GX8, speedlights, burst mode, and crushing disappointment

I shoot dance schools as well and after reading your post it scared the crap out of me as I just sold all my slr gear. I ran to the car and got my em5 + yn56011 set to 1/16 and burst on camera and away she fired.... sheeeshe that was lucky as I have a big dance school shoot coming up. and use 4 yu 560 set at 1/8 to feeeeeze motion when the girls do their acro shots.

cheers don
 
When it comes to using a flash during burst mode...what flash can handle such facility? I have an old Oly FL-36, and I'm pretty sure it's recharge rate is no where near fast enough to recycle before the next shot can be taken in flash. I think it takes around a second to recharge? So...which m43 flash can handle such a situation? Or am I looking at this wrong?
A speedlight will take up to 5 seconds to recharge from zero to full, so if you fire off a full-power shot you'll have to wait five seconds. Two and a half seconds for half power, about one second for a quarter power, half a second for 1/8th etc. But most speedlights will fire without being fully charged, so you can get 8 x 1/8 shots in a row easily.

I set my lights up to 1/32 or 1/16, and can increase them to 1/8 if I need to, but to keep the recharge times low I just added more lights. Two lights at 1/8 = 1 light at 1/4, etc.
 
I shoot dance schools as well and after reading your post it scared the crap out of me as I just sold all my slr gear. I ran to the car and got my em5 + yn56011 set to 1/16 and burst on camera and away she fired.... sheeeshe that was lucky as I have a big dance school shoot coming up. and use 4 yu 560 set at 1/8 to feeeeeze motion when the girls do their acro shots.
Yeah the Oly doesn't have the same problem. Lucky! =)
 
When it comes to using a flash during burst mode...what flash can handle such facility? I have an old Oly FL-36, and I'm pretty sure it's recharge rate is no where near fast enough to recycle before the next shot can be taken in flash. I think it takes around a second to recharge? So...which m43 flash can handle such a situation? Or am I looking at this wrong?
A speedlight will take up to 5 seconds to recharge from zero to full, so if you fire off a full-power shot you'll have to wait five seconds. Two and a half seconds for half power, about one second for a quarter power, half a second for 1/8th etc. But most speedlights will fire without being fully charged, so you can get 8 x 1/8 shots in a row easily.

I set my lights up to 1/32 or 1/16, and can increase them to 1/8 if I need to, but to keep the recharge times low I just added more lights. Two lights at 1/8 = 1 light at 1/4, etc.
 
A speedlight will take up to 5 seconds to recharge from zero to full, so if you fire off a full-power shot you'll have to wait five seconds. Two and a half seconds for half power, about one second for a quarter power, half a second for 1/8th etc. But most speedlights will fire without being fully charged, so you can get 8 x 1/8 shots in a row easily.

I set my lights up to 1/32 or 1/16, and can increase them to 1/8 if I need to, but to keep the recharge times low I just added more lights. Two lights at 1/8 = 1 light at 1/4, etc.
That makes much more sense. Didn't realize subsequent flashes weren't full power. Hmm...should try using the flash with burst on my DSLR's (Pentax) and see how it goes...not that my ancient Pentax's have very fast burst...Still, would be good to learn how to properly use a flash.

Once again, thanks for the info. Greatly appreciated :)
 
That makes much more sense. Didn't realize subsequent flashes weren't full power. Hmm...should try using the flash with burst on my DSLR's (Pentax) and see how it goes...not that my ancient Pentax's have very fast burst...Still, would be good to learn how to properly use a flash.

Once again, thanks for the info. Greatly appreciated :)
Well, to be clear, a flash won't fire if you ask it to do 1/2 and it's at 1/4 charge, but if it's at 1/4 and you want 1/16 it usually will. not always though! I had a Nissin that wouldn't do anything if it wasn't fully charged.

Works: http://nfgphoto.com
Instagram: http://instagram.com/nfgphoto
 
Last edited:
How about shooting 4K video at 30 fps?

Is there any other way to force your flashes to do 8 or 10 or even 15 flashes per second?

Provided that 8MP is enough for you, of course.
Yeah, 8mpix isn't really good enough. I did consider this though, and I figure the big problem is syncing the lights with the shutter. I can see the two drifting out of sync pretty easily.

I reckon I will give it a try though, set the camera up at full speed, remote-triggered at the same time as the lights, everything firing at 8Hz.

Or borrow dad's Oly. ;)
 
Maybe DPR should look at including burst rate flash testing into their review procedures.
 
That makes much more sense. Didn't realize subsequent flashes weren't full power. Hmm...should try using the flash with burst on my DSLR's (Pentax) and see how it goes...not that my ancient Pentax's have very fast burst...Still, would be good to learn how to properly use a flash.

Once again, thanks for the info. Greatly appreciated :)
Well, to be clear, a flash won't fire if you ask it to do 1/2 and it's at 1/4 charge, but if it's at 1/4 and you want 1/16 it usually will. not always though!
And to be clear as mud. It depends!

Some flashes (with CPU communication to the body) will only fire (or let you make a shutter activation) if they have charged enough to allow the requisite power to be delivered. Think of it as a ' correct flash power priority' mode

Other flashes will let you take a shot regardless, even if the capacitor hasn't reached full charge, the assumption being an underexposed shot is better than no shot at all. Think of it as 'shutter priority' mode.

I have a feeling that some flashes let you set this priority mode (higher end Canon models?)

FWIW. This has been a very useful thread. Its the kind of thing I do very occasionally, and I can imaging thinking "I'll try using the MFT gear today instead of the Nikons...." and getting caught out as well. One would assume that this would just work. Annoying.

I actually had to check it myself. Tried it on a GH3 and put the drive mode dial into continuous. The flash does actually fire .... but only once, as the camera disables the continuous drive (it can't stop you selecting it as its a physical knob on the GH3/4). It does therefore seem to be a deliberate operating decision forced upon you by Panasonic.

I tried it with an FL50 and also a 3rd party radio trigger. Same result.

Bugger.
 
That makes much more sense. Didn't realize subsequent flashes weren't full power. Hmm...should try using the flash with burst on my DSLR's (Pentax) and see how it goes...not that my ancient Pentax's have very fast burst...Still, would be good to learn how to properly use a flash.

Once again, thanks for the info. Greatly appreciated :)
Well, to be clear, a flash won't fire if you ask it to do 1/2 and it's at 1/4 charge, but if it's at 1/4 and you want 1/16 it usually will. not always though!
And to be clear as mud. It depends!

Some flashes (with CPU communication to the body) will only fire (or let you make a shutter activation) if they have charged enough to allow the requisite power to be delivered. Think of it as a ' correct flash power priority' mode

Other flashes will let you take a shot regardless, even if the capacitor hasn't reached full charge, the assumption being an underexposed shot is better than no shot at all. Think of it as 'shutter priority' mode.

I have a feeling that some flashes let you set this priority mode (higher end Canon models?)

FWIW. This has been a very useful thread. Its the kind of thing I do very occasionally, and I can imaging thinking "I'll try using the MFT gear today instead of the Nikons...." and getting caught out as well. One would assume that this would just work. Annoying.

I actually had to check it myself. Tried it on a GH3 and put the drive mode dial into continuous. The flash does actually fire .... but only once, as the camera disables the continuous drive (it can't stop you selecting it as its a physical knob on the GH3/4). It does therefore seem to be a deliberate operating decision forced upon you by Panasonic.

I tried it with an FL50 and also a 3rd party radio trigger. Same result.

Bugger.
that's very disappointing, from pro cameras.

cheers don
 
BUT I can't believe anyone serious would move into a shoot without testing their equipment before hand, whether it was the old tried and true set up or -- particularly -- something new.
Geez, really? It was a test session, a friend's daughter, some spare time on both sides, and I had a handful of things I wanted to try out. I didn't test them in advance because the whole point of having her come over was TO TEST THINGS. First thing failed right off the bat, so we moved on.
A test session, fine (but did you say so?). Regardless of that, you set up the camera lights, etc., and you fire off a test frame or three just to make sure you remembered to plug everything in, the wireless triggers are working, etc.

Then you know right off the bat that something is not working and you don't have to go purple-faced in front of the dancer and her mum.
No, mate, sorry, not a lot of sympathy.
I'm not looking for sympathy, I'm warning people. It is, as you agreed, a bloody weird decision by Panasonic, and I reckon other people might be interested.
Fine, and I have been warned, and appreciate that.
 
Pick up a flash with strobe/multiple flash option, job done.
Oh please read the rest of the thread before you say things that are already discussed, geez.
You need to be a whole lot more professional with your approach, arranging and setting this up without knowing your equipment, sorry there is no excuse.
WTF use is your post? You don't discuss the issues at hand and instead criticize me. I didn't ask for career advice.

As already mentioned this was a test shoot,
Was it ?

These were your own words and I`m not a mind reader.

"Today I had a ballet dancer in the studio. I had six Cactus speedlights set up, triggered from the GX8 hotshoe with a Cactus V6. This same combination works brilliantly on my Nikon D800 and I recommend it to everyone.

I was planning to use the GX8 today, instead of the D800, because it has double the framerate vs the D800 (8 vs 4) and I was going to mount the camera on a tripod, set the dancer loose and capture 8fps of flash-illuminated beauty.

The intent was to later composite the frames into single images, multi-exposure style.

Those of you who know the Panasonic M43 system well have already figured out where I went wrong, but I was floored, absolutely stunned, by Panasonic's bizarre decision:

The hotshoe is disabled in burst mode.

You can't even enter burst mode with a flash or trigger attached to the hotshoe, unless you explicitly set the flash to OFF.

Seriously considered hurling it at the floor and screaming, but for my model and their mother excitedly waiting for me to be less purple and get on with things"

we were trying new things. This was one of several things being attempted.

And the problem was surprising and, based on my fairly lengthy experience, entirely unexpected. I'm not entirely sure it's reasonable to expect someone to test this feature before arranging a session to test the results.

Thing that works on every other camera ever (as far as I know) doesn't work on this one. First attempt to test it failed. Internet users disparage OP.

=P

--
My Works: http://nfgphoto.com
Instagram: http://instagram.com/nfgphoto
 
NFG wrote

As already mentioned this was a test shoot,
Was it ?

These were your own words and I`m not a mind reader.
You're not even a reader apparently. The post immediately preceding yours:
NFG

It was a test session, a friend's daughter, some spare time on both sides, and I had a handful of things I wanted to try out. I didn't test them in advance because the whole point of having her come over was TO TEST THINGS. First thing failed right off the bat, so we moved on.
Last I checked this was not CareerReview.com. I'm sure you thought you were being helpful, but you're basically making ad-hominem attacks instead of contributing to the conversation.
 
NFG wrote

As already mentioned this was a test shoot,
Was it ?

These were your own words and I`m not a mind reader.
You're not even a reader apparently. The post immediately preceding yours:
I read in threaded view, not flat view and I was replying to your initial post, you should have made it all clear in your first post.
NFG

It was a test session, a friend's daughter, some spare time on both sides, and I had a handful of things I wanted to try out. I didn't test them in advance because the whole point of having her come over was TO TEST THINGS. First thing failed right off the bat, so we moved on.
Last I checked this was not CareerReview.com. I'm sure you thought you were being helpful, but you're basically making ad-hominem attacks instead of contributing to the conversation.

--
My Works: http://nfgphoto.com
Instagram: http://instagram.com/nfgphoto
 
I read in threaded view, not flat view and I was replying to your initial post, you should have made it all clear in your first post.
Why? You'd have just complained that my unprofessional studio uses the wrong shade of white paint on the non-standard curve of the cyc-wall.

You inferred too much, my friend. I can't help you with that.
 
Well I've been experimenting with burst node, and there seems to be no way to sync a speed light firing at 8Hz and the GX8 firing on full burst. sometimes one frame is illuminated, sometimes one and a bit, but in an 8-image sequence I can't get two frames properly lit.

Also the shutter lag using a remote is ~67ms. O_o
 
Also the shutter lag using a remote is ~67ms. O_o
I'm not countering your facts (really) and I know you are saying it's an approximate but how are you measuring such lag?
 
Also the shutter lag using a remote is ~67ms. O_o
I'm not countering your facts (really) and I know you are saying it's an approximate but how are you measuring such lag?
The Cactus RF60 light has a delay feature for situations like this. I set the camera up and increased the time by 5ms over and over until I saw the flash in the photo. Then I stepped it back 1ms at a time until I had the lowest number possible.

So I'm pretty confident about this number. =)
 
Last edited:

Keyboard shortcuts

Back
Top