Cameras are way out of price reach for just about everyone.

.... Everyone can afford a smartphone today...
The bottom of the line iPhone SE is $349.

A factory refurbished Canon Rebel Sl1 with an 18-55mm lens is also $349.

The iPhone has many other functions but I find the Rebel SL1 takes better photos.

I would say that $349 is not "out of reach" for many of those who want a DSLR. Adjusted for inflation, is it less than what I spent for 35mm SLRs in my youth.
But why would someone spend another $349 when they already own something that takes pictures?

I get that some people want better pictures but many people with cameras already in their pocket are perfectly happy with what they own.
Correct.

Under good conditions cell phone cameras are capable of taking excellent photos.

A friend of mine sold one of her prints for $3K. The photo was taken with an iPhone and printed large on plexi.

When an iPhone print sells for $3K, it's hard to justify the OP's hypothesis that you need to spend a lot of money on order to get a camera good enough for a quality photo.

Personally, I find it easier to work with a DSLR than an iPhone, but that's a personal preference.
 
Agree completely. For us plain rural mid U.S. working class folks at least. I am considered terribly extravagant for paying $500-$600 for a camera. And finding anyone in regular working class in our part of the country that will pay $1,000 and up for a camera is pretty well unheard of. We just not have this amount of disposable dollars available for unnecessary things.
I agree with this 100%. I have three good friends who have been shooting for decades. Two own Canon D60s and one owns a D50. My sister in law paid about 500.00 dollars for a Nikon ( don't recall the model ) and lens 14 years ago when my niece was born.

Of all the people I have known personally in my 59 years they are the only four who I know that have spent 500.00 dollars or more on a camera and lens. I look at golf and photography in the same way. A good set of irons, woods, driver, and putter can easily set you back 1500.00 to 2000,00 dollars. My K1 was 2400.00 for camera and lens.

They are both viewed as luxury hobbies in my mind. Some of my friends and family have just as hard a time comprehending 2400.00 on a camera and lens as they did when I spent 300.00 on a new driver or 900.00 on a new set of irons. At least with my camera, I do not have any green fees still to pay :-P
Total nonsense.

There have always been people that had no many to pay the rent never mind buy a camera.

Reality is that cameras have never been as affordable as now.

And yes , it has to do with needing to work for fewer hours than before to buy one.

BTW, I don't have close friends that play golf , so none of my friends would spend any money for that hobby. However just outside the nearest town there is a very large golf club with plenty of people having their thousands of dollars of clubs , cart, membership and several an apartment right there.

Should they make golf more affordable ?
I absolute believe you that none of your friends , and yourself play golf, but what has golf to do with camera's, as this was / is the topic on this thread ?

Why so often you come on with a different topic just to compare with something which is the original topic, why not stay on the topic ?......
I think for the true topic, inflation has caused the apparent increase in camera cost. Just as others have talked about it concerning food, housing, and utility bills rising. I think golf is a good comparison. Probably better than the others since both are considered hobbies by most of us.
But this is still a photographic forum, one can stay on the topic " Money " for camera's , but why it has to shift to cars / golf / food etc ? this leading then to endless none related comments.......
The point is when you use inflation you have to compare prices. This way one can make sure cameras are not going up more than other things in life. Which would show one way or the other if the camera industries pricing tactics were really unfair.
But compare prices re inflation will not change the prices the camera makers asking, apart that one cannot compare the prices asked for cars / golf / food etc for cameras, if cameras industries would lower their prices just because other things are cheaper, then this would result in a flood that every maker has to lower their prices......in other words : one has to pay the price asked for a camera / car / food etc........
Comparisions are only a tool to see if they are gauging us one way or the other.

Here is some food for thought: I bought my first windows computer in 1994. It cost 800.00 and did not come with a CD Drive, sound card, or monitor. My same 800.00 dollars gets me a lot more PC today. Quite honestly I can spend 600,00 and get a lot more computer today. Can you say the same today about your first 120.00 dollar camera, Does your 120.00 dollars get you a lot more camera today?
My first camera was a Agfa Silette , and was a gift from my Father...........I used the Agfa till I switched over to my first digital camera which was the Olympus C-770 Ultra Zoom, and so far I remember I paid about $A 650.00 for it.........

I would say for $A 650.00 I would get a bit more camera today, although the C-770 was not bad........

Re computers .... I truly cannot comment, as my Grandson is a I technician, and I am very lucky as he has my past and present computer ( s ) built for me himself .........
 
Years ago (I am 60 so I'm going back many years), cameras were affordable. It seems to me that nowadays, cameras are totally out of the price range for just about everyone unless you are willing to rack up your credit card debt sky high. Included is the price of lenses and accessories as well.

Camera manufacturers need to get back to the basics of affordable products. Even smartphones are now priced out of reach for most folk.

The demise of camera manufacturers will come from pricing themselves out of business.
My first crop sensor DSLR, the D30, started out at a retail of well over $3k. It was a measly 3 megapixels, shot at a max rate of 3 frames per second until the buffer filled - which was only 8 large/fine jpg images. I won't bother going through the rest of the specs. I waited until the price dropped, but still paid over $2k.

By comparison, when the 7D II came out it was $1,700 new. 10 fps for 31 raw images; the rest of the specs are equally far better. So I paid a lot less many years later for a camera that was far, far better.

BTW, my second compact - the Powershot G1 - originally retailed for over $800. The compacts today are far better for a lot less money. So I'm not seeing what the problem is.
 
.... Everyone can afford a smartphone today...
The bottom of the line iPhone SE is $349.

A factory refurbished Canon Rebel Sl1 with an 18-55mm lens is also $349.

The iPhone has many other functions but I find the Rebel SL1 takes better photos.

I would say that $349 is not "out of reach" for many of those who want a DSLR. Adjusted for inflation, is it less than what I spent for 35mm SLRs in my youth.
But why would someone spend another $349 when they already own something that takes pictures?

I get that some people want better pictures but many people with cameras already in their pocket are perfectly happy with what they own.
Correct.

Under good conditions cell phone cameras are capable of taking excellent photos.

A friend of mine sold one of her prints for $3K. The photo was taken with an iPhone and printed large on plexi.

When an iPhone print sells for $3K, it's hard to justify the OP's hypothesis that you need to spend a lot of money on order to get a camera good enough for a quality photo.

Personally, I find it easier to work with a DSLR than an iPhone, but that's a personal preference.
Absolute perfectly said !!!!!!!

I myself have a iPhone, and although I take from time to time a couple of images with it, I will keep going on to shoot with my Fuji X-T1........

But I think, apart from photographers like us, the future will be more and more with iPhone's ........
 
Years ago (I am 60 so I'm going back many years), cameras were affordable. It seems to me that nowadays, cameras are totally out of the price range for just about everyone unless you are willing to rack up your credit card debt sky high. Included is the price of lenses and accessories as well.
I agree 100%.

Part of the problem is that these manufacturers refuse to offer "basic" models that can only take photographs. We have to buy both a still and a video camera. I don't know how much sound and video capabilities add to the base price of a camera but I am guessing what, at minimum $100? If manufacturers offered a line of still only models, there would be a lot more affordable cameras for the public.
 
Depends on how you look at it. I have a 6D which I paid $1700 at the time, the only lens I had for a year was the 50MM F1.4. So I spent $2100 about 6 years ago. Taking the $2100 and dividing it by 72 months, I'm out ~ $29 per month. I pay more than $29 for cable, internet or cellphone. $29 is 3 bottles of inexpensive wine or 18 bottles of a microbrew. If I keep the camera a few more years the cost goes even further down. Considering I sold my Olumpus E510 to get the Canon, I further reduced my initial out lay. Since I got $400 for the Olympus , 2 kit lens and an inexpensive flash, my original outlay was only $1700 or $24 a month, not really a lot of money.
I agree in the long run camera equipment is not expensive. That is why I finally went all in on the K1. I only wished I would have done it two years ago.
 
Years ago (I am 60 so I'm going back many years), cameras were affordable. It seems to me that nowadays, cameras are totally out of the price range for just about everyone unless you are willing to rack up your credit card debt sky high. Included is the price of lenses and accessories as well.
I agree 100%.

Part of the problem is that these manufacturers refuse to offer "basic" models that can only take photographs. We have to buy both a still and a video camera. I don't know how much sound and video capabilities add to the base price of a camera but I am guessing what, at minimum $100? If manufacturers offered a line of still only models, there would be a lot more affordable cameras for the public.
I think you may have hit on something; but then a lot of people will say why pay 250.00 dollars for a camera that won't do video when my phone can already do both.
 
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Years ago (I am 60 so I'm going back many years), cameras were affordable. It seems to me that nowadays, cameras are totally out of the price range for just about everyone unless you are willing to rack up your credit card debt sky high. Included is the price of lenses and accessories as well.
I agree 100%.

Part of the problem is that these manufacturers refuse to offer "basic" models that can only take photographs. We have to buy both a still and a video camera. I don't know how much sound and video capabilities add to the base price of a camera...
An entry-level ILC these days gets very little R&D, it's all trickled down from previous cameras. Meaning the cost to implement video is pretty close to $0.

And a camera without video won't sell as well.
 
In 1999, I paid $621 for a brand new EOS Elan IIe (AKA EOS 50e) 35mm film camera with a low quality 28-80 lens.

Today (18 years later) the current price of a brand new Canon Rebel SL2 with an 18-55 good quality kit lens is $700.

That's a price increase of about 12%. Having both cameras, I can tell you that the SL2 is far more than 12% better than the Elan IIe.

Keep in mind that the Elan IIe used disposable batteries, and you had to pay for film and developing.

To put that 12% price increase in context, in 1999 gas was about $1.30 a gallon, a first class stamp was 33¢, a movie ticket was $5, and a one day ticket to Disneyland was $41.

According to an online inflation calculator, $621 in 1999 is about the same as $912 today. By that metric when adjusted for inflation, the DSLR is about 24% less expensive than that film camera.
A very well made argument, thanks for sharing.
 
Another thing that actually makes cameras more 'affordable' these days is downward feature creep.

Many features, (and even basic image quality) that were reserved for high-end cameras a few years ago have now crept downward to entry-level models. If you are shopping in the lower end of the market you tend to get more bang for your buck than you could get back in 2010.

My X-T20 is a 'lower end' model, buts its almost a miracle camera compared to the Canon 300D that I purchased new back in 2005 for an equivalent price.
 
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Years ago (I am 60 so I'm going back many years), cameras were affordable. It seems to me that nowadays, cameras are totally out of the price range for just about everyone unless you are willing to rack up your credit card debt sky high. Included is the price of lenses and accessories as well.

Camera manufacturers need to get back to the basics of affordable products. Even smartphones are now priced out of reach for most folk.

The demise of camera manufacturers will come from pricing themselves out of business.
Well said. The higher the price they go, the less appealing they become to the average consumer, the less popular, the higher the price....vicious cycles.

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High strategy is a great strategy for immediately short term gain, but @a cost of long-term lost. Its a sign that camera has given up completely, on selling dedicated camera to the current generation. There is stronger immediate profit selling expensive camera as once-in-a-life-time-toy to older 60,70,80's population then shut down the camera division.
 
Years ago (I am 60 so I'm going back many years), cameras were affordable. It seems to me that nowadays, cameras are totally out of the price range for just about everyone unless you are willing to rack up your credit card debt sky high. Included is the price of lenses and accessories as well.

Camera manufacturers need to get back to the basics of affordable products. Even smartphones are now priced out of reach for most folk.

The demise of camera manufacturers will come from pricing themselves out of business.
My first crop sensor DSLR, the D30, started out at a retail of well over $3k. It was a measly 3 megapixels, shot at a max rate of 3 frames per second until the buffer filled - which was only 8 large/fine jpg images. I won't bother going through the rest of the specs. I waited until the price dropped, but still paid over $2k.

By comparison, when the 7D II came out it was $1,700 new. 10 fps for 31 raw images; the rest of the specs are equally far better. So I paid a lot less many years later for a camera that was far, far better.

BTW, my second compact - the Powershot G1 - originally retailed for over $800. The compacts today are far better for a lot less money. So I'm not seeing what the problem is.
I honestly think the OP is thinking of days of film when pro cameras were 1000.00 dollars and a good enthusiast was 350.00. And doing so without factoring in inflation. My Koni Omega Rapid M camera would even make him more depressed, a true 6x7 medium format range finder that retailed for around 350.00 dollars in the sixties and seventies.

But if someone really wants to get nostalgic and with a warranty the Lomography LC-A 120 Medium Format Film Camera can be had for 429.00 at BH :-)
 
Years ago (I am 60 so I'm going back many years), cameras were affordable. It seems to me that nowadays, cameras are totally out of the price range for just about everyone unless you are willing to rack up your credit card debt sky high. Included is the price of lenses and accessories as well.

Camera manufacturers need to get back to the basics of affordable products. Even smartphones are now priced out of reach for most folk.

The demise of camera manufacturers will come from pricing themselves out of business.
My perception is pretty much the opposite - back in the 70s you could get a very inexpensive point-and-shoot, but the interchangeable lens cameras were very definitely aspirational because they were very expensive by comparison.
You are completely wrong. Film SLR's were not excessively expensive. My father had a Canon SLR and 3 or so lenses and he made no money at all in the '70's. Very expensive? Hardly. Non pro SLR's were very affordable.
 
Years ago (I am 60 so I'm going back many years), cameras were affordable. It seems to me that nowadays, cameras are totally out of the price range for just about everyone unless you are willing to rack up your credit card debt sky high. Included is the price of lenses and accessories as well.

Camera manufacturers need to get back to the basics of affordable products. Even smartphones are now priced out of reach for most folk.

The demise of camera manufacturers will come from pricing themselves out of business.
My perception is pretty much the opposite - back in the 70s you could get a very inexpensive point-and-shoot, but the interchangeable lens cameras were very definitely aspirational because they were very expensive by comparison.
You are completely wrong. Film SLR's were not excessively expensive. My father had a Canon SLR and 3 or so lenses and he made no money at all in the '70's. Very expensive? Hardly. Non pro SLR's were very affordable.
Yup. In the 90s, if you had wanted an entry level non pro SLR, you could've gotten a Pentax K1000 for $200.
 
Years ago (I am 60 so I'm going back many years), cameras were affordable. It seems to me that nowadays, cameras are totally out of the price range for just about everyone unless you are willing to rack up your credit card debt sky high. Included is the price of lenses and accessories as well.

Camera manufacturers need to get back to the basics of affordable products. Even smartphones are now priced out of reach for most folk.

The demise of camera manufacturers will come from pricing themselves out of business.
My perception is pretty much the opposite - back in the 70s you could get a very inexpensive point-and-shoot, but the interchangeable lens cameras were very definitely aspirational because they were very expensive by comparison.
You are completely wrong. Film SLR's were not excessively expensive. My father had a Canon SLR and 3 or so lenses and he made no money at all in the '70's. Very expensive? Hardly. Non pro SLR's were very affordable.
Well, that's settled. So the question is...are cameras less affordable now? We've had many posts so far saying no. What is missing are absolutely stripped models at sub-$200 prices. I don't think, however, that they would restore the early 21st Century health of the camera market - but a few minimalist would be interested.
 
The price of a decent camera has been about the monthly salary of middle class citizen. So a decent camera is quite pricy as it has been before.

BTW having a night with a woman of the street costs about the price of a decent pair of shoes, again as it has been before. ;-)

What gives more pleasure between shooting pictures and having a night with a woman I don't know but you choose what pleases you more. Of course you may have both if you can afford. :-D

--
You really want you a pound of flesh, don't you?
-- Mallory to Miller in the movie 'The Guns of Navarone'
 
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High strategy is a great strategy for immediately short term gain, but @a cost of long-term lost. Its a sign that camera has given up completely, on selling dedicated camera to the current generation.
They gave up on cheap cameras, because people stopped buying them.

Selling cheaper cameras won't fix the issue. Canon could sell a 12mp APS DSLR with a lens for $250, and younger people still won't buy them.

Price isn't the problem. It's that smartphones are built into the phone, connected to the Internet, takes minimal effort to share seconds after capture, and provides more than enough quality to satisfy most people.

Meanwhile, the reality is that ILC sales aren't actually much worse than they were in the late film era. I.e. there's a ton of hand-wringing over nothing.
 
In 1999, I paid $621 for a brand new EOS Elan IIe (AKA EOS 50e) 35mm film camera with a low quality 28-80 lens.

Today (18 years later) the current price of a brand new Canon Rebel SL2 with an 18-55 good quality kit lens is $700.

That's a price increase of about 12%. Having both cameras, I can tell you that the SL2 is far more than 12% better than the Elan IIe.

Keep in mind that the Elan IIe used disposable batteries, and you had to pay for film and developing.

To put that 12% price increase in context, in 1999 gas was about $1.30 a gallon, a first class stamp was 33¢, a movie ticket was $5, and a one day ticket to Disneyland was $41.

According to an online inflation calculator, $621 in 1999 is about the same as $912 today. By that metric when adjusted for inflation, the DSLR is about 24% less expensive than that film camera.
What a joke. You compare an enthusiast film camera with a Rebel. Try like for like for a REAL cost comparison. Elan IIe vs a 7D, or to keep it FF vs FF, vs a 6D.
 
Years ago (I am 60 so I'm going back many years), cameras were affordable. It seems to me that nowadays, cameras are totally out of the price range for just about everyone unless you are willing to rack up your credit card debt sky high. Included is the price of lenses and accessories as well.

Camera manufacturers need to get back to the basics of affordable products. Even smartphones are now priced out of reach for most folk.

The demise of camera manufacturers will come from pricing themselves out of business.
My perception is pretty much the opposite - back in the 70s you could get a very inexpensive point-and-shoot, but the interchangeable lens cameras were very definitely aspirational because they were very expensive by comparison.
You are completely wrong. Film SLR's were not excessively expensive. My father had a Canon SLR and 3 or so lenses and he made no money at all in the '70's. Very expensive? Hardly. Non pro SLR's were very affordable.
Find out how much he paid for them , then find out how many hours he had to work to make that amount of money.

Then get the current hourly wage for the same or similar job and see what happens....
 
High strategy is a great strategy for immediately short term gain, but @a cost of long-term lost. Its a sign that camera has given up completely, on selling dedicated camera to the current generation.
They gave up on cheap cameras, because people stopped buying them.

Selling cheaper cameras won't fix the issue. Canon could sell a 12mp APS DSLR with a lens for $250, and younger people still won't buy them.

Price isn't the problem. It's that smartphones are built into the phone, connected to the Internet, takes minimal effort to share seconds after capture, and provides more than enough quality to satisfy most people.

Meanwhile, the reality is that ILC sales aren't actually much worse than they were in the late film era. I.e. there's a ton of hand-wringing over nothing.
Do you realize that there are close to 80 million more people in the US since 1990 (the film era). Don't you think camera sales should be far more than the film era? Why is returning to film era sales volume OK when there are 80 more million people NOT buying cameras?

Now think world wide. There are BILLIONS of more people in the world since the film era.

Yet sales are down. The percentage of people buying non smart phone cameras is in a HUGE decline.
 

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