A Sony TTL flash question

Dr_Love · Dec 10, 2017

kli said:
Dr_Love said:

...The old Minolta shoe only has 4 contacts.

Click to expand...

Actually, Nikon, Pentax, and four-thirds do sync/TTL/HSS over only 4 contacts. Canon and Fuji do it over five.

The MI hotshoe is a multi-interface hotshoe. Only about a half dozen of the pins are for flash usage, the others are for microphones and viewfinders, etc. Multiple interfaces.

AFAIK (and you might get better information from the Sony E-mount area folks than from this Canon/MFT/Fuji shooter) the old Minolta-shoe flashes have full function on the MI hotshoe if used with an appropriate adapter. You just have to determine if the flash you have is film era or digital era. 2013 sounds like digital to me so it should be compatible with TTL/HSS if spec'd as such for Sony. Of course, with cheapie 3rd-parties, nothing's really a given.

In addition your problem with "Auto flash" menu selection is, I think, due to a misunderstanding. "Auto flash" does not mean TTL on the flash. It means telling the camera you want it to decide when to use flash. Naturally, this is only going to be good with Auto mode. The PSAM modes typically assume you want to make that kind of decision for yourself.

Also, I think there's a vocabulary overlap thing going on. If you're used to much older speedlight tech, the old "Auto" mode you could find on speedlights is also not TTL. The old Auto modes used an autothyristor sensor on the flash, and you still had to dial in the ISO and aperture settings you were using into the flash to get it to work right, since the camera isn't talking to the flash other than to give the sync signal. That's not TTL, either.

I know exactly what TTL is. I was an early adopter - 1979 Contax 139. Only other TTL flash system at the time was Olympus OM-2. I understand a thyristors as well had nothing to do with exposure an everything to do with power conservation. You might be referring to igbt tech for exposure control.

kli said:
TTL is where your flash talks to your camera, and the camera tells the flash to send out a small "preburst" of light that it can meter through-the-lens (TTL). Based on the metering reading it gets back, the camera's autoexposure system can then automatically set the flash's power level to where it thinks the result is good. So the flash does go off twice for every shot.

If this is how digital ttl works, you can keep it. In the film days, the flash only fires once. A sensor in the old days reads directly off the film plane and cuts the light off when corect exposure is reached. Now the exposure sensor and 'film plane' are the same thing so it should be even simpler. If the tech has gone backwards to requiring multiple flashes then have zero interest in ttl anymore. If I need to fire the flash more than once I might as well use my flash meter and get a more accurate reading with insodent light. What a crock.

kli said:
Setting TTL/HSS for most camera systems can be done on either the body via external flash control menus or on the flash itself but I have no idea how the Sony cameras handle this.

Dr_Love · Dec 10, 2017

kli said:
forest m said:

I think that you will find that your Minolta/Sony flashgun is not compatible because Sony changed the mount for their latest cameras. As previously stated the gun foot needs those tiny contacts on the foot.

Click to expand...

Actually, there are Minolta-to-MI hotshoe adapters that do make them compatible. The issue is whether the OP's Bower can actually do the current digital version of Sony's TTL communication. Without knowing the model, none of us could tell him; especially since Bower is a generic rebranding label. The actual manufacturer could be anyone.

Also, I'm not exactly sure how the OP is managing to fire an Minolta iISO speedlight from an A6000 if he doesn't have one. If he's using a iISO->ISO single-pin adapter (or other adapter that only has pins on the bottom of the foot) that would definitely explain why there's no TTL, since the preflash communication needs the MI contacts on the front edge.

I was firing the iISO show with the NEX7 which uses the older shoe. It was the last camera made with it before the change over to the new multi shoe. The ttl should work fine with the NEX7. I don't have expectations for my A6500 with an adapter. I'm trying to decide whether or not to buy a speedlight for the A6500 but I want to confirm that it will behave the way I'm expecting it to.

kli · Dec 10, 2017

Dr_Love said:
kli said:

TTL is where your flash talks to your camera, and the camera tells the flash to send out a small "preburst" of light that it can meter through-the-lens (TTL). Based on the metering reading it gets back, the camera's autoexposure system can then automatically set the flash's power level to where it thinks the result is good. So the flash does go off twice for every shot.

Click to expand...

If this is how digital ttl works, you can keep it. ... If the tech has gone backwards to requiring multiple flashes then have zero interest in ttl anymore. If I need to fire the flash more than once I might as well use my flash meter and get a more accurate reading with incident light. What a crock.

You don't need to release the shutter twice, if that's what you're thinking. The system does the pre-flash automatically, and in typical use (i.e., you're not doing 2nd-curtain with a long exposure time) you probably won't be able to distinguish between the pre-flash and the main burst.

The main complaints about TTL aren't about the existence of the pre-burst, so much as that since it's metering based, it's not consistent, shot-to-shot. Like using aperture-priority or shutter-priority modes. I tend to think of TTL as "ambient-priority".

kli · Dec 10, 2017

Dr_Love said:
kli said:

Just me, but you may want to take a look at Godox's X system which is rebranded and supported by Adorama as Flashpoint R2 gear. ...

Click to expand...

I have a complete Buff Einstein system for when I need real power and modifiers. I'm just looking to add a speedlight or two for occasional convenience of use where I can't take my studio equipment. I have battery packs for location work.

Not saying you need the Godox options; just that you might want to be aware they're out there. Speedlights may not have enough power/spread to fill a 60" umbrella the way you want. Godox's bare bulb flashes sort of fill in the middle ground between speedlights and monolights, but with mostly speedlight convenience/portability.

A lot of folks move to mirrorless for portability and a lighter kit, and for some off-camera light folks, that may include the strobes, too. I know of at least one person who mentioned trading in his Buff lights for AD200s for the carry convenience.

Not having to haul the Vagabonds along can be a good thing. And having your speedlights and your strobes in the same triggering system can be mighty convenient. It's not like you can remotely set the power on a speedlight using a CyberCommander.

OTOH, nobody likes changing their workflow. If what you have works for you, that's fine. I'm just saying possibly consider where you might be going with the speedlights if you're using them off-camera and whether you want them to work in concert with your bigger lights.

Labe · Dec 10, 2017

Member said:
I was firing the iISO show with the NEX7 which uses the older shoe. It was the last camera made with it before the change over to the new multi shoe. The ttl should work fine with the NEX7. I don't have expectations for my A6500 with an adapter. I'm trying to decide whether or not to buy a speedlight for the A6500 but I want to confirm that it will behave the way I'm expecting it to.

Well I canfirm that the sony hvl F43M does ttl/hss with A6000 series, RX10 and my A68 as I got one myself 2nd hd for £150 and its great.

I didn't mind paying more for the sony model as I wanted the portrait tilt ability when used on body.

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A Sony TTL flash question

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