From DSLR to Mirrorless. 4/3 or APS-C?

AkiraOkihu · May 21, 2017

For the TL;DR read the bold text.

Hey there! It's already nearly 1:00 AM here, so I'll try to make this quick. I've spent the last 3 hours reading about mirrorless, but I have to ask this question because I've no more time available, unfortunately.

Sony vs Fuji vs Olympus vs Panasonic? I want a small camera that I can bring with me every day because my EOS 700D is quite hard to take with around everywhere.

For street photography, I'm thinking about a 40mm (ff equivalent). I also do portraits, so I'd need at least an 80mm (ff equivalent). I don't normally do wildlife yet, so that's not a concern for now. Video is very important as well. I'm a hybrid shooter.

The main camera I have in mind is the A6000. The thing is it's an APS-C sensor, but they also have a full-frame line which I'd like to upgrade to. I can't afford to buy an A7 directly right now. And even if I would, I wouldn't afford the lenses.

I'm afraid that there are better APS-C mirrorless cameras out there. I have been looking at mirrorless ever since Sony has announced the A9. I would love to upgrade to that system, but I'm afraid I wouldn't be able to use my APS-C lenses.

Should I go Fuji/Olympus and get into ff Sony directly when I can upgrade or should I get the A6000?

I mostly know the answer, since I want to upgrade to ff Sony anyways. I just want to make sure I'm not making the wrong decision by getting the A6000 instead of buying another system, like a Fuji or an Olympus.

I've also read somewhere, can't recall where, that the 4/3 mount is the same for all manufacturers. This would mean I can use Fuji lenses with Olympus bodies and vice-versa. Is this true? I'll look into this tomorrow anyways, it's just that it's so late here I don't have the time right now.

If it makes a difference, I'm also looking to adapt vintage lenses to use on my Mirrorless system. So, bonus points for the system that can adapt most lenses.

Thanks for the help!

beatboxa · May 21, 2017

AkiraOkihu said:
For the TL;DR read the bold text.

Hey there! It's already nearly 1:00 AM here, so I'll try to make this quick. I've spent the last 3 hours reading about mirrorless, but I have to ask this question because I've no more time available, unfortunately.

Sony vs Fuji vs Olympus vs Panasonic? I want a small camera that I can bring with me every day because my EOS 700D is quite hard to take with around everywhere.

For street photography, I'm thinking about a 40mm (ff equivalent). I also do portraits, so I'd need at least an 80mm (ff equivalent). I don't normally do wildlife yet, so that's not a concern for now. Video is very important as well. I'm a hybrid shooter.

The main camera I have in mind is the A6000. The thing is it's an APS-C sensor, but they also have a full-frame line which I'd like to upgrade to. I can't afford to buy an A7 directly right now. And even if I would, I wouldn't afford the lenses.

I'm afraid that there are better APS-C mirrorless cameras out there. I have been looking at mirrorless ever since Sony has announced the A9. I would love to upgrade to that system, but I'm afraid I wouldn't be able to use my APS-C lenses.

Should I go Fuji/Olympus and get into ff Sony directly when I can upgrade or should I get the A6000?

I mostly know the answer, since I want to upgrade to ff Sony anyways. I just want to make sure I'm not making the wrong decision by getting the A6000 instead of buying another system, like a Fuji or an Olympus.

I've also read somewhere, can't recall where, that the 4/3 mount is the same for all manufacturers. This would mean I can use Fuji lenses with Olympus bodies and vice-versa. Is this true? I'll look into this tomorrow anyways, it's just that it's so late here I don't have the time right now.

If it makes a difference, I'm also looking to adapt vintage lenses to use on my Mirrorless system. So, bonus points for the system that can adapt most lenses.

Thanks for the help!

--
Always have a camera with you.

I'm not saying this is the choice for you, but here is what I did.

For the main problem that you are attempting to solve, I use a Panasonic GM1 + 20mm F/1.7 + 42.5mm F/1.7 lens today (micro four thirds system). For equivalents, multiply by 2 (eg. 20mm is 40mm equivalent and 42.5mm is 85mm equivalent). I also really like Fuji. I think Canon has a good mirrorless system too (like the M6).

The Sony is much more capable feature-wise than my GM1, but I like the convenience of the GM1 more. I don't know how the lens selection is for what you want to do in the Sony, but I would research that before you buy. There are also more featured cameras than mine, like the Panasonic GX85.

I also have FF DSLR systems and an adapter, but I almost never actually use adapted lenses. Every system you mentioned should be able to adapt vintage lenses.

Yes, you can use Olympus & Panasonic lenses interchangeably--sometimes a few features are different (like image stabilization).

For my system, I carry it around in my jeans pockets.

This is the camera, 2 lenses, and a set of keys...in my hand.

You can compare the size to an A6000 here or at camerasize.com .

As far as if you want to 'upgrade' to full frame, remember that if you want the camera to be small, you'll probably buy lenses designed for APS-C sized sensors for now. If you go full frame, you'll need to replace these anyway. So I don't think the system you choose will directly relate to which FF system you go with.

Alternatively, you could research some compact cameras like the Sony RX100 and Panasonic LX100. They may meet your needs until you decide what you want to do longer term.

osv · May 21, 2017

AkiraOkihu said:
Sony vs Fuji vs Olympus vs Panasonic? I want a small camera that I can bring with me every day because my EOS 700D is quite hard to take with around everywhere.

compare dynamic range between different cameras here: http://photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm

AkiraOkihu said:
For street photography, I'm thinking about a 40mm (ff equivalent). I also do portraits, so I'd need at least an 80mm (ff equivalent). I don't normally do wildlife yet, so that's not a concern for now. Video is very important as well. I'm a hybrid shooter.

do you need autofocus for video?

AkiraOkihu said:
The main camera I have in mind is the A6000. The thing is it's an APS-C sensor, but they also have a full-frame line which I'd like to upgrade to. I can't afford to buy an A7 directly right now. And even if I would, I wouldn't afford the lenses.

you can easily afford ff legacy glass, that will work on both crop and ff.

it'll probably be manual focus, tho...

AkiraOkihu said:
Should I go Fuji/Olympus and get into ff Sony directly when I can upgrade or should I get the A6000?

the advantage with sony is that if you want to get e-mount lenses, get 'em in ff, so that they can be used on both crop and ff.

there isn't any path to ff with m4/3 and fuji.

AkiraOkihu said:
If it makes a difference, I'm also looking to adapt vintage lenses to use on my Mirrorless system. So, bonus points for the system that can adapt most lenses.

e-mount has the most comprehensive adapter availability, by far.

a_c_skinner · May 21, 2017

If you want smaller forget full frame mirrorless. The Sony body is smaller, but overall the size saving is modest or non existent.

If you want video then only the later Fujis will do, Fuji were late in getting good video. Panasonic's higher end cameras are said to be excellent for both. Sony APS-C doesn't have the lens selection that Fuji and M43 have.

hifimacianer · May 22, 2017

AkiraOkihu said:
Sony vs Fuji vs Olympus vs Panasonic? I want a small camera that I can bring with me every day because my EOS 700D is quite hard to take with around everywhere.

You can get a small system with all of them. But keep in mind, that there are no fast aperture lenses in the Sony APS-C lens lineup. They have no fast zoom, and only a few prime lenses that have 1.8 as their fastest aperture. So you would have to buy the bigger (and expensive) lenses that are designed for Sony FF, if you want really fast lenses.

AkiraOkihu said:
For street photography, I'm thinking about a 40mm (ff equivalent). I also do portraits, so I'd need at least an 80mm (ff equivalent). I don't normally do wildlife yet, so that's not a concern for now. Video is very important as well. I'm a hybrid hooter.

I don't know much about video, but I heared that there are some m43 cameras that do it pretty good. Regarding the focal lenght you prefer, I think you'll find something in every system. But it really depends on how fast the lenses should be.

AkiraOkihu said:
The main camera I have in mind is the A6000. The thing is it's an APS-C sensor, but they also have a full-frame line which I'd like to upgrade to. I can't afford to buy an A7 directly right now. And even if I would, I wouldn't afford the lenses.

If you want to go to FF, the Sony system seems to be the best choice.

BUT, if you won't buy any of the FF lenses for the A6000 now, it won't help you on your switch to FF. In the end you would have to buy everything new, when you switch to Sony FF.

AND you won't have any advantage in size, because the FF lenses are pretty big.

So the most logical decision for your actual needs would be, to look for a compact system with a good lens selection. If you want to go to FF on a later stage, you can sell your gear - and it doesn't make a difference if you sell your Sony APS-C gear, or your Fuji or m43 gear.

AkiraOkihu said:
I'm afraid that there are better APS-C mirrorless cameras out there. I have been looking at mirrorless ever since Sony has announced the A9. I would love to upgrade to that system, but I'm afraid I wouldn't be able to use my APS-C lenses.

There are better APS-C cameras out there - the Fuji X-T2 or X-T20 for example. But there are also really good m43 cameras available. If you go the Sony way, but only buy APS-C lenses, you can't really use them on the FF cameras. The Mount is the same, but they are just not designed for the FF sensor, because the Image circle is too small.

AkiraOkihu said:
Should I go Fuji/Olympus and get into ff Sony directly when I can upgrade or should I get the A6000?

If you don't have any plans to buy the Sony FF lenses now, I would prefer it to buy into m43 or Fuji now, and build a compact system that suits your actual needs (compact/video). If you want to have it small/compact, it doesn't make sense to buy a small camera (A6000) and attatch big FF lenses on it.

AkiraOkihu said:
I mostly know the answer, since I want to upgrade to ff Sony anyways. I just want to make sure I'm not making the wrong decision by getting the A6000 instead of buying another system, like a Fuji or an Olympus.

As I said before, if you buy a FF Sony one day, you have to buy a complete new set of lenses for it. So you could also look for another system now, that suits your actual needs better.

AkiraOkihu said:
I've also read somewhere, can't recall where, that the 4/3 mount is the same for all manufacturers.

Only for manufacturers that Support m43. m43 is not only the mount, it's also the sensor format (smaller than APS-C). Olympus and Panasonic are the main Players here. Fuji has a different mount and has it's own lens lineup.

AkiraOkihu said:
This would mean I can use Fuji lenses with Olympus bodies and vice-versa.

AkiraOkihu said:
Is this true?

No, you can only use m43 lenses on m43 cameras, and Fuji lenses on Fuji cameras. Fuji has a bigger (APS-C) sensor than m43.

AkiraOkihu said:
If it makes a difference, I'm also looking to adapt vintage lenses to use on my Mirrorless system. So, bonus points for the system that can adapt most lenses.

--

There are plenty of lens adapters for all 3 mirrorless systems. If you talk about real (manual) vintage lenses, you won't have a problem to use these on all 3 systems.

a_c_skinner · May 22, 2017

PS my strong advice is to forget full frame completely for the immediate future. The number of people who truly get better photos from it than they would have from APS-C and probably M4/3 is small. Depth of field is less on bigger sensors, but not hugely so over APS-C and in any case we spent years trying to get the deepest DoF we could, shallow DoF is not essential by any means, it is a current vogue. I know it helps some pictures, but then so does deep DoF. If I say more my unreasoning prejudice against Sony will surface, and it is (largely) unreasoned!

--
Andrew Skinner

AkiraOkihu · May 22, 2017

Thanks for the help! The thing is, I don't need to go 100% compact. I have no problem with buying the FF lenses now. This was the plan with Canon as well. I just need a wide and an 80mm, both pancakes or at least quite small, for the Sony APS-C. I need a camera that can be both compact and pocketable, but also big and powerful if I need it to be. My plan is to upgrade to FF because I am looking to get into pro event shooting.

I don't need the fastest lenses out there. Even with my Canon I only have the kit lens and a 50mm f/1.4 (which I keep at f/2.8 anyways) and I do just fine. If I need low-light capabilities I bring a tripod.

I've looked into the GM1. There are two things I don't like about it: it has no viewfinder and it seems too small. I know the EVF is just another screen, but it is protected from the sun, which helps a lot because the sun is quite bright here. Also, I have big hands (about 19cm from my palm to my middle finger), so I don't think I'd be comfortable using it long term. I'll have to go into a store and test it out.

I do need autofocus for video. It's not that big of a deal if I don't have it because I won't film myself a lot. But I do plan on filming myself, so not having to ask someone to focus for me would be awesome. Slow motion recording is nice as well. I want to make music videos and narrative videos, so if there is such a feature, why not use it?

I also am on a budget, kind of. After selling my current gear and with some money I could gather, I'd have about $850 to spend on new gear. I live in Romania, so the prices are a bit bigger here as well. I could afford the X-T1 sh or the X-T10 sh, but I've read it is subpar for videos. If I stretch my budget, I could get the A6300, which has 120 fps for HD video.

These are details I should've added yesterday. Being tired didn't help me.

Thanks for the help!

hifimacianer · May 22, 2017

AkiraOkihu said:
Thanks for the help! The thing is, I don't need to go 100% compact. I have no problem with buying the FF lenses now. This was the plan with Canon as well. I just need a wide and an 80mm, both pancakes or at least quite small, for the Sony APS-C. I need a camera that can be both compact and pocketable, but also big and powerful if I need it to be. My plan is to upgrade to FF because I am looking to get into pro event shooting.

What you want doesn't exist at the moment, at least with Sony. The only pancakes for Sony are for the APS-C cameras, and can't be used on FF later on. But these pancakes don't match your prefered 40mm and 80mm FL.

If you look for small primes for Sony FF (that can be used on the APS-C too), there is only the 35/2.8 for around 800$, the 85/1.8 for around 600$ and the 50/1.8 for 250$, but they are not in your prefered FL too.

I don't know what Kind of pro event shooting you want to do in future, but usually you need fast glass for this, especially if you have people around there and can't use a flash.

And then it get's really expensive on Sony FF.

AkiraOkihu said:
I do need autofocus for video. It's not that big of a deal if I don't have it because I won't film myself a lot. But I do plan on filming myself, so not having to ask someone to focus for me would be awesome. Slow motion recording is nice as well. I want to make music videos and narrative videos, so if there is such a feature, why not use it?

I also am on a budget, kind of. After selling my current gear and with some money I could gather, I'd have about $850 to spend on new gear. I live in Romania, so the prices are a bit bigger here as well. I could afford the X-T1 sh or the X-T10 sh, but I've read it is subpar for videos. If I stretch my budget, I could get the A6300, which has 120 fps for HD video.

I wouldn't recommend the X-T1 or X-T10 if you want to do video too. They are just not good for this.

Regarding your tight budget, I fear that you won't find proper gear for your needs, if you also need new lenses AND want to use them on FF later on.

AkiraOkihu · May 22, 2017

hifimacianer said:
AkiraOkihu said:

Thanks for the help! The thing is, I don't need to go 100% compact. I have no problem with buying the FF lenses now. This was the plan with Canon as well. I just need a wide and an 80mm, both pancakes or at least quite small, for the Sony APS-C. I need a camera that can be both compact and pocketable, but also big and powerful if I need it to be. My plan is to upgrade to FF because I am looking to get into pro event shooting.

Click to expand...

What you want doesn't exist at the moment, at least with Sony. The only pancakes for Sony are for the APS-C cameras, and can't be used on FF later on. But these pancakes don't match your prefered 40mm and 80mm FL.

If you look for small primes for Sony FF (that can be used on the APS-C too), there is only the 35/2.8 for around 800$, the 85/1.8 for around 600$ and the 50/1.8 for 250$, but they are not in your prefered FL too.

The 50/1.8 is, actually, in my preferred FL. If I use it with an APS-C, I'd have an 80mm, exactly what I have with my Canon APS-C and the 50mm. Or am I missing something? But they are just the right focal lengths (35mm and 85mm) for FF.

Also, I'm not looking for small primes for the FF. I realise that the FF has big lenses. I'm looking for a small wide that can be used on the A6000, as I won't sell it unless I want to upgrade to another APS-C mirrorless. Having a backup body even when I go mirrorless is always a good idea.

hifimacianer said:
I don't know what Kind of pro event shooting you want to do in future, but usually you need fast glass for this, especially if you have people around there and can't use a flash.

And then it get's really expensive on Sony FF.

All fast glass is quite expensive for FF, isn't it?

hifimacianer said:
hifimacianer said:

I do need autofocus for video. It's not that big of a deal if I don't have it because I won't film myself a lot. But I do plan on filming myself, so not having to ask someone to focus for me would be awesome. Slow motion recording is nice as well. I want to make music videos and narrative videos, so if there is such a feature, why not use it?

I also am on a budget, kind of. After selling my current gear and with some money I could gather, I'd have about $850 to spend on new gear. I live in Romania, so the prices are a bit bigger here as well. I could afford the X-T1 sh or the X-T10 sh, but I've read it is subpar for videos. If I stretch my budget, I could get the A6300, which has 120 fps for HD video.

Click to expand...

I wouldn't recommend the X-T1 or X-T10 if you want to do video too. They are just not good for this.

Regarding your tight budget, I fear that you won't find proper gear for your needs, if you also need new lenses AND want to use them on FF later on.

I'm not going to buy all the gear at once. I can do fine with the kit lens and a 50mm on Canon APS-C, I can do fine with this setup on any other system. I will want to upgrade the lenses, of course, but I won't do it all at once.

I've looked into micro 4/3 lenses and they do look quite nice in terms of focal length and aperture.

But you are right, Sony gets quite expensive, if only for the fact that not many people use it here, so the second-hand market is small. I'll guess I'll stick with Canon for now. Once I make some money with photography, I'll look into mirrorless again.

Thanks!

hifimacianer · May 22, 2017

AkiraOkihu said:
The 50/1.8 is, actually, in my preferred FL. If I use it with an APS-C, I'd have an 80mm, exactly what I have with my Canon APS-C and the 50mm. Or am I missing something?

No, you are correct, it was my mistake here!

AkiraOkihu said:
But they are just the right focal lengths (35mm and 85mm) for FF.

Yes, for FF they will match, if you can live with the 5mm difference. I thought that you want 40mm for a reason (35mm too narrow etc.). But if you are OK with the difference, these would be ok later.

But on APS-C, there is no compact 35 or 40 equivalent lens that you could use later too.

AkiraOkihu said:
Also, I'm not looking for small primes for the FF. I realise that the FF has big lenses.

I had the Impression that you look for small primes that can be used on both.

AkiraOkihu said:
I'm looking for a small wide that can be used on the A6000, as I won't sell it unless I want to upgrade to another APS-C mirrorless. Having a backup body even when I go mirrorless is always a good idea.

OK, then you are fine with this choice.

AkiraOkihu said:
AkiraOkihu said:

I don't know what Kind of pro event shooting you want to do in future, but usually you need fast glass for this, especially if you have people around there and can't use a flash.

And then it get's really expensive on Sony FF.

Click to expand...

All fast glass is quite expensive for FF, isn't it?

I think you could get it a bit cheaper if you look for Canon or Nikon, they just have more variants of the same focal length, but with different max aperture, so the price may be a bit lower.

Or you could of course just use APS-C with fast lenses. There are many photographers who went the other way (FF to Fuji APS-C), and are perfectly happy with the results. And they also shoot weddings and other official stuff. Especially if you don't want to buy the fastest available glass for Sony FF on a later point, you won't notice any big difference to Fuji with it's affordable F1.4 primes.

But I wouldn't go below the X-T2, because you also want to have good video. That would be the biggest compromise, that you would have to spend more for the body now, but on a later stage you just have to buy faster glass for your pro-work, and not an additional camera AND FF lenses.

But that's up to you, if you definately want FF later, Sony will be the only Option.

AkiraOkihu said:
AkiraOkihu said:

AkiraOkihu said:

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

I've looked into micro 4/3 lenses and they do look quite nice in terms of focal length and aperture.

There are really good options available for m43 too

Ido Scharf · May 22, 2017

It basically sounds like you'll end up with two separate setups: a very small and lightweight one for general use, and another setup for professional event shooting, which could be bigger. So the latter could, potentially, be a Sony a7-series or a9 camera with FE lenses, but does that really mean the smaller setup has to be Sony APS-C? I'm not sure how similar the controls are between, say, an a6000 and an a7R II, so that's not really a concern. And it doesn't seem like you'll be crisscrossing lenses between the two setups, so why not look at two different systems?

For the small setup, you'll really get the most from a Micro Four Thirds camera, like the Panasonic GX85. Add the 20mm f/1.7, or 15mm f/1.7, and the 42.5mm f/1.7, and you have a very small and lightweight kit.

For the pro setup, maybe it would be a good idea just to hold on to your Canon DSLR for now? You might even find, in use, that the Panasonic isn't any worse, and it could be just as viable for professional event photography. But if you still think it's suboptimal, then maybe keeping the Canon will ease the way to a bigger sensor and better lenses, size and weight be damned.

beagle1 · May 22, 2017

AkiraOkihu said:
For the TL;DR read the bold text.

Hey there! It's already nearly 1:00 AM here, so I'll try to make this quick. I've spent the last 3 hours reading about mirrorless, but I have to ask this question because I've no more time available, unfortunately.

Sony vs Fuji vs Olympus vs Panasonic? I want a small camera that I can bring with me every day because my EOS 700D is quite hard to take with around everywhere.

For street photography, I'm thinking about a 40mm (ff equivalent). I also do portraits, so I'd need at least an 80mm (ff equivalent). I don't normally do wildlife yet, so that's not a concern for now. Video is very important as well. I'm a hybrid shooter.

The main camera I have in mind is the A6000. The thing is it's an APS-C sensor, but they also have a full-frame line which I'd like to upgrade to. I can't afford to buy an A7 directly right now. And even if I would, I wouldn't afford the lenses.

I'm afraid that there are better APS-C mirrorless cameras out there. I have been looking at mirrorless ever since Sony has announced the A9. I would love to upgrade to that system, but I'm afraid I wouldn't be able to use my APS-C lenses.

Should I go Fuji/Olympus and get into ff Sony directly when I can upgrade or should I get the A6000?

I mostly know the answer, since I want to upgrade to ff Sony anyways. I just want to make sure I'm not making the wrong decision by getting the A6000 instead of buying another system, like a Fuji or an Olympus.

I've also read somewhere, can't recall where, that the 4/3 mount is the same for all manufacturers. This would mean I can use Fuji lenses with Olympus bodies and vice-versa. Is this true? I'll look into this tomorrow anyways, it's just that it's so late here I don't have the time right now.

If it makes a difference, I'm also looking to adapt vintage lenses to use on my Mirrorless system. So, bonus points for the system that can adapt most lenses.

Thanks for the help!

--
Always have a camera with you.

I use a small mirrorless and 'pancake' lens or everyday'street (and much more)

www.flickr.com/photos/mmirrorless

Tim Reidy Productions · May 22, 2017

AkiraOkihu said:
Thanks for the help! The thing is, I don't need to go 100% compact. I have no problem with buying the FF lenses now. This was the plan with Canon as well. I just need a wide and an 80mm, both pancakes or at least quite small, for the Sony APS-C. I need a camera that can be both compact and pocketable, but also big and powerful if I need it to be. My plan is to upgrade to FF because I am looking to get into pro event shooting.

AkiraOkihu said:
You may want to buy both a compact and a ff as you seem to have 2 needs

AkiraOkihu said:
I don't need the fastest lenses out there. Even with my Canon I only have the kit lens and a 50mm f/1.4 (which I keep at f/2.8 anyways) and I do just fine. If I need low-light capabilities I bring a tripod.

I've looked into the GM1. There are two things I don't like about it: it has no viewfinder and it seems too small. I know the EVF is just another screen, but it is protected from the sun, which helps a lot because the sun is quite bright here. Also, I have big hands (about 19cm from my palm to my middle finger), so I don't think I'd be comfortable using it long term. I'll have to go into a store and test it out.

m43 has a variety of bodies you should pick the body that will work for you.

plus you have pancake options. I use my oly 17 2.8 for street.

AkiraOkihu said:
I do need autofocus for video. It's not that big of a deal if I don't have it because I won't film myself a lot. But I do plan on filming myself, so not having to ask someone to focus for me would be awesome. Slow motion recording is nice as well. I want to make music videos and narrative videos, so if there is such a feature, why not use it?

m43 is nice in video, but so is sony

AkiraOkihu said:
I also am on a budget, kind of. After selling my current gear and with some money I could gather, I'd have about $850 to spend on new gear. I live in Romania, so the prices are a bit bigger here as well. I could afford the X-T1 sh or the X-T10 sh, but I've read it is subpar for videos. If I stretch my budget, I could get the A6300, which has 120 fps for HD video.

you way want to go m43 or a sony a6000 but only have the money for one

AkiraOkihu said:
These are details I should've added yesterday. Being tired didn't help me.

Thanks for the help!

--
Always have a camera with you.

golfhov · May 22, 2017

hifimacianer said:
AkiraOkihu said:

The 50/1.8 is, actually, in my preferred FL. If I use it with an APS-C, I'd have an 80mm, exactly what I have with my Canon APS-C and the 50mm. Or am I missing something?

Click to expand...

No, you are correct, it was my mistake here!

hifimacianer said:

But they are just the right focal lengths (35mm and 85mm) for FF.

Click to expand...

Yes, for FF they will match, if you can live with the 5mm difference. I thought that you want 40mm for a reason (35mm too narrow etc.). But if you are OK with the difference, these would be ok later.

But on APS-C, there is no compact 35 or 40 equivalent lens that you could use later too.

actually there is the 28 f2 which would be 42mm. Fairly small and light. Works like a champ on ff too if you want a 28

hifimacianer said:
hifimacianer said:

Also, I'm not looking for small primes for the FF. I realise that the FF has big lenses.

Click to expand...

I had the Impression that you look for small primes that can be used on both.

hifimacianer said:

I'm looking for a small wide that can be used on the A6000, as I won't sell it unless I want to upgrade to another APS-C mirrorless. Having a backup body even when I go mirrorless is always a good idea.

Click to expand...

OK, then you are fine with this choice.

hifimacianer said:

hifimacianer said:

I don't know what Kind of pro event shooting you want to do in future, but usually you need fast glass for this, especially if you have people around there and can't use a flash.

And then it get's really expensive on Sony FF.

Click to expand...

All fast glass is quite expensive for FF, isn't it?

Click to expand...

I think you could get it a bit cheaper if you look for Canon or Nikon, they just have more variants of the same focal length, but with different max aperture, so the price may be a bit lower.

you can generally save money going canikon. It is going to vary depending on the quality of glass the OP wants, FL, and aperture...........of course if the are a real cheapskate the Laea3 and minolta glass and they will save even more. Worse glass than the cheap canon stuff tho

hifimacianer said:
Or you could of course just use APS-C with fast lenses. There are many photographers who went the other way (FF to Fuji APS-C), and are perfectly happy with the results. And they also shoot weddings and other official stuff. Especially if you don't want to buy the fastest available glass for Sony FF on a later point, you won't notice any big difference to Fuji with it's affordable F1.4 primes.

research those "affordable" primes. Fuji is in the same ball park on price. Obviously depends on choices

hifimacianer said:
But I wouldn't go below the X-T2, because you also want to have good video. That would be the biggest compromise, that you would have to spend more for the body now, but on a later stage you just have to buy faster glass for your pro-work, and not an additional camera AND FF lenses.

actually the xt20 looks quite capable on paper. No experience with it tho

hifimacianer said:
But that's up to you, if you definately want FF later, Sony will be the only Option.

yup......or Leica.....you wanna talk expensive?

hifimacianer said:
hifimacianer said:

I've looked into micro 4/3 lenses and they do look quite nice in terms of focal length and aperture.

Click to expand...

There are really good options available for m43 too

yup. M43 has the largest native lens selection in mirrorless. Although Sony is quickly catching up. The one kicker for m43 that I always end up with is m43 can be small, inexpensive, or relatively fast glass but you need to pick two. Not all three. The "fastss" they offer starts to put them in the cost and size territory of "slow" lenses of larger formats. Start pricing(and sizing) those 1.2/1.4 primes and 2.8 zooms and all of the sudden m43 is as large and expensive(or more) than their bigger bretheren. Not trying to beat a dead horse. i just want to be sure that the OP understands this

hifimacianer · May 22, 2017

golfhov said:
hifimacianer said:

AkiraOkihu said:

The 50/1.8 is, actually, in my preferred FL. If I use it with an APS-C, I'd have an 80mm, exactly what I have with my Canon APS-C and the 50mm. Or am I missing something?

Click to expand...

No, you are correct, it was my mistake here!

golfhov said:

But they are just the right focal lengths (35mm and 85mm) for FF.

Click to expand...

Yes, for FF they will match, if you can live with the 5mm difference. I thought that you want 40mm for a reason (35mm too narrow etc.). But if you are OK with the difference, these would be ok later.

But on APS-C, there is no compact 35 or 40 equivalent lens that you could use later too.

Click to expand...

actually there is the 28 f2 which would be 42mm. Fairly small and light. Works like a champ on ff too if you want a 28

+1 correct!

golfhov said:
golfhov said:

golfhov said:

Especially if you don't want to buy the fastest available glass for Sony FF on a later point, you won't notice any big difference to Fuji with it's affordable F1.4 primes.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

research those "affordable" primes. Fuji is in the same ball park on price. Obviously depends on choices

The Sony F1.4 primes are double the price of the Fujis!

golfhov said:
golfhov said:

But I wouldn't go below the X-T2, because you also want to have good video. That would be the biggest compromise, that you would have to spend more for the body now, but on a later stage you just have to buy faster glass for your pro-work, and not an additional camera AND FF lenses.

Click to expand...

actually the xt20 looks quite capable on paper. No experience with it tho

The X-T20 is a great camera, with the IQ of the X-T2, bit I thought that there are some limitations in video, because you can't attach the booster handgrip on it.

golfhov said:

golfhov · May 23, 2017

hifimacianer said:
golfhov said:

hifimacianer said:

AkiraOkihu said:

The 50/1.8 is, actually, in my preferred FL. If I use it with an APS-C, I'd have an 80mm, exactly what I have with my Canon APS-C and the 50mm. Or am I missing something?

Click to expand...

No, you are correct, it was my mistake here!

hifimacianer said:

But they are just the right focal lengths (35mm and 85mm) for FF.

Click to expand...

Yes, for FF they will match, if you can live with the 5mm difference. I thought that you want 40mm for a reason (35mm too narrow etc.). But if you are OK with the difference, these would be ok later.

But on APS-C, there is no compact 35 or 40 equivalent lens that you could use later too.

Click to expand...

actually there is the 28 f2 which would be 42mm. Fairly small and light. Works like a champ on ff too if you want a 28

Click to expand...

+1 correct!

hifimacianer said:

hifimacianer said:

hifimacianer said:

Especially if you don't want to buy the fastest available glass for Sony FF on a later point, you won't notice any big difference to Fuji with it's affordable F1.4 primes.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

research those "affordable" primes. Fuji is in the same ball park on price. Obviously depends on choices

Click to expand...

The Sony F1.4 primes are double the price of the Fujis!

Ah but........you are comparing APSC to FF. They are not apples to apples. Same as you can get 43 1.4 primes for even less generally speaking. If you care not for equivelance this makes sense

Edit: I double checked. Fuji has 3 or 4 1.4s. A 24, 35, 50, and 85 "eq". They are all marginally cheaper than the Sony except the 50. Batis 25 1.8 is 200 more. Sony doesn't have a 35 f1.8 they have a similar priced 2.8 that is a stop slower or a much higher priced 1.4 that is a stop faster (per eq). The 50 1.8 is 250 less. The 85 1.4 (appropriate because the 52 is a 1.2 not a 1.4). Is $1600 vs 1400 on Fuji.

Your statement as written is kinda true(the 50 1.4 and 35 1.4 of sony are double the price if you pit 1.4 against 1.4) but it hardly reflects the two lineups. Carry this same thing over to zooms and you can get 2.8 zooms for much less on Fuji.........but you are comparing APSC lenses to ff. You can get f4 Sony zooms for a similar price to the Fuji 2.8s

hifimacianer said:
hifimacianer said:

hifimacianer said:

But I wouldn't go below the X-T2, because you also want to have good video. That would be the biggest compromise, that you would have to spend more for the body now, but on a later stage you just have to buy faster glass for your pro-work, and not an additional camera AND FF lenses.

Click to expand...

actually the xt20 looks quite capable on paper. No experience with it tho

Click to expand...

The X-T20 is a great camera, with the IQ of the X-T2, bit I thought that there are some limitations in video, because you can't attach the booster handgrip on it.

I forget the others sync speed? Build quality? Fuji obviously isn't going to offer the exact same features for a lower price but it does seem to offer most

AkiraOkihu · May 24, 2017

Thanks everyone for all the recommendations. I've looked into micro 4/3 and have been surprised to find out there are quite a few cameras on the second-hand market for quite cheap. I went to a store to test out different mirrorless cameras and how they feel, and I've got to say they are awesome.

I'll sell my Canon APS-C gear and switch to Micro 4/3. I love the fact that I can choose either Pansonic or Olympus. For now, I'll go with the Panasonic Lumix GX7. I love the look the Olympus E-M10 silver, but the Pansonic is more pocketable and the buttons are closer to what I already know. I have easy WB, ISO etc. access, which is awesome. Also, the tiltable screen and the silent shutter will allow me to go all ninja mode for my street photography. I know both line-ups have this, I just felt like mentioning it.

The GX7 is surprisingly cheap second hand, cheaper than my EOS 700D. I can't wait to get it so I can carry my camera around more often. When I'll need FF for big sports events and the like, I'll go with the Sony FF.

I know the EVF is either loved or hated. As I've said, I tested some mirrorless cameras. Oh, boy, do I love the EVF. I love having a histogram and knowing if my horizon is levelled and having compositional guidelines, all in my viewfinder.

Thank you, everyone!

Edit: By "pocketable" I don't mean jeans pocketable. I mean I can get it in my school bag along with a pancake lens (in a separate part of the bag, not where I keep my books) so I can have it everywhere, every day. My DSLR with a 50mm is just too bulky to do this. If I want true pocketability (by which I mean having the camera in one pocket in my jeans and the lens in another pocket) I'll get an Olympus E-PL.

--
Always have a camera with you.

golfhov · May 24, 2017

Read the manuals and do your homework during the transition. If you get stuck try searching the 43 forum on this site. Many topics have been coversed there. Good luck

AkiraOkihu · May 24, 2017

golfhov said:
Read the manuals and do your homework during the transition. If you get stuck try searching the 43 forum on this site. Many topics have been coversed there. Good luck

Thanks! I will.

From DSLR to Mirrorless. 4/3 or APS-C?

New member

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Forum Pro

Forum Enthusiast

Forum Pro

New member

Forum Enthusiast

New member

Forum Enthusiast

Veteran Member

Forum Pro

Veteran Member

Forum Pro

Forum Enthusiast

Forum Pro

New member

Forum Pro

New member

Keyboard shortcuts