking of getting a D2X but I am not a pro, I use to have a
F4 with 3 AFD-lens to 2 AF-lens also SB22, SB24 and a Metz 60CT-4.
What my question is if I use my old flashs without getting the new
SB800 am I going to lose a lot of advatage of using this HT D2X
camera?
Why I choose D2X because I just think I should get a Nikon digital
camera ISO Fuji S2 well I don't know I think I feel better with
Nikon???
Or I should wait for the Fuji S3???
--
http://www.pbase.com/jbviajero
 
I might not meet what you think your needs are, but this is not the
camera's problem, that is yours.

Best regards,
Bernard
I know exactly what my needs are: 2400x3600 pixels (but I will gladly accept more). I don't have a problem. If Nikon wants to sell me a camera, then THEY have the problem.
I think he means D2X. Most non professional photographers pass > > > over
the D2H because it is not 100MP.
I would venture to guess that a LOT of professionals pass over the D2h because of its low pixel count. Back in the olden days of film, very many pros used medium and large format.

The D2h is great for those that want to blaze off 40 frames in 5 seconds, but I doubt a large format user would get too excited about that. Some photographers only need to take 1 shot.

The D2h is aimed squarely at PJs and sports photographers. It would probably also be good at snapshots. But for the miriad of other photographic uses, 4MP comes up a bit short.

--
Tuktu Sijuktei
'Please tell me if the lens cap is on.'
 
Hi Lee -

Most of your comments seemed right on, to me.

But I don't think it's by any means a slam dunk
that the D1x has "much more detail" than the
828 will have.

Here are DPReview's resolution figures for the
D1x vs. the (current) Sony F717:

Horizontal: D1x=1600, F717=1450
Diagonal: D1x=900, F717=1000
Vertical: D1x=1150, F717=1300

It would be extremely surprising if Sony's new
8MP flagship did not exceed the performance
of their 5MP F717. And if it does, its fine detail
should not be at all shabby, even if compared
to a D1x.

Of course, there are various other measures of
image quality... notably noise. The smaller
F828 sensor SHOULD result in considerably
more noise than the D1x.

...Still hoping that there will be a D2x, and that
I'll be able to afford it...

Ed
(snip)

So despite being mocked by 'pros' you just keep caring about
megapixels when chosing a camera. Just don't forget that that's not
the ONLY thing you need to care about. For example, my 6 megapixel
D1x will have much more detail than the new 8 megapixel Sony (sorry
I can't recall the model name) because the sensor is several times
larger.

--
Lee Saxon, AIAS
 
I know exactly what my needs are: 2400x3600 pixels (but I will
gladly accept more). I don't have a problem. If Nikon wants to sell
me a camera, then THEY have the problem.
That's fine - but quite obviously the D2H isn't aimed at you ;) The fact that the D2H is "only" 4MP isn't a problem with the camera - it suits it's target market quite well and won't have any problem selling. The problem you have is with Nikon not releasing the D2X right now, not with the D2H.
I would venture to guess that a LOT of professionals pass over the
D2h because of its low pixel count. Back in the olden days of film,
very many pros used medium and large format.
And many more pros used 35mm - what's your point?

The D2H doesn't have a "low" pixel count - it is just aimed at a market that you are not a part of. There are a LOT of professionals for whom this camera meets or exceeds their requirements and who will be more than happy to buy as soon as they can get their hands on them ;)

I think what the prior post was saying is that professionals typically know what kind of pixel count they need - we know our reproduction technologies, and as such we know exactly what the maximum requirements our photos will have and there is no point in recording copious ammounts of detail that we won't use. All else being equal, more pixels mean smaller photosites (which means more noise and lower dynamic range), a slower camera and ultimately more data that needs to be processed, transmitted and archived - if I'm not going to use them, then I don't want to pay for them ;)
The D2h is great for those that want to blaze off 40 frames in 5
seconds, but I doubt a large format user would get too excited
about that. Some photographers only need to take 1 shot.
And again, the D2H is not aimed at that market - Nikon did just fine in the 35mm SLR market for many years, picking up LF and MF shooters is just gravy.
The D2h is aimed squarely at PJs and sports photographers. It would
probably also be good at snapshots. But for the miriad of other
photographic uses, 4MP comes up a bit short.
Exactly, and that's precisely why there will be a D2X in the future. The D2H is not aimed at the "miriad of other photographic uses", but instead the markets where 4MP is more than enough - the number of people buying the D1H and the 1D will tell you something about the market for this camera.
 
The problem you have is with Nikon not releasing the D2X
right now, not with the D2H.
As I said, I don't have a problem. If Nikon wants to sell me a camera then THEY have the problem. If Nikon doesn't announce a suitable camera for my needs within the next few months then I will buy a Canon 1Ds. Obviously I won't be buying any new Nikon glass until I know that I need it. I'd prefer to stick with Nikon, simply due to familairity, but I'm not too old to learn a new camera system.
I would venture to guess that a LOT of professionals pass over the
D2h because of its low pixel count. Back in the olden days of film,
very many pros used medium and large format.
And many more pros used 35mm - what's your point?
My point, I thought, was obvious. Ask your wife. Sometimes faster is not necessarily better.

I'm not knocking the D2h. It looks like an excellent design for what must be a fairly small segment of the market. It certainly isn't suitable for weddings, studio, most stock, scenics, gallery prints, portraiture, ...

My comments were directed mainly at the poster who claimed that only amateurs want more pixels. This is total hogwash. If people didn't want larger prints or more cropping options there would never have been a market for medium and large formats. The same is true of digital.
I think what the prior post was saying is that professionals
typically know what kind of pixel count they need - we know our
reproduction technologies, and as such we know exactly what the
maximum requirements our photos will have and there is no point in
recording copious ammounts of detail that we won't use.
Except, sometimes we don't know what the requirements of our final image will be and therefore need to record enough detail to cover the most demanding uses. I do publication and stock work, which means I often have no idea what my images will be required to do. Some are printed almost contact size while others are used for large posters. Ideally I would like around 12-15MP. This would give me the comfort of knowing that my images could be used for almost anything.
Nikon did just
fine in the 35mm SLR market for many years, picking up LF and MF
shooters is just gravy.
Provided they don't lose this market to Canon before they get the chance to taste the gravy.

Bill Gates once said, "640K ought to be enough for anybody." That sounded pretty stupid within a few short years. Nikon has not said that 4MP ought to be enough, but a lot of the Nikonophiles in this forum seem to accept it as gospel nonetheless.

--
Tuktu Sijuktei
'Please tell me if the lens cap is on.'
 
Both of you know what you're saying and I don't understand why you
guys seem to get into these message exchanges...

I don't understand what you two are arguing about... I can read back afew messages and understand what each one is saying but you two seem to wanna duke it out :)

Lets, relax and read the full message and its meaning before firing off another message :)

Peace

Arjh
The problem you have is with Nikon not releasing the D2X
right now, not with the D2H.
As I said, I don't have a problem. If Nikon wants to sell me a
camera then THEY have the problem. If Nikon doesn't announce a
suitable camera for my needs within the next few months then I will
buy a Canon 1Ds. Obviously I won't be buying any new Nikon glass
until I know that I need it. I'd prefer to stick with Nikon, simply
due to familairity, but I'm not too old to learn a new camera
system.
I would venture to guess that a LOT of professionals pass over the
D2h because of its low pixel count. Back in the olden days of film,
very many pros used medium and large format.
And many more pros used 35mm - what's your point?
My point, I thought, was obvious. Ask your wife. Sometimes faster
is not necessarily better.

I'm not knocking the D2h. It looks like an excellent design for
what must be a fairly small segment of the market. It certainly
isn't suitable for weddings, studio, most stock, scenics, gallery
prints, portraiture, ...

My comments were directed mainly at the poster who claimed that
only amateurs want more pixels. This is total hogwash. If people
didn't want larger prints or more cropping options there would
never have been a market for medium and large formats. The same is
true of digital.
I think what the prior post was saying is that professionals
typically know what kind of pixel count they need - we know our
reproduction technologies, and as such we know exactly what the
maximum requirements our photos will have and there is no point in
recording copious ammounts of detail that we won't use.
Except, sometimes we don't know what the requirements of our final
image will be and therefore need to record enough detail to cover
the most demanding uses. I do publication and stock work, which
means I often have no idea what my images will be required to do.
Some are printed almost contact size while others are used for
large posters. Ideally I would like around 12-15MP. This would give
me the comfort of knowing that my images could be used for almost
anything.
Nikon did just
fine in the 35mm SLR market for many years, picking up LF and MF
shooters is just gravy.
Provided they don't lose this market to Canon before they get the
chance to taste the gravy.

Bill Gates once said, "640K ought to be enough for anybody." That
sounded pretty stupid within a few short years. Nikon has not said
that 4MP ought to be enough, but a lot of the Nikonophiles in this
forum seem to accept it as gospel nonetheless.

--
Tuktu Sijuktei
'Please tell me if the lens cap is on.'
 
I agree with Kevin...so far the indications are that the D2H will exceed the resolution of the D1X...I make saleable 20 by 30 prints with my D1X...all this junk about an image that has not been shown yet is silly...so far the preproduction images appear to exceed the D1X...wheres the beef...
I might not meet what you think your needs are, but this is not the
camera's problem, that is yours.

Best regards,
Bernard
I know exactly what my needs are: 2400x3600 pixels (but I will
gladly accept more). I don't have a problem. If Nikon wants to sell
me a camera, then THEY have the problem.
I think he means D2X. Most non professional photographers pass > > > over
the D2H because it is not 100MP.
I would venture to guess that a LOT of professionals pass over the
D2h because of its low pixel count. Back in the olden days of film,
very many pros used medium and large format.

The D2h is great for those that want to blaze off 40 frames in 5
seconds, but I doubt a large format user would get too excited
about that. Some photographers only need to take 1 shot.

The D2h is aimed squarely at PJs and sports photographers. It would
probably also be good at snapshots. But for the miriad of other
photographic uses, 4MP comes up a bit short.

--
Tuktu Sijuktei
'Please tell me if the lens cap is on.'
--
****
 
Hello!
Here are DPReview's resolution figures for the
D1x vs. the (current) Sony F717:

Horizontal: D1x=1600, F717=1450
Diagonal: D1x=900, F717=1000
Vertical: D1x=1150, F717=1300

It would be extremely surprising if Sony's new
8MP flagship did not exceed the performance
of their 5MP F717. And if it does, its fine detail
should not be at all shabby, even if compared
to a D1x.
Perhaps, but coupled with a stinker lens like most other prosumer cameras, you'll still be left behind a D1x with ED glass - even if it says SONY on the front =o)

Frankly, I believe that few of us really need more than 6MPixels in general, then again realizing that there are situations where more is better.

As a D1x user, I'm obviously biased towards high end SLRs, but I would really like to see a prosumer camera deliver the same high imagequality from e.g. an old Nikon D1 (NEF -> QImage).

Who needs more megapixels, if all they do is show the imperfections of your lens? =o)

--
with regards
anders borum
 
if they give 6 or more pixel to the D2h it would be the best cam ever made and not just for PhotoJournalists !!! then everybody can use it for art and speed-fotos. but 4 is nothing for a cam like this.

And it is important ! does not matter what all the peopels say about the mpixel ! the just calm themself because they dont have a cam with more then 2 or 3 mps !
 
Hi Anders -

Well, no one is trying to persuade you to leave DSLRs
and go back to digicams. But you do seem to be a bit
out of touch with what's going on in the digicam world;
so I've inserted a few comments below...
Here are DPReview's resolution figures for the
D1x vs. the (current) Sony F717:

Horizontal: D1x=1600, F717=1450
Diagonal: D1x=900, F717=1000
Vertical: D1x=1150, F717=1300

It would be extremely surprising if Sony's new
8MP flagship did not exceed the performance
of their 5MP F717. And if it does, its fine detail
should not be at all shabby, even if compared
to a D1x.
Perhaps, but coupled with a stinker lens like most other prosumer
cameras, you'll still be left behind a D1x with ED glass - even if
it says SONY on the front =o)
Characterizing the lenses on the F-series Sonys as "stinkers"
is more than incorrect, it's a canard. They could not possibly
be "stinkers" and deliver the tremendous performance that
they do. (Look it up, if you'd like. Their performance has
been documented in various tests, on this and other sites.)

And by the way, they don't say SONY on the front;
they say CARL ZEISS. :

Lest you think I have no basis for comparison, I'll make
mention that I have about 15 Nikkors, along with various
Leica, Hasselblad, Rolleiflex, and Tokina lenses. The Zeiss/
Sony lenses are very competitive with any of these,
especially the zooms.
Frankly, I believe that few of us really need more than 6MPixels in
general, then again realizing that there are situations where more
is better.

As a D1x user, I'm obviously biased towards high end SLRs, but I
would really like to see a prosumer camera deliver the same high
imagequality from e.g. an old Nikon D1 (NEF -> QImage).
Well, the current Sony F717 tests out at about 20% higher
resolution than the D1. I'm going to take a wild guess and
predict that the F828 will be about 25% higher resolution
than the D1. On the other hand, the D1 should show much
better noise levels than the F-series Sonys, or any other (non-
DSLR) digicams.

I'm not going to get into color issues, because that is highly
subjective; and most every camera brand partisian will claim
that their colors are the best.
Who needs more megapixels, if all they do is show the imperfections
of your lens? =o)
You're not wrong that DSLRs enjoy image quality advantages
over even the best digicams. It's just that you're beating
the wrong horse when you trash their generally excellent
lenses. It's widely accepted at this point the lower noise
levels from the big DSLR sensors are the real advantage.
--
with regards
anders borum
Regards to you, too...

Ed
 
As I said, I don't have a problem. If Nikon wants to sell me a
camera then THEY have the problem. If Nikon doesn't announce a
suitable camera for my needs within the next few months then I will
buy a Canon 1Ds.
Go for it, I might do the same, but won't blame it on Nikon.
I'm not knocking the D2h. It looks like an excellent design for
what must be a fairly small segment of the market. It certainly
isn't suitable for weddings, studio, most stock, scenics, gallery
prints, portraiture, ...
Who said it was?
My comments were directed mainly at the poster who claimed that
only amateurs want more pixels. This is total hogwash. If people
didn't want larger prints or more cropping options there would
never have been a market for medium and large formats. The same is
true of digital.
I hope that you are not talking about me, because I never said that only amateurs want more pixels. I said that some pros know they don't need more pixels (perhaps impliying that most amateurs don't know that they might not need more - although this second part was not explicitely stated).
Except, sometimes we don't know what the requirements of our final
image will be and therefore need to record enough detail to cover
the most demanding uses. I do publication and stock work, which
means I often have no idea what my images will be required to do.
Some are printed almost contact size while others are used for
large posters. Ideally I would like around 12-15MP. This would give
me the comfort of knowing that my images could be used for almost
anything.
Again, you might not know what your pics will be used for, but a lot of pros know that a double magazine page is the largest enlargement that they will ever need. 4 M sharp and little noised pixels is enough for them.

They also know that a sharp pic taken thanks to a great AF will always be far supperior to a blurred pic taken with a lesser AF, even if the second camera has 4 times more pixels...

They also know that accurate colors gained thanks to an accurate WB system on the spot will save them hours of post-processing and will help them making sure that the pic on the first page of the NY Times with their name under it gets there within one hour with enough quality.
Bill Gates once said, "640K ought to be enough for anybody." That
sounded pretty stupid within a few short years. Nikon has not said
that 4MP ought to be enough, but a lot of the Nikonophiles in this
forum seem to accept it as gospel nonetheless.
It is well known that 4MP (again pixels of "good quality") is enough for a double page in a magazine at the current printing definition.

I am not aware of a move of any magazine towards higher definition printing technique, are you?

This won't happen in the next 3 years, because customers of magazine just don't ask for it. The current quality is enough, and it will not change within the next 3 years (life span of the D2H).

Since the D2H is targetting sports and PJ phtograpers, for whom magazines is the mahor output, I don't think that your Gates comparison is relevant. It sounds good, but, IMHO, it just doesn't make sense in the current context.

Best regards,
Bernard
 
Sotare, why won't you understand that a 6MP would be a worse camera for some people than a 4PM D2H???

Just don't buy it if you believe that it doesn't fit your needs, but please, stop bashing blindly a camera that is obviously just perfect for a category of photographers.

Regards,
Bernard
if they give 6 or more pixel to the D2h it would be the best cam
ever made and not just for PhotoJournalists !!! then everybody can
use it for art and speed-fotos. but 4 is nothing for a cam like
this.

And it is important ! does not matter what all the peopels say
about the mpixel ! the just calm themself because they dont have a
cam with more then 2 or 3 mps !
 

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