Reading mode: Light Dark

Why is Sony so reluctant about touchscreen?

Go to last post
SilvanBromide said:
I doubt that the inclusion of a touchscreen relates to whether or not it's considered 'pro'.
Click to expand...
Look at the commentaries here. A huge amount of users react so fiercely, as if the inclusion of a touch screen would be a personal insult to their abilities as a photographer.

I have seen that earlier with other features such as Auto ISO in M, or flippable screens, or most recently: USB charging.

So I am pretty convinced that the camera makers take this into account and do not include features which will make their target audience consider the camera less professional.

So sadly, dinosaur users are to be blamed for camera makers holding back useful features.
 
Allan Olesen said:
SilvanBromide said:
I doubt that the inclusion of a touchscreen relates to whether or not it's considered 'pro'.
Click to expand...
Look at the commentaries here. A huge amount of users react so fiercely, as if the inclusion of a touch screen would be a personal insult to their abilities as a photographer.

I have seen that earlier with other features such as Auto ISO in M, or flippable screens, or most recently: USB charging.

So I am pretty convinced that the camera makers take this into account and do not include features which will make their target audience consider the camera less professional.

So sadly, dinosaur users are to be blamed for camera makers holding back useful features.
Click to expand...
I expect you're right, Allan.

My comment was meant to relate specifically to the inclusion of a touchscreen in the a6500, rather than in Sony products more generally. However I agree that the strong opinions of some pockets of established users (with a heavy investment in the status quo, one might suppose) may have the effect of holding back progress.

It was ever thus... :-|

--
Former Canon, Nikon and Pentax user.
Online Gallery: https://500px.com/raycologon
 
Last edited:
Allan Olesen said:
SilvanBromide said:
I doubt that the inclusion of a touchscreen relates to whether or not it's considered 'pro'.
Click to expand...
Look at the commentaries here. A huge amount of users react so fiercely, as if the inclusion of a touch screen would be a personal insult to their abilities as a photographer. I have seen that earlier with other features such as Auto ISO in M, or flippable screens, or most recently: USB charging. So I am pretty convinced that the camera makers take this into account and do not include features which will make their target audience consider the camera less professional. So sadly, dinosaur users are to be blamed for camera makers holding back useful features.
Click to expand...
Would you include our own Brian Smith ?
 
Last edited:
Vcize said:
The people that are fighting against a touchscreen being added to cameras are probably the ones that thought it was a dumb idea to put a touchscreen on a phone. And the same ones that fight every innovation in camera technology that a few years later they end up using all the time and not knowing how they ever lived without it.

Cameras are some of the last holdouts to not have touchscreens as a standard. 10 years from now touchscreens on cameras will be as ubiquitous as LCDs are on cameras right now anyway so it's time to get used to the idea.
Click to expand...
Just wait till the industry starts to consider making the whole thing mostly electronic, with no actual buttons (haptic type interfaces ala-apple). Then they will really through a fit. They will fail to see how such an innovation can be for the better (if of course there is no noticeable input lag).

Except for actual playback operations though, I don't actually think we need a touch screen for normal camera use (through the VF). I do wish sony provided a joy stick as well as the touch screen. Touch for LCD type shooting, and joystick for EVF. Usually you would be operating the lens with your left hand and ideally use your right thumb to move the AF point around. In that respect a joy stick would be better. Heck, I almost which they would replace the read botton + wheel with a joystick and a wheel around it. I believe that most of us are a little annoyed when you are pressing right, left, up, down to move the AF point around that you might accidentally rotate the wheel thus changing AF size in the process.
 
lawny13 said:
Docno said:
...Contra Mundum said:
Docno said:
I've bounced around various android phones over the past few years... HTC, Samsung, etc. Last year I thought I'd give Sony a try. Well, right now, the phone is in for repairs for the SECOND time. Problem? Touchscreen issues...both times. And these issues are all over the net (you can Google Sony C4 + touchscreen if you don't believe me). I personally don't want another unnecessary (for me) part/feature that can go wrong. I can understand it may have value for some people, but I'm not sold on it nor convinced that it can be done without reducing the reliability of the camera...
Click to expand...
Lots of people (myself included) used Sony NEX5, A5xxx series with touch screens and never experienced any reliability issues. Lots of people are using m43, Canon, Samsung cameras with TS and report no reliability issues. In fact you won't find any reports about that on camera forums, and people here like to harp about even very insignificant problems. So your anecdote is irrelevant to this topic.
Click to expand...
.... then google Xperia C4 touchscreen problems. 100s of so-called anecdotes out there. Yes, the Xperia is a phone. But a touchscreen just means one more piece of complex electronics that can fail .
Click to expand...
Lol, how many 100s of phones out there and you pick up on that one. Just cause a handful of implementations are bad doesn't mean that no touch screen is better. May I ask... do you have a smart phone with a touch screen?

sure if the option is a flawed buggy touch screen from Sony or none at all, we probably would go for none. But if it is like canon or Nikon touch screens, or iPhone or Samsung like smart implementations than bring it on. I can point out to you many failures in different tech sectors, but that doesn't mean you avoid it entirely, from planes, to cars, to Tv etc etc.
Click to expand...
Do I have a handphone with a touchscreen? Maybe read my post again. Yes, I have a Sony Xperia that has had to go in for repairs twice for touchscreens problems. I had an HTC phone in the past that also had a faulty touchscreen. Modern smartphones need a touchscreen for operation. Cameras don't ... at most, it's a 'nice to have'. Touchscreens are another complex component that increases the chance of failure while not being essential to the operation of the camera. Simple concept, really....
 
sean lancaster said:
Docno said:
...Contra Mundum said:
Docno said:
I've bounced around various android phones over the past few years... HTC, Samsung, etc. Last year I thought I'd give Sony a try. Well, right now, the phone is in for repairs for the SECOND time. Problem? Touchscreen issues...both times. And these issues are all over the net (you can Google Sony C4 + touchscreen if you don't believe me). I personally don't want another unnecessary (for me) part/feature that can go wrong. I can understand it may have value for some people, but I'm not sold on it nor convinced that it can be done without reducing the reliability of the camera...
Click to expand...
Lots of people (myself included) used Sony NEX5, A5xxx series with touch screens and never experienced any reliability issues. Lots of people are using m43, Canon, Samsung cameras with TS and report no reliability issues. In fact you won't find any reports about that on camera forums, and people here like to harp about even very insignificant problems. So your anecdote is irrelevant to this topic.
Click to expand...
.... then google Xperia C4 touchscreen problems. 100s of so-called anecdotes out there. Yes, the Xperia is a phone. But a touchscreen just means one more piece of complex electronics that can fail .
Click to expand...
Phones are used constantly, sometimes all day and every day by people and the touch is at the very essence of a smartphone. When a single phone maker has huge issues then it's likely they screwed up in manufacturing or they cut costs too much and used cheap parts. Who knows? But we do know that we have seen people buy more than 1 billion iPhones alone (and that's not even considering Android and others). And people keep buying these things, so the reliability has to be good enough that people keep on buying. I have no clue why a poorly manufactured phone is even being brought into the discussion when we have very durable and reliable touchscreens made by the Sony camera division on the NEX cameras (e.g., my NEX 5N that is still performing really well) that we can discuss. There were never rampant complaints about the touchscreens on the NEX cameras, so these aren't some touchscreens made by Sony Mobile Communications Inc. (Sony is a multinational conglomerate corporation with mobile being a company independent from the corporation that makes cameras).
Click to expand...
My point was not that a bad Sony phone touchscreen means a bad Sony camera touchscreen. Rather, as I clearly stated, my point was: "...a touchscreen just means one more piece of complex electronics that can fail ." A touchscreen is essential for the operation of a modern phone, but it is merely a 'nice to have' for a camera. You are advocating the addition of something that increases the chance of failure while not being necessary for camera functionality or improving IQ, etc.

I've not only had touchscreen problems with Xperia but also with an HTC phone. And this is the only sort of failure I've have had with phones. Touchscreen problems. Two different phones made by different manufacturers. That's why I am against them on a camera. Even the vaunted Apple iPhone 6 has a documented touchscreen problem: iPhone touchscreen issue
 
FOTONOTO said:
Still no touchscreen on A99II? I don't understand.

This makes me worry about the coming A9 and A7III. I was hoping them to have a touchscreen focus box dragging system like the EOS M5, which is the most intuitive way to choose where to focus, especially for mirrorless.

I'm sure that Sony want us to use lock-on AF more, and slowly forget the old DSLR style focus point selection way. But right now lock-on AF is still not as reliable as "flexible point". I'm 100% sure that "focus box dragging" like EOS M5 will be way more efficient when it comes to focus.

Besides, touchscreen is not something that will dramatically increase the cost, and if some users don't like it, they can just turn off the function.

It doesn't make sense.

In my dream, Sony might provide some kind of paid service that can let me send my A7R2 back to factory and change the LCD into a touchscreen. I'll pay another thousand for it (well, since it will never happen, just name it).
Click to expand...
In a recent interview a manager from Sony camera divison said that professional Sony camera users expressed they do NOT wish for touchscreen functionality.

The only thing I can conclude from this is that professional Sony users do NOT frequent these forums here at dpreview because I have never seen anybody being against touchscreens here.
 
ottonis said:
The only thing I can conclude from this is that professional Sony users do NOT frequent these forums here at dpreview because I have never seen anybody being against touchscreens here.
Click to expand...
I am deeply against touchscreen.

My smartphone obviously has it, and I use it to pixel peep and that's about it. However, the screen on my smartphone has to be cleaned all the time. It's a disgusting mess of smears that makes me recoil and rub it against my shirt or a cloth or pants or anything to get that nasty junk off the screen. It's so gross.

I don't want that gunk on my LCD.

I didn't read through all of the replies here, but the Sony A99ii does have touchscreen. I won't be using it, that's for sure. Yuck!
 
Biological_Viewfinder said:
ottonis said:
The only thing I can conclude from this is that professional Sony users do NOT frequent these forums here at dpreview because I have never seen anybody being against touchscreens here.
Click to expand...
I am deeply against touchscreen.

My smartphone obviously has it, and I use it to pixel peep and that's about it. However, the screen on my smartphone has to be cleaned all the time. It's a disgusting mess of smears that makes me recoil and rub it against my shirt or a cloth or pants or anything to get that nasty junk off the screen. It's so gross.

I don't want that gunk on my LCD.

I didn't read through all of the replies here, but the Sony A99ii does have touchscreen. I won't be using it, that's for sure. Yuck!
Click to expand...
 
Don't most cameras with touch screen give you an option to turn it off if you don't like it?
 
Biological_Viewfinder said:
ottonis said:
The only thing I can conclude from this is that professional Sony users do NOT frequent these forums here at dpreview because I have never seen anybody being against touchscreens here.
Click to expand...
I am deeply against touchscreen.

My smartphone obviously has it, and I use it to pixel peep and that's about it. However, the screen on my smartphone has to be cleaned all the time. It's a disgusting mess of smears that makes me recoil and rub it against my shirt or a cloth or pants or anything to get that nasty junk off the screen. It's so gross.
Click to expand...
Did you notice people would avoid shaking your hand? Did you try washing your hands, using sanitizer, other things people use to keep their hands clean?
 
ISO 1 Million said:
Wait, I thought it did NOT have a touchscreen? The a6500 is the first Sony camera in decades to have a touchscreen. I thought that's why it's being talked about so much.
Click to expand...
I'm sorry if I raised any hopes about the A99m2 having touchscreen. I was positive that I had seen it in an interview from photokina, however I'm unable to locate it again.

I don't think it really matters though since what I did see on the interview was the person asking the rep about touchscreen and then the rep sort of almost apologizing for it and showing on camera that there was discernable lag between the touch and the focus.
 
Last edited:
Biological_Viewfinder said:
ottonis said:
The only thing I can conclude from this is that professional Sony users do NOT frequent these forums here at dpreview because I have never seen anybody being against touchscreens here.
Click to expand...
I am deeply against touchscreen.

My smartphone obviously has it, and I use it to pixel peep and that's about it. However, the screen on my smartphone has to be cleaned all the time. It's a disgusting mess of smears that makes me recoil and rub it against my shirt or a cloth or pants or anything to get that nasty junk off the screen. It's so gross.

I don't want that gunk on my LCD.

I didn't read through all of the replies here, but the Sony A99ii does have touchscreen. I won't be using it, that's for sure. Yuck!

--
Quote of the Day:
Somewhere out there is a tree, tirelessly producing oxygen so you can breathe.
I think you owe it an apology.
Click to expand...
you better stop using cellphones, tablets, laptops, car gps monitors, computer monitors, heck even refrigerators and washer/dryers, and who knows what else will start implementing touchscreens in the future.

Technology sucks, we should just take a step backwards instead. Yuck!
 
Last edited:
Contra Mundum said:
Biological_Viewfinder said:
ottonis said:
The only thing I can conclude from this is that professional Sony users do NOT frequent these forums here at dpreview because I have never seen anybody being against touchscreens here.
Click to expand...
I am deeply against touchscreen.

My smartphone obviously has it, and I use it to pixel peep and that's about it. However, the screen on my smartphone has to be cleaned all the time. It's a disgusting mess of smears that makes me recoil and rub it against my shirt or a cloth or pants or anything to get that nasty junk off the screen. It's so gross.
Click to expand...
Did you notice people would avoid shaking your hand? Did you try washing your hands, using sanitizer, other things people use to keep their hands clean?
Click to expand...
Quite silly.

Try this test: With stabilization off, make a short movie only using the LCD and then do the same using the viewfinder. Look at your results. If you were objective, or perhaps even more scientific and performed the test many times, you will notice that your movie will be much more stable when using the viewfinder.

holding_camera_standing_horizontal_correct.gif


By bracing your elbows to your core, and holding the camera to your head, you make yourself much more steady like a tripod. Leaning against a pole or a tree enhances this effect even further.

Hand shake is produced by the body's inability to keep itself still. This is much more pronounced when you aren't "set", and your arms are extended to look at a LCD.

The LCD is for reviewing images, unless you are indeed using a tripod; in which case the LCD can be used for Live-View photography. But let's be honest, most people don't carry a tripod with them anymore.

Using the LCD without a tripod is going to affect the sharpness of your photography. You can test this. By setting yourself properly and using the viewfinder, you can shoot at speeds slower than 1 second with a powerful camera like the A7R2; but using the LCD to do so will cause more blur.

--
Quote of the Day:
Somewhere out there is a tree, tirelessly producing oxygen so you can breathe.
I think you owe it an apology.
 
sye46 said:
sye46 wrote:.
Click to expand...
sye46 said:
you better stop using cellphones, tablets, laptops, car gps monitors, computer monitors, heck even refrigerators and washer/dryers, and who knows what else will start implementing touchscreens in the future.

Technology sucks, we should just take a step backwards instead. Yuck!
Click to expand...
I would prefer not to use a smartphone. I would rather use some sort of transparent VR system, like Google glass but without the negative social effect it had against the wearer.

I don't use tablets. I don't use laptops, my GPS doesn't require my fingers to touch the screen, my computer monitor does not either. My appliances do not have screens.

The LCD is a preview for chimping, and sometimes useful for live-view photography on a tripod. I try to keep it as clean as possible at all times. If I touched it constantly, it would be dirty constantly; which is not only disgusting, but prevents the viewing experience from being optimal for the exact same reason that I keep my glasses clean.
 
Biological_Viewfinder said:
Quite silly.
Click to expand...
Really?
Biological_Viewfinder said:
Try this test: With stabilization off, make a short movie only using the LCD and then do the same using the viewfinder. Look at your results. If you were objective, or perhaps even more scientific and performed the test many times, you will notice that your movie will be much more stable when using the viewfinder.
Click to expand...
"It depends"

If you are shooting a scene where you do not adjust the shot angle, and have VR turned off, perhaps. If your scene involves a more fluid camera motion, keeping the camera pressed against your forehead might be an unnecessary encumberment, and actually add shake to the video. Of course, VR ought to mitigate any of this to a large degree.
Biological_Viewfinder said:
By bracing your elbows to your core, and holding the camera to your head, you make yourself much more steady like a tripod. Leaning against a pole or a tree enhances this effect even further.
Click to expand...
Yes, but at the expense of fluid camera motion. This might not matter, depending on what you are going for in the shot. Not all video is shot with the same intentions as yours.
Biological_Viewfinder said:
Hand shake is produced by the body's inability to keep itself still. This is much more pronounced when you aren't "set", and your arms are extended to look at a LCD.
Click to expand...
Correct, but VR mitigates this to a large degree.
Biological_Viewfinder said:
The LCD is for reviewing images,
Click to expand...
The LCD is for at least three things:
  1. Reviewing images
  2. Menu settings
  3. Taking pictures (e.g. "live view")
Why limit yourself? How silly!
Biological_Viewfinder said:
Using the LCD without a tripod is going to affect the sharpness of your photography. You can test this. By setting yourself properly and using the viewfinder, you can shoot at speeds slower than 1 second with a powerful camera like the A7R2; but using the LCD to do so will cause more blur.
Click to expand...
I often shoot handheld shots, using the LCD, at speeds of a little over one second to 1/4s. Sometimes these are "periscope" style, with the camera held over my head. VR pretty much eliminates any handshake blur.
 
Do you have a wiki for all of these rules of how to correctly use a camera? I use the LCD almost exclusively to take my shots, it would have been helpful to have learned earlier that I was doing it wrong all these years.
 
Biological_Viewfinder said:
ISO 1 Million said:
Wait, I thought it did NOT have a touchscreen? The a6500 is the first Sony camera in decades to have a touchscreen. I thought that's why it's being talked about so much.
Click to expand...
I'm sorry if I raised any hopes about the A99m2 having touchscreen. I was positive that I had seen it in an interview from photokina, however I'm unable to locate it again.

I don't think it really matters though since what I did see on the interview was the person asking the rep about touchscreen and then the rep sort of almost apologizing for it and showing on camera that there was discernable lag between the touch and the focus.
Click to expand...
How could the rep show that there was lag between touch and focus on a camera that doesn't have a touchscreen?
 
ISO 1 Million said:
Biological_Viewfinder said:
ISO 1 Million said:
Wait, I thought it did NOT have a touchscreen? The a6500 is the first Sony camera in decades to have a touchscreen. I thought that's why it's being talked about so much.
Click to expand...
I'm sorry if I raised any hopes about the A99m2 having touchscreen. I was positive that I had seen it in an interview from photokina, however I'm unable to locate it again.

I don't think it really matters though since what I did see on the interview was the person asking the rep about touchscreen and then the rep sort of almost apologizing for it and showing on camera that there was discernable lag between the touch and the focus.
Click to expand...
How could the rep show that there was lag between touch and focus on a camera that doesn't have a touchscreen?
Click to expand...
My best guess is that I was mistaken and that I was watching a 6500 or Rx100v video. I've been watching a ton of videos since I had a bad gig with indoor lighting and started researching the A7Rii to overcome that problem. Then I heard about the A99ii.

While I like the A99ii's specs and think it will be an incredible camera, I have reservations about auto-focus video in P-mode only. And I also have trouble understanding how a translucent mirror will allow me to clean the mirror (both sides), or how I'm supposed to get to the sensor to clean that. I'm probably overthinking it, but I'm interested in silent shutter (even if it does reduce dynamic range) and I like the idea of GMaster lenses now instead of whenever they get around to it for the A-mount. Therefore, I'm waiting until CES & CP+ are over in the hopes that the A9 or A7Riii will be announced.

But yeah, I've been doing my best to educate myself with knowledge about Sony's incredibly fast innovation and flagship camera systems.

--
Quote of the Day:
Somewhere out there is a tree, tirelessly producing oxygen so you can breathe.
I think you owe it an apology.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.

Keyboard shortcuts

f
Forum
m
My threads
Mobile site
About
Editorial content
Cameras & Lenses
Community
All content, design, and layout are Copyright © 1998–2025 Digital Photography Review All Rights Reserved.
Reproduction in whole or part in any form or medium without specific written permission is prohibited.
When you use DPReview links to buy products, the site may earn a commission.
©GPS Media - Guides, Products, Services.
Back
Top