Hey! Dad

Pete Cockerell said:

I'll leave the technical comments about lighting etc. to others,
but one thing I'd say is that she seemed pretty tense, especially
around the mouth. This could well be because of the tension of
trying to "get it right" that you alluded to. One thing I do when
I'm taking pics of my daughter now is the old trick of getting
her to make a funny noise, blow a raspberry etc. to loosen up her
face muscles and make her laughter/smile more natural looking. Of
course, she's only 3, but I don't see why it shouldn't work with
your daughter (who looks like a lovely lass, btw).

Cheers,
Pete

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Normally if people are tense I ask them to puff out thier cheeks and you can't help but laugh when you breath out for looking so daft. But, I cannot work now because of 4 strokes that I have suffered and it's affected my memory severly. I am chuffed if I remember to turn the camera on. I know the techniques in theory but I just forget to put them into practice when I most need them.It can be fustrating sometimes but I laugh and joke about it. ( It can also be usefull sometimes). On the plus side, I now go for a walk once a day with my camera and I have taken over 8000 pics in 3 months.
Cheers, john

pcockerell said:

John Watts said:

Could you take some photo's of me for a bit of a portfolio?.
My doughter is doing her third year as a Phsycology student, but to
pay her way ( i'm skint ) she dances on stage in a Manchester
nightclub. She has never modeled before and I have never
Photographed a model before.
So, armed with a eos10d, Sigma 28 - 105 lens, 550 ex and 420ex, 12
ft + 16ft living room,false tan, makeup that only lasts 10 mins,
and a bookcase with some black material pinned to it, off we went.
I never imagined it would be so hard. We were like two ducks out of
water, 3 hours later we decided enough was enough, You
professionals out there have my upmost admiration for the skill and
artistic flair that you must have to do this for a living.
anyway, this is the result and we were both pleased that we got
something out of the hard work we put in. These are just a few of
the 35 that we ended up with.
http://www.pbase.com/johnaline/maxine

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--
http://www.pbase.com/pcockerell
http://www.peter-cockerell.net:8080/

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J. Roberts said:

Clearly you are clueless about the modeling industry. If your
daughter takes these images into an agency, they will laugh at
them. Models are not strippers.

Regards,
J. Roberts

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Who said anything about her being a MODEL. Model to me means posing in front of a camera. Give me a break lads, I would not have posted this thread if I thought I would get so much stick. But thats the risk you take when you put your life on the internet I surpose. Please take this for what it was meant to be. An amature photographer and a daughter that wanted a few photos for some sort of portfolio. NO MOTIVES. NO EXPERIANCE. just wanted to share.
Thanks

Ignore J. Roberts.....he never has anything nice to say.

John Watts said:

J. Roberts said:

Clearly you are clueless about the modeling industry. If your
daughter takes these images into an agency, they will laugh at
them. Models are not strippers.

Regards,
J. Roberts

Click to expand...

Who said anything about her being a MODEL. Model to me means posing
in front of a camera. Give me a break lads, I would not have posted
this thread if I thought I would get so much stick. But thats the
risk you take when you put your life on the internet I surpose.
Please take this for what it was meant to be. An amature
photographer and a daughter that wanted a few photos for some sort
of portfolio. NO MOTIVES. NO EXPERIANCE. just wanted to share.
Thanks

Click to expand...

--
John

Opinions expressed are my own....if you dont like them....you're free to disregard them.

Equipment list in profile...subject to change on a daily basis ;^)

Duct tape is like the Force. It has a light side, a dark side, and it holds the universe together

Join the Mid-Atlantic DSLR group....for all DSLR Users in the Eastern PA, NJ, DE, MD areas
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlantic-dslr/join

Not erotic? Hmm, depends on the definition. One definition is "tending to arouse sexual desire".

Even though the girl in question isn't exactly my type, I'd say a few of those image were erotic.

John Mankos said:

The pictures were NOT erotic or exploitive in any way

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--
The Lowest Paid Concert Photographer Around
http://www.neonlightsimaging.com/artshow/final.htm
Photography -- just another word for compromise

'Since we can't keep crime in check, why don't we legalize it and tax it out of business?' -- Will Rogers

I guess it depends on how you look at it.

I dont consider a girl in a bikini to cause "sexual desire". Sure, I like lookin at em ;^).....but not necessarily arousing. If that was the case I'd never be able to go to the beach in a loose pair of trunks ;^) (cuz I've seen a lot skimpier outfits at the beach)

If they're in suggestive poses, touching themselves, etc.....then I'd consider it erotic...but these dont fall into that category IMHO.

DavidP said:

Even though the girl in question isn't exactly my type, I'd say a
few of those image were erotic.

John Mankos said:

The pictures were NOT erotic or exploitive in any way

Click to expand...

--
The Lowest Paid Concert Photographer Around
http://www.neonlightsimaging.com/artshow/final.htm
Photography -- just another word for compromise

'Since we can't keep crime in check, why don't we legalize it and
tax it out of business?' -- Will Rogers

Click to expand...

--
John

Opinions expressed are my own....if you dont like them....you're free to disregard them.

Equipment list in profile...subject to change on a daily basis ;^)

Duct tape is like the Force. It has a light side, a dark side, and it holds the universe together

Join the Mid-Atlantic DSLR group....for all DSLR Users in the Eastern PA, NJ, DE, MD areas
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/midatlantic-dslr/join

I think you did very well, John. Take no notice of the silly man with psychological problems. These are tastefully done shots.

John Mankos, you might not like my style, and that is your choice. However, my comments are accurate and have relevance. I am encouraging when the situation merits that approach. Perhaps if your comments had value, you would carry more weight.

J. Roberts

Dave Deacon said:

I think you did very well, John. Take no notice of the silly man
with psychological problems. These are tastefully done shots.

Click to expand...

Thanks. John.

Still think taking such pictures of one's daughter and posting them on the internet is wrong. And condoning her dancing in a club is wrong. Sure, she may very well do it any way, but nothing good can come from it. Period. Guess I'm just an old fashioned reactionary who believes that a father should protect his children, shelter them from the evils of the world, and set a good example. But then that's just me.

Bob Haverford said:

I know, I know. We're all "sophisticated" here! What's a little
objectifying suggestive photos among friends?

And what the hell is she going to use the portfolio for?

You ought to be ashamed of yourself.

John Watts said:

Could you take some photo's of me for a bit of a portfolio?.
My doughter is doing her third year as a Phsycology student, but to
pay her way ( i'm skint ) she dances on stage in a Manchester
nightclub. She has never modeled before and I have never
Photographed a model before.
So, armed with a eos10d, Sigma 28 - 105 lens, 550 ex and 420ex, 12
ft + 16ft living room,false tan, makeup that only lasts 10 mins,
and a bookcase with some black material pinned to it, off we went.
I never imagined it would be so hard. We were like two ducks out of
water, 3 hours later we decided enough was enough, You
professionals out there have my upmost admiration for the skill and
artistic flair that you must have to do this for a living.
anyway, this is the result and we were both pleased that we got
something out of the hard work we put in. These are just a few of
the 35 that we ended up with.
http://www.pbase.com/johnaline/maxine

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Technical question -- how did you mount the lights? Looks to me like they were too close together. Try one at about a 45 degree angle and look at the shadows. Cut the power on one in half, then do it the other way.

(I had to practice on a dummy's head -- much more patient and cooperative!)

You both show a lot of raw talent -- like the old saying goes, "practice, etc. etc."

As for her being "model material" she obviously is not skinny enough or stuck on herself enough to qualify.

(can you tell tonge is firmly in cheek??)

(can you tell I'm glad I've got 2 sons and no daughters!!)

Well done, and I hope she does well. (Some potential clients here)

--
Mike Caldwell
'if your only tool is a hammer, you tend to see every problem as a nail'

Bob Haverford said:

Still think taking such pictures of one's daughter and posting them
on the internet is wrong. And condoning her dancing in a club is
wrong. Sure, she may very well do it any way, but nothing good can
come from it. Period. Guess I'm just an old fashioned reactionary
who believes that a father should protect his children, shelter
them from the evils of the world, and set a good example. But then
that's just me.

Click to expand...

Guess what? Im going to let you into a little secret here. I'm a devout Christian, So is my doughter, and my wife is a priest. (just let that sink in for a min) I know this world is evil but how do you do anything about it?. You get down there with where it's happening and try to sort the problem. Not sit there and criticise. My daughter also helps to run three church youth groups.She can take care of herself in this big bad world,but ask yourself one question? what do I do to make it a better place.
Think about it
reguards john.

Bob Haverford said:

Bob Haverford said:

I know, I know. We're all "sophisticated" here! What's a little
objectifying suggestive photos among friends?

And what the hell is she going to use the portfolio for?

You ought to be ashamed of yourself.

John Watts said:

Could you take some photo's of me for a bit of a portfolio?.
My doughter is doing her third year as a Phsycology student, but to
pay her way ( i'm skint ) she dances on stage in a Manchester
nightclub. She has never modeled before and I have never
Photographed a model before.
So, armed with a eos10d, Sigma 28 - 105 lens, 550 ex and 420ex, 12
ft + 16ft living room,false tan, makeup that only lasts 10 mins,
and a bookcase with some black material pinned to it, off we went.
I never imagined it would be so hard. We were like two ducks out of
water, 3 hours later we decided enough was enough, You
professionals out there have my upmost admiration for the skill and
artistic flair that you must have to do this for a living.
anyway, this is the result and we were both pleased that we got
something out of the hard work we put in. These are just a few of
the 35 that we ended up with.
http://www.pbase.com/johnaline/maxine

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

John

1. 1) w/ lack of experience in studio work, this is a pretty good start. the lighting is way too harsh, in my opinion... if you're in your living room, you can bounce the flash to diffuse it, or since you're experimenting anyway, try shooting the flash through a white bedsheet to soften the light... by simply doing this, you'll see dramatic improvement.

1. 2) expression... i agree, she seems a little tense... make her laugh to loosen her up more (not saying to shoot her laughing, but it'll loosen her up). another idea, besides puffing her cheeks (i like that one), is to have her close her eyes, thing of something funny, & then when she's ready, "come back" to you... that will generally make someone laugh... & if not, as her father you should be able to think of something.

1. 3) ethics discussed above... ok, so I'm kind of conventional in thinking you shouldn't get a semi-direct breast shot of your daughter, but it's not that bad. She's an adult, and it's very respectable that you two have a relationship open enough to do a fashion shoot like this. Had she been a teenager, it'd be a different story.

nice work & keep practicing!

peace,
~ scott

Don't mind the nasty comments. Although I don't think I could look at my daughter (errr...if I had one) objectively enough to decide what where the best parts, etc.; I tend to have very rose-coloured glasses in those cases.

Anyway, pretty good for the first try out. You might want to try some different clothes. -4 in particular makes her a bit more formless then she actually is. She seems to have a slightly large rib-cage, so you want to be careful to not over-emphasize her ribs; was she sucking in her stomach? The bikini shots are quite nice, but a top which moved less to the side and made a little more cleavage might be good and would give her more bodily form. Obviously she is not the super-thin runway type, so might as well play up the curves angle (which I think most people prefer anyway).

I strongly disagree with the "stripper" comments, but these might be a little more on the "glamour" side then you would like, depending on the target customer. Actually, just probably a good idea to get a little more variety. She is quite pretty so I think she could do the more tame "blond next door" look pretty well to, not to mention the cowgirl, etc. variety is the spice of work. Not that I ever had a girl that pretty next door to me, but we all wish we did...

Good work, hope you can share your follow-up work with use too and ignore the harsher posters.

John Watts said:

Could you take some photo's of me for a bit of a portfolio?.
My doughter is doing her third year as a Phsycology student, but to
pay her way ( i'm skint ) she dances on stage in a Manchester
nightclub. She has never modeled before and I have never
Photographed a model before.
So, armed with a eos10d, Sigma 28 - 105 lens, 550 ex and 420ex, 12
ft + 16ft living room,false tan, makeup that only lasts 10 mins,
and a bookcase with some black material pinned to it, off we went.
I never imagined it would be so hard. We were like two ducks out of
water, 3 hours later we decided enough was enough, You
professionals out there have my upmost admiration for the skill and
artistic flair that you must have to do this for a living.
anyway, this is the result and we were both pleased that we got
something out of the hard work we put in. These are just a few of
the 35 that we ended up with.
http://www.pbase.com/johnaline/maxine

Click to expand...

As the daughter of a photographer, I doubt that I would have been comfortable enough when I was that age to strike those poses in front of dear old Dad and not have been visibly tense. Of course, my father was always chasing us around the house with the camera and probably would have been thrilled if I'd asked him to take shots for a portfolio and then actually stayed still long enough for the poses.

I liked Maxine-2 with the wind and bangles blowing. I think there's some artistic flair to that one. Also liked the b/w one.

Otherwise, I'm just an unqualified newbie, so won't comment on the technical stuff, other than to agree with the comments on the lighting.

• nancy

John Watts said:

Could you take some photo's of me for a bit of a portfolio?.
My doughter is doing her third year as a Phsycology student, but to
pay her way ( i'm skint ) she dances on stage in a Manchester
nightclub. She has never modeled before and I have never
Photographed a model before.
So, armed with a eos10d, Sigma 28 - 105 lens, 550 ex and 420ex, 12
ft + 16ft living room,false tan, makeup that only lasts 10 mins,
and a bookcase with some black material pinned to it, off we went.
I never imagined it would be so hard. We were like two ducks out of
water, 3 hours later we decided enough was enough, You
professionals out there have my upmost admiration for the skill and
artistic flair that you must have to do this for a living.
anyway, this is the result and we were both pleased that we got
something out of the hard work we put in. These are just a few of
the 35 that we ended up with.
http://www.pbase.com/johnaline/maxine

Click to expand...

I thought #1 and #7 (#1 to a much larger degree) is fairly "suggestive".

No, it's not THAT high on a scale of 1 to 10. But it's not just a "here I stand in my bikini" pose (rating 0 on 1 to 10 -- lol) either.

As to how "arousing" it is, I guess that would totally depend on the girl.

Yeah, I've seen a lot skimpier outfits, too. And I'd say I generally find those "arousing". LOL.

John Mankos said:

I guess it depends on how you look at it.

I dont consider a girl in a bikini to cause "sexual desire". Sure,
I like lookin at em ;^).....but not necessarily arousing. If that
was the case I'd never be able to go to the beach in a loose pair
of trunks ;^) (cuz I've seen a lot skimpier outfits at the beach)

If they're in suggestive poses, touching themselves, etc.....then
I'd consider it erotic...but these dont fall into that category
IMHO.

Click to expand...

--
The Lowest Paid Concert Photographer Around
http://www.neonlightsimaging.com/artshow/final.htm
Photography -- just another word for compromise

'Since we can't keep crime in check, why don't we legalize it and tax it out of business?' -- Will Rogers

hadley said:

As the daughter of a photographer, I doubt that I would have been
comfortable enough when I was that age to strike those poses in
front of dear old Dad and not have been visibly tense. Of course,
my father was always chasing us around the house with the camera
and probably would have been thrilled if I'd asked him to take
shots for a portfolio and then actually stayed still long enough
for the poses.

I liked Maxine-2 with the wind and bangles blowing. I think
there's some artistic flair to that one. Also liked the b/w one.

Otherwise, I'm just an unqualified newbie, so won't comment on the
technical stuff, other than to agree with the comments on the
lighting.

• nancy

Click to expand...

It's not easy being a dad but as a friend also we had a laugh taking these photos.I am totally inexperianced at taking these sort of shots. As for the technical stuff, I have had some helpfull tips on this thread and they are much appreciated. I just hope that I remember them. But because of the few who think I am wrong and not fit to be a father taking these sort of shots of my daughter I think I will stick to Nature, You know, Animals killing each other and mating in public. Its a funny old world !.
God bless
John.

I agree totally with you man! I dont have any kids, but if I did i would support them in whateva they choose to do in life.

These pics are not nude or in any way below board!!

GREAT PICS!! BEAUTIFUL MODEL/Daughter

DONT WORRY ABOUT THE TROLL!!

keep up the good work buddy!

John Watts said:

Bob Haverford said:

Can't believe you'd take such pictures of your own daughter.
Listen, I'm no prude, but I'd NEVER take such exploitive pictures
of my daughter. Furhtermore I'd NEVER let her dance in a
nightclub. Just what do you think might happen?

I know, I know. We're all "sophisticated" here! What's a little
objectifying suggestive photos among friends?

And what the hell is she going to use the portfolio for?

You ought to be ashamed of yourself.

First, Let me say that my doughter is 21 years old.( Its her life now )

Click to expand...

2nd, She is not topless or nude. A portfolio of any description
costs a lot of money, especially for a student. who would you
rather have do the photos, yourself or some guy in a studio
somewhere. As for the club thing. I have checked it out and she
dances on a stage well back from the main dancefloor and she is
fully clothed. She enjoys life. Do you ?.
As for the portfolio, she works for Red Bull doing promotional work
at various events around the country.To do this sort of work
requires photos to send off to other agencies. I'm afraid a holiday
snap holding an ice cream
and a kiss me quick hat won't cut the mustard here.
At least I know what MY daughter is up to. I do take an interest in
her life and try as I might to give her advice. ( not that she
hears me most of the time.) How about this!. We go to church as
well. Seems to me that it is only you that has a problem here. What
went through YOUR mind when you saw the pictures?.

Click to expand...

Bro for your first time taking these types of pics.. they are great!!

Dont let the minority get their way mate!! If you do they win!!

you must be extremely proud to have such a lovely dayghter! Keep working at it!!

John Watts said:

hadley said:

As the daughter of a photographer, I doubt that I would have been
comfortable enough when I was that age to strike those poses in
front of dear old Dad and not have been visibly tense. Of course,
my father was always chasing us around the house with the camera
and probably would have been thrilled if I'd asked him to take
shots for a portfolio and then actually stayed still long enough
for the poses.

I liked Maxine-2 with the wind and bangles blowing. I think
there's some artistic flair to that one. Also liked the b/w one.

Otherwise, I'm just an unqualified newbie, so won't comment on the
technical stuff, other than to agree with the comments on the
lighting.

• nancy

Click to expand...

It's not easy being a dad but as a friend also we had a laugh
taking these photos.I am totally inexperianced at taking these sort
of shots. As for the technical stuff, I have had some helpfull tips
on this thread and they are much appreciated. I just hope that I
remember them. But because of the few who think I am wrong and not
fit to be a father taking these sort of shots of my daughter I
think I will stick to Nature, You know, Animals killing each other
and mating in public. Its a funny old world !.
God bless
John.

Click to expand...

John Watts said:

Guess what? Im going to let you into a little secret here. I'm a
devout Christian, So is my doughter, and my wife is a priest. (just
let that sink in for a min)

Click to expand...

Sorry, devout Christians don't dance in night clubs. My daughter's school doesn't even allow dancing (BTW, even I consider that particular restriction ridiculous!). And no Christian church I've ever been a member of allows for a woman priest. I've always considered the Episcopalians to be an "anything goes" type of watered down Christian-lite. Say, where in the Bible does it say that women should be priests? Oh, that's right! A Christianity unfettered by the Bible! Or Christ for that matter. Sort of like a United States unfettered by a pesky thing known as a Constitution!

Listen, I'm pulling your chain a little here, but I still stand by my original statement that taking and posting pictures of your daughter scantily clad in poses that at the very least objectify her is a disservice to her and unbecoming of you. Obviously I live in a world and participate in a forum where my opinions are no longer mainstream.