problem with vertical grip

terrylau · Dec 5, 2016

I start to use a Sony original vertical grip for my A77 recently and notice the switch over

to the second battery only take place when the first battery is depleted to almost zero .

This would seem not too good for long term health of the batteries .

My questions are :

1> Is there a way to make it switch over earlier say at between 10-20 %

2> Do all vertical grips use the batteries consecutively and have same switch over

behaviour ?

3> Do batteries drain any faster if left unused in the vertical grip compared with

removing it to outside ?

Answers much appreciated

terrylau

Marco Cinnirella · Dec 5, 2016

1 and 2 I think thet answer is "no" and "yes". 3 I am not sure

steelhead3 · Dec 5, 2016

When the switchover occurs the battery is not completely drained (20% is left in for safety). If you leave your grip on, it will drain the battery.

Edward Sargent · Dec 5, 2016

terrylau said:
1> Is there a way to make it switch over earlier say at between 10-20 %

Probably not

terrylau said:
2> Do all vertical grips use the batteries consecutively and have same switch over

behaviour ?

Mine (2) behave the same way

terrylau said:
3> Do batteries drain any faster if left unused in the vertical grip compared with

removing it to outside ?

Short of doing a long testing I would say no. I have never experienced a drained battery when I did not expect it.

terrylau · Dec 5, 2016

Edward Sargent said:
Edward Sargent said:

3> Do batteries drain any faster if left unused in the vertical grip compared with

removing it to outside ?

Click to expand...

Short of doing a long testing I would say no. I have never experienced a drained battery when I did not expect it.

--

Thanks your reply . my short experience seems to indicate battery level fall off faster when used in a vertical grip than when used as a single battery in the camera . Certainly need more testing to confirm this

terrylau

ivan2001ve · Dec 5, 2016

terrylau said:
Edward Sargent said:

terrylau said:

3> Do batteries drain any faster if left unused in the vertical grip compared with

removing it to outside ?

Click to expand...

Short of doing a long testing I would say no. I have never experienced a drained battery when I did not expect it.

--

Click to expand...

Thanks your reply . my short experience seems to indicate battery level fall off faster when used in a vertical grip than when used as a single battery in the camera . Certainly need more testing to confirm this

terrylau

What I may be happening is a potential equivalence or something called like that, " I'm not an Electrical Engineer", but here is the batteries that you are using are probably not the same age, so one will hold higher charge than the other one, being connected together the one the has less energy drains some from the one with more, and that makes them go faster on the end. Same happens with your Tv remote for example, if you install to brand new batteries at the same time the last you 6 moths for example, and they are depleted at the same time, while if you install one fully charge and with one exhausted, they made last you only 2-3 moths.

I have noticed that when I install one that I bought this year with the older ones they new one seems to die faster, than when I install the two old ones.

John Tait · Dec 5, 2016

ivan2001ve said:
terrylau said:

Edward Sargent said:

ivan2001ve said:

3> Do batteries drain any faster if left unused in the vertical grip compared with

removing it to outside ?

Click to expand...

Short of doing a long testing I would say no. I have never experienced a drained battery when I did not expect it.

--

Click to expand...

Thanks your reply . my short experience seems to indicate battery level fall off faster when used in a vertical grip than when used as a single battery in the camera . Certainly need more testing to confirm this

terrylau

Click to expand...

What I may be happening is a potential equivalence or something called like that, " I'm not an Electrical Engineer", but here is the batteries that you are using are probably not the same age, so one will hold higher charge than the other one, being connected together the one the has less energy drains some from the one with more, and that makes them go faster on the end. Same happens with your Tv remote for example, if you install to brand new batteries at the same time the last you 6 moths for example, and they are depleted at the same time, while if you install one fully charge and with one exhausted, they made last you only 2-3 moths.

I have noticed that when I install one that I bought this year with the older ones they new one seems to die faster, than when I install the two old ones.

Your idea makes sense, but for this to be a problem the batteries in the grip would have to be connected in series or in parallel. They aren't electrically connected at all, they are used sequentially one at a time. As long as I remember to turn the power off on the grip when I'm not using it I've never found that the batteries drain while in the grip.

John

Marco Cinnirella · Dec 6, 2016

John Tait said:
ivan2001ve said:

terrylau said:

Edward Sargent said:

John Tait said:

3> Do batteries drain any faster if left unused in the vertical grip compared with

removing it to outside ?

Click to expand...

Short of doing a long testing I would say no. I have never experienced a drained battery when I did not expect it.

--

Click to expand...

Thanks your reply . my short experience seems to indicate battery level fall off faster when used in a vertical grip than when used as a single battery in the camera . Certainly need more testing to confirm this

terrylau

Click to expand...

What I may be happening is a potential equivalence or something called like that, " I'm not an Electrical Engineer", but here is the batteries that you are using are probably not the same age, so one will hold higher charge than the other one, being connected together the one the has less energy drains some from the one with more, and that makes them go faster on the end. Same happens with your Tv remote for example, if you install to brand new batteries at the same time the last you 6 moths for example, and they are depleted at the same time, while if you install one fully charge and with one exhausted, they made last you only 2-3 moths.

I have noticed that when I install one that I bought this year with the older ones they new one seems to die faster, than when I install the two old ones.

Click to expand...

Your idea makes sense, but for this to be a problem the batteries in the grip would have to be connected in series or in parallel. They aren't electrically connected at all, they are used sequentially one at a time. As long as I remember to turn the power off on the grip when I'm not using it I've never found that the batteries drain while in the grip.

John

Drain has not been my proble, but rather that sometimes, despite only using the genuine batteries that came included with Sony cameras, when a battery gets low and it should switch to the next battery the camera gives an 'infolithium only' error message as if it is a third party battery. This plagued the original grip for the a700 and seems to have been an issue with the a77 and a99 grips as well - but mysteriously only for some users. As I said, my batteries are only the ones from the cameras so are guaranteed genuine.

Michael Fritzen · Dec 6, 2016

Hi,

since I got my A99 with its dedicated VG in 2012 I've noticed this and despite its high price it doesn't allow some intelligent power management which could be a simple switch for either reducing possible deep discharge stress to the batteries (such as switching to the next at 30-40% of residual charge which seems to be the best range for extending battery life) or for "heavy duty usage" that would allow to use max of the charge.

So for [1] you're only option at this moment is to have an eye on the power level and remove a battery when it's reaching the defined level of residual charge.

[2] AFAIK the sequence of battery usage is first the battery with the lowest power level in the grip, then the second and in the case of the A99 the last one is the one in the body. The great plus in case of the A99 was that the holder in the grip could be removed, batteries exchanged, while the cam remained powered by the battery in the body.

[3] Not that I'm aware of. Again as mentioned in the case of the A99 it may be wise to exchange from time to time the in-body battery with one of the grip just to keep the batteries at similar stages of ageing.

BTW, the batteries in the grip are always depleted first before the switch to the next unit. So there isn't any (by the cam measureable) power level left. Possibly not a "deep discharge" which may shorten significantly the life span but also not residual charge levels which are considered positive for extended life.

tbcass · Dec 6, 2016

Cameras don't allow use of batteries to zero charge. They shut down ahead of that. I've read 20% is common.

--
Tom
Look at the picture, not the pixels
------------
Misuse of the ability to do 100% pixel peeping is the bane of digital photography.

tbcass · Dec 6, 2016

steelhead3 said:
When the switchover occurs the battery is not completely drained (20% is left in for safety). If you leave your grip on, it will drain the battery.

And mine which said the same thing. Camera won't allow discharge below 20%.

terrylau · Dec 6, 2016

tbcass said:
Cameras don't allow use of batteries to zero charge. They shut down ahead of that. I've read 20% is common.

--
Tom
Look at the picture, not the pixels
------------
Misuse of the ability to do 100% pixel peeping is the bane of digital photography.

Thanks yr reply . In actual practice i can operate the camera way below 20 % without it

shutting down until the orange empty battery indicator appeared , However i dont like

to wait until that happen and always change the battery earlier . I assume the battery

indicator is accurate .

terrylau

steelhead3 · Dec 6, 2016

It isn't....when showing 0%, it is actually 20% so the battery isn't damaged.

terrylau · Dec 6, 2016

Michael Fritzen said:
Hi,

since I got my A99 with its dedicated VG in 2012 I've noticed this and despite its high price it doesn't allow some intelligent power management which could be a simple switch for either reducing possible deep discharge stress to the batteries (such as switching to the next at 30-40% of residual charge which seems to be the best range for extending battery life) or for "heavy duty usage" that would allow to use max of the charge.

So for [1] you're only option at this moment is to have an eye on the power level and remove a battery when it's reaching the defined level of residual charge.

[2] AFAIK the sequence of battery usage is first the battery with the lowest power level in the grip, then the second and in the case of the A99 the last one is the one in the body. The great plus in case of the A99 was that the holder in the grip could be removed, batteries exchanged, while the cam remained powered by the battery in the body.

[3] Not that I'm aware of. Again as mentioned in the case of the A99 it may be wise to exchange from time to time the in-body battery with one of the grip just to keep the batteries at similar stages of ageing.

BTW, the batteries in the grip are always depleted first before the switch to the next unit. So there isn't any (by the cam measureable) power level left. Possibly not a "deep discharge" which may shorten significantly the life span but also not residual charge levels which are considered positive for extended life.

--
Cheers,
Michael Fritzen

Thanks yr reply . I wonder why manufacturer do not incorporate a

switch ,either mechanical or electronic ,to allow user who are worried about deep

discharge to switch batteries earlier . Removing the battery cassette holder is the

the only way at the moment .

terrylau

lhkjacky · Dec 6, 2016

terrylau said:
Thanks yr reply . I wonder why manufacturer do not incorporate a
switch ,either mechanical or electronic ,to allow user who are worried about deep
discharge to switch batteries earlier . Removing the battery cassette holder is the
the only way at the moment .

Because it is not necessary.

The battery automatically cut off & switch to another battery before it get any negative impact to the battery.

The battery control IC is so intelligence, it won't allow your battery over discharge.

tbcass · Dec 6, 2016

terrylau said:
I assume the battery indicator is accurate .

terrylau said:
terrylau

Yes and no. It's accurate as to how much usable battery is left but 0% is, in actuality, 20% of full capacity.

terrylau · Dec 6, 2016

tbcass said:
terrylau said:

I assume the battery indicator is accurate .

terrylau

Click to expand...

Yes and no. It's accurate as to how much usable battery is left but 0% is, in actuality, 20% of full capacity.

--
Tom
Look at the picture, not the pixels
------------

Thanks . So you mean when the orange indicator appears there is actually 20% left

What about when it show 20 % does it mean actually40 % and 80 % means 100 % etc

terrylau

tbcass · Dec 7, 2016

terrylau said:
Thanks . So you mean when the orange indicator appears there is actually 20% left

What about when it show 20 % does it mean actually40 % and 80 % means 100 % etc

terrylau

I don't know for sure but if 20% battery capacity is 0% and full 100% the usable range is 80% of full battery capacity. So if the reading is 20% left it would be 20% of 80% or 16%. 20% +16% =36% of full capacity at 20% of usable capacity. This is speculation on my part but it makes sense to me.

--
Tom
Look at the picture, not the pixels
------------
Misuse of the ability to do 100% pixel peeping is the bane of digital photography.

PaulinUK99999 · Dec 8, 2016

has anyone actually had a problem here? I've only used the various original batteries that came with the cameras, always keep the camera grip on my 77 (77II) and simply recharge them when get home whether need it or not. Worked for years, 100,000+ shots and never noticed an issue...

Paul

tbcass · Dec 8, 2016

If you recharge every night you won't notice it.

problem with vertical grip

Forum Enthusiast

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Senior Member

Forum Enthusiast

Well-known member

Forum Enthusiast

Veteran Member

Veteran Member

Forum Pro

Forum Pro

Forum Enthusiast

Veteran Member

Forum Enthusiast

Senior Member

Forum Pro

Forum Enthusiast

Forum Pro

Forum Enthusiast

Forum Pro

Keyboard shortcuts