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High MP density digital camera should employ leaf shutter.
- Thread starter James Bligh
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olyflyer
Forum Pro
My general opinion is that it is nonsense. Sorry.
please apologize my faulty post just one Minute before - did not see that I had clicked on "post" before I was writing anytghing. sorry.
so, the question is, how and in which sequence Pixel charges are transmitted to adc and processor and cam Memory. if yu have double no. of Pixels, you either Need double parallel processing capacity or the readout of complete sensor will be slower - which is today the case for all stills cams compared to e-m1 II.
I do not think that full well capacity or lenght of Signal paths (bigger sensor dimensions) pleay a Special time consuming role there, but the architecture of Signal read out and processing.
i am not an expert, but readout Speed for the complete sensor depends on number of pixels. the e-m1 II has 20 megapix on 1/4 of sensor area of FF.
so, the question is, how and in which sequence Pixel charges are transmitted to adc and processor and cam Memory. if yu have double no. of Pixels, you either Need double parallel processing capacity or the readout of complete sensor will be slower - which is today the case for all stills cams compared to e-m1 II.
I do not think that full well capacity or lenght of Signal paths (bigger sensor dimensions) pleay a Special time consuming role there, but the architecture of Signal read out and processing.
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michaeladawson
Forum Pro
I believe that you correctly read.
but please note that the real answer can only be given by an expert - which I am not.
I think, true global shutter is nowadays no Problem for any manufacturer with less than 4 megapixels.
secondly, I do not know, whether any of the FF manufacturers are currently working on a development in respect of global shutter. e-m1 II has a fraction of readout time of d5.
so, better ask Nikon, when they believe that they can be there ...
BR gusti
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James Bligh
Senior Member
I am not a physicist but I was told Big Bang theory can be derived from Einstein's famous equation of energy (E) = the mass (m) multiplied by the speed of light (c) squared. Ironically Einstein didn't believe in Big Bang theory at first even though he himself developed the equation. The border between sense and nonsense may be very thin.
olyflyer
Forum Pro
I am not talking about Einstein's words, but the ones you wrote. I don't know what Einstein believed in or not, nor is it important here, none of us is Einstein.
You asked: "What is your opinion?"
My opinion is: It's nonsense.
Pixel density in FF DSLRs is not as high as you think, other formats, DX, MFT, 1" all have higher pixel density and have had it for a long time, even before the D800. If high pixel density of FF DSLRs would be a problem then the "problem" should have been seen by all those people who are not using and never used an FF camera. They are not more ignorant or stupid than you and I are, even if they are not using FF cameras.
Leaf shutter or low pixel density is not a solution to poor workmanship. Learn how to hold a camera and you will not have an issue.
I have used the D800 ever since it hit the market and can only say that it presents no problems in anything which could be solved with leaf shutter or lower pixel density. Personally I have never taken better images (in every aspect) than I do with the D800 and I have used FF cameras ever since 1970, started with the Zenit E. I rarely use tripod, especially compared with the film cameras I used.
I also use the V1 since it hit the market, which also has a higher pixel density than the D800. Almost all the time I use the mechanical shutter and notice no problems at all. OK, some users have reported that it is easier (for them) to take images with the electronic shutter because they notice camera shake caused by the mechanical shutter, but really, leaf shutter would not be the best solution as a shutter. It has been abandoned for some very good reason, namely it makes the cameras MUCH more expensive, it is fer to complex, must be built in into the lenses, and limits the maximum shutter speed.
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Osvaldo Cristo
Senior Member
I made a few teste with my D810 and I could not find any relevant issue.
I have made 60k+ shots with my D810 and I found no issue.
For my use, in my own D810, It is a non issue.
All the best,
James Bligh
Senior Member
FF DSLR with its bigger mirror box and focal plane shutter, if it is combined with high pixel density sensor certainly it will be vulnerable to camera shake due to Mirror and Shutter induced Shock.
I read 'fer to complex' as 'far too complex'. Complex it may be and in spite of its limitations I think leaf shutter may be and could be a solution to Mirror and Shutter induced Shock in high pixel density FF DSLR. And it is at least in theory.
Hi, you keep using this phrase "Mirror and Shutter induced Shock in high pixel density FF DSLR." as if it's some common problem. I have taken 80,000 images with my D800 and have never seen anything resembling the described "problem". It reminds me of all the warnings that the D8xx series would not be suitable for any thing but studio work on a tripod as the resolution would make it unusable for any handheld work which turned out to be rubbish, of course. Sorry but I think you are chasing down a rabbit hole with this James,
James Bligh
Senior Member
James Bligh
Senior Member
briantilley
Veteran Member
You're "flogging a dead horse" with this one.
This really is a non-issue in actual photography, and I'm sorry but it is "nonsense" to suggest that (as you did in your original post):
olyflyer
Forum Pro
Ok, stop this. You can't back up something which is not true with something else which also make no sense.
Yes, "fer to complex" = "far too complex" typo.
Again, no.leaf shutters would just introduce limitations without advantages. The only advantage it would have is unlimited shutter sync speed with any flash.
You are trying to solve a non issue, probably because you have no experience of the subject.
James Bligh
Senior Member
Then Rishi Sanyal, Richard Butler, Samuel Spencer, Barney Britton, did they make fool of us when they wrote a page about this non-issue? I am bewildered.
https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikon-d810/17
James Bligh
Senior Member
I can't understand why they devoted in experimenting and allotted one page of the review to the so called Mirror and Shutter induced Shock if this is non-issue. It doesn't make sense, does it?
https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/nikon-d810/17
My suggestion may be nonsense but I think your 'non-issue' statement is also nonsense. At most it may be non-issue to you but it doesn't mean it is non-issue to others too since your world is not the only world I may say.
briantilley
Veteran Member
Well if we're counting, the seven people who have posted in this thread indicating that they find this to be a non-issue - having actaually shot with a D8xx camera - outdo the four you linked to!
Glad you agree
Have you used a D8xx series camera?
James Bligh
Senior Member
Yeah every man thinks he is center of the world as the people had thought sun circles around the earth and the earth is center of the universe. What do we call these/those people? You choose the word.
Glad as if a lad won a game? Your resume tells you are retired so I suspect your brain accumulates amyloid.Glad you agree
I have avoided D810 because of its thermal noise issue(white dots), let's see what next generation D8XX will bring. I'll be surprised if the pixel count does not increase in the next generation D8XX, so the issues I mentioned will be more relevant than it is now.
briantilley
Veteran Member
Your loss, because that is also a non-issue in real photography.Yeah every man thinks he is center of the world as the people had thought sun circles around the earth and the earth is center of the universe. What do we call these/those people? You choose the word.
Glad as if a lad won a game? Your resume tells you are retired so I suspect your brain accumulates amyloid.Glad you agree
I have avoided D810 because of its thermal noise issue(white dots)...
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