Camera Stores - unethical sales techniques.

Marco Nero

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Following on from the "Man, I Hate How These Computer Stores Act As If You Know Nothing And They Know All!!" posting the other day, it occured to me that many consumers might be unaware of some of the drivel that goes on behind the scenes in the camera stores today.

I worked a few years in camera retail, both before and after I entered the film industry full-time. I've dealt with all manner of regular & genuine customers, celebrity customers, rich kids, low income earners, irate idiots, shoplifters (both violent and drug crazed and the obscenely stupid), professionals, wannabee professionals, mental patients on day release with repetitive behaviours that bring them into my store again and again... and of course, the infamousTWA's (aka: time wasting @sses). Some of the people employed at the store were physics students, photography students, career sales professionals and people related to the boss/owner.

Contributing to consumer's woes are a number of negative things that might be encountered in any given Camera Store:
Lazy, ineffectual staff. Uninformed staff that are unfamilliar with a product, yet pretend otherwise.

Tyrant managers who dictate sales statistics to force more sales from staff at any cost. The use of commission based on sales.
  • Utilisation of sales techniqes and selling systems such as the infamous "Friedman Group© Sales Technique" and similar.
Pious and aggressive sales staff who like to bully the consumer into a sale. Really REALLY stupid staff who don't know any better.

Cash bonuses paid to staff as incentives to sell certain older or defunct products and clear the store of obselete models.

Bait-and-switch: where a product is advertised in a catalogue to lure in the customers for a great deal, only to find that stock are sold or haven't arrived and an alternate, more expensive product is then offered. It's illegal but hard to prove... my store never did this but others have.


The above are merely an example, yet simply working on a commission/bonus incentive can mean that a staff member does not provide adequate information to inform the customer of the best choice. More often than not, the wrong choice of camera is offered.

The Friedman Selling System © is the most common sales system in use in the United States and Canada. It takes 12 weeks to three months to complete by each potential staff member and has been rated by newspapers (such as the Telegraph & SMH) and vitims on both sides as an unfair statistic-driven sales system that involves dehumanising the staff and forcing them to perform on a measurable hourly based system. It involves the staff being forced to consistently exceed the previous sales each day from the previous year. Failure to achive the required percentage of sales over the previous year for more than a fortnight results in a cautionary warning. Failure to correct the problem results in a formal warning and threat of dismissal. No exception is made. Luck, economy and customer base are not included in the statistics. Failure to secure a sale and add-on results in formal cautions and dismissal.

The system guarrentees a higher return for the store owner yet quickly erodes the customer base as consumers avoid the high pressure sales techniques and ultimately the stores themselves. It's easy to spot a store using this technique: They greet you within 60 seconds upon entering the store, ask you open ended questions that cannot be answered with a "Yes" or "No", then probe you further to determine your worth and likelihood of purchasing. From here, they'll try to "smoke out" your objections before manipulating you into purchasing a product that you may not have been interested in the first place. Psychological techniques such as handing a product to the customer to develop a bond with the item are used, as well as hand written notes on business cards are common ploys (customers are 75% more likely to keep a business card with hand written notes on it) used to secure a sale.

The Camera store I once worked at in Parramatta is just now using this technique, having purchased the rights to do so from the United States. On my last trip to the States, I was besieged by stores using this very method from LA to Florida. I myself was schooled in it in 1996 and then left the company I was with in disgust.

If you find yourself being pressured, don't engage the sales staff any further. Leave the store and find another because their job is anything other than helping you make the best choice for yourself.

All the best.

--
Marco Nero.
http://www.pbase.com/nero_design
 
Just remember that the store needs you, the customer. Therefore they should treat you well.

If they treat you poorly or attempt to manipulate you, they don't deserve your business.

Unfortunately, many fields use aggressive sales techniques like this. It's important to be able to see it coming and ignore it (cut through the bullplop) or go somewhere else.
--
Alexander Kahn
 
Just remember that the store needs you, the customer. Therefore
they should treat you well.

If they treat you poorly or attempt to manipulate you, they don't
deserve your business.

Unfortunately, many fields use aggressive sales techniques like
this. It's important to be able to see it coming and ignore it (cut
through the bullplop) or go somewhere else.
--
Alexander Kahn
I generally go with the concept of know what you are going to buy before you go to the store. If you just want to look, never buy it the day you first looked at it. Go home, check it out online, see what it is selling for, go to the manufactures web site and get info etc. If they cannot live with the idea that you are not going to buy it today, screw em! Playing with the heads of arogant high preasure sales men can be fun. What can be even more fun is waste a lot of his time, find out what you want to buy, go home and check it out, then come back and buy it from another sales man that is nicer. I have found that even in these kinds of stores, some sales men are worse than others. I an only refering to doing this with high preasure sales men of course.
 
kingLatency wrote:
Unfortunately, many fields use aggressive sales techniques like
this. It's important to be able to see it coming and ignore it (cut
through the bullplop) or go somewhere else.
That's exactly right. Amazingly, sales tecnhiques like the ones I mentioned (Also known as Direct-aggressive sales/marketing) have ploys to prevent a customer from walking out easily. One such technique used in a variety of camera and jewellery stores covers mentally restraining the customer who says "I'll think about it" or "I need to show my husband first" or the immortal "We'll just go have a cup of coffee and think about it" line. If a salesperson is unable to make the sale, they are serverely rebuked for it. It is up to the sales person (under such sales techniques) to "smoke out the objections" of the customer's lack of decision. If it's due to price, then it's the salesperson's fault for not determining the amount that the customer was prepared to part with and then showing them something cheaper. If it was lack of quality in the product, it is the salesperson's fault for not instilling "value" in the product during the demonstration process.

If one salesperson is unable to secure a sale, especially where expensive cameras are concerned, they are required to "Hand over the sale" to someone more aggressive by calling them over and involving them in the conversation before stepping back and letting the new salesperson apply their own style of pressure. I've had this done to me a number of times recently and enjoy wasting their time if I can spare it myself.

The first thing a salesperson tries to do is "Schmooze" with the customer. If they want to pretend to be your friend, then, if you can spare the time, show them that you are prepared to "pretend to buy". Heh heh!

Funniest thing of all is that the companies that sell such sales techniques (rights cost up to as high as $500,000 AUD for larger chain stores) to businesses and franchaises usually apply the same techniques to finalise the contract... by instilling sometimes false value in it. It's a crooked circle.

Last time I was in San Fransisco, the staff stood in the doorway of shops at one of the piers and literally called customers over to get them talking and invite them into the stores to be grilled by the staff within. I felt so sorry for them both. Hopefully this is not an indication of the future of retail. Cameras are expensive, it's websites like this one that can ultimately benefit the consumers.

Anyone had a bad experience here themselves?

Caio!

--
Marco Nero.
http://www.pbase.com/nero_design
 
kingLatency wrote:
Unfortunately, many fields use aggressive sales techniques like
this. It's important to be able to see it coming and ignore it (cut
through the bullplop) or go somewhere else.
That's exactly right. Amazingly, sales tecnhiques like the ones I
mentioned (Also known as Direct-aggressive sales/marketing) have
ploys to prevent a customer from walking out easily. One such
technique used in a variety of camera and jewellery stores covers
mentally restraining the customer who says "I'll think about it" or
"I need to show my husband first" or the immortal "We'll just go
have a cup of coffee and think about it" line. If a salesperson is
unable to make the sale, they are serverely rebuked for it. It is
up to the sales person (under such sales techniques) to "smoke out
the objections" of the customer's lack of decision. If it's due to
price, then it's the salesperson's fault for not determining the
amount that the customer was prepared to part with and then showing
them something cheaper. If it was lack of quality in the product,
it is the salesperson's fault for not instilling "value" in the
product during the demonstration process.

If one salesperson is unable to secure a sale, especially where
expensive cameras are concerned, they are required to "Hand over
the sale" to someone more aggressive by calling them over and
involving them in the conversation before stepping back and letting
the new salesperson apply their own style of pressure. I've had
this done to me a number of times recently and enjoy wasting their
time if I can spare it myself.

The first thing a salesperson tries to do is "Schmooze" with the
customer. If they want to pretend to be your friend, then, if you
can spare the time, show them that you are prepared to "pretend to
buy". Heh heh!

Funniest thing of all is that the companies that sell such sales
techniques (rights cost up to as high as $500,000 AUD for larger
chain stores) to businesses and franchaises usually apply the same
techniques to finalise the contract... by instilling sometimes
false value in it. It's a crooked circle.

Last time I was in San Fransisco, the staff stood in the doorway of
shops at one of the piers and literally called customers over to
get them talking and invite them into the stores to be grilled by
the staff within. I felt so sorry for them both. Hopefully this is
not an indication of the future of retail. Cameras are expensive,
it's websites like this one that can ultimately benefit the
consumers.

Anyone had a bad experience here themselves?

Caio!

--
Marco Nero.
http://www.pbase.com/nero_design
I haven't had this experience in a camera store. I have a G3 that I bought from an on-line dealer about a month ago. I called on the phone to make sure they had it in stock, and ordered it that way. No hi-pressure to buy overpriced extras, very pleasent experience. That last time I bought a camera, about 20 years ago, was in a store, but no pressure there either. But I've read posts from people who've had horrible experiences.

Now, if you really want to go through an absolutely miserable time, go to a car dealership here in the US and tell a salesperson that you're interested in buying, as opposed to just looking. Trust me when I say that camera shops will seem like heaven compared to car dealers. heh heh
 
Following on from the "Man, I Hate How These Computer Stores Act As
If You Know Nothing And They Know All!!" posting the other day, it
occured to me that many consumers might be unaware of some of the
drivel that goes on behind the scenes in the camera stores today.

I worked a few years in camera retail, both before and after I
entered the film industry full-time. I've dealt with all manner of
regular & genuine customers, celebrity customers, rich kids, low
income earners, irate idiots, shoplifters (both violent and drug
crazed and the obscenely stupid), professionals, wannabee
professionals, mental patients on day release with repetitive
behaviours that bring them into my store again and again... and of
course, the infamousTWA's (aka: time wasting @sses). Some of the
people employed at the store were physics students, photography
students, career sales professionals and people related to the
boss/owner.
You make a good point M.N. As for the sales people I have had to deal with lately. They for the most part really did not know their products. Were not easy to find and not much help then. (This was in a BestBuy) The camera Dept. had the only small patch of carpet so I waited as the spiked and colored haired manager. stood and watched as a vacuum was being given a demo. in his camera Dept. space. How wonderful having to hear that roaring monster as I waited to ask a question. I also walked over to look at their GPS units. They were across the Isle in the stereo Dept. Had to endure a loud bashing from the speakers as a sales person tried asking me if I needed help. Yeah help hearing as I lose what hearing I have left. At other stores (Wolf Photo) They the sales staff just looked the other way as I walked around their display case. Needless to say I went online (B&H Photo) got great service no hasseling and am enjoying my new camera. I did buy my GPS unit at a local (Academy Sports) not that they were much or any real help. I got a lot of good Info. off the Net. from usenet groups and Web sites. It's just Academy will let you return a GPS unit even after a Month. So this gave me time to see if the GPS really met my needs. They have a pretty steep learning curve. I like it and plan on keeping it. Could have saved about $90 US after shipping buying on Net. Oh well. :-)
 
Hi Marco,

thanks for the very informative post that confirmed all of my suspicions. i think deep down we all know this stuff goes on in most retail stores, but we keep hoping (unrealistically) that it won't happen to us (which it will of course).

very recently, my parents and i were in a jewelry store to purchase my mom something for a milestone anniversary. before we went to this store i think we pretty much had in mind paying about $300 or so for some ring or pendant (not trying to be cheap, but not really ready to spend a big sum of money at that point either).

so we go into the store to look around and are instantly greeted by an older salesman. he immediately shows us his higher priced stuff and of course my mom and dad begin to weaken...LOL so we are looking around for a while and i keep telling my parents that we are not here to look at the Hope Diamond (LOL) but rather to find something "reasonably priced." that falls on deaf ears...LOL

so eventually my mom ends up falling in love with 2 VERY expensive items (a watch and a ring) made by (name witheld, begins with a "C"). of course they make us a "special" deal if we buy BOTH items and it soon becomes apparent that if we leave one behind my mom will be unhappy so we do in fact get them both...LOL

the bottom line is that we ended up spending a lot more than we had initially planned because of the sales technique and also our own failure to stick to our guns regarding a suitable price range (certainly our fault).

in this situation the blame does go to the salesperson for using high pressure tactics. but it also goes to us for succumbing to those tactics.

sometimes, we are our own worst enemy.

--
Paul

http://www.pbase.com/sdpaul
 
Funny you should mention this. Yesterday, I was looking around at Ritz Camera near my house. I was looking at the Teleconverter for the A70. I asked the price on that and the adapter. He told me $120 for the TC, and $20 for the adapter, and then he said, "If you're going to get the TC, i'd suggest you don't get it unless you're going to get the insurance on it." I said, "How much is it", thinking maybe $20 or something. Heh, he said it was $65, and thought I was going to pay that. Well, they lost my sale, because after his sales tactics, it turned me off of the whole sale in general, although I may just buy the adapter there, as they are the only one who has it closeby.
Following on from the "Man, I Hate How These Computer Stores Act As
If You Know Nothing And They Know All!!" posting the other day, it
occured to me that many consumers might be unaware of some of the
drivel that goes on behind the scenes in the camera stores today.

I worked a few years in camera retail, both before and after I
entered the film industry full-time. I've dealt with all manner of
regular & genuine customers, celebrity customers, rich kids, low
income earners, irate idiots, shoplifters (both violent and drug
crazed and the obscenely stupid), professionals, wannabee
professionals, mental patients on day release with repetitive
behaviours that bring them into my store again and again... and of
course, the infamousTWA's (aka: time wasting @sses). Some of the
people employed at the store were physics students, photography
students, career sales professionals and people related to the
boss/owner.

Contributing to consumer's woes are a number of negative things
that might be encountered in any given Camera Store:
Lazy, ineffectual staff. Uninformed staff that are unfamilliar with a product, yet pretend
otherwise.
Tyrant managers who dictate sales statistics to force more sales
from staff at any cost.
The use of commission based on sales.
  • Utilisation of sales techniqes and selling systems such as the
infamous "Friedman Group© Sales Technique" and similar.
Pious and aggressive sales staff who like to bully the consumer
into a sale.
Really REALLY stupid staff who don't know any better.
Cash bonuses paid to staff as incentives to sell certain older or
defunct products and clear the store of obselete models.
Bait-and-switch: where a product is advertised in a catalogue to
lure in the customers for a great deal, only to find that stock are
sold or haven't arrived and an alternate, more expensive product is
then offered. It's illegal but hard to prove... my store never did
this but others have.

The above are merely an example, yet simply working on a
commission/bonus incentive can mean that a staff member does not
provide adequate information to inform the customer of the best
choice. More often than not, the wrong choice of camera is offered.

The Friedman Selling System © is the most common sales system in
use in the United States and Canada. It takes 12 weeks to three
months to complete by each potential staff member and has been
rated by newspapers (such as the Telegraph & SMH) and vitims on
both sides as an unfair statistic-driven sales system that involves
dehumanising the staff and forcing them to perform on a measurable
hourly based system. It involves the staff being forced to
consistently exceed the previous sales each day from the previous
year. Failure to achive the required percentage of sales over the
previous year for more than a fortnight results in a cautionary
warning. Failure to correct the problem results in a formal
warning and threat of dismissal. No exception is made. Luck,
economy and customer base are not included in the statistics.
Failure to secure a sale and add-on results in formal cautions and
dismissal.

The system guarrentees a higher return for the store owner yet
quickly erodes the customer base as consumers avoid the high
pressure sales techniques and ultimately the stores themselves.
It's easy to spot a store using this technique: They greet you
within 60 seconds upon entering the store, ask you open ended
questions that cannot be answered with a "Yes" or "No", then probe
you further to determine your worth and likelihood of purchasing.
From here, they'll try to "smoke out" your objections before
manipulating you into purchasing a product that you may not have
been interested in the first place. Psychological techniques such
as handing a product to the customer to develop a bond with the
item are used, as well as hand written notes on business cards are
common ploys (customers are 75% more likely to keep a business card
with hand written notes on it) used to secure a sale.

The Camera store I once worked at in Parramatta is just now using
this technique, having purchased the rights to do so from the
United States. On my last trip to the States, I was besieged by
stores using this very method from LA to Florida. I myself was
schooled in it in 1996 and then left the company I was with in
disgust.

If you find yourself being pressured, don't engage the sales staff
any further. Leave the store and find another because their job is
anything other than helping you make the best choice for yourself.

All the best.

--
Marco Nero.
http://www.pbase.com/nero_design
 
Funny you should mention this. Yesterday, I was looking around at
Ritz Camera near my house. I was looking at the Teleconverter for
the A70. I asked the price on that and the adapter. He told me $120
for the TC, and $20 for the adapter, and then he said, "If you're
going to get the TC, i'd suggest you don't get it unless you're
going to get the insurance on it." I said, "How much is it",
thinking maybe $20 or something. Heh, he said it was $65, and
thought I was going to pay that. Well, they lost my sale, because
after his sales tactics, it turned me off of the whole sale in
general, although I may just buy the adapter there, as they are the
only one who has it closeby.
I would walk into the store and tell him that you will give him 120$ for the lens and adapter and if he won't take it, buy the adapter and let him keep the lens. B&H has it for 100$ and I found 2 local camera stores that had the lens in stock here in Dallas for 100$. If he wants the sale let him give you a good price. By the way, have you seen the metal adapter that bugeye digital has? I have the canon plastic one and it is a piece of shi*t. Ritz actually helped me out with that one though. The guy at the store I called volentered to call corporate and have them check inventory in the area. He called back 20 minutes later with the location of the only two stores that had the plastic one. I'm going to get the metal one even t\hough I already have the plastic one.
 
sometimes, we are our own worst enemy.
Gee SDPaul,

I'm sorry about that experience you had. This is exactly the sort of thing that I see day to day and it's got nothing to do with the customer being at fault for getting tricked into the wrong kind of sale or purchase. If anything, your folks sound like real nice people. And that's what makes this so bad, the fact that it's nasty people causing nice people grief and misery.

The reason I resigned from the jewellery industry was when my boss told me to pretty much do the same thing to an elderly woman as what happenned to you guys. I baulked. I got angry. I refused. I grew angrier. I kicked my manager's ass. He called the district manager who flew interstate to deal with me. I kicked his ass too. Verbally, physically and then ultimately legally. My store manager was fired by the district manager for letting the incident blow up as it did. I then pressured the district manager who resigned. The two staff who took the manager's side over the incident were later arrested for taking merchandise home "by mistake". I then walked out on Christmas Eve to leave them wallowing in their own mess.

I'm a lot happier now although dismayed that my old camera store is now implementing the same sales techniques. The 9th staff member in two months is handing in his resignation today due to the introduction of the Friedman Selling System being introduced there. Already, I have met three potential customers who have since refused to shop there anymore and spent a literal fortune elsewhere (one sale was for the Govt. and was worth about $55,000 worth of cameras for the Dept of Community Services). Heh heh.

Cheers all.
--
Marco Nero.
http://www.pbase.com/nero_design
 
I generally go with the concept of know what you are going to buy
before you go to the store. If you just want to look, never buy it
the day you first looked at it. Go home, check it out online, see
what it is selling for, go to the manufactures web site and get
info etc. If they cannot live with the idea that you are not going
to buy it today, screw em! Playing with the heads of arogant high
preasure sales men can be fun. What can be even more fun is waste
a lot of his time, find out what you want to buy, go home and check
it out, then come back and buy it from another sales man that is
nicer. I have found that even in these kinds of stores, some sales
men are worse than others. I an only refering to doing this with
high preasure sales men of course.
Bravo ;). To top it off, you leave with a chuckle and now he's got stress issues, instead of you walking out with your blood pressure boiling. I love watching used car dealers spin when I shop for cars. I walk in with a piece of scrap paper covered with notes and my pencil... looking all around the car ignoring all his comments while he's trying to 'steer' me to what he wants me to see. I love to write notes about the car and try to be obvious about comparing it to other cars I've looked at. Within a short time you can catch them glancing at that scrap of paper with hate in their eyes. And they become so desperate when you leave the lot without buying.

As someone said before, never buy on the spot, whether its cars, cameras, computers, whatever. I either leave to check up on prices & reviews, or I've done my homework already and know what I want when I get there. I have to shake my head and walk away when I'm checking out the stuff in the camera departments and people are picking out a new camera based on what it looks like without a clue what it does or if it meets their needs.

Kevin
 
Hi

We had the same experience in Mexico this winter, we attended a time share sales pitch, we told the salesman up front that we only had two hours to spare and had to almost fight to leave, we met people that had been 6 hours at one of these events, at the end they try to make you feel bad that its your fault and your type shouldnt waste our time, even though they came to us at the airport with all sorts of offers of trips and gifts to get us to go

Dave
Oliver BC
kingLatency wrote:
Unfortunately, many fields use aggressive sales techniques like
this. It's important to be able to see it coming and ignore it (cut
through the bullplop) or go somewhere else.
That's exactly right. Amazingly, sales tecnhiques like the ones I
mentioned (Also known as Direct-aggressive sales/marketing) have
ploys to prevent a customer from walking out easily. One such
technique used in a variety of camera and jewellery stores covers
mentally restraining the customer who says "I'll think about it" or
"I need to show my husband first" or the immortal "We'll just go
have a cup of coffee and think about it" line. If a salesperson is
unable to make the sale, they are serverely rebuked for it. It is
up to the sales person (under such sales techniques) to "smoke out
the objections" of the customer's lack of decision. If it's due to
price, then it's the salesperson's fault for not determining the
amount that the customer was prepared to part with and then showing
them something cheaper. If it was lack of quality in the product,
it is the salesperson's fault for not instilling "value" in the
product during the demonstration process.

If one salesperson is unable to secure a sale, especially where
expensive cameras are concerned, they are required to "Hand over
the sale" to someone more aggressive by calling them over and
involving them in the conversation before stepping back and letting
the new salesperson apply their own style of pressure. I've had
this done to me a number of times recently and enjoy wasting their
time if I can spare it myself.

The first thing a salesperson tries to do is "Schmooze" with the
customer. If they want to pretend to be your friend, then, if you
can spare the time, show them that you are prepared to "pretend to
buy". Heh heh!

Funniest thing of all is that the companies that sell such sales
techniques (rights cost up to as high as $500,000 AUD for larger
chain stores) to businesses and franchaises usually apply the same
techniques to finalise the contract... by instilling sometimes
false value in it. It's a crooked circle.

Last time I was in San Fransisco, the staff stood in the doorway of
shops at one of the piers and literally called customers over to
get them talking and invite them into the stores to be grilled by
the staff within. I felt so sorry for them both. Hopefully this is
not an indication of the future of retail. Cameras are expensive,
it's websites like this one that can ultimately benefit the
consumers.

Anyone had a bad experience here themselves?

Caio!

--
Marco Nero.
http://www.pbase.com/nero_design
I haven't had this experience in a camera store. I have a G3 that I
bought from an on-line dealer about a month ago. I called on the
phone to make sure they had it in stock, and ordered it that way.
No hi-pressure to buy overpriced extras, very pleasent experience.
That last time I bought a camera, about 20 years ago, was in a
store, but no pressure there either. But I've read posts from
people who've had horrible experiences.
Now, if you really want to go through an absolutely miserable time,
go to a car dealership here in the US and tell a salesperson that
you're interested in buying, as opposed to just looking. Trust me
when I say that camera shops will seem like heaven compared to car
dealers. heh heh
 
I generally go with the concept of know what you are going to buy
before you go to the store. If you just want to look, never buy it
the day you first looked at it. Go home, check it out online, see
what it is selling for, go to the manufactures web site and get
info etc. If they cannot live with the idea that you are not going
to buy it today, screw em! Playing with the heads of arogant high
preasure sales men can be fun. What can be even more fun is waste
a lot of his time, find out what you want to buy, go home and check
it out, then come back and buy it from another sales man that is
nicer. I have found that even in these kinds of stores, some sales
men are worse than others. I an only refering to doing this with
high preasure sales men of course.
Bravo ;). To top it off, you leave with a chuckle and now he's got
stress issues, instead of you walking out with your blood pressure
boiling. I love watching used car dealers spin when I shop for
cars. I walk in with a piece of scrap paper covered with notes and
my pencil... looking all around the car ignoring all his comments
while he's trying to 'steer' me to what he wants me to see. I love
to write notes about the car and try to be obvious about comparing
it to other cars I've looked at. Within a short time you can catch
them glancing at that scrap of paper with hate in their eyes. And
they become so desperate when you leave the lot without buying.

As someone said before, never buy on the spot, whether its cars,
cameras, computers, whatever. I either leave to check up on prices
& reviews, or I've done my homework already and know what I want
when I get there. I have to shake my head and walk away when I'm
checking out the stuff in the camera departments and people are
picking out a new camera based on what it looks like without a
clue what it does or if it meets their needs.

Kevin
Car dealers are special. Car dealers are fun. Anybody know what dealer financing is? It is not when the the car dealer finds you a loan. It is the fact that most car dealers do not have the money to pay the manufacture up front for the cars they have on the lot (unless they are a really big chain, which still take advantage of this). Most car dealers take out a dealer loan to pay the manufacture for the cars on thier lot. The dealer gives them a kick back (I think mitshubishi calls this a dealer rebate, where as dodge pretends it dosen't exsist). These two have a buisness partnership, but it can really vary and car salesmen, are not always honest (go figure). It is basically the car manufacture agreeing to pay the intrest on the dealer lone for a period of time (about 3 months). Havent you wondered why you can research the "dealer cost" online, and they will sell you a car for 2-3 hundred dollars more? How could they support their buisness on that? The fun part is when a dealers tries to sell you a car that is basically what you are looking for, but this model is beter because it has certain features (has been on the lot longer and they are loosing money). If you know what is going on it can really be fun to mess with them (they are lieing to you, they deserve it). Tell them both cars are really nice, but it is not exactlly what you want. Tell them you went online and found out that you could have them order the car from the manufacture with the exact options, paint color, interior etc. that you want. Tell them that you would like to order it, and see how the pricing changes, special delivery fees etc. They still get the dealer loan amount fron the manufacture if you order, but thier job is to sell the cars on the lot. The longer it is on the lot, the more it is loosing money. They are paying intrest on all those cars. God forbid other buisnesses begin to do this.[/U]
 
Hi

We had the same experience in Mexico this winter, we attended a
time share sales pitch, we told the salesman up front that we only
had two hours to spare and had to almost fight to leave, we met
people that had been 6 hours at one of these events, at the end
they try to make you feel bad that its your fault and your type
shouldnt waste our time, even though they came to us at the airport
with all sorts of offers of trips and gifts to get us to go

Dave
Oliver BC
Now you know that by taking their bait "that free "B" trip they are going to try like HeXX to sell you the deal. So I really can't feel for you having to endure the long pitch.
kingLatency wrote:
Unfortunately, many fields use aggressive sales techniques like
this. It's important to be able to see it coming and ignore it (cut
through the bullplop) or go somewhere else.
That's exactly right. Amazingly, sales tecnhiques like the ones I
mentioned (Also known as Direct-aggressive sales/marketing) have
ploys to prevent a customer from walking out easily. One such
technique used in a variety of camera and jewellery stores covers
mentally restraining the customer who says "I'll think about it" or
"I need to show my husband first" or the immortal "We'll just go
have a cup of coffee and think about it" line. If a salesperson is
unable to make the sale, they are serverely rebuked for it. It is
up to the sales person (under such sales techniques) to "smoke out
the objections" of the customer's lack of decision. If it's due to
price, then it's the salesperson's fault for not determining the
amount that the customer was prepared to part with and then showing
them something cheaper. If it was lack of quality in the product,
it is the salesperson's fault for not instilling "value" in the
product during the demonstration process.

If one salesperson is unable to secure a sale, especially where
expensive cameras are concerned, they are required to "Hand over
the sale" to someone more aggressive by calling them over and
involving them in the conversation before stepping back and letting
the new salesperson apply their own style of pressure. I've had
this done to me a number of times recently and enjoy wasting their
time if I can spare it myself.

The first thing a salesperson tries to do is "Schmooze" with the
customer. If they want to pretend to be your friend, then, if you
can spare the time, show them that you are prepared to "pretend to
buy". Heh heh!

Funniest thing of all is that the companies that sell such sales
techniques (rights cost up to as high as $500,000 AUD for larger
chain stores) to businesses and franchaises usually apply the same
techniques to finalise the contract... by instilling sometimes
false value in it. It's a crooked circle.

Last time I was in San Fransisco, the staff stood in the doorway of
shops at one of the piers and literally called customers over to
get them talking and invite them into the stores to be grilled by
the staff within. I felt so sorry for them both. Hopefully this is
not an indication of the future of retail. Cameras are expensive,
it's websites like this one that can ultimately benefit the
consumers.

Anyone had a bad experience here themselves?

Caio!

--
Marco Nero.
http://www.pbase.com/nero_design
I haven't had this experience in a camera store. I have a G3 that I
bought from an on-line dealer about a month ago. I called on the
phone to make sure they had it in stock, and ordered it that way.
No hi-pressure to buy overpriced extras, very pleasent experience.
That last time I bought a camera, about 20 years ago, was in a
store, but no pressure there either. But I've read posts from
people who've had horrible experiences.
Now, if you really want to go through an absolutely miserable time,
go to a car dealership here in the US and tell a salesperson that
you're interested in buying, as opposed to just looking. Trust me
when I say that camera shops will seem like heaven compared to car
dealers. heh heh
 

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