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D850 - What is going on here?

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PhotoKhan

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I am sorry if this has already been discussed. If so, just point me to that discussion.

I noticed something on one of the shots from DPR's samples gallery (a "Straight out of camera JPEG" one).

I downloaded the NEF file, opened it in PS, neutral settings dialed-in and saved it as full-sized jpg, without any alterations.

What is going on here?





100% crop.



PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com

Zenfolio | Humberto Borges

I am a Portuguese airline captain, with a photographic eye into some earthly things in addition to our wondrous skies. If there's a moment in our lives that defines our future non-human affections, mine was at a very early age. In the early sixties, my parents just newlywed, our family...
www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com
www.pbase.com

Galleries by photokhan

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PhotoKhan said:
I am sorry if this has already been discussed. If so, just point me to that discussion.

I noticed something on one of the shots from DPR's samples gallery (a "Straight out of camera JPEG" one).

I downloaded the NEF file, opened it in PS, neutral settings dialed-in and saved it as full-sized jpg, without any alterations.

What is going on here?



100% crop.



PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com/
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
-------------------------------------------------
Click to expand...
It is the ACR, no such artifacts using Capture NXD.



converted using capture NXD
converted using capture NXD



I am finding that ACR is terrible with processing D850 raws. This is so unfortunate.
 
p m h said:
PhotoKhan said:
I am sorry if this has already been discussed. If so, just point me to that discussion.

I noticed something on one of the shots from DPR's samples gallery (a "Straight out of camera JPEG" one).

I downloaded the NEF file, opened it in PS, neutral settings dialed-in and saved it as full-sized jpg, without any alterations.

What is going on here?



100% crop.



PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com/
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
-------------------------------------------------
Click to expand...
It is the ACR, no such artifacts using Capture NXD.

converted using capture NXD
converted using capture NXD

I am finding that ACR is terrible with processing D850 raws. This is so unfortunate.
Click to expand...
Much better, yes...there's still some ugly posterization/artifacts on the right leg, though.

Thank you for the Capture NXD conversion

PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com

Zenfolio | Humberto Borges

I am a Portuguese airline captain, with a photographic eye into some earthly things in addition to our wondrous skies. If there's a moment in our lives that defines our future non-human affections, mine was at a very early age. In the early sixties, my parents just newlywed, our family...
www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com
www.pbase.com

Galleries by photokhan

www.pbase.com
(PBase Supporter)
-------------------------------------------------
 
PhotoKhan said:
p m h said:
I am finding that ACR is terrible with processing D850 raws. This is so unfortunate.
Click to expand...
Much better, yes...there's still some ugly posterization/artifacts on the right leg, though.

Thank you for the Capture NXD conversion
Click to expand...
The next question: is anyone going to take this issue to Adobe?

Chris
 
p m h said:
PhotoKhan said:
I am sorry if this has already been discussed. If so, just point me to that discussion.

I noticed something on one of the shots from DPR's samples gallery (a "Straight out of camera JPEG" one).

I downloaded the NEF file, opened it in PS, neutral settings dialed-in and saved it as full-sized jpg, without any alterations.

What is going on here?



100% crop.



PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com/
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
-------------------------------------------------
Click to expand...
It is the ACR, no such artifacts using Capture NXD.

converted using capture NXD
converted using capture NXD

I am finding that ACR is terrible with processing D850 raws. This is so unfortunate.
Click to expand...
You mean the color in ACR is dull and dark? That is normal with ACR since Adobe cannot interpret the Nikon proprietary color profile in the NEF file. The default is the Adobe color profile. Just change it to the one you like or create calibrated profiles.
 
ChiArch said:
p m h said:
PhotoKhan said:
I am sorry if this has already been discussed. If so, just point me to that discussion.

I noticed something on one of the shots from DPR's samples gallery (a "Straight out of camera JPEG" one).

I downloaded the NEF file, opened it in PS, neutral settings dialed-in and saved it as full-sized jpg, without any alterations.

What is going on here?



100% crop.



PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com/
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
-------------------------------------------------
Click to expand...
It is the ACR, no such artifacts using Capture NXD.

converted using capture NXD
converted using capture NXD

I am finding that ACR is terrible with processing D850 raws. This is so unfortunate.
Click to expand...
You mean the color in ACR is dull and dark? That is normal with ACR since Adobe cannot interpret the Nikon proprietary color profile in the NEF file. The default is the Adobe color profile. Just change it to the one you like or create calibrated profiles.
Click to expand...
No, I am not talking about the dull and dark color here.

We are talking about the posterization/artifacts on the front leg (pink/red color) in the ACR conversion.
 
Been wondering about this as well. Since LR does not support the 850 yet, I've used DNG converter on the NEFs in order to play with them in LR. The big disadvantage I see is that there are no profiles under 'camera calibration', only Adobe Standard. I've always used 'camera neutral' as a starting point, but I guess that's not possible until Adobe actually updates LR? Hopefully, we won't see the issue that the OP mentioned once LR works with the 850.
 
PhotoKhan said:
p m h said:
PhotoKhan said:
I am sorry if this has already been discussed. If so, just point me to that discussion.

I noticed something on one of the shots from DPR's samples gallery (a "Straight out of camera JPEG" one).

I downloaded the NEF file, opened it in PS, neutral settings dialed-in and saved it as full-sized jpg, without any alterations.

What is going on here?



100% crop.



PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com/
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
-------------------------------------------------
Click to expand...
It is the ACR, no such artifacts using Capture NXD.

converted using capture NXD
converted using capture NXD

I am finding that ACR is terrible with processing D850 raws. This is so unfortunate.
Click to expand...
Much better, yes...there's still some ugly posterization/artifacts on the right leg, though.

Thank you for the Capture NXD conversion

PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com/
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
-------------------------------------------------
Click to expand...
I think what you see on the right leg is just reflection of the light source. Also it was taken at ISO180, so some of the ISO64 smoothness is gone.
 
Camera Raw in Photoshop seems to work fine. I guess it is a hassle to port all the CR features into Lightroom, so taking longer.

Of course there was always an issue of Adobe immediately figuring out Nikon's color balance, and Capture always seemed to have an advantage in the early days, although I chose not to go to Capture NX.
 
I'm pretty sure that Adobe takes the position of "we're not reverse-engineering your encrypted metadata every time you come out with a new camera".

I could be wrong.

Chris
 
p m h said:
ChiArch said:
p m h said:
PhotoKhan said:
I am sorry if this has already been discussed. If so, just point me to that discussion.

I noticed something on one of the shots from DPR's samples gallery (a "Straight out of camera JPEG" one).

I downloaded the NEF file, opened it in PS, neutral settings dialed-in and saved it as full-sized jpg, without any alterations.

What is going on here?



100% crop.



PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com/
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
-------------------------------------------------
Click to expand...
It is the ACR, no such artifacts using Capture NXD.

converted using capture NXD
converted using capture NXD

I am finding that ACR is terrible with processing D850 raws. This is so unfortunate.
Click to expand...
You mean the color in ACR is dull and dark? That is normal with ACR since Adobe cannot interpret the Nikon proprietary color profile in the NEF file. The default is the Adobe color profile. Just change it to the one you like or create calibrated profiles.
Click to expand...
No, I am not talking about the dull and dark color here.

We are talking about the posterization/artifacts on the front leg (pink/red color) in the ACR conversion.
Click to expand...
I see. I think the front leg is in a tricky lighting situation (quite obvious in B/W, even for the Capture NXD sample) which is exaggerated by the Adobe's camera profile.
 
p m h said:
ChiArch said:
p m h said:
PhotoKhan said:
I am sorry if this has already been discussed. If so, just point me to that discussion.

I noticed something on one of the shots from DPR's samples gallery (a "Straight out of camera JPEG" one).

I downloaded the NEF file, opened it in PS, neutral settings dialed-in and saved it as full-sized jpg, without any alterations.

What is going on here?



100% crop.



PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com/
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
-------------------------------------------------
Click to expand...
It is the ACR, no such artifacts using Capture NXD.

converted using capture NXD
converted using capture NXD

I am finding that ACR is terrible with processing D850 raws. This is so unfortunate.
Click to expand...
You mean the color in ACR is dull and dark? That is normal with ACR since Adobe cannot interpret the Nikon proprietary color profile in the NEF file. The default is the Adobe color profile. Just change it to the one you like or create calibrated profiles.
Click to expand...
No, I am not talking about the dull and dark color here.

We are talking about the posterization/artifacts on the front leg (pink/red color) in the ACR conversion.
Click to expand...
The posterization can happen when Adobe has not done their Color profiles correctly as did with some of the original D810 profiles. They redid them after complaints.
 
inasir1971 said:
p m h said:
ChiArch said:
p m h said:
PhotoKhan said:
I am sorry if this has already been discussed. If so, just point me to that discussion.

I noticed something on one of the shots from DPR's samples gallery (a "Straight out of camera JPEG" one).

I downloaded the NEF file, opened it in PS, neutral settings dialed-in and saved it as full-sized jpg, without any alterations.

What is going on here?



100% crop.



PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com/
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
-------------------------------------------------
Click to expand...
It is the ACR, no such artifacts using Capture NXD.

converted using capture NXD
converted using capture NXD

I am finding that ACR is terrible with processing D850 raws. This is so unfortunate.
Click to expand...
You mean the color in ACR is dull and dark? That is normal with ACR since Adobe cannot interpret the Nikon proprietary color profile in the NEF file. The default is the Adobe color profile. Just change it to the one you like or create calibrated profiles.
Click to expand...
No, I am not talking about the dull and dark color here.

We are talking about the posterization/artifacts on the front leg (pink/red color) in the ACR conversion.
Click to expand...
The posterization can happen when Adobe has not done their Color profiles correctly as did with some of the original D810 profiles. They redid them after complaints.
Click to expand...
Yea, we need to make sure they redo it this time as well. If you look at dpreview's studio scene comparison, d850 file has tons of false color (looks similar to CA). But i ran the file through capture nxd and all those artifacts disappeared (even with abbration control turned off).
 
The bike chain should be lubricated and something is loose on her right shoe...
 
p m h said:
inasir1971 said:
p m h said:
ChiArch said:
p m h said:
PhotoKhan said:
I am sorry if this has already been discussed. If so, just point me to that discussion.

I noticed something on one of the shots from DPR's samples gallery (a "Straight out of camera JPEG" one).

I downloaded the NEF file, opened it in PS, neutral settings dialed-in and saved it as full-sized jpg, without any alterations.

What is going on here?



100% crop.



PK

--
“Loose praise may feed my ego but constructive criticism advances my skills”
************************************************************
-------------------------------------------------
http://www.humbertoborgesfotografia.com/
http://www.pbase.com/photokhan
(PBase Supporter)
-------------------------------------------------
Click to expand...
It is the ACR, no such artifacts using Capture NXD.

converted using capture NXD
converted using capture NXD

I am finding that ACR is terrible with processing D850 raws. This is so unfortunate.
Click to expand...
You mean the color in ACR is dull and dark? That is normal with ACR since Adobe cannot interpret the Nikon proprietary color profile in the NEF file. The default is the Adobe color profile. Just change it to the one you like or create calibrated profiles.
Click to expand...
No, I am not talking about the dull and dark color here.

We are talking about the posterization/artifacts on the front leg (pink/red color) in the ACR conversion.
Click to expand...
The posterization can happen when Adobe has not done their Color profiles correctly as did with some of the original D810 profiles. They redid them after complaints.
Click to expand...
Yea, we need to make sure they redo it this time as well. If you look at dpreview's studio scene comparison, d850 file has tons of false color (looks similar to CA). But i ran the file through capture nxd and all those artifacts disappeared (even with abbration control turned off).
Click to expand...
I suggest also turning D-Lighting of in CNX-D, it also produces extra color contrast that is better controlled by hand, especially for portraits. That comes when using the Auto profile, a new thing, but also in other profiles. Portrait or Neutral are best to start RAW conversions, they produce the least artifacts.

--
Renato.
www.flickr.com

Renato Pedrosa

Explore Renato Pedrosa’s 937 photos on Flickr!
www.flickr.com www.flickr.com
OnExposure member
Good shooting and good luck
(after Ed Murrow)
 
There are two type of replies until now.

1. Blaming it on ACR profiles, although a conversion made with Capture NXD was already kindly posted that also exhibits the problem, although to a lesser extent.

2. Spin-off humor.

I am a Canon user that's has been having an hard time in the last years both trying to explain to my crowd DR is useful (...and the wider, the better...) and also to Sony-sourced sensors zealots that there's photography life beyond simple DR.

Now, I see this from a camera that has been measured and proven to be a reference and my question is?

What good is extended for DR if shadows may come straight out of the camera at low ISO and proper exposure looking like a smartphone shot ill-treated by a cheap polarization app?

PK
 
PhotoKhan said:
There are two type of replies until now.

1. Blaming it on ACR profiles, although a conversion made with Capture NXD was already kindly posted that also exhibits the problem, although to a lesser extent.

2. Spin-off humor.

I am a Canon user that's has been having an hard time in the last years both trying to explain to my crowd DR is useful (...and the wider, the better...) and also to Sony-sourced sensors zealots that there's photography life beyond simple DR.

Now, I see this from a camera that has been measured and proven to be a reference and my question is?

What good is extended for DR if shadows may come straight out of the camera at low ISO and proper exposure looking like a smartphone shot ill-treated by a cheap polarization app?

PK
Click to expand...
 
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