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DF2 Future

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AM4L

AM4L

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Within the interview about Nikon pursuing a FF Mirrorless, the first and larger part talks about the DF and future DF possibility. The translation is really rough, but I took away a few things.

The sensor was deliberately chosen for its lower resolution to work better with older lenses and the D4 sensor happened to be the one available for it. Also, that if a future model were to come out, a lower resolution sensor say the D5 sensor might be chosen over the D750. Again, this is my interpretation of a really spotty translation.

Maybe a stretch but it seems the he might be saying that the D750 tech would be used this time, not the D610... could mean 51 point AF. Also lighter and thinner frame and or smaller size?

Also,, I think that it's clear from this Nikon doesn't feel it sold well and that if people want to see a new model, lol, they need to go buy up the rest of the existing cameras.

http://info.xitek.com/Interviews/201709/13-232034.html

Google translate version (awful)


Be interested to see what others might get from translating it. The first part is a lot to do with his own DF mods, and interesting read in itself.
 
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I hope Nikon can manage a DF2. In the NikonRumors coverage/translation, there is also mention of possibly using the D850 sensor. Looks like they're still weighing between alternatives.

Loading…

nikonrumors.com
 
AM4L said:
The sensor was deliberately chosen for its lower resolution to work better with older lenses and the D4 sensor happened to be the one available for it.
Click to expand...
Whether the translation is accurate is separate to the fact that, backward compatibility aside, lower resolution sensors do not produce "better" pictures with older lenses as the image files from lower resolution sensors contain less detail than if older lenses are used with a higher resolution sensor.
 
lickity split said:
His comments made it sound like they have a large amount of DF's they'd have to unload before they would consider a #2
Click to expand...
Yes - the remark was quite discouraging. Almost implying that sales of the current Df would need to increase before they considered replacement.

Do they seriously believe sales figures for a 6 year old body are going to increase?
 
MrScrooge said:
lickity split said:
His comments made it sound like they have a large amount of DF's they'd have to unload before they would consider a #2
Click to expand...
Yes - the remark was quite discouraging. Almost implying that sales of the current Df would need to increase before they considered replacement.

Do they seriously believe sales figures for a 6 year old body are going to increase?
Click to expand...
Nope so he indirectly said the DF line is pretty much dead in the water.
 
AM4L said:
Also,, I think that it's clear from this Nikon doesn't feel it sold well and that if people want to see a new model, lol, they need to go buy up the rest of the existing cameras.
Click to expand...
My take on that part was that he was surfacing an internal argument within Nikon. Looks to me like he was a champion of the DF project and felt like some decisions they made about its design were wrong ones. And it seemed to me like he would like to build a Df2, but is facing resistance from other forces within Nikon who are arguing it was a sales failure.

Basically, I think he was saying, "If we had built the Df the way I wanted to, it would have sold better. It didn't, and now I'm having trouble winning the argument to make a follow up. If people want a Df2, they can help me win the argument by going out and buying a bunch of them."

It's a strange interview. I've never seen a Nikon employee allow himself to be publicly shown using third-party accessories with a Nikon camera. And he spoke at length about the weaknesses of the Df that those accessories help correct. Very unusual. That looked to me like a deliberate attempt to stick a finger in the eye of whoever was responsible for those design decisions. (Presumably not him.)

Edit: Another possibility is that putting customized mods on your camera is a big thing in China, and he was playing to that audience. I dunno; just a random thought.

Caveat: we're still working with very imperfect translations, so I think we should be careful making too much of anything he said (or allegedly may have said, depending on how you translate it.)
 
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Eamon Hickey said:
It's a strange interview. I've never seen a Nikon employee allow himself to be publicly shown using third-party accessories with a Nikon camera. And he spoke at length about the weaknesses of the Df that those accessories help correct. Very unusual. That looked to me like a deliberate attempt to stick a finger in the eye of whoever was responsible for those design decisions. (Presumably not him.)

Caveat: we're still working with very imperfect translations, so I think we should be careful making too much of anything he said (or allegedly may have said, depending on how you translate it.)
Click to expand...
One thing hinting towards a suboptimal translation is that the grip is said to be from a third party while it really looks like the Nikon grip. At least it looks like the one I have on mine (well, mine doesn't have the weight-saving extra holes).

Topi
 
Lets make the new FF mirrorless even more reto, How about a updated Nikon SP/S/M rangefinder at 36 to 48 MP?? I loved shooting with my old Nikon M rangefinder.

Mike
 
- smaller and lighter body

- D5 sensor

-shutter speed upto 1/8000

- no video option and retro design (as previous gen.)

- FX compatible mouth (no new mouth)

- around $2000 (this is to kill all SONY A series and make Fuji guys switch)

no doubt that This will be a good alternative to mirrorless cameras, and Nikon can gain market shear from Fuji and Sony. To be honest, i can switch to Nikon depending on DF2 Specs and price Tag.
 
Lower resolution sensors don't necessarily make better images than higher resolution sensors, but the Df would have been lame with a D750 sensor, IMO. The 36 would have made very little sense. I think the 16MP sensor was one of their best ever for various things other than resolution and it was absolutely the perfect choice for the Df.

In their FX lineup since the D700, the 24MP, while insanely impressive in its capability (DR, high ISO), is for some reason often last for me in output as I browse through lightroom. I'm not saying it is bad, but the 16, 36 and most times 12MP from the D700 almost always look better to me.

I'm very happy to have that Nikon-designed 16MP sensor in one of the last Japan-made Nikon cameras. It's quirky and it is very Nikon. I'll keep it as a collector's item, always.
 
Eamon Hickey said:
AM4L said:
Also,, I think that it's clear from this Nikon doesn't feel it sold well and that if people want to see a new model, lol, they need to go buy up the rest of the existing cameras.
Click to expand...
My take on that part was that he was surfacing an internal argument within Nikon. Looks to me like he was a champion of the DF project and felt like some decisions they made about its design were wrong ones. And it seemed to me like he would like to build a Df2, but is facing resistance from other forces within Nikon who are arguing it was a sales failure.

Basically, I think he was saying, "If we had built the Df the way I wanted to, it would have sold better. It didn't, and now I'm having trouble winning the argument to make a follow up. If people want a Df2, they can help me win the argument by going out and buying a bunch of them."

It's a strange interview. I've never seen a Nikon employee allow himself to be publicly shown using third-party accessories with a Nikon camera. And he spoke at length about the weaknesses of the Df that those accessories help correct. Very unusual. That looked to me like a deliberate attempt to stick a finger in the eye of whoever was responsible for those design decisions. (Presumably not him.)

Edit: Another possibility is that putting customized mods on your camera is a big thing in China, and he was playing to that audience. I dunno; just a random thought.

Caveat: we're still working with very imperfect translations, so I think we should be careful making too much of anything he said (or allegedly may have said, depending on how you translate it.)
Click to expand...
Good points!
 
I agree about the sensitive low pixel count (high ISO) sensor vs. the high dynamic range high pixel count (low ISO) dichotomy, but I think they made the right choice before with the D4 sensor. It would be stupid for Nikon to try and please everyone with this camera, they have to choose certain priority sets that make sense. In fact, I think they still tried too hard to make everyone happy, a more purist-oriented camera would have sold better (I passed on the Df myself).

I think they could get it into a slimmer body/package like the older F/F2/F3/FE/FM/FG/etc if they eliminated the rear LCD package that has to be installed behind the sensor array. The sensor+LCD combo is a lot of what makes modern DSLRs so damn boxy in appearance and deep in dimension, rather than slim like they were in the past. Yes the live view is useful for chimps, but do you really absolutely need it to make great photographs? I think not. If you're worried that you didn't nail your exposure, simply bracket and then no need to worry. It would also bring back some of the excitement of not seeing your photos until they are developed (or downloaded).

Df II wishes: Ditch the LCD, live view, movies, etc., and load it up with just the good stuff! Put the D5 sensor, processor, awesome AF guts, shutter (up to 1/8000 sec), and a fantastic battery in there...that's it. Maybe also make the viewfinder a bit larger (1.00x or even beyond), while we're at it.
 
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JHern said:
I agree about the sensitive low pixel count (high ISO) sensor vs. the high dynamic range high pixel count (low ISO) dichotomy, but I think they made the right choice before with the D4 sensor. It would be stupid for Nikon to try and please everyone with this camera, they have to choose certain priority sets that make sense. In fact, I think they still tried too hard to make everyone happy, a more purist-oriented camera would have sold better (I passed on the Df myself).

I think they could get it into a slimmer body/package like the older F/F2/F3/FE/FM/FG/etc if they eliminated the rear LCD package that has to be installed behind the sensor array. The sensor+LCD combo is a lot of what makes modern DSLRs so damn boxy in appearance and deep in dimension, rather than slim like they were in the past. Yes the live view is useful for chimps, but do you really absolutely need it to make great photographs? I think not. If you're worried that you didn't nail your exposure, simply bracket and then no need to worry. It would also bring back some of the excitement of not seeing your photos until they are developed (or downloaded).

Df II wishes: Ditch the LCD, live view, movies, etc., and load it up with just the good stuff! Put the D5 sensor, processor, awesome AF guts, shutter (up to 1/8000 sec), and a fantastic battery in there...that's it. Maybe also make the viewfinder a bit larger (1.00x or even beyond), while we're at it.
Click to expand...
Df doesn't do movies (video) so there is nothing to ditch. Not being able to review images would guarantee they would sell almost zero.
 
What I love about the Df is the D4 sensor. The camera also looks great. But using it in low light, I hate the ergonomics and the weak AF. If there was a Df2 with the D5's sensor and AF, I might be tempted.
 
I don't think there will be a Df2. I know many people really liked the camera but the sales were never that great. Nikon makes cameras to sell and not because a small group of people like a camera. I'm sure that if the Df had sold like the D800 or even the D810, you'd be seeing a Df2.
 
nuke12 said:
I don't think there will be a Df2. I know many people really liked the camera but the sales were never that great. Nikon makes cameras to sell and not because a small group of people like a camera. I'm sure that if the Df had sold like the D800 or even the D810, you'd be seeing a Df2.
Click to expand...
 
scokill said:
nuke12 said:
I don't think there will be a Df2. I know many people really liked the camera but the sales were never that great. Nikon makes cameras to sell and not because a small group of people like a camera. I'm sure that if the Df had sold like the D800 or even the D810, you'd be seeing a Df2.
Click to expand...
I've never seen sales figures nor Nikon's forecast for sales so not sure how someone could say the sales were never that great. I doubt the expectations were the same as the D800 or D810. But I do agree it is unlikely there will be a DF2. I think there was a confluence of events with hardware that led to the Df.
Click to expand...
Not deadly accurate but has about the same accuracy for any Nikon camera. Go here and start adding up the serial numbers for the Df compared to a lot of the other Nikon cameras.

http://www.photosynthesis.co.nz/nikon/camera.html
 
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