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ZEISS Batis 2.8/135 APO [ $1,999.00 ] is officially announced...

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RubberDials said:
netscorer2 said:
kelly15 said:
netscorer2 said:
kelly15 said:
netscorer2 said:
Sony E mount system desperately needs Sigma and Tamron native lenses. Zeiss can only charge these prices in current vacuum.
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In your opinion, which will be the added value to have native Sigma FE lenses compared to the current coupled with the MC-11 adapter?
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I see two issues with the current adapted Sigma lenses - they are bigger and heavier then they could be since they are designed for DSLRs and the AF would never be as reliable with adapter as native. For Sigma 135 F1.8 Art, for example, this may turn off most of the pro photographers who actually buy this focal prime as they would never trade 1 extra stop for the AF they can not trust.
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Do you mean that Sigma should completely re-design all ART lenses to fit Sony FE bodies?

If so, I think it will never happens. Too expensive and, mainly, not sure to achieve the current excellent performances of ART series with adapter.

About AF in some way I may agree with you as I lost very few shots due to not correct AF but nevertheless they are too many.

I'm confident Sigma can totally or partially solve this concern via firmware, lenses and/or adapter.
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Sigma is already working on native FE lenses. They said as much in recent interview. And yes, this will be a completely new optical design, taking advantage of short distance to sensor. I would not expect them to simply replicate current Art series, but look intelligently where they can contribute and where they can compete with existing FE lineup.
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I hate to disappoint you but I am confident that Sigma will spam FE users from here to eternity and produce a lens for every focal length imaginable.

50% of threads on this forum over the next five years will consist of Sigma users declaring anybody who has bought an FE lens not made by Sigma to be 'insane' or a 'Zeiss/GM fanboi'.

I'm dreading it already.
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Sorry to disappoint. I have not found a single Sigma lens, in FE or EF mount, worth buying.
 
vett93 said:
RubberDials said:
netscorer2 said:
kelly15 said:
netscorer2 said:
kelly15 said:
netscorer2 said:
Sony E mount system desperately needs Sigma and Tamron native lenses. Zeiss can only charge these prices in current vacuum.
Click to expand...
In your opinion, which will be the added value to have native Sigma FE lenses compared to the current coupled with the MC-11 adapter?
Click to expand...
I see two issues with the current adapted Sigma lenses - they are bigger and heavier then they could be since they are designed for DSLRs and the AF would never be as reliable with adapter as native. For Sigma 135 F1.8 Art, for example, this may turn off most of the pro photographers who actually buy this focal prime as they would never trade 1 extra stop for the AF they can not trust.
Click to expand...
Do you mean that Sigma should completely re-design all ART lenses to fit Sony FE bodies?

If so, I think it will never happens. Too expensive and, mainly, not sure to achieve the current excellent performances of ART series with adapter.

About AF in some way I may agree with you as I lost very few shots due to not correct AF but nevertheless they are too many.

I'm confident Sigma can totally or partially solve this concern via firmware, lenses and/or adapter.
Click to expand...
Sigma is already working on native FE lenses. They said as much in recent interview. And yes, this will be a completely new optical design, taking advantage of short distance to sensor. I would not expect them to simply replicate current Art series, but look intelligently where they can contribute and where they can compete with existing FE lineup.
Click to expand...
I hate to disappoint you but I am confident that Sigma will spam FE users from here to eternity and produce a lens for every focal length imaginable.

50% of threads on this forum over the next five years will consist of Sigma users declaring anybody who has bought an FE lens not made by Sigma to be 'insane' or a 'Zeiss/GM fanboi'.

I'm dreading it already.
Click to expand...
Sorry to disappoint. I have not found a single Sigma lens, in FE or EF mount, worth buying.
Click to expand...
 
joger said:
landshark said:
I am looking forward to this lens arriving, from all accounts so far it is optically stunning, the size is reasonable, the aperture is fine for my use, I do want a well made lens that has autofocus, I have zero desire to use adapters(own one for nikon lenses), zero desire to only manual focus( did that for more years than I care to remember and still own a number of manual focus film cameras), not thrilled but have gotten use to no aperture ring, do not want to carry the 80-200 around, would I like it to be cheaper sure, but it is an APO. This should be the last lens for my Sony's unless they bring out a 300 or 400. Do I miss the fact that it is not an F2 or faster, not really, I would not want it to be that much heavier or larger.

Mine is on order, hopefully here next month, will let all know how it shoots.
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I have zero desire for another bulky and slow lens and I have zero desire to use any kind of zoom on my A7RM2.

I would hardly call F2.8 slow on any Tele

AF on fast primes is extremely welcome and MF on slower and smaller primes is very acceptable for me - I have two lens lines - one for situations where AF is desperately needed and one of situations where MF makes utterly sense.
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Agree manual on super wides works just as well as af
joger said:
I have also two cars - one for traveling and one for fun - the Batis lenses seem to be the family van that is supposed to be spacey but neither very fast nor very agile in handling - I guess this describes it best.
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Would hardly describe them as family vans, I have three cars one to drive fast for fun, one to be practical and travel with dogs and family and one for off road expeditions. I like having the right tool for the job at hand, For me manual focus is a waste of time on most lenses if accurate and fast AF is available. Manually focused for over 30 years of my photo career see little point in it now, so for me I could care less how the focus by wire feels on the Batis but if manual focus is what one wants, enjoy what you like.
joger said:
Of course I am happy for everybody that desires a family van - not my cup of tea though :-)
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vett93 said:
I am a muscle/pony car fan. I had a 1993 Corvette back in the days, after a Mustang and a Firebird Trans Am. After these 3 cars, I made a big mistake of buying a German car, a BMW 7-series with factory lowered M-Sport suspension. It drove like a dream when it was not in the shop. It was the single POS car I have ever owned and I was stranded 7 times in the 8 years of ownership. No more German car for me after that. I was on a BMW 7-series forum back then. Everyone's BMW 7-series had tons of problems.

I am now back to American muscle car with a 392 cubic inch engine and 485 HP! When I was shopping for this car, my wife told me that I should get the 707HP version. Wish I had listened to her. Vroommmm....
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A 135mm is no 85mm, no question here but for portrait I prefer a fast ultra creamy 85mm 1.4 G-Master instead this beast. Against the G-Master I see no advantage at all for this beast.
 
landshark said:
vett93 said:
I am a muscle/pony car fan. I had a 1993 Corvette back in the days, after a Mustang and a Firebird Trans Am. After these 3 cars, I made a big mistake of buying a German car, a BMW 7-series with factory lowered M-Sport suspension. It drove like a dream when it was not in the shop. It was the single POS car I have ever owned and I was stranded 7 times in the 8 years of ownership. No more German car for me after that. I was on a BMW 7-series forum back then. Everyone's BMW 7-series had tons of problems.

I am now back to American muscle car with a 392 cubic inch engine and 485 HP! When I was shopping for this car, my wife told me that I should get the 707HP version. Wish I had listened to her. Vroommmm....
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
vett93 said:
landshark said:
vett93 said:
I am a muscle/pony car fan. I had a 1993 Corvette back in the days, after a Mustang and a Firebird Trans Am. After these 3 cars, I made a big mistake of buying a German car, a BMW 7-series with factory lowered M-Sport suspension. It drove like a dream when it was not in the shop. It was the single POS car I have ever owned and I was stranded 7 times in the 8 years of ownership. No more German car for me after that. I was on a BMW 7-series forum back then. Everyone's BMW 7-series had tons of problems.

I am now back to American muscle car with a 392 cubic inch engine and 485 HP! When I was shopping for this car, my wife told me that I should get the 707HP version. Wish I had listened to her. Vroommmm....
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
mg_k said:
I never expect it to be cheap, but just not outrageously overpriced especially it's only a f2.8.
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Your other 'tele' option is Sony 100mm STF at $1500, also f/2.8.
 
mg_k said:
Between the 2 I'd pick the STF over this anyday.
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Suppose you already have Batis 85 1.8? STF seems like a specialist lens (portraits) which is great but I do a lot of street photos, candids, and landscapes...
 
BBQue said:
So price has to be significantly above the other non-APO Batis lenses. No surprise!
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Well, ED glass (which makes apo's possible) is cheaper than it once was, depending on the grade of ED glass. But at f/2.8 it points out that Zeiss wanted this to be truly well-corrected, maybe next to perfect. Otherwise, Samyang makes a very good 135mm f/2.0 that costs about 1/4 of that price.
 
Michael Jardine said:
mg_k said:
Between the 2 I'd pick the STF over this anyday.
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Suppose you already have Batis 85 1.8?
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Yes, and the new FE85, also FE90 macro and 90 cron pre-asph with full of character.
Michael Jardine said:
STF seems like a specialist lens (portraits) which is great but I do a lot of street photos, candids, and landscapes...
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Because it's a specialty lens I find the $1.5k pricetag more justified.

A general prime (well 135mm isn't really that general tbh) as jack of all trades master of none however isn't worth $2k imho.
Michael Jardine said:
--
Michael
Blog http://qamera.com
Photos http://galleries.qamera.com
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--
My Flickr
My Getty Images
 
Last edited:
OlyPent said:
Well, ED glass (which makes apo's possible) is cheaper than it once was, depending on the grade of ED glass. But at f/2.8 it points out that Zeiss wanted this to be truly well-corrected, maybe next to perfect. Otherwise, Samyang makes a very good 135mm f/2.0 that costs about 1/4 of that price.
Click to expand...
Native to Sony FF and auto focus?
 
mg_k said:
A general prime (well 135mm isn't really that general tbh) as jack of all trades master of none however isn't worth $2k imho.
Click to expand...
Do you think Zeiss made a mistake in their pricing and marketing? Or that it's just not of value to you personally?
 
landshark said:
. . . For me manual focus is a waste of time on most lenses if accurate and fast AF is available. Manually focused for over 30 years of my photo career see little point in it now, so for me I could care less how the focus by wire feels on the Batis but if manual focus is what one wants, enjoy what you like.
Click to expand...
Just finished a wedding shooting last weekend - AF was in some situations no option since the AF did not work up to my expectations - especially on faces with people wearing glasses and in dimmer situations at night.

I really enjoyed the much more precise way of MFing on the f/1.4 50 and 85 Sony lenses. The videographer (hired additionally for this event) had a Batis line up - mainly because of the lower weight for the gimbal. He tried my Sony lenses and literally freaked out about the precision of the MF :-)

I am a big fan of AF when it makes sense - yet it malfunctions even on the best cameras too many times in my experience. The individual mile age may vary and/or the sense for perfection. AF is not delivering what I want on any camera I've ever tested - MFing is key for me to have wide open the utmost precision. Eye-AF fortunately helps a lot but it is still not so good that I could live without a good enough MF and when I start to MF I really enjoy real MF instead of focus by wire - the fast Sony AF lenses are quite close to a real MF - close enough to not dislike them too much - the Batis lenses are too far off for my taste - let's see how the new 135 will perform - I will rent it anyway when available. Have the 100 STF on pre order for renting too.

I always like to understand what works and what not - to date no Batis worked for me good enough - especially taking the price into account. The Loxias from the same company are more my kind of understanding of perfection. (especially in stations where the AF malfunctions by design)

--
__________________________________
A7R II - one camera to rule them all
ISO 9000 definition of quality: 'Degree to which a set of inherent characteristic fulfills requirements'
I am the classic “Windows by Day, Mac by Night user'
“The horizon of many people is a circle with zero radius which they call their point of view.” Albert Einstein
"In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." Douglas Adams
 
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joger said:
Just finished a wedding shooting last weekend - AF was in some situations no option since the AF did not work up to my expectations - especially on faces with people wearing glasses and in dimmer situations at night.
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Perhaps you needed to better tool to properly AF, meaning a good-old DSLR:) Just kidding:)
 
joger said:
landshark said:
. . . For me manual focus is a waste of time on most lenses if accurate and fast AF is available. Manually focused for over 30 years of my photo career see little point in it now, so for me I could care less how the focus by wire feels on the Batis but if manual focus is what one wants, enjoy what you like.
Click to expand...
Just finished a wedding shooting last weekend - AF was in some situations no option since the AF did not work up to my expectations - especially on faces with people wearing glasses and in dimmer situations at night.

I really enjoyed the much more precise way of MFing on the f/1.4 50 and 85 Sony lenses. The videographer (hired additionally for this event) had a Batis line up - mainly because of the lower weight for the gimbal. He tried my Sony lenses and literally freaked out about the precision of the MF :-)

I am a big fan of AF when it makes sense - yet it malfunctions even on the best cameras too many times in my experience. The individual mile age may vary and/or the sense for perfection. AF is not delivering what I want on any camera I've ever tested - MFing is key for me to have wide open the utmost precision. Eye-AF fortunately helps a lot but it is still not so good that I could live without a good enough MF and when I start to MF I really enjoy real MF instead of focus by wire - the fast Sony AF lenses are quite close to a real MF - close enough to not dislike them too much - the Batis lenses are too far off for my taste - let's see how the new 135 will perform - I will rent it anyway when available. Have the 100 STF on pre order for renting too.

I always like to understand what works and what not - to date no Batis worked for me good enough - especially taking the price into account. The Loxias from the same company are more my kind of understanding of perfection. (especially in stations where the AF malfunctions by design)
Click to expand...
 
Steve W said:
I'm not sure what to say about your comments that you have not been happy with the AF from any camera and that it malfunctions often. I'm very happy with my Sony gear and both my Batis and Loxia lenses but when I think of AF performance in low light I clearly give the nod to my Canon 1DX and 5D Mark IV. If you really want AF you might want to consider a different system. I don't have any experience but its my understanding the the Nikon D500 also has stellar AF performance. Sony is doing much better but my DSLRs have always focused faster. On the Sony though I've really come to love the Eye-AF capability and find it very accurate.
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Steve

I agree high end DSLR at this moment still has way better AF, especially when it comes to tracking moving objects, I recently got a D500 (about 6 months ago), as far as AF and tracking, it is really day and night better than my A7RII, that's besides the frame rate and buffer stuffs, purely AF/tracking, I already have the 1DX and 1Ds3 and still have the dinosaur 1D MK II, but want to get a latest APS-C for its crop factor, these pro DSLRs also handle so much better with big lenses too, so even Sony makes A7R III AF and tracks as good as the 1DX/D500, I still wouldn't use it for sport shooting, period, i really hate its handling and ergonomics, as for eye focus, I found A7R II works pretty good with say theh 85GM, 55 1.8....but i still found the 3D tracking on my D800E works much more reliable in my experience.
 
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