Spots on sensor A7II and A7RII

Neurad1 · Dec 24, 2015

I have an absolute TON of spots on my sensor...brand new A7RII and slightly older A7II. Is anyone else experiencing this? Another Nikon D600 problem? No mirrors in these cameras.....

Note multiple rounded spots in the top right corner and two very dark spots, one to the right of subject's head and another at bottom right.

This is REALLY bumming me out. I have only changed the lens on my A7RII a few times since purchasing it and have been very careful to minimize opportunities for dust entry.

Admittedly, this was shot at a stupidly small aperture (f22). This makes these far more conspicuous, but that's what I was trying to demonstrate. I have spots on my A7II sensor, too, although not nearly as bad as on my brand new A7RII.

Please advise.....

--

Neurad1

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l_d_allan · Dec 29, 2015

DFPanno said:
Incidently - my assertion that it was the liquid was provided by the owner of Kolari.

Just to clarify a possibly ambiguous statement:

"The owner of Kolari stated that the liquid I used (and bought elsewhere) was probably involved in the sensor damage."

Not ...

"The liquid that I bought from Kolari was involved in the sensor damage."

Or not?

Neurad1 · Dec 29, 2015

l_d_allan said:
DFPanno said:

Incidently - my assertion that it was the liquid was provided by the owner of Kolari.

Click to expand...

Just to clarify a possibly ambiguous statement:

"The owner of Kolari stated that the liquid I used (and bought elsewhere) was probably involved in the sensor damage."

Not ...

"The liquid that I bought from Kolari was involved in the sensor damage."

Or not?

My brain hurts.

PVCdroid · Dec 29, 2015

Neurad1 said:
l_d_allan said:

DFPanno said:

Incidently - my assertion that it was the liquid was provided by the owner of Kolari.

Click to expand...

Just to clarify a possibly ambiguous statement:

"The owner of Kolari stated that the liquid I used (and bought elsewhere) was probably involved in the sensor damage."

Not ...

"The liquid that I bought from Kolari was involved in the sensor damage."

Or not?

Click to expand...

My brain hurts.

l_d_allan · Dec 29, 2015

PVCdroid said:
There is too much fretting on this subject.

Except for the one user,

Not meaning to be argumentative (moi?) and I certainly hope you are 100% correct.

However ... my speculation is that "the one user" might have written a post much like yours ... a day before they trashed their sensor ... admittedly by operator error.

So to "meet the two of you in the middle", perhaps?

If you haven't ever wet-cleaned a non-IBIS and/or non-Exmor sensor, I'd recommend against such a sensor being the first sensor you wet-clean. (triple negative? sorry)

OK?

Addendum: If you can get your sensor professionally cleaned locally for $30 or less (as mentioned in another recent post, not on this thread), go that route.

Loading…

www.dpreview.com

PVCdroid · Dec 29, 2015

l_d_allan said:
PVCdroid said:

There is too much fretting on this subject.

Except for the one user,

Click to expand...

Not meaning to be argumentative (moi?) and I certainly hope you are 100% correct.

However ... my speculation is that "the one user" might have written a post much like yours ... a day before they trashed their sensor ... admittedly by operator error.

So to "meet the two of you in the middle", perhaps?

If you haven't ever wet-cleaned a non-IBIS and/or non-Exmor sensor, I'd recommend against such a sensor being the first sensor you wet-clean. (triple negative? sorry)

OK?

Addendum: If you can get your sensor professionally cleaned locally for $30 or less (as mentioned in another recent post, not on this thread), go that route.

Loading…

www.dpreview.com

I did once use a local service and they hit the side of the camera with a tool accidentally and left a nice little nick in the camera for me to remember my mistake. Plus the time it sat in their shop waiting to be cleaned. Never again. If you saw how fast they work you would not want them touching your camera. I just lived with their mistake and didn't make an issue of it. They can not do a better job than you can at home. It's the same process. Stop with the paranoia and trying to scare everyone.

l_d_allan · Dec 29, 2015

PVCdroid said:
PVCdroid said:

PVCdroid said:

There is too much fretting on this subject.

Except for the one user,

Click to expand...

Not meaning to be argumentative (moi?) and I certainly hope you are 100% correct.

However ... my speculation is that "the one user" might have written a post much like yours ... a day before they trashed their sensor ... admittedly by operator error.

So to "meet the two of you in the middle", perhaps?

If you haven't ever wet-cleaned a non-IBIS and/or non-Exmor sensor, I'd recommend against such a sensor being the first sensor you wet-clean. (triple negative? sorry)

OK?

Addendum: If you can get your sensor professionally cleaned locally for $30 or less (as mentioned in another recent post, not on this thread), go that route.
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/56985127

Click to expand...

I did once use a local service and they hit the side of the camera with a tool accidentally and left a nice little nick in the camera for me to remember my mistake. Plus the time it sat in their shop waiting to be cleaned. Never again. If you saw how fast they work you would not want them touching your camera. I just lived with their mistake and didn't make an issue of it. They can not do a better job than you can at home. It's the same process.

Can we agree to disagree? (and sorry for my snarky reply earlier)

PVCdroid said:
Stop with the paranoia and trying to scare everyone.

At the risk of being repetitive: Can we agree to disagree?

IIRC, I've learned a lot from your posts over the years, especially when you (and others) have "corrected the error of my ways". Am I the only one on DPR forums who has learned a LOT in that manner? ;-)

My speculation is that we have been in agreement on other threads perhaps 90% or more of the time.

Swordfish · Dec 30, 2015

l_d_allan said:
l_d_allan said:

My speculation is that we have been in agreement on other threads perhaps 90% or more of the time.

Click to expand...

Or not? >:-> (I think this is what's annoying some people. Or not?) Sorry couldn't help it. ☺

Neurad1 · Dec 30, 2015

l_d_allan said:
PVCdroid said:

There is too much fretting on this subject.

Except for the one user,

Click to expand...

Not meaning to be argumentative (moi?) and I certainly hope you are 100% correct.

However ... my speculation is that "the one user" might have written a post much like yours ... a day before they trashed their sensor ... admittedly by operator error.

So to "meet the two of you in the middle", perhaps?

If you haven't ever wet-cleaned a non-IBIS and/or non-Exmor sensor, I'd recommend against such a sensor being the first sensor you wet-clean. (triple negative? sorry)

OK?

Addendum: If you can get your sensor professionally cleaned locally for $30 or less (as mentioned in another recent post, not on this thread), go that route.
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/56985127

Where I live there aren't even any decent camera stores, let alone legitimate repair shops....If there were I would go that route, for sure. $30 would be trivial to avoid the anxiety, risk, and time spent. I'm in the largest city in my state, no less. The internet has contributed to closure of lots of businesses that can no longer compete with Amazon, B&H, etc, so with the retail stores goes the ancillary services....

l_d_allan · Dec 30, 2015

Swordfish said:
l_d_allan said:

Swordfish said:

My speculation is that we have been in agreement on other threads perhaps 90% or more of the time.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Or not? >:-> (I think this is what's annoying some people. Or not?) Sorry couldn't help it. ☺

Well .... "Or not?" is my way of conveying that I have less than 100% confidence in my attempted reply/answer. My intent is to invite "correction of the error of my ways."

Perhaps otherwise? ;-)

DFPanno · Dec 30, 2015

PVCdroid said:
PVCdroid said:

l_d_allan said:

DFPanno said:

Incidently - my assertion that it was the liquid was provided by the owner of Kolari.

Click to expand...

Just to clarify a possibly ambiguous statement:

"The owner of Kolari stated that the liquid I used (and bought elsewhere) was probably involved in the sensor damage."

Not ...

"The liquid that I bought from Kolari was involved in the sensor damage."

Or not?

Click to expand...

My brain hurts.

Click to expand...

DrummerCT · Dec 30, 2015

Having read through many posts over the years about sensor cleaning, I conclude that we don't truly have sufficient knowledge about which products are truly appropriate for wet cleaning in particular. What we have are manufacturer claims and user assertions and opinions, albeit well intended and interesting, but no reviews or scientific analysis of the impact of different sensor cleaning solutions. This state of affairs is all the more pertinent with super high resolution sensors.

As I've suggested in a related current thread in this forum, the user community would benefit, I believe, from an official DPReview in-depth comparison article about sensor cleaning products and approaches, including interviews of manufacturers and others. Do you not at times check out review articles for cameras and lenses to help guide a decision?

Opinions, even strong ones, while valuable are not facts. Yes I realize sensors look clear of dust and other debris, but what evidence do we have that said cleaning is or is not gradually wiping away or causing an issue with topmost sensor layer, coatings, especially from multiple cleanings over several years?

Neurad1 · Dec 31, 2015

DrummerCT said:
Having read through many posts over the years about sensor cleaning, I conclude that we don't truly have sufficient knowledge about which products are truly appropriate for wet cleaning in particular. What we have are manufacturer claims and user assertions and opinions, albeit well intended and interesting, but no reviews or scientific analysis of the impact of different sensor cleaning solutions. This state of affairs is all the more pertinent with super high resolution sensors.

As I've suggested in a related current thread in this forum, the user community would benefit, I believe, from an official DPReview in-depth comparison article about sensor cleaning products and approaches, including interviews of manufacturers and others. Do you not at times check out review articles for cameras and lenses to help guide a decision?

Opinions, even strong ones, while valuable are not facts. Yes I realize sensors look clear of dust and other debris, but what evidence do we have that said cleaning is or is not gradually wiping away or causing an issue with topmost sensor layer, coatings, especially from multiple cleanings over several years?

Excellent response/idea.

Neurad1 · Jan 1, 2016

Some of you might be interested in this response I got from a question about Eclipse on the B&H website:

David answered: Photographic Solutions Expert

"Joel, As a result of your query and concerns, I have spent much of the day doing more research. Apparently, prolonged exposure of the Sony A7 to Eclipse can affect the coating, due to the high concentration of Methanol. But it does require almost flooding the sensor. Therefore we have changed our recommendation to the use of our new non-flammable AEROCLIPSE, which has significantly less methanol. Please let me know if I can help with any additional details. DMS"

l_d_allan · Jan 1, 2016

Neurad1 said:
Some of you might be interested in this response I got from a question about Eclipse on the B&H website:

David answered: Photographic Solutions Expert

"Joel, As a result of your query and concerns, I have spent much of the day doing more research. Apparently, prolonged exposure of the Sony A7 to Eclipse can affect the coating, due to the high concentration of Methanol. But it does require almost flooding the sensor. Therefore we have changed our recommendation to the use of our new non-flammable AEROCLIPSE, which has significantly less methanol. Please let me know if I can help with any additional details. DMS"

WOW ... super follow-up on your part. Thanks!

I look forward to additional follow-up from you ... hopefully in a year or so, after you (and others?) have had success and no sensor harm with 3+ sensor cleanings. ;-)

The B&H reply seems completely consistent with what has been reported in this thread.

Who really knew that the Copperhill w/Eclipse method that is fine with Canon and non-Exmor Nikons would be ill-advised with the latest Sony sensors?

However, the next question is: How effective is proper use of AEROCLIPSE compared to proper use of the more "powerful" Eclipse?

I suppose the AEROCLIPSE instructions will address revisions to the former "best practice" with too-strong-for-Exmor Eclipse, so as to achieve equal effectiveness with sensor crud.

tl;dr ? sorry ...

My speculation is that Kolari might be willing to comment on AEROCLIPSE vs Eclipse (from same company?). My impression is that Kolari's main business is not dealing with Sony sensors that have been unintentionally abused with too-strong methanol.

Extracts from a very long poem by Pope in 1711: "An Essay on Criticism"

A little learning is a dangerous thing. [Part II, often misquoted as "knowledge"]
Fools rush in where angels fear to tread. [from Part III]
To err is human, to forgive divine. [didn't check which part]

l_d_allan · Jan 2, 2016

Brian_Smith said:
5 Simple Steps to Camera Sensor Cleaning

These may be in another post on this thread, but here are two LensRentals links (but not all that current, and Sony sensor cleaning still immature as far as "best practices")

http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2010/04/how-to-clean-a-camera-sensor

http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2011/05/the-lensrentals-lens-cleaning-methods

And see this recent DPR post for Roger C at LR with caveats:

Loading…

www.dpreview.com

billzilla2000 · Jan 2, 2016

I've read a few claims that solution-based cleaning damaged a sensor, but have yet to see the actual images of this damage, how that looks, what to look for and exact frequency, brand and method of cleaning used in that particular case (ie. did it take a dozen cleanings for this to happen, over a year?)...

It would be helpful to have reference of that sort for those of us who have or still do clean with swabs and solution.

DrummerCT · Jan 2, 2016

billzilla2000 said:
I've read a few claims that solution-based cleaning damaged a sensor, but have yet to see the actual images of this damage, how that looks, what to look for and exact frequency, brand and method of cleaning used in that particular case (ie. did it take a dozen cleanings for this to happen, over a year?)...

It would be helpful to have reference of that sort for those of us who have or still do clean with swabs and solution.

Yes, that would be useful to know about - to see photos of the damage along with a description of products and process used.

Alphabert · Mar 7, 2016

if you know how to overcome the issues of IBIS and wet cleaning you will be surprised how easy and efficient it is, here my best practice:

MoreGooderPhotos · Mar 8, 2016

I'd like to chime in with my experience with cleaning my A7II sensor.

There were three spots on the sensor that could not be removed using the automatic sensor clean procedure in the camera menus. There were two types of debris on the sensor: Household dust and pollen. The dust was gray and very tiny, and clung on for dear life with a static charge. A rocket blower did nothing to budge them. The pollen was green/yellow and sticky.

I bought two products from B&H: A Lenspen SensorKlear II and a Kinetronics Spec Grabber Pro. I bought them both because they were each very different. The former being a compressed powdered compound of some sort, and the latter being a tacky gel.

The Lenspen SensorKlear II simply created additional very fine particles of dust that would not blow off with a rocket blower. It made the situation far, far worse. The tiny particles were stuck on via static charge very well. (This was in February, and the humidity in the house was low).

The Kinetronics Spec Grabber actually picked up the debris I was trying to remove, as well as the fine dust from the LensPen SensorKlear II. However, it left tiny streaks of residue on the sensor.

After getting all of the dust off the sensor I very gently used a brand new and clean microfiber lens cleaning cloth to swipe away the residue. My sensor is perfectly clean and performs as new. Using F22, low ISO, slow shutter against a white wall I see no spots (this method was used before cleaning to see the spots on the sensor to confirm my suspicion of sensor dust in the first place).

As an aside, for the first time in my life I found my extremely myopic vision to be of actual use. My vision without my contact lenses is so poor I can see the tiniest spec of dust without using a loop. I just pop out my right contact lens, grab a bright LED flashlight and get to work.

I"ll be ordering the Sensor Gel Stick for Sony sensors that was linked earlier in this thread.

upgrader · Jul 4, 2016

Did somebody here had any problems when using the classic Speckgrabber with the A7RII?

Spots on sensor A7II and A7RII

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