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Several Questions about Flashes (Nissin vs Godox)

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MatthewWongPhotography

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Part 1: Nissin di700a + Nissin i40a + Air-1 Commander

It costs $300 to buy a di700a + Air 1 commander. The new Nissin i60a by itself costs a whopping $340 ($640 total). I don't own a flash yet, but I do want one and I want to do off-camera flash. Having 2 flashes would be nice because then I can try backlighting techniques. My question is, is this a good setup? I figure I could use the i60a (smaller and portable) on-camera and use the di700a when I want that second flash. Will everything be compatible?

The reason I ask is because if I were to purchase an Air-1 Commander separately ($80) + 2 i60a's ($340 each) that would cost me $760... vs $640.

Thanks!

OR, should I just buy a di700a with air commander and see if I like it? (i60a doesn't come out for another month anyway) It's so big though..

Edit:

Part 2: Nissin i40 + Godox TT685s

Simple (maybe not) question: Can the Godox TT685s be controlled as a slave by a master i40 through an optical sensor? Will the Godox still have HSS off-camera?
 
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Godox has a set that's pretty inexpensive for two flashes and a wireless trigger:

Loading…

www.amazon.com

I've never used Godox, but it's a flash setup that I've got my eye on seeing as it supports HSS and wireless TTL. I rarely use a flash at all so investing in an expensive setup isn't on my wishlist, but this one is interesting enough due to its low entry cost and features that it's on my radar.
 
Hi Matthew,

I'm also looking into getting a flash system and have been following your threads on flash. Here is what I'm thinking, if you are shooting outdoor or use it to bounce indoor, you need a powerful and good quality flash. I would not get something unreliable or not that powerful just to save money, especially when you are making money on photography.

Additionally, you can do a lot already using just one flash and a remote (and a reflector). Heck, you can do a lot already using just one flash and bounce. Maybe you can consider getting just the Nissin i60a and an Air Commander for now, and if you find that you really need a 2nd flash, you can get that later. Most of the professional photographers I see working outdoor only bring one flash with them (including the ones who did my engagement shoot, we did it outdoor, at night).

I'm considering getting the i60a and Air Commander for myself also, after reading your threads :-)
 
dankwok said:
Hi Matthew,

I'm also looking into getting a flash system and have been following your threads on flash. Here is what I'm thinking, if you are shooting outdoor or use it to bounce indoor, you need a powerful and good quality flash. I would not get something unreliable or not that powerful just to save money, especially when you are making money on photography.

Additionally, you can do a lot already using just one flash and a remote (and a reflector). Heck, you can do a lot already using just one flash and bounce. Maybe you can consider getting just the Nissin i60a and an Air Commander for now, and if you find that you really need a 2nd flash, you can get that later. Most of the professional photographers I see working outdoor only bring one flash with them (including the ones who did my engagement shoot, we did it outdoor, at night).

I'm considering getting the i60a and Air Commander for myself also, after reading your threads :-)
Click to expand...
 
dankwok said:
... I would not get something unreliable or not that powerful just to save money ...
Click to expand...
For the products mentioned, long term reliability is still to be determined - especially for the one that is not yet on the market!

Regarding power, none of these are really very powerful. The stated guide numbers of 60-70 apply only when the flash zoom is set to 200mm, which is a tightly focused beam. How often will that be a useful zoom setting? The i40 claims a GN of 40 at a more practical 105mm zoom - meaning those others are misrepresenting their true relative power. (Of course all of this assumes the specs are accurate in the first place.)
 
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MatthewWongPhotography said:
dankwok said:
Hi Matthew,

I'm also looking into getting a flash system and have been following your threads on flash. Here is what I'm thinking, if you are shooting outdoor or use it to bounce indoor, you need a powerful and good quality flash. I would not get something unreliable or not that powerful just to save money, especially when you are making money on photography.

Additionally, you can do a lot already using just one flash and a remote (and a reflector). Heck, you can do a lot already using just one flash and bounce. Maybe you can consider getting just the Nissin i60a and an Air Commander for now, and if you find that you really need a 2nd flash, you can get that later. Most of the professional photographers I see working outdoor only bring one flash with them (including the ones who did my engagement shoot, we did it outdoor, at night).

I'm considering getting the i60a and Air Commander for myself also, after reading your threads :-)

--
-Daniel
Click to expand...
Thanks for your reply. I like how we're on the same page, and I'm a little bashful you're following my posts about the flashes, haha.

The Godox system is certainly tempting. Everybody seems to be saying great things about it. I even talked to Brian Smith at PhotoCon LA this weekend and asked him about flash systems (because I occasionally read his blog when he posts new products for Sony). Surprisingly he recommended Godox over Nissin. But I'm almost positive he was basing that on forum users/reviews alone, not personal experience. I highly doubt a photographer like Brian Smith uses Godox. I would expect him to use Phottix at the very least.

Still like Daniel said, I don't know how I would feel about Godox. It's still new and it's still Chinese, and it's still ~$200. Where is the support when something goes wrong? Is Nissin really that unreliable? I'm sure the number of negative reviews are skewed.

One thing I will want to know is, does the new i60a have the ability to bounce HSS (on-camera)? Because apparently the di700a can't...
Click to expand...
Thanks for the information Matthew! If the Nissin i60a cannot do HSS when tilted, what are the advantages of using these Nissin/Godox systems over Sony's OEM, other than price? Are they more powerful than Sony's? I am a little conservative when it comes to China made product as well. Some say for portrait photography, a good quality flash sometimes is even more important than the lens and camera...

--
-Daniel
 
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sybersitizen said:
dankwok said:
... I would not get something unreliable or not that powerful just to save money ...
Click to expand...
For the products mentioned, long term reliability is still to be determined - especially for the one that is not yet on the market!

Regarding power, none of these are really very powerful. The stated guide numbers of 60-70 apply only when the flash zoom is set to 200mm, which is a tightly focused beam. How often will that be a useful zoom setting? The i40 claims a GN of 40 at a more practical 105mm zoom - meaning those others are misrepresenting their true relative power. (Of course all of this assumes the specs are accurate in the first place.)
Click to expand...
Thanks for the information! Which flash systems would you say is powerful enough for outdoor and bounce? Are Sony OEM ones more powerful than the Nissins and the Godox?

The statement that you quoted, what I was trying to tell the OP is that I would rather get one good quality (reliable and powerful) flash than two less quality ones.
 
dankwok said:
sybersitizen said:
dankwok said:
... I would not get something unreliable or not that powerful just to save money ...
Click to expand...
For the products mentioned, long term reliability is still to be determined - especially for the one that is not yet on the market!

Regarding power, none of these are really very powerful. The stated guide numbers of 60-70 apply only when the flash zoom is set to 200mm, which is a tightly focused beam. How often will that be a useful zoom setting? The i40 claims a GN of 40 at a more practical 105mm zoom - meaning those others are misrepresenting their true relative power. (Of course all of this assumes the specs are accurate in the first place.)
Click to expand...
Thanks for the information! Which flash systems would you say is powerful enough for outdoor and bounce?
Click to expand...
Any of those will handle most people's needs. It's just important to understand that advertised guide numbers are almost always stated in relation to the maximum zoom setting, so you have to know what that maximum is. That way you won't be caught by surprise when you do your shooting at moderate or wide zoom settings, where the guide number is lower.
dankwok said:
Are Sony OEM ones more powerful than the Nissins and the Godox?
Click to expand...
Some are, yes. For example, the HVL-F60M's maximum zoom setting is 105mm, not 200mm; so the F60M is in fact more powerful than the Nissin i60 or Godox TT685s even though their published guide numbers are the same.
dankwok said:
The statement that you quoted, what I was trying to tell the OP is that I would rather get one good quality (reliable and powerful) flash than two less quality ones.
Click to expand...
It can be a hard call if the budget is limited. For some jobs it's better to have two light sources rather than one, even if they are modest in power.
 
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Hey Mathew, I've been following your post since I was looking to purchase a flash myself, and interested in the same units. The Godox TT685 is a well made unit and cheaper, but it's heavy for me. I went with the Nissan i40, which I love and what I wanted to begin with, but was trying to save a couple of dollars. I'd wait for the 60(actually only a couple of weeks away) unless you really need something now.
 
I have Nissin i40 and Godox TT685s, waiting for the XT1-s commander to ship.

Regarding your 2nd question, the i40 cannot be used as a optical commander, only as slave.

Moreover, I found that Godox only supports the newer Sony optical protocol, while Nissin supports both the new and the old. As a result, the Godox can't be optically triggered by an inexpensive small flash like the Sony HVL-F20M (while Nissin can). It requires at least the HVL-F32M, or another Godox, but in that case you would go radio, not optical.

With the righ commander, both flashes fully support TTL and HSS off camera.

Regards,

Marco
 
sybersitizen said:
dankwok said:
sybersitizen said:
dankwok said:
... I would not get something unreliable or not that powerful just to save money ...
Click to expand...
For the products mentioned, long term reliability is still to be determined - especially for the one that is not yet on the market!

Regarding power, none of these are really very powerful. The stated guide numbers of 60-70 apply only when the flash zoom is set to 200mm, which is a tightly focused beam. How often will that be a useful zoom setting? The i40 claims a GN of 40 at a more practical 105mm zoom - meaning those others are misrepresenting their true relative power. (Of course all of this assumes the specs are accurate in the first place.)
Click to expand...
Thanks for the information! Which flash systems would you say is powerful enough for outdoor and bounce?
Click to expand...
Any of those will handle most people's needs. It's just important to understand that advertised guide numbers are almost always stated in relation to the maximum zoom setting, so you have to know what that maximum is. That way you won't be caught by surprise when you do your shooting at moderate or wide zoom settings, where the guide number is lower.
sybersitizen said:
Are Sony OEM ones more powerful than the Nissins and the Godox?
Click to expand...
Some are, yes. For example, the HVL-F60M's maximum zoom setting is 105mm, not 200mm; so the F60M is in fact more powerful than the Nissin i60 or Godox TT685s even though their published guide numbers are the same.
sybersitizen said:
The statement that you quoted, what I was trying to tell the OP is that I would rather get one good quality (reliable and powerful) flash than two less quality ones.
Click to expand...
It can be a hard call if the budget is limited. For some jobs it's better to have two light sources rather than one, even if they are modest in power.
Click to expand...
Thank you for the clarification. They do make it tricky when they put out guide numbers and then a zoom range such that you cannot really compare the numbers directly (when the zoom ranges are different).
 
Another day another dollar...but I still can't decide!!!!!

The Godox is oh so tempting at only $165 for the flash AND a receiver. Getting the Nissin i60a and an Air 1 Commander will cost more than twice that.

I just can't get around the massive size of the Godox compared to how compact the Nissin is, however. I'm thinking that if I went with the Godox I'd almost never use it for general/family use, because it would be inconvenient to carry around.

Thoughts?
 
MatthewWongPhotography said:
Another day another dollar...but I still can't decide!!!!!

The Godox is oh so tempting at only $165 for the flash AND a receiver. Getting the Nissin i60a and an Air 1 Commander will cost more than twice that.

I just can't get around the massive size of the Godox compared to how compact the Nissin is, however. I'm thinking that if I went with the Godox I'd almost never use it for general/family use, because it would be inconvenient to carry around.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
I'd personally go with Godox rather than spend $330 for the slightly smaller Nissin. I'd then buy a different flash that is quite a bit smaller for more casual use ... something like this Neewer NW320 ... and still have $80 left over to later apply to a second Godox, which I would inevitably want.
 
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sybersitizen said:
MatthewWongPhotography said:
Another day another dollar...but I still can't decide!!!!!

The Godox is oh so tempting at only $165 for the flash AND a receiver. Getting the Nissin i60a and an Air 1 Commander will cost more than twice that.

I just can't get around the massive size of the Godox compared to how compact the Nissin is, however. I'm thinking that if I went with the Godox I'd almost never use it for general/family use, because it would be inconvenient to carry around.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
I'd personally go with Godox rather than spend $330 for the slightly smaller Nissin. I'd then buy a different flash that is quite a bit smaller for more casual use ... something like this Neewer NW320 ... and still have $80 left over to later apply to a second Godox, which I would inevitably want.
Click to expand...
Can the Nissin do HSS when tilted in hotshoe (bounce)? If not, that's another reason to go with the Godox. Also, any opinion on the Cheetah V860 systems?

Cheetah flash

--
-Daniel
 
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dankwok said:
dankwok wrote:.
Click to expand...
dankwok said:
Can the Nissin do HSS when tilted in hotshoe (bounce)?
Click to expand...
I dunno. I haven't found a user manual.
dankwok said:
If not, that's another reason to go with the Godox.
Click to expand...
Is it really? HSS reduces flash power significantly, and bouncing reduces it even more.
dankwok said:
Also, any opinion on the Cheetah V860 systems?

Cheetah flash
Click to expand...
Everything I see on that Cheetah page is clearly rebranded Godox gear. (There is also Godox gear sold under the Neewer name.)
 
sybersitizen said:
sybersitizen said:
dankwok wrote:.

Can the Nissin do HSS when tilted in hotshoe (bounce)?
Click to expand...
I dunno. I haven't found a user manual.
sybersitizen said:
If not, that's another reason to go with the Godox.
Click to expand...
Is it really? HSS reduces flash power significantly, and bouncing reduces it even more.
Click to expand...
I see having that option is at least a benefit over not having the option. For example, if I'm using the bounce flash as a fill instead of main, I don't need it to be that high power, but being able to do HSS might allow me to use a wider aperture.
sybersitizen said:
sybersitizen said:
Also, any opinion on the Cheetah V860 systems?

Cheetah flash
Click to expand...
Everything I see on that Cheetah page is clearly rebranded Godox gear. (There is also Godox gear sold under the Neewer name.)
Click to expand...
Yea, I figured that out after researching a little more...
 
Just now getting into using flash and don't know much about all the options out there. For right now, I'm trying to keep the budget low. Just bought the a6300 and a couple lenses(making a move from Canon), so, trying to keep the budget low for now. With that said, what are the thoughts on Yongnuo?
 
HugaPorcupine said:
Just now getting into using flash and don't know much about all the options out there. For right now, I'm trying to keep the budget low. Just bought the a6300 and a couple lenses(making a move from Canon), so, trying to keep the budget low for now. With that said, what are the thoughts on Yongnuo?
Click to expand...
I've been using the Yongnuo flashes and triggers for a while now with my A6000. Totally manual and no HSS, but economical and work well.
 
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