Reading mode: Light Dark

How to use a polarizing filter on 717

Go to last post
B

Bluto

Leading Member
Messages
692
Reaction score
10
Location
US
OK, here's a big drawback for EVF's for me ... when I attempt to use the polarizing filter on bright sunny days (when I would usually need one) I can see very little difference as I rotate the filter. Sometimes, just to be sure I get the right shot, I take the picture 4 times and rotate the filter 90 degress each time.

So how do all of you maximize the effect of the filter? The only other option I have found is to set it in aperature priority mode and watch the shutter speed as I rotate it. The slowest shutter speed is usually max effect, but I find that to be tedious. Any suggestions?
 
Bluto said:
OK, here's a big drawback for EVF's for me ... when I attempt to
use the polarizing filter on bright sunny days (when I would
usually need one) I can see very little difference as I rotate the
filter. Sometimes, just to be sure I get the right shot, I take the
picture 4 times and rotate the filter 90 degress each time.
Click to expand...
Keep in mind that you won't see any difference in the sky in some directions, no matter how it is turned.
Bluto said:
So how do all of you maximize the effect of the filter? The only
other option I have found is to set it in aperature priority mode
and watch the shutter speed as I rotate it. The slowest shutter
speed is usually max effect, but I find that to be tedious. Any
suggestions?
Click to expand...
Try using the histogram. It is pretty obvious with it.

The thing that has me a bit upset is that I bought a circular polarizer because everyone was saying that you'd have problems if you used a linear polarizer. Now it seems that everyone was wrong and the a linear one works just fine with the F707 & F717. The reason this is so annoying is that I wanted to use two polarizers with my IR filter so that I could "dial in" the neutral density I needed - well that doesn't work with circular polarizers! :-{ So I guess I'm going to be buying some more filters at some point. :-_

LewK
--
Windows - It's just work
Macintosh - It just works
 
First of all turning the polarizer 180 degrees halfaway around is the same thing turning from 0 to 90 degrees will pass the minimum and maxium effect point think how it works...

Secondly taking shots at intervals within a 90 degree range is all that is necessary.

Secondly you can use a circular polarizer with a linear polarizer on the outside to use as a variable nd filter.

Finally the easiest way to see the effect is to have the filter held to your eye and turn it and then see the effect and fix it to your camera.
 
Lew K said:
Bluto said:
OK, here's a big drawback for EVF's for me ... when I attempt to
use the polarizing filter on bright sunny days (when I would
usually need one) I can see very little difference as I rotate the
filter. Sometimes, just to be sure I get the right shot, I take the
picture 4 times and rotate the filter 90 degress each time.
Click to expand...
Keep in mind that you won't see any difference in the sky in some
directions, no matter how it is turned.
Lew K said:
So how do all of you maximize the effect of the filter? The only
other option I have found is to set it in aperature priority mode
and watch the shutter speed as I rotate it. The slowest shutter
speed is usually max effect, but I find that to be tedious. Any
suggestions?
Click to expand...
Try using the histogram. It is pretty obvious with it.

The thing that has me a bit upset is that I bought a circular
polarizer because everyone was saying that you'd have problems if
you used a linear polarizer. Now it seems that everyone was wrong
and the a linear one works just fine with the F707 & F717. The
reason this is so annoying is that I wanted to use two polarizers
with my IR filter so that I could "dial in" the neutral density I
needed - well that doesn't work with circular polarizers! :-{ So I
guess I'm going to be buying some more filters at some point. :-_

LewK
--
Windows - It's just work
Macintosh - It just works
Click to expand...
I like the histogram notion. There is one other thing you can do. Either note a spot on the filter that is exactly on the left side of the moving ring when a floor or water glare is extinguished or put a dot there with a marker (silver Sharpie). That dot will ALWAYS be on the left (or 180 degrees on the right) for ALL level glares like water, highways or floors. You don't need to be looking through the camera for this--just look through the filter.f

Same goes for sky extinguishing. Sky polarization is strongest at 90 degrees away from the sun. Period. The dot will guide you there, too.

Or you can make a pseudo polarization effect with these. They're free:

http://www.digitalsecrets.net/secrets/polarizer.html

-iNova
--
http://www.itssony.com
 
Peter Derrett said:
First of all turning the polarizer 180 degrees halfaway around is
the same thing turning from 0 to 90 degrees will pass the minimum
and maxium effect point think how it works...

Secondly taking shots at intervals within a 90 degree range is all
that is necessary.
Click to expand...
Nope. Logical error afoot.

Your extinguish point is rather dramatic. You need to be within a few degrees to have it look best. And you need to be within that tolerance from 0 to 180 degrees. Ninety degrees won't hook it. Because 5 degrees clockwise and 5 degrees counter clockwise are not the same.

The best thing is to test with something obvious. Like pointing down towards water at exactly 45 degrees with your camera. Now the glare can be dialed out fairly easily, but it won't work as well at flatter viewing angles.

Simply shooting every 90 degrees won't hook it, either. What if the angle of extinguish was at 45 degrees to the left of your first shot? You'd miss just as much on either side of happiness with that scheme.

If you rotate it and simply can't see the effect, the chances are excellent that the effect is minimal anyhow so nothing you do with the polarizer will bring joy.

-iNova
Peter Derrett said:
Secondly you can use a circular polarizer with a linear polarizer
on the outside to use as a variable nd filter.

Finally the easiest way to see the effect is to have the filter
held to your eye and turn it and then see the effect and fix it to
your camera.
Click to expand...
--
http://www.itssony.com
 
Thank you all for the advice. I will try these out and see which method works best for me.

I have a love/hate relationship with the EVF going ... I love being able to see all the data and focus before taking the shot, but they aren't good enough yet to allow the fine levels of detail that you get with SLR/DSLR.
Bluto said:
OK, here's a big drawback for EVF's for me ... when I attempt to
use the polarizing filter on bright sunny days (when I would
usually need one) I can see very little difference as I rotate the
filter. Sometimes, just to be sure I get the right shot, I take the
picture 4 times and rotate the filter 90 degress each time.

So how do all of you maximize the effect of the filter? The only
other option I have found is to set it in aperature priority mode
and watch the shutter speed as I rotate it. The slowest shutter
speed is usually max effect, but I find that to be tedious. Any
suggestions?
Click to expand...
 
Peter iNova said:
Peter Derrett said:
First of all turning the polarizer 180 degrees halfaway around is
the same thing turning from 0 to 90 degrees will pass the minimum
and maxium effect point think how it works...

Secondly taking shots at intervals within a 90 degree range is all
that is necessary.
Click to expand...
Nope. Logical error afoot.

Your extinguish point is rather dramatic. You need to be within a
few degrees to have it look best. And you need to be within that
tolerance from 0 to 180 degrees. Ninety degrees won't hook it.
Because 5 degrees clockwise and 5 degrees counter clockwise are not
the same.

The best thing is to test with something obvious. Like pointing
down towards water at exactly 45 degrees with your camera. Now the
glare can be dialed out fairly easily, but it won't work as well at
flatter viewing angles.

Simply shooting every 90 degrees won't hook it, either. What if the
angle of extinguish was at 45 degrees to the left of your first
shot? You'd miss just as much on either side of happiness with that
scheme.

If you rotate it and simply can't see the effect, the chances are
excellent that the effect is minimal anyhow so nothing you do with
the polarizer will bring joy.

-iNova
Member said:
Secondly you can use a circular polarizer with a linear polarizer
on the outside to use as a variable nd filter.

Finally the easiest way to see the effect is to have the filter
held to your eye and turn it and then see the effect and fix it to
your camera.
Click to expand...
--
http://www.itssony.com
Click to expand...
An interesting side effect I have noted in using both a Circular and regular polarizing filter as a substitute for an ND filter is that you seem to loose the color information imbedded in the IR shot with the polarizer combination.

For example, when I take an IR shot with an Hoya 72 and an ND8 filter, I can import the file in PSE and use the Color Hue/Saturation to remove the green and then add the blueish effect. When I use the dual polarizer instead of the ND filters, I get what looks like the same shot on the original, however the Hue/Saturation effect no longer works on that particular shot...

When I apply Black and White gradient, I get the same results, regardless of what I have used for reducing the light density... Interesting...!

--
Robert
 
An SLR's optical viewfinder is quite a different animal from an active pixel display...

It helps to think of an EVF as a framing device first, a resolution/evaluation device second. Most of the time, I frame and make the exposure. Then, if there's a question, I use Review to check for focus and whether anything obnoxious made it into the picture, with the 5x zoom function. NEVER try to evaluate exposure on the EVF, that's not what it's for ... Use the Histogram display instead.

The real review happens on your computer screen after downloading.

Godfrey
Bluto said:
I have a love/hate relationship with the EVF going ... I love being
able to see all the data and focus before taking the shot, but they
aren't good enough yet to allow the fine levels of detail that you
get with SLR/DSLR.
Click to expand...
 
Lew,
Lew K said:
The thing that has me a bit upset is that I bought a circular
polarizer because everyone was saying that you'd have problems if
you used a linear polarizer.
Click to expand...
Hopefully, not "everyone".

The commonest situation in which a linear polarizer can cause a problem is with a camera using prism splitters for the automatic focus system, usually when that is of the so-called "phase comparison" type. This mostly only shows up in SLR cameras.

Doug Kerr
 
Peter Derrett said:
The amount of transmitted energy (light) is equal to the original
energy x cos (angle between polarized light and polarizer screen)
as such -5 degrees and +5 degrees transmit the same amount of light
  • consider this article
http://cea.curtin.edu.au/tlf/tlf1997/swan.html it's a technique
used in our degree for stress analysis.

--
  • PJ
http://www.pbase.com/p82d/
Click to expand...
Let's say you don't know where the extinction angle is. You shoot and change angle 5 degrees clockwise and shoot again and so on. How many times do you need to shoot with a new angle before you are ASSURED of having one shot within 2.5 degrees of perfect?

A clue: Since the polarizer in hand only repeats its perfect extinction every 180 degrees, you are going to be required to shoot all 180 degrees.

Not just the 18 shots that make up a 90 degree attempt. So you were in error.

-iNova
--
http://www.itssony.com
 
Alrite so in all the work I do I use a fixed polarized light source and a graduated scale on the polarizer to scale back to - couldn't get the physical idea that you could start at an angle that wasn't either fully or non-polarized!

Anyway soz for dragging it out - sure you've got more worries with the impending court case than how to use a polarizer!

--
  • PJ
http://www.pbase.com/p82d/
 
If you buy a linear polarizer, mount the circular polarizer on the camera first then mount the linear second, it will qork just as two linears would. reversing the order or using two circulars will not work though. You nee two polarizers anyway, just buy one more, a linear.

Re: max effect (on the sky) shoot with the sun perpendicular to the lens on a clear day. For reflctions off glass or bodies of water (particularly on sunny days the effect should be easier to see.
Lew K said:
Bluto said:
OK, here's a big drawback for EVF's for me ... when I attempt to
use the polarizing filter on bright sunny days (when I would
usually need one) I can see very little difference as I rotate the
filter. Sometimes, just to be sure I get the right shot, I take the
picture 4 times and rotate the filter 90 degress each time.
Click to expand...
Keep in mind that you won't see any difference in the sky in some
directions, no matter how it is turned.
Lew K said:
So how do all of you maximize the effect of the filter? The only
other option I have found is to set it in aperature priority mode
and watch the shutter speed as I rotate it. The slowest shutter
speed is usually max effect, but I find that to be tedious. Any
suggestions?
Click to expand...
Try using the histogram. It is pretty obvious with it.

The thing that has me a bit upset is that I bought a circular
polarizer because everyone was saying that you'd have problems if
you used a linear polarizer. Now it seems that everyone was wrong
and the a linear one works just fine with the F707 & F717. The
reason this is so annoying is that I wanted to use two polarizers
with my IR filter so that I could "dial in" the neutral density I
needed - well that doesn't work with circular polarizers! :-{ So I
guess I'm going to be buying some more filters at some point. :-_

LewK
--
Windows - It's just work
Macintosh - It just works
Click to expand...
 
Doug Kerr said:
Lew K said:
The thing that has me a bit upset is that I bought a circular
polarizer because everyone was saying that you'd have problems if
you used a linear polarizer.
Click to expand...
Hopefully, not "everyone".

The commonest situation in which a linear polarizer can cause a
problem is with a camera using prism splitters for the automatic
focus system, usually when that is of the so-called "phase
comparison" type. This mostly only shows up in SLR cameras.

Doug Kerr
Click to expand...
Doug:

Well... maybe not "EVERYONE". ;-) But certainly every thread I read here about a year and a half ago said that linear polarizers could/would cause problems with the auto-focusing optics. I realize now, that they were evidently misapplying something from SLRs & DSLRs to the 7x7. :-_ But that was the best information I could find at the time.

As usual, hindsight tends to be 20/20 or better. :-}

And Peter, thanks for the tip that I can use a linear with the circular for the neutral density effect! :-)

LewK
--
Windows - It's just work
Macintosh - It just works
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Keyboard shortcuts

f
Forum
m
My threads
Mobile site
About
Editorial content
Cameras & Lenses
Community
All content, design, and layout are Copyright © 1998–2025 Digital Photography Review All Rights Reserved.
Reproduction in whole or part in any form or medium without specific written permission is prohibited.
When you use DPReview links to buy products, the site may earn a commission.
©GPS Media - Guides, Products, Services.
Back
Top