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D30: Sync cord and ST-E2 transmitter, possible?

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Lincoln Mennuti

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My Setup:
D30
420EX
Alien Bees AB800 Strobe

I'm trying to setup for Portraits and have the AB800 setup with a Softbox (with sync wire) and want to use the 420 remotely (instead of on the hotshoe)

To my understanding, the 420 can ONLY be triggered by either being connected directly to the HotShoe or via IR Transmitter (like the 550EX or ST-E2).

So, before I make the investment to buy the ST-E2 (so I can fire the 420 remotely) will the D30 trigger BOTH the ST-E2 AND a sync wire connected at the same time (I know the AB800 can be triggered from any flash activity within 50meters, but I'd rather use the sync wire to be sure)?

Thanks.
--
http://www.lincolnsworld.com
 
... make certain that the flash AND the camera are on full manual control! (I assume you can do this with the 420; you can with the 550.) In ETTL mode your system will be fooled completely with the external flash.
Ken
lincoln mennuti said:
My Setup:
D30
420EX
Alien Bees AB800 Strobe

I'm trying to setup for Portraits and have the AB800 setup with a
Softbox (with sync wire) and want to use the 420 remotely (instead
of on the hotshoe)

To my understanding, the 420 can ONLY be triggered by either being
connected directly to the HotShoe or via IR Transmitter (like the
550EX or ST-E2).

So, before I make the investment to buy the ST-E2 (so I can fire
the 420 remotely) will the D30 trigger BOTH the ST-E2 AND a sync
wire connected at the same time (I know the AB800 can be triggered
from any flash activity within 50meters, but I'd rather use the
sync wire to be sure)?

Thanks.
--
http://www.lincolnsworld.com
Click to expand...
--

Wanted: Beautiful young woman to be my wife. Must be obsessive-compulsive about housekeeping.
http://www.ahomls.com/gallery.htm
 
Ken Phillips said:
... make certain that the flash AND the camera are on full manual
control! (I assume you can do this with the 420; you can with the
550.) In ETTL mode your system will be fooled completely with the
external flash.
Ken
Click to expand...
Thanks for the info Ken, I usually shoot in Full Manual anyway...Off to find the best price for the ST-E2!
 
1st, the 420ex is a fully 100% E-TTL flash. That means it it will read pre-flash for exposure. During the pre-flash, the Bees does not fire because it is connected via sync cord. Thinking that there are no other flashes around, the 420ex will think that it is the only flash (main flash). It will output too much power. This is why the 550ex is valuable in this situation because it can be set to Manual (there is a Manual mode on the flash which will not take a pre-flash measurement).

--
Simon-Ph
 
I own 3 Bees 800s the ST-E2 and 3 550s. The Bees come with a cordless plug just for this purpose. Put the plug in the Bees and it shuts off the automatic light sensor. Connect the PC cord from the D30 to the Bees and now you can use your ETTL system without the preflash triggering the Bees.
lincoln mennuti said:
My Setup:
D30
420EX
Alien Bees AB800 Strobe

I'm trying to setup for Portraits and have the AB800 setup with a
Softbox (with sync wire) and want to use the 420 remotely (instead
of on the hotshoe)

To my understanding, the 420 can ONLY be triggered by either being
connected directly to the HotShoe or via IR Transmitter (like the
550EX or ST-E2).

So, before I make the investment to buy the ST-E2 (so I can fire
the 420 remotely) will the D30 trigger BOTH the ST-E2 AND a sync
wire connected at the same time (I know the AB800 can be triggered
from any flash activity within 50meters, but I'd rather use the
sync wire to be sure)?

Thanks.
--
http://www.lincolnsworld.com
Click to expand...
--
Doug Walker
Check my profile for equipment list.
 
Doug,

follow-up question:
can you trigger the Bees using ST-E2?

thanks,
breycap
Doug Walker said:
I own 3 Bees 800s the ST-E2 and 3 550s. The Bees come with a
cordless plug just for this purpose. Put the plug in the Bees and
it shuts off the automatic light sensor. Connect the PC cord from
the D30 to the Bees and now you can use your ETTL system without
the preflash triggering the Bees.
Click to expand...
 
But one I don't have the answer to. I've not tried using a ST-E2 by itself to trigger the Bees. I somehow don't think it'll work since the ST-E2 is designed to communicate with the EX units which fire a preflash. The ST-E2 waits for the camera to determine the proper light output from the preflash and then the camera instructs the ST-E2 to fire the flash again at the proper light output for good exposure (this all happens in milliseconds). I suppose I could try it to find out.
breycap said:
follow-up question:
can you trigger the Bees using ST-E2?

thanks,
breycap
Doug Walker said:
I own 3 Bees 800s the ST-E2 and 3 550s. The Bees come with a
cordless plug just for this purpose. Put the plug in the Bees and
it shuts off the automatic light sensor. Connect the PC cord from
the D30 to the Bees and now you can use your ETTL system without
the preflash triggering the Bees.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
Doug Walker
Check my profile for equipment list.
 
ETTL meters off of the preflash ... and the Bees don't preflash, so you'll come up grossly overexposed.
Ken
Doug Walker said:
lincoln mennuti said:
My Setup:
D30
420EX
Alien Bees AB800 Strobe

I'm trying to setup for Portraits and have the AB800 setup with a
Softbox (with sync wire) and want to use the 420 remotely (instead
of on the hotshoe)

To my understanding, the 420 can ONLY be triggered by either being
connected directly to the HotShoe or via IR Transmitter (like the
550EX or ST-E2).

So, before I make the investment to buy the ST-E2 (so I can fire
the 420 remotely) will the D30 trigger BOTH the ST-E2 AND a sync
wire connected at the same time (I know the AB800 can be triggered
from any flash activity within 50meters, but I'd rather use the
sync wire to be sure)?

Thanks.
--
http://www.lincolnsworld.com
Click to expand...
--
Doug Walker
Check my profile for equipment list.
Click to expand...
--

Wanted: Beautiful young woman to be my wife. Must be obsessive-compulsive about housekeeping.
http://www.ahomls.com/gallery.htm
 
Ken Phillips said:
ETTL meters off of the preflash ... and the Bees don't preflash, so
you'll come up grossly overexposed.
Click to expand...
I would assume you can set the underexposure option for the ETTL flash. And as long as you use that flash as the primary flash, the extra light from the Alien Bee shouldn't be a problem.

And don't forget you can use the LCD to see how a test shot works and then play with the camera/flash settings and distance to get the correct balance.

--
Jeff Peterman
 
with a strobe setup like the Bees. Set the camera to manual and adjust the Bees for proper exposure. ETTL will take care of itself. The PC cord will not fire the Bees on the preflash but on the actual flash. It's up to the photographer to set the proper light output of the strobes. This is standard practice.
Ken Phillips said:
Doug Walker said:
lincoln mennuti said:
My Setup:
D30
420EX
Alien Bees AB800 Strobe

I'm trying to setup for Portraits and have the AB800 setup with a
Softbox (with sync wire) and want to use the 420 remotely (instead
of on the hotshoe)

To my understanding, the 420 can ONLY be triggered by either being
connected directly to the HotShoe or via IR Transmitter (like the
550EX or ST-E2).

So, before I make the investment to buy the ST-E2 (so I can fire
the 420 remotely) will the D30 trigger BOTH the ST-E2 AND a sync
wire connected at the same time (I know the AB800 can be triggered
from any flash activity within 50meters, but I'd rather use the
sync wire to be sure)?

Thanks.
--
http://www.lincolnsworld.com
Click to expand...
--
Doug Walker
Check my profile for equipment list.
Click to expand...
--
Wanted: Beautiful young woman to be my wife. Must be
obsessive-compulsive about housekeeping.
http://www.ahomls.com/gallery.htm
Click to expand...
--
Doug Walker
Check my profile for equipment list.
 
Doug Walker said:
with a strobe setup like the Bees. Set the camera to manual and
adjust the Bees for proper exposure. ETTL will take care of itself.
The PC cord will not fire the Bees on the preflash but on the
actual flash. It's up to the photographer to set the proper light
output of the strobes. This is standard practice.
Click to expand...
Doug,

Are you using your Bees cabled together (through the remote socket) with the supplementary cordless plugs inserted in the sync sockets of all the Bees except for the one controlled by the camera--so none of the Bees fire in response to a flash?

What if you want to use the 550 at a constant setting (like one of the Bees), rather than have it respond according to its own ETTL reading?

--bill
 
... it makes zero sense to use ETTL at all with external strobes. Switch to full manual on both the camera and the 550s if you want to add them to the mix with the Bees. Compensating for the ETTL by adjusting your strobes strikes me as silly!

I've occasionally used a 550 for a little fill with strobes (now I use a very portable Vivitar 285HV w/slave trigger) ... but only on full manual.
Ken

Wanted: Beautiful young woman to be my wife. Must be obsessive-compulsive about housekeeping.
http://www.ahomls.com/gallery.htm
 
Simon-Ph said:
1st, the 420ex is a fully 100% E-TTL flash. That means it it will
read pre-flash for exposure. During the pre-flash, the Bees does
not fire because it is connected via sync cord. Thinking that
there are no other flashes around, the 420ex will think that it is
the only flash (main flash). It will output too much power. This
is why the 550ex is valuable in this situation because it can be
set to Manual (there is a Manual mode on the flash which will not
take a pre-flash measurement).

--
Simon-Ph
Click to expand...
--

Wanted: Beautiful young woman to be my wife. Must be obsessive-compulsive about housekeeping.
http://www.ahomls.com/gallery.htm
 
I'll do a hitlist...
  • Yes, the ST-E2 can trigger Bees. But I'm reading not very reliably (like 75%).
  • I'm not reading good things about the ST-E2 range (The Canon Spec sheets say same as the 550 at 12 to 15 meters, but Chuck Westfall (Head Tech at Canon) says it's only 3 to 5 meters)...I've seen no actual ST-E2 owner accounts yet though
  • A 420EX, in slave mode, locks itself down to 24mm Flash...So there is NO variance issues is mixing E-TTL with Strobes (you'd have to take a few test shots in Manual mode, but once you've got it right you should get consistant results thereafter)
  • Spoke with Lauri at the Bees toll-free number and she says if the PC Sync cord is connected to any of the Bees, then the optical sync is automatically disabled (no need to plug anything else into the Bee). I was test shooting last night and I can confirm this
  • Lauri also confirmed that since I've already had my 420EX mounted on the hotshoe AND the PC Sync cable plugged in and fired off both Flashes (again, from last night's test shooting) that the ST-E2 and PC Sync would be no problem.
So, now the only thing holding my buying trigger finger from getting the ST-E2 is getting confirm on it's actual range (indoors and out)
 
You may be getting shots that are properly exposed, or you may not, but you are NOT using ETTL! Because ... to do so, the big strobes would need to preflash at a known setting ... OR go off with the preflash AND have enough time to recharge (which could and has been done with FEL.)

But ... why? You have the Bees ... you can do a lot with ONE light, and you have a set.

I'm an old guy, BTW, and I use old-fashioned wires to trigger my strobes. Works every time.
Ken
lincoln mennuti said:
I'll do a hitlist...
  • Yes, the ST-E2 can trigger Bees. But I'm reading not very
reliably (like 75%).
  • I'm not reading good things about the ST-E2 range (The Canon Spec
sheets say same as the 550 at 12 to 15 meters, but Chuck Westfall
(Head Tech at Canon) says it's only 3 to 5 meters)...I've seen no
actual ST-E2 owner accounts yet though
  • A 420EX, in slave mode, locks itself down to 24mm Flash...So
there is NO variance issues is mixing E-TTL with Strobes (you'd
have to take a few test shots in Manual mode, but once you've got
it right you should get consistant results thereafter)
  • Spoke with Lauri at the Bees toll-free number and she says if the
PC Sync cord is connected to any of the Bees, then the optical sync
is automatically disabled (no need to plug anything else into the
Bee). I was test shooting last night and I can confirm this
  • Lauri also confirmed that since I've already had my 420EX mounted
on the hotshoe AND the PC Sync cable plugged in and fired off both
Flashes (again, from last night's test shooting) that the ST-E2 and
PC Sync would be no problem.

So, now the only thing holding my buying trigger finger from
getting the ST-E2 is getting confirm on it's actual range (indoors
and out)
Click to expand...
--

Wanted: Beautiful young woman to be my wife. Must be obsessive-compulsive about housekeeping.
http://www.ahomls.com/gallery.htm
 
Ken Phillips said:
You may be getting shots that are properly exposed, or you may not,
but you are NOT using ETTL! Because ... to do so, the big strobes
would need to preflash at a known setting ... OR go off with the
preflash AND have enough time to recharge (which could and has been
done with FEL.)
Click to expand...
No disagreement there...Except for some specific 3rd party flashes, E-TTL is out the door as soon as you go with something other than Canon EX flash. I'm just referring to the ability to trigger the Bees.
Ken Phillips said:
But ... why? You have the Bees ... you can do a lot with ONE light,
and you have a set.
Click to expand...
I have 1 B800 and 1 420EX. I'm trying to keep costs down and options up. The ST-E2 is attractive because; It offers the AF-Assist, it'll remotely trigger the 420 (cheaper to utilize the 420, like for backlight, than to invest in another Bee right now) and I like the idea of portability with the setup of D30/420/ST-E2 (was reading through the forums and someone had a setup like that and went on a random parade shoot in the streets of the Philipines with nice results)
Ken Phillips said:
I'm an old guy, BTW, and I use old-fashioned wires to trigger my
strobes. Works every time.
Ken
Click to expand...
Yup, while I'm in the house I'll definitely be using my PC Sync on my B800...AND remotely firing the 420 with the ST-E2 (and since I'll be in Manual mode, I'm not worried too much about E-TTL going ape because I'll take a few test shots and adjust accordingly)

...That's what I'm thinking anyway.
 
... although I used to shoot with two Vivitar 285HV units! Once you get used to the power of fairly large strobes (I use 2400WS Balcars) it's hard to go back!

It would be nice if you could kill the preflash on the built-in unit, just for this purpose!
KP
lincoln mennuti said:
Ken Phillips said:
You may be getting shots that are properly exposed, or you may not,
but you are NOT using ETTL! Because ... to do so, the big strobes
would need to preflash at a known setting ... OR go off with the
preflash AND have enough time to recharge (which could and has been
done with FEL.)
Click to expand...
No disagreement there...Except for some specific 3rd party flashes,
E-TTL is out the door as soon as you go with something other than
Canon EX flash. I'm just referring to the ability to trigger the
Bees.
Lincoln Mennuti said:
But ... why? You have the Bees ... you can do a lot with ONE light,
and you have a set.
Click to expand...
I have 1 B800 and 1 420EX. I'm trying to keep costs down and
options up. The ST-E2 is attractive because; It offers the
AF-Assist, it'll remotely trigger the 420 (cheaper to utilize the
420, like for backlight, than to invest in another Bee right now)
and I like the idea of portability with the setup of D30/420/ST-E2
(was reading through the forums and someone had a setup like that
and went on a random parade shoot in the streets of the Philipines
with nice results)
Lincoln Mennuti said:
I'm an old guy, BTW, and I use old-fashioned wires to trigger my
strobes. Works every time.
Ken
Click to expand...
Yup, while I'm in the house I'll definitely be using my PC Sync on
my B800...AND remotely firing the 420 with the ST-E2 (and since
I'll be in Manual mode, I'm not worried too much about E-TTL going
ape because I'll take a few test shots and adjust accordingly)

...That's what I'm thinking anyway.
Click to expand...
--

Wanted: Beautiful young woman to be my wife. Must be obsessive-compulsive about housekeeping.
http://www.ahomls.com/gallery.htm
 
I'm still in the doghouse for getting the AB setup!
 
lincoln mennuti said:
I'll do a hitlist...
  • Yes, the ST-E2 can trigger Bees. But I'm reading not very
reliably (like 75%).
  • I'm not reading good things about the ST-E2 range (The Canon Spec
sheets say same as the 550 at 12 to 15 meters, but Chuck Westfall
(Head Tech at Canon) says it's only 3 to 5 meters)...I've seen no
actual ST-E2 owner accounts yet though
  • A 420EX, in slave mode, locks itself down to 24mm Flash...So
there is NO variance issues is mixing E-TTL with Strobes (you'd
have to take a few test shots in Manual mode, but once you've got
it right you should get consistant results thereafter)
  • Spoke with Lauri at the Bees toll-free number and she says if the
PC Sync cord is connected to any of the Bees, then the optical sync
is automatically disabled (no need to plug anything else into the
Bee). I was test shooting last night and I can confirm this
  • Lauri also confirmed that since I've already had my 420EX mounted
on the hotshoe AND the PC Sync cable plugged in and fired off both
Flashes (again, from last night's test shooting) that the ST-E2 and
PC Sync would be no problem.

So, now the only thing holding my buying trigger finger from
getting the ST-E2 is getting confirm on it's actual range (indoors
and out)
Click to expand...
Found this other solution from hunting the Forums...www.d-store.com sells a slave trigger (SA-10, $80) that ignores the PreFlash and fires on the Main Flash.

--
http://www.lincolnsworld.com
 
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