Nikon V4-When?

Vincent Aquilino said:

Why are their mistakes? Please explain

Click to expand...

1. Nikon designed the 1 series sensor not to "cannibalize" DX sales. They forgot that it's better to cannibalize your own sales rather than let a competitor do it.
2. They forgot the lessons of Apple. If you are going to build a small, high-priced product the ergonomics have to be right. Technology is only part of the package.
3. They forgot that the U.S. male consumers don't equate miniaturization with quality or luxury. This caused them to enter at too high a price point.
4. They confused people with too many too similar configurations. Why V and J and S?
5. They build an advertising campaign around Ashton Kutcher, who was already fading as a "face."
6. They made silly decisions such as a single "proprietary accessory port" which needed to serve multiple roles and it's own expensive gear. Then with the V3, they not only doubled down on this mistake, but went from a sleek design to a camera with a wart.

slothead said:

pda4you said:

It appears N1 may be relegated to the Jx and Sx line. Not sure about the "high" end future of the Vx line. It appears they are doing slow(ish) zooms and no longer focusing on the V series. Hard to blame them frankly with the very slow sales.

Sad....my N1 migration clock is ticking....

Mike

Click to expand...

Rumor has it (maybe it's more than just rumor) that Nikon has acquired or is acquiring Samsung's mirrorless line. If such is true, I am guessing they will combine the designs of these two (N1 and Samsung) to create a much larger and capable sensor. And if that is the case, the N1 line will take a drastic turn.

Click to expand...

BlueBomberTurbo said:

Sony RX100 IV: Best pocket camera. Period. The image quality decimates the competition, on par with some M4/3 cameras. Oozing with features and controls, with near PDAF-quick AF, you won't feel like you're missing out by not shooting a DSLR. Video is amazing, as well. The only letdown for me was the focal length. If you're good with 24-70, you'll really only need another camera for low light shooting. If not, you'll be annoyed by missing shots beyond the wider and longer ends. Sold mine because of this, and the RX10 II defeats the purpose of a pocket camera. Especially since it costs the same as a D7200, which blows it away in everything but video.

Click to expand...

BlueBomberTurbo said:

Here's my take on these cameras. I've owned a Nikon D750, Sony RX100 IV, Sony A6000, and Nikon J5, and have checked out most other recent cameras. Still waiting for a Nikon 1 V series to hit my desk.

Nikon D750: Absolute IQ and control at the expense of size and cost. You won't find anything with noticeably better quality unless you move up to medium format, where you'll sacrifice weight, size, and AF. I reserve mine for paid work, planned trips, and very low light situations. Bought this after deciding not to compromise on IQ or AF anymore, and it's everything I could want an more (ridiculous DR!).

Sony RX100 IV: Best pocket camera. Period. The image quality decimates the competition, on par with some M4/3 cameras. Oozing with features and controls, with near PDAF-quick AF, you won't feel like you're missing out by not shooting a DSLR. Video is amazing, as well. The only letdown for me was the focal length. If you're good with 24-70, you'll really only need another camera for low light shooting. If not, you'll be annoyed by missing shots beyond the wider and longer ends. Sold mine because of this, and the RX10 II defeats the purpose of a pocket camera. Especially since it costs the same as a D7200, which blows it away in everything but video.

Nikon 1 J5: better IQ than the RX100 IV by maybe 15%. High ISO is amazingly smooth in chroma noise, while the DR is nothing to scoff at. Control is where it falls face down. I tested an AW1 at work, so I knew what I was in for. Otherwise, the J5 would have been sent back the next day. Got it used at KEH plus 20% off for Cyber Monday, so I took the chance. I use it with the FT1 and a magnifying loupe for super telephoto work. Beyond that, it's just too fiddly to use as a daily camera. The IQ does make me interested in a V4 with better control and an integrated viewfinder, though. It's good enough in good light to keep it around next to my D750 and...

Sony A6000: Best all-around lightweight compact camera, and a low/midrange DSLR killer. There's a reason it's still high in the charts at Amazon. The IQ is very good. Not as good as Nikon's top APS-C cameras, but really only noticeable if you max out the DR or shoot above ISO 3200. VERY sharp for a sensor that still has an AA filter, and traveling with the Sigma prime trio makes up for a terrible kit lens at a bargain basement price.

The interface is even more flexible than the RX100 IV, leaving everything I need at my fingertips. I find myself menu digging in my D750 more than the A6000, and I've been a Nikon guy since 2010 (D90 through D7100)! Beyond that, the camera is just super responsive, and the video easily beats my D750's. My go-to camera for just about everything I don't use my D750 or J5 on, it never lets me down. I even prefer it over the A7 series for its smaller lenses and (very noticeably) lighter weight. Definitely planning on upgrading when the successor arrives, and looking hard at the Commlite Nikon autofocus adapter. The only thing that could make me sell is a Nikon mirrorless made by their DSLR group.

Nikon D3xxx Series: Great IQ, starting with the D3200. Absolutely blows any Canon crop sensor ever made out of the water, and competes very nicely with any Nikon crop sensor, too. Light as a feather compared to the rest of Nikon's lineup, and very compact. Again, it suffers from the control issue. Being beginner/consumer oriented, it has very little in physical shooting controls, making it cumbersome for advanced shooters. Even the D5xxx series with additional controls frustrates me. And for being a compact DSLR, it's still huge in comparison to the A6000 with a prime or even the older (superior) 18-55mm kit lens.

Click to expand...

BlueBomberTurbo said:

I've also tested most M4/3 cameras and Fuji X cameras at work, and none have impressed me. Beyond sub par IQ and so-so AF, it was mainly the annnoying menu systems or oddly placed/tiny controls that ruined the experience.

Click to expand...

BlueBomberTurbo said:

And no, I didn't have a problem adapting to Sony's mirrorless controls or menus. Don't get me started on Canon gear...

Click to expand...

Jorginho said:

BlueBomberTurbo said:

Here's my take on these cameras. I've owned a Nikon D750, Sony RX100 IV, Sony A6000, and Nikon J5, and have checked out most other recent cameras. Still waiting for a Nikon 1 V series to hit my desk.

Nikon D750: Absolute IQ and control at the expense of size and cost. You won't find anything with noticeably better quality unless you move up to medium format, where you'll sacrifice weight, size, and AF. I reserve mine for paid work, planned trips, and very low light situations. Bought this after deciding not to compromise on IQ or AF anymore, and it's everything I could want an more (ridiculous DR!).

Sony RX100 IV: Best pocket camera. Period. The image quality decimates the competition, on par with some M4/3 cameras. Oozing with features and controls, with near PDAF-quick AF, you won't feel like you're missing out by not shooting a DSLR. Video is amazing, as well. The only letdown for me was the focal length. If you're good with 24-70, you'll really only need another camera for low light shooting. If not, you'll be annoyed by missing shots beyond the wider and longer ends. Sold mine because of this, and the RX10 II defeats the purpose of a pocket camera. Especially since it costs the same as a D7200, which blows it away in everything but video.

Nikon 1 J5: better IQ than the RX100 IV by maybe 15%. High ISO is amazingly smooth in chroma noise, while the DR is nothing to scoff at. Control is where it falls face down. I tested an AW1 at work, so I knew what I was in for. Otherwise, the J5 would have been sent back the next day. Got it used at KEH plus 20% off for Cyber Monday, so I took the chance. I use it with the FT1 and a magnifying loupe for super telephoto work. Beyond that, it's just too fiddly to use as a daily camera. The IQ does make me interested in a V4 with better control and an integrated viewfinder, though. It's good enough in good light to keep it around next to my D750 and...

Sony A6000: Best all-around lightweight compact camera, and a low/midrange DSLR killer. There's a reason it's still high in the charts at Amazon. The IQ is very good. Not as good as Nikon's top APS-C cameras, but really only noticeable if you max out the DR or shoot above ISO 3200. VERY sharp for a sensor that still has an AA filter, and traveling with the Sigma prime trio makes up for a terrible kit lens at a bargain basement price.

The interface is even more flexible than the RX100 IV, leaving everything I need at my fingertips. I find myself menu digging in my D750 more than the A6000, and I've been a Nikon guy since 2010 (D90 through D7100)! Beyond that, the camera is just super responsive, and the video easily beats my D750's. My go-to camera for just about everything I don't use my D750 or J5 on, it never lets me down. I even prefer it over the A7 series for its smaller lenses and (very noticeably) lighter weight. Definitely planning on upgrading when the successor arrives, and looking hard at the Commlite Nikon autofocus adapter. The only thing that could make me sell is a Nikon mirrorless made by their DSLR group.

Nikon D3xxx Series: Great IQ, starting with the D3200. Absolutely blows any Canon crop sensor ever made out of the water, and competes very nicely with any Nikon crop sensor, too. Light as a feather compared to the rest of Nikon's lineup, and very compact. Again, it suffers from the control issue. Being beginner/consumer oriented, it has very little in physical shooting controls, making it cumbersome for advanced shooters. Even the D5xxx series with additional controls frustrates me. And for being a compact DSLR, it's still huge in comparison to the A6000 with a prime or even the older (superior) 18-55mm kit lens.

I've also tested most M4/3 cameras and Fuji X cameras at work, and none have impressed me. Beyond sub par IQ and so-so AF, it was mainly the annnoying menu systems or oddly placed/tiny controls that ruined the experience.

Click to expand...

Which cams did you use and what glass was used? Any mFT sensor since 2013 (bar G6 and GF6) has better IQ than any 1"series sensor. So that can't be it. Also: AF-s of mFTs is the best in mirrorless land and it only gets better in low light. AF-c in the GH4, G7 and GX8 as well as the EM1 is up there with midrange DSLRs too. So what cam did you use?

Jorginho said:

And no, I didn't have a problem adapting to Sony's mirrorless controls or menus. Don't get me started on Canon gear...

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

jimoyer said:

I wonder if people are ever going to stop declaring one camera or another the absolute best that decimates all comers, and realize that it may be the truth based on the type of photography they do, but not so much based on other types of photography. Perhaps it's not at all, and it just happens to be the best for them. Even worse is basing it on DXO scores. Get off of DXO's site and take some pictures. Then tell us about it. Based on DXO scores, the Df rates higher for sports than a D4s. I'll bet my D4s against anyone wanting to make the claim that the Df is a better sports camera than the D4s....lets say for a Nikon 500 f4 for the winner?

My point is that the best camera for you isn't necessarily the best camera. I know that's hard to believe. DXO is just a guide, no the Holy Book of Photography. Finally, it's probably not the best idea to quote Ken Rockwell if you're trying to prove a point. Beyond that, go out and take some pictures then come back to us and rather than saying "this camera will decimate all comers" tell us what you like about the camera after actually using it, and provide some images to illustrate why.

JMHO

Click to expand...

jimoyer said:

I wonder if people are ever going to stop declaring one camera or another the absolute best that decimates all comers, and realize that it may be the truth based on the type of photography they do, but not so much based on other types of photography. Perhaps it's not at all, and it just happens to be the best for them. Even worse is basing it on DXO scores. Get off of DXO's site and take some pictures. Then tell us about it. Based on DXO scores, the Df rates higher for sports than a D4s. I'll bet my D4s against anyone wanting to make the claim that the Df is a better sports camera than the D4s....lets say for a Nikon 500 f4 for the winner?

My point is that the best camera for you isn't necessarily the best camera. I know that's hard to believe. DXO is just a guide, no the Holy Book of Photography. Finally, it's probably not the best idea to quote Ken Rockwell if you're trying to prove a point. Beyond that, go out and take some pictures then come back to us and rather than saying "this camera will decimate all comers" tell us what you like about the camera after actually using it, and provide some images to illustrate why.

JMHO

Click to expand...

DaveR43 said:

jimoyer said:

I wonder if people are ever going to stop declaring one camera or another the absolute best that decimates all comers, and realize that it may be the truth based on the type of photography they do, but not so much based on other types of photography. Perhaps it's not at all, and it just happens to be the best for them. Even worse is basing it on DXO scores. Get off of DXO's site and take some pictures. Then tell us about it. Based on DXO scores, the Df rates higher for sports than a D4s. I'll bet my D4s against anyone wanting to make the claim that the Df is a better sports camera than the D4s....lets say for a Nikon 500 f4 for the winner?

My point is that the best camera for you isn't necessarily the best camera. I know that's hard to believe. DXO is just a guide, no the Holy Book of Photography. Finally, it's probably not the best idea to quote Ken Rockwell if you're trying to prove a point. Beyond that, go out and take some pictures then come back to us and rather than saying "this camera will decimate all comers" tell us what you like about the camera after actually using it, and provide some images to illustrate why.

JMHO

Click to expand...

I'm not sure who you are addressing this at. Certainly not Liz, who's post you replied to...

Click to expand...

Cliff Fujii said:

Jorginho said:

BlueBomberTurbo said:

Here's my take on these cameras. I've owned a Nikon D750, Sony RX100 IV, Sony A6000, and Nikon J5, and have checked out most other recent cameras. Still waiting for a Nikon 1 V series to hit my desk.

Nikon D750: Absolute IQ and control at the expense of size and cost. You won't find anything with noticeably better quality unless you move up to medium format, where you'll sacrifice weight, size, and AF. I reserve mine for paid work, planned trips, and very low light situations. Bought this after deciding not to compromise on IQ or AF anymore, and it's everything I could want an more (ridiculous DR!).

Sony RX100 IV: Best pocket camera. Period. The image quality decimates the competition, on par with some M4/3 cameras. Oozing with features and controls, with near PDAF-quick AF, you won't feel like you're missing out by not shooting a DSLR. Video is amazing, as well. The only letdown for me was the focal length. If you're good with 24-70, you'll really only need another camera for low light shooting. If not, you'll be annoyed by missing shots beyond the wider and longer ends. Sold mine because of this, and the RX10 II defeats the purpose of a pocket camera. Especially since it costs the same as a D7200, which blows it away in everything but video.

Nikon 1 J5: better IQ than the RX100 IV by maybe 15%. High ISO is amazingly smooth in chroma noise, while the DR is nothing to scoff at. Control is where it falls face down. I tested an AW1 at work, so I knew what I was in for. Otherwise, the J5 would have been sent back the next day. Got it used at KEH plus 20% off for Cyber Monday, so I took the chance. I use it with the FT1 and a magnifying loupe for super telephoto work. Beyond that, it's just too fiddly to use as a daily camera. The IQ does make me interested in a V4 with better control and an integrated viewfinder, though. It's good enough in good light to keep it around next to my D750 and...

Sony A6000: Best all-around lightweight compact camera, and a low/midrange DSLR killer. There's a reason it's still high in the charts at Amazon. The IQ is very good. Not as good as Nikon's top APS-C cameras, but really only noticeable if you max out the DR or shoot above ISO 3200. VERY sharp for a sensor that still has an AA filter, and traveling with the Sigma prime trio makes up for a terrible kit lens at a bargain basement price.

The interface is even more flexible than the RX100 IV, leaving everything I need at my fingertips. I find myself menu digging in my D750 more than the A6000, and I've been a Nikon guy since 2010 (D90 through D7100)! Beyond that, the camera is just super responsive, and the video easily beats my D750's. My go-to camera for just about everything I don't use my D750 or J5 on, it never lets me down. I even prefer it over the A7 series for its smaller lenses and (very noticeably) lighter weight. Definitely planning on upgrading when the successor arrives, and looking hard at the Commlite Nikon autofocus adapter. The only thing that could make me sell is a Nikon mirrorless made by their DSLR group.

Nikon D3xxx Series: Great IQ, starting with the D3200. Absolutely blows any Canon crop sensor ever made out of the water, and competes very nicely with any Nikon crop sensor, too. Light as a feather compared to the rest of Nikon's lineup, and very compact. Again, it suffers from the control issue. Being beginner/consumer oriented, it has very little in physical shooting controls, making it cumbersome for advanced shooters. Even the D5xxx series with additional controls frustrates me. And for being a compact DSLR, it's still huge in comparison to the A6000 with a prime or even the older (superior) 18-55mm kit lens.

I've also tested most M4/3 cameras and Fuji X cameras at work, and none have impressed me. Beyond sub par IQ and so-so AF, it was mainly the annnoying menu systems or oddly placed/tiny controls that ruined the experience.

Click to expand...

Which cams did you use and what glass was used? Any mFT sensor since 2013 (bar G6 and GF6) has better IQ than any 1"series sensor. So that can't be it. Also: AF-s of mFTs is the best in mirrorless land and it only gets better in low light. AF-c in the GH4, G7 and GX8 as well as the EM1 is up there with midrange DSLRs too. So what cam did you use?

Cliff Fujii said:

And no, I didn't have a problem adapting to Sony's mirrorless controls or menus. Don't get me started on Canon gear...

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

If you look at the dXo tests between the Sony RX-100 Mk IV and the Panasonic G5, the Sony wins in all categories except sports.

Click to expand...

Cliff Fujii said:

When compared with a camera with an APS-C sensor, dXo says that the Sony just gets edged out by the Nikon D3300 (DR).

Click to expand...

Cliff Fujii said:

So I think with a few more years of development, the 1" sensor will become a great all around sensor.

Click to expand...

Cliff Fujii said:

--
Cliff

Click to expand...

DaveR43 said:

jimoyer said:

I wonder if people are ever going to stop declaring one camera or another the absolute best that decimates all comers, and realize that it may be the truth based on the type of photography they do, but not so much based on other types of photography. Perhaps it's not at all, and it just happens to be the best for them. Even worse is basing it on DXO scores. Get off of DXO's site and take some pictures. Then tell us about it. Based on DXO scores, the Df rates higher for sports than a D4s. I'll bet my D4s against anyone wanting to make the claim that the Df is a better sports camera than the D4s....lets say for a Nikon 500 f4 for the winner?

My point is that the best camera for you isn't necessarily the best camera. I know that's hard to believe. DXO is just a guide, no the Holy Book of Photography. Finally, it's probably not the best idea to quote Ken Rockwell if you're trying to prove a point. Beyond that, go out and take some pictures then come back to us and rather than saying "this camera will decimate all comers" tell us what you like about the camera after actually using it, and provide some images to illustrate why.

JMHO

Click to expand...

I'm not sure who you are addressing this at. Certainly not Liz, who's post you replied to...

Click to expand...

jimoyer said:

DaveR43 said:

jimoyer said:

I wonder if people are ever going to stop declaring one camera or another the absolute best that decimates all comers, and realize that it may be the truth based on the type of photography they do, but not so much based on other types of photography. Perhaps it's not at all, and it just happens to be the best for them. Even worse is basing it on DXO scores. Get off of DXO's site and take some pictures. Then tell us about it. Based on DXO scores, the Df rates higher for sports than a D4s. I'll bet my D4s against anyone wanting to make the claim that the Df is a better sports camera than the D4s....lets say for a Nikon 500 f4 for the winner?

My point is that the best camera for you isn't necessarily the best camera. I know that's hard to believe. DXO is just a guide, no the Holy Book of Photography. Finally, it's probably not the best idea to quote Ken Rockwell if you're trying to prove a point. Beyond that, go out and take some pictures then come back to us and rather than saying "this camera will decimate all comers" tell us what you like about the camera after actually using it, and provide some images to illustrate why.

JMHO

Click to expand...

I'm not sure who you are addressing this at. Certainly not Liz, who's post you replied to...

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

jimoyer said:

OK so this time I am actually replying to Liz. VERY nice images in that Flickr account. Images of that quality say just about all that needs to be said ;-)

Very Nice!

Click to expand...

lizardi said:

jimoyer said:

OK so this time I am actually replying to Liz. VERY nice images in that Flickr account. Images of that quality say just about all that needs to be said ;-)

Very Nice!

Click to expand...

Thank you very much! As you can probably tell, I'm a bird nerd. I've only owned superzooms so far, but am hoping a V4 will be my next camera, that's why I've been lurking here. :-D

Liz

Click to expand...

jonikon said:

Hopefully in the spring of next year, but certainly by October, 2016 at the latest.

- Jon

Click to expand...