XF 18-55 still better than the XF 16-55

The 16-55 is still one stop brighter at 55mm, which can make all the difference when trying to keep your shutter speed up.
Well, the question is whether OIS on the kit lens all but invalidates that particular advantage. That's not to say that the 16-55 doesn't have some distinct advantages of its own, including the DOF advantage at longer FLs and 2mm wider FL, etc.
OIS only helps with static subjects. One stop more light can be the difference between 1/30 and 1/60 in a dark venue.

--
www.darngoodphotos.com
Again, that's not entirely true.

Take the 90mm F2. You'll need to shoot at 1/120 or faster to avoid camera shake. But, if that lens had OIS, you could shoot at 1/60 and drop the ISO by a whole stop.

35mm is roughly the "break even" point for OIS's benefit for moving subjects on aps-c, since you have to shoot at 1/60 (more or less) anyway to freeze people. Below that, it's not much help. Above that, does help, at equivalent apertures.

Of course, the faster things move, the less important OIS is.
I agree about the 90, and I forgot about it helping with longer focal lengths, but we're discussing zooms that top out at 55mm. I like having OIS on my 55-200.

--
www.darngoodphotos.com
 
Last edited:
The 16-55 is still one stop brighter at 55mm, which can make all the difference when trying to keep your shutter speed up.
Well, the question is whether OIS on the kit lens all but invalidates that particular advantage. That's not to say that the 16-55 doesn't have some distinct advantages of its own, including the DOF advantage at longer FLs and 2mm wider FL, etc.
OIS only helps with static subjects. One stop more light can be the difference between 1/30 and 1/60 in a dark venue.
 
The 16-55 is still one stop brighter at 55mm, which can make all the difference when trying to keep your shutter speed up.
Well, the question is whether OIS on the kit lens all but invalidates that particular advantage. That's not to say that the 16-55 doesn't have some distinct advantages of its own, including the DOF advantage at longer FLs and 2mm wider FL, etc.
OIS only helps with static subjects. One stop more light can be the difference between 1/30 and 1/60 in a dark venue.
Again, that's not entirely true.

Take the 90mm F2. You'll need to shoot at 1/120 or faster to avoid camera shake. But, if that lens had OIS, you could shoot at 1/60 and drop the ISO by a whole stop.

35mm is roughly the "break even" point for OIS's benefit for moving subjects on aps-c, since you have to shoot at 1/60 (more or less) anyway to freeze people. Below that, it's not much help. Above that, does help, at equivalent apertures.

Of course, the faster things move, the less important OIS is.
I agree about the 90, and I forgot about it helping with longer focal lengths, but we're discussing zooms that top out at 55mm. I like having OIS on my 55-200.
True. But if the 16-55 had OIS, you could capture moving subjects @ 55mm at 1/60 of second instead of 1/100, allowing lower ISO.
Good point.
 
Anyway, as has been stated, it's good to have options and I can see the appeal of the 16-55. I'll probably have one eventually, but not before the 16mm F1.4, or the 150-400.
Would be a good way to meet... you'll recognize me as the tired looking guy at the head of the line at Pro Photo Supply waiting for the 100-400. :-) :-)
 
Anyway, as has been stated, it's good to have options and I can see the appeal of the 16-55. I'll probably have one eventually, but not before the 16mm F1.4, or the 150-400.
Would be a good way to meet... you'll recognize me as the tired looking guy at the head of the line at Pro Photo Supply waiting for the 100-400. :-) :-)
Hope we do meet some time!
 
nd again. That's why they’re called revolutions" T. Pratchett, OBE, RIP.
Right, as I said, the OIS will do nothing to freeze motion of a moving object, it only helps with camera shake. That is it, it can have no effect over the motion of a moving object.
But I can still shoot moving action at a lower ISO with IOS than I can without, depending on the focal length and aperture of the lens.

--
"Don’t put your trust in revolutions. They always come around again. That's why they’re called revolutions" T. Pratchett, OBE, RIP.
The OIS has no bearing on that whatsoever, you still need (x) shutter speed to freeze motion. OIS doesn't change that. I love image stabilization, I have shot Canon for years and love my 70-200 f4 L IS lens, the IS is fantastic, but it still has no effect on a moving subject, only the camera shake.
 
Last edited:
nd again. That's why they’re called revolutions" T. Pratchett, OBE, RIP.
Right, as I said, the OIS will do nothing to freeze motion of a moving object, it only helps with camera shake. That is it, it can have no effect over the motion of a moving object.
But I can still shoot moving action at a lower ISO with IOS than I can without, depending on the focal length and aperture of the lens.
 
The OIS has no bearing on that whatsoever, you still need (x) shutter speed to freeze motion. OIS doesn't change that. I love image stabilization, I have shot Canon for years and love my 70-200 f4 L IS lens, the IS is fantastic, but it still has no effect on a moving subject, only the camera shake.
Right. So, OIS affects everything in the scene that isn't moving. In situations where the shutter speed needed to eliminate camera shake is faster than the shutter speed needed to freeze the motion, OIS will allow a lower shutter speed and therefore more light on the sensor.

--
http://georgehudetzphotography.smugmug.com/
My Flikr stream: http://flic.kr/ps/Ay8ka
OIS affects everything, but you still need (x) shutter speed to freeze a moving subject. If a person is walking across the filed of view, 1/15 of a second isn't going to freeze the motion, but OIS may prevent blur from camera shake at, say 55mm focal length. OIS only cancels out the movement of the camera, not something actually moving in the scene.

And OIS is great for travel when you don't want to carry a tripod. It isn't a complete replacement for a tripod though, but it does a great job.
 
Last edited:
Anyway, as has been stated, it's good to have options and I can see the appeal of the 16-55. I'll probably have one eventually, but not before the 16mm F1.4, or the 150-400.
Would be a good way to meet... you'll recognize me as the tired looking guy at the head of the line at Pro Photo Supply waiting for the 100-400. :-) :-)
Hope we do meet some time!
Me too, George. I always enjoy your posts.
 
The OIS has no bearing on that whatsoever, you still need (x) shutter speed to freeze motion. OIS doesn't change that. I love image stabilization, I have shot Canon for years and love my 70-200 f4 L IS lens, the IS is fantastic, but it still has no effect on a moving subject, only the camera shake.
Right. So, OIS affects everything in the scene that isn't moving. In situations where the shutter speed needed to eliminate camera shake is faster than the shutter speed needed to freeze the motion, OIS will allow a lower shutter speed and therefore more light on the sensor.
 
You are completely missing the point.

Sometimes the shutter speed required to freeze motion is lower than the shutter speed required to avoid camera shake. This frequently happens with telephoto lenses.

I need about 1/100s to shoot a rock concert with a D800 and 200mm lens.

But I need at least 1/200s to prevent camera shake.

--
"Don’t put your trust in revolutions. They always come around again. That's why they’re called revolutions" T. Pratchett, OBE, RIP.
Sorry, not missing the point. We have been discussing the 18-55 vs 16-55. If you are talking about a 200mm lens then on occasion it can help, but not by much with moving objects. I just shot a bunch the other day at 1/1/25 second of people on stage, that still isn't enough to completely freeze the motion of the people on stage at times, I bumped to to 1/250. I shoot that type of scene often, I can get away with 1/60 a lot of the time, but get a lot of blur from their hands and head. Unless they are stationary 1/125 is the slowest that works decently at 200mm. You will still see more apparent motion blur using a longer focal length that with a shorter focal length. It all depends on the size of the moving object in comparison to the image size. Star trails are a good example. You can shoot the night sky with a short focal length like a 23mm at a longer shutter speed without noticing the star trails as much as the same shutter speed with a longer focal length like a 200mm. As the focal length get longer, and your subject gets larger in the image, the motion blur will be more apparent.

I am an entertainer and shoot other entertainers on stage often. Unless you are shooting a petty reading the people will be moving, and you will get blur that OIS won't help. I shoot a lot of stand up comics and even with them I can get blur at 1/60 or even 1/125. At small enlargements it won't be an issue, but as you make the print bigger, it will show up.

As far at the 18-55 or 16-55 range goes, OIS won't make any real difference in that situation. That is what I was commenting on specifically. At 200mm it can help in some situations, as I said, I shoot a lot with a 70-200 F4 L IS Canon.
 
Last edited:
You are completely missing the point.

Sometimes the shutter speed required to freeze motion is lower than the shutter speed required to avoid camera shake. This frequently happens with telephoto lenses.

I need about 1/100s to shoot a rock concert with a D800 and 200mm lens.

But I need at least 1/200s to prevent camera shake.
 
Another option if you already have the 18-55 f2.8-f4 zoom - buy the 50-140 f2.8 zoom and you get OIS too! What a great combination.
 
I am an entertainer and shoot other entertainers on stage often. Unless you are shooting a petty reading the people will be moving, and you will get blur that OIS won't help. I shoot a lot of stand up comics and even with them I can get blur at 1/60 or even 1/125. At small enlargements it won't be an issue, but as you make the print bigger, it will show up.
As far at the 18-55 or 16-55 range goes, OIS won't make any real difference in that situation. That is what I was commenting on specifically. At 200mm it can help in some situations, as I said, I shoot a lot with a 70-200 F4 L IS Canon.
So it isn't true for ALL action with ALL lenses, which is all I was saying.
 
I am an entertainer and shoot other entertainers on stage often. Unless you are shooting a petty reading the people will be moving, and you will get blur that OIS won't help. I shoot a lot of stand up comics and even with them I can get blur at 1/60 or even 1/125. At small enlargements it won't be an issue, but as you make the print bigger, it will show up.
As far at the 18-55 or 16-55 range goes, OIS won't make any real difference in that situation. That is what I was commenting on specifically. At 200mm it can help in some situations, as I said, I shoot a lot with a 70-200 F4 L IS Canon.
So it isn't true for ALL action with ALL lenses, which is all I was saying.

--
"Don’t put your trust in revolutions. They always come around again. That's why they’re called revolutions" T. Pratchett, OBE, RIP.
I am not saying it helps much at all, in fact it doesn't help a lot. There isn't much action you can freeze with 1/100 second. When I shoot people on stage, their hand movement is often blurred with 1/100 second at 200mm. I did conceded it can help in some cases, but those cases are very few and extremely specific. You would be better off with a faster lens to higher ISO.
You have a specific use in mind. I was arguing against the general point. I concede your premise applies at shorter focal lengths, but becomes less true for longer ones, particularly given the resolution of modern cameras. A point you appear to concede also.

We are not disagreeing fundamentally, and I suspect the relevance to each of us will be different depending on the subject matter we typically shoot.

So, no need to argue further I suspect.

--
"Don’t put your trust in revolutions. They always come around again. That's why they’re called revolutions" T. Pratchett, OBE, RIP.
 
Last edited:

Keyboard shortcuts

Back
Top