Panasonic is on the ball!

Wasabi Bob · Aug 5, 2015

Looks like Panasonic is really getting their act together. This morning they released new lens firmware to enable Dual IS for the GX8. This afternoon I just installed the latest Adobe Camera RAW 9.1.1 which added support for the GX8. Maybe the typical wait for RAW support is over!

s_grins · Aug 5, 2015

Wasabi Bob said:
Looks like Panasonic is really getting their act together. This morning they released new lens firmware to enable Dual IS for the GX8. This afternoon I just installed the latest Adobe Camera RAW 9.1.1 which added support for the GX8. Maybe the typical wait for RAW support is over!

Hey, can you post the link to lens firmware update?

Thank you in advance.

Wasabi Bob · Aug 5, 2015

This will only be an advantage for GX8 owners.

Gbone · Aug 5, 2015

The LUMIX app has been updated to include GX8.

Aleo Veuliah · Aug 6, 2015

Yes, they are a great company, from my experience with Panasonic (even non photography products) I can only say good about them.

Wasabi Bob · Aug 10, 2015

I really did not want to turn this into a debate, but it’s difficult not to when all the facts are not presented for consideration. The reality is that some form of shutter shock exists on all cameras. We call it shutter shock and the D-SLR guys call it mirror slap. Some have suggested that the solution is to implement the EFCS (Electronic First Curtain Shutter). As with any product / feature there are pros and cons.

For the EFCS Shutter

PROS

- Less audible shutter noise.

- Less lag between trigger and shutter actuation.

- Less overall camera vibration from the inertia of the shutter.

CONS

- Exposure issues with some 3rd party lenses - It has to do with shutter lag being required so the iris can close down properly during an exposure.

- Uneven wear on the shutter which can eventually cause mechanical issues after the camera has aged.

- Some mirrorless cameras implement electronic first curtain shutter (EFCS) to reduce the shutter shock, however EFCS causes non-uniformity of luminance for high speed shutter. This is why the fastest shutter speed of E-M5 Mark II with EFCS is limited to 1/320 sec.

- Often more sensor noise because images often end up under exposed because of the iris issue.

- Often issues with high speed motion on high speed shutters.

So regarding the testing that was referenced earlier in this thread, any testing can be done to show or not show what you are looking for – it just depends what your agenda is. Longer lens tend to show it more, but not if you follow shutter speed guidelines that have been taught for years – your minimum shutter speed = 1/ lens focal length (35mm format). When I’m shooting my 100-300 (which is equivalent to 200-600mm). I use Shutter priority set to 1/250. I enable OIS (which gives me a solid 2 EV of correction), and I no longer worry about shutter shock.

Once we all realize and accept the fact that there is no perfect camera, we can all enjoy our cameras for what we bought them for – to take photos. If I listened to the movie and restaurant critics I’d never go out to dinner or go to the movies. I ignored their opinions and formed my own.

SpinOne · Aug 10, 2015

Wasabi Bob said:
I really did not want to turn this into a debate, but it’s difficult not to when all the facts are not presented for consideration. The reality is that some form of shutter shock exists on all cameras. We call it shutter shock and the D-SLR guys call it mirror slap.

Yeah, it's really not the same thing.

Mirror slap generally has a bigger impact as the shutter speeds are slow. If you're shooting a 1/320, you should not see much effect from the mirror slap.

Wasabi Bob said:
Some have suggested that the solution is to implement the EFCS (Electronic First Curtain Shutter). As with any product / feature there are pros and cons.

Fuji doesn't seem to have any SS issues. Care to explain?

Wasabi Bob said:
Longer lens tend to show it more....

I've seen it in focal lengths 12mm - 30mm.

Wasabi Bob said:
Once we all realize and accept the fact that there is no perfect camera, we can all enjoy our cameras for what we bought them for – to take photos.

True, but that's no excuse for a manufacturer shipping a new product that loses critical sharpness at multiple shutter speeds. That's just nonsense.

Tom Caldwell · Aug 10, 2015

Wasabi Bob said:
Looks like Panasonic is really getting their act together. This morning they released new lens firmware to enable Dual IS for the GX8. This afternoon I just installed the latest Adobe Camera RAW 9.1.1 which added support for the GX8. Maybe the typical wait for RAW support is over!

So much so that one day they might give the extra firmware features released with the GM5 to GM1 owners?

Old Listener · Aug 10, 2015

SpinOne said:
Wasabi Bob said:

I really did not want to turn this into a debate, but it’s difficult not to when all the facts are not presented for consideration. The reality is that some form of shutter shock exists on all cameras. We call it shutter shock and the D-SLR guys call it mirror slap.

Click to expand...

Yeah, it's really not the same thing.

Mirror slap generally has a bigger impact as the shutter speeds are slow. If you're shooting a 1/320, you should not see much effect from the mirror slap.

SpinOne said:

Some have suggested that the solution is to implement the EFCS (Electronic First Curtain Shutter). As with any product / feature there are pros and cons.

Click to expand...

Fuji doesn't seem to have any SS issues. Care to explain?

SpinOne said:

Longer lens tend to show it more....

Click to expand...

I've seen it in focal lengths 12mm - 30mm.

SpinOne said:

Once we all realize and accept the fact that there is no perfect camera, we can all enjoy our cameras for what we bought them for – to take photos.

Click to expand...

True, but that's no excuse for a manufacturer shipping a new product that loses critical sharpness at multiple shutter speeds. That's just nonsense.

Panasonic has had eShutter for some time.

Were you equally upset when Olympus shipped the E-M5 with no remedy for shutter shock?

rashid7 · Aug 10, 2015

I believe the GMx EFCS is an inherent trait of its shutter and cannot be implemented via Firmware.

Also using shutter spd > the reciprocal of FF equiv focal length only works w/ extremely long lenses. Anything less than 100mm m4/3 would put u into the SS zone.

Wasabi Bob · Aug 11, 2015

SpinOne said:
True, but that's no excuse for a manufacturer shipping a new product that loses critical sharpness at multiple shutter speeds. That's just nonsense.

In actual use, it's never presented me with any problem. With any product, if you want to find something to complain about, you can. The nature of such on line discussions is to complain, find some issue to justify why your camera choice is better than some one else's. Don't get me wrong, it might exist but it's no where as big a deal as people exaggerate it to be.

Wasabi Bob · Aug 11, 2015

Tom Caldwell said:
So much so that one day they might give the extra firmware features released with the GM5 to GM1 owners?

s_grins · Aug 11, 2015

SpinOne said:
Wasabi Bob said:

I really did not want to turn this into a debate, but it’s difficult not to when all the facts are not presented for consideration. The reality is that some form of shutter shock exists on all cameras. We call it shutter shock and the D-SLR guys call it mirror slap.

Click to expand...

Yeah, it's really not the same thing.

Mirror slap generally has a bigger impact as the shutter speeds are slow. If you're shooting a 1/320, you should not see much effect from the mirror slap.

SpinOne said:

Some have suggested that the solution is to implement the EFCS (Electronic First Curtain Shutter). As with any product / feature there are pros and cons.

Click to expand...

Fuji doesn't seem to have any SS issues. Care to explain?

SpinOne said:

Longer lens tend to show it more....

Click to expand...

I've seen it in focal lengths 12mm - 30mm.

SpinOne said:

Once we all realize and accept the fact that there is no perfect camera, we can all enjoy our cameras for what we bought them for – to take photos.

Click to expand...

True, but that's no excuse for a manufacturer shipping a new product that loses critical sharpness at multiple shutter speeds. That's just nonsense.

Come on!!!

All sample photos - DPR gallery and outside - do not show any, ANY! loss of critical sharpness.

Stop BS.

Gregm61 · Aug 11, 2015

Wasabi Bob said:
Looks like Panasonic is really getting their act together. This morning they released new lens firmware to enable Dual IS for the GX8. This afternoon I just installed the latest Adobe Camera RAW 9.1.1 which added support for the GX8. Maybe the typical wait for RAW support is over!

As a subscription platform, Adobe should be offering updates, fast and furious all the time. They seem to, but I think the GX8 probably also just hit the market at the "right" time in terms of getting onto Adobe's update schedule earlier instead of later.

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