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Did Sony just kill the A7s ?

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Alpha Photo

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The new A7rii has such amazing specs in every respect, I find it hard to even imagine what the A7sii should look like. Let's say they bring up the pixels to 16MP. What will they have to do on the video side to make up for for the lack of MP?

- 8K? Anyone need or can even use that?

- 10-bit internal 4K? Is that significant enough?

- Even better high ISO?

What video improvement would make you consider an A7sii over the A7rii ?
 
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a7s still has its advantages:

* 1080p oversample video. （On a7RII the oversample mode is only available @ 4K）

* -4EV low light auto focus ability.

And it's cheaper than a7RII. Hope SONY will decide to lower the price of a7s so that it won't be killed by a7RII ;-)
 
I recently paid good money for A7S. But all these feature on A7rII really make me jealous.

RAGE RAGE RAGE.At least i can shoot in the dark.

I do not know why i want to shoot in the dark, but at least i can still shoot in the dark.

I am still happy about my A7s, because this is the only camera to shoot in the dark.
 
Nope A7S still has better low light sensitivity and can do full pixel read out in full frame for HD and 4K via an external recorder. The A7RII can only do full pixel read out in crop mode.
 
Agreed. The A7S was designed as a high-end video camera with still photo, I think, as a bonus. Everyone I know that has the A7S uses it, almost exclusively, for video.

The previous posters are correct... the A7S still beats the 7II in low light sensitivity. As much as I would really like 4K internal recording, I am not willing to give up all the benefits of a Full Frame sensor to get it. You have to go to the Super-35 (essentialy APS-C) to not only get 4K, but to get a full pixel readout free of moire and aliasing. THAT is where the A7S shines

I bought the 28-135mm lens for my A7S, knowing that I would get, actually, 28-135. For about 2.5x the money I could have bought the FS7 camera with the 28-135 lens, but the lens would have been far less useful as a 42-202mm lens using the FS7's smaller Super35mm sensor.

MY ideal camera would be to take the A7S (or A7SII) guts and put it in a true video camera form-factor. But there is no way Sony would do that... it would kill off the $8,000-range FS7.

I love all the attributes of a total full-frame sensor for video -- the shallow DoF, the extra sensitivity from a low pixel sensor, the "real" 35mm focal lengths.
 
Interesting. I was (theoretically) aware about the full frame read-out of the A7s. But not being into video all that much, I wasn't aware that this is so much of a (practical) issue that users of the A7s don't feel tempted by the A7rii.

Will be interesting to see how the A7sii will up the ante.
 
High ISO video will not be as good on the A7RII.

The A7S can shoot full frame (16:9) 4K video without the need for line skipping or pixel binning.
 
Alpha Photo said:
The new A7rii has such amazing specs in every respect, I find it hard to even imagine what the A7sii should look like. Let's say they bring up the pixels to 16MP. What will they have to do on the video side to make up for for the lack of MP?

- 8K? Anyone need or can even use that?

- 10-bit internal 4K? Is that significant enough?

- Even better high ISO?

What video improvement would make you consider an A7sii over the A7rii ?
Click to expand...
That's a good question. I personally believe the answer is Yes. Not because of ordinary improvements (ISO, MP, 8 or 10 bit, 4k, etc.), but because A7s doesn't have the new revolutionary PDAF to take advantage of high-performance Canon AF lenses.

Have Sony killed the A7II too?, would be a valid question too. But the real question would be; is this new PDAF mature enough to kill all pre-A7rII models? It may need some time to mature, but if it's mature enough, now you can use high-performance Canon lenses (and probably other brands too) and that's a big game changer. A new Sony strategy that would change the whole concept of "lens", price, quality, options, etc, that would shape the future.
 
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I don't think the A7ii got "killed" because of the enormous price differential between A7ii and A7rii.

On the other hand, the to be expected A7sii will also be around $3k, if not more.... so I question what specs should such a camera bring, to be competitive with A7rii...?
 
Alpha Photo said:
I don't think the A7ii got "killed" because of the enormous price differential between A7ii and A7rii.

On the other hand, the to be expected A7sii will also be around $3k, if not more.... so I question what specs should such a camera bring, to be competitive with A7rii...?
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It needs this new revolutionary PDAF + IBIS, plus the ordinary/expected improvements for a new generation.
 
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Stephen787 said:
I recently paid good money for A7S. But all these feature on A7rII really make me jealous.

RAGE RAGE RAGE.At least i can shoot in the dark.

I do not know why i want to shoot in the dark, but at least i can still shoot in the dark.

I am still happy about my A7s, because this is the only camera to shoot in the dark.
Click to expand...
Stephen, its all about the dark. Glad to see we're all keeping our sense of humor.
 
Steve W said:
Stephen, its all about the dark. Glad to see we're all keeping our sense of humor.
Click to expand...
The only camera the ghostbuster or ghosthunter need for their job. I am proud to use the camera that the elites use.

Yes Sir lee.

Ok, i am broke. I have no more money for A7rii.

I can't sell it, everyone going after A7rii.
 
Alpha Photo said:
The new A7rii has such amazing specs in every respect, I find it hard to even imagine what the A7sii should look like. Let's say they bring up the pixels to 16MP. What will they have to do on the video side to make up for for the lack of MP?

- 8K? Anyone need or can even use that?

- 10-bit internal 4K? Is that significant enough?

- Even better high ISO?

What video improvement would make you consider an A7sii over the A7rii ?
Click to expand...
A A7SII would have a BSI sensor with copper connecting layer, giving 3.5 times the readout speed. This will allow for a higher mega pixel sensor and cooler operation. The ISO performance could be even better the the A7S with internal FF 4K recording ability.
 
npires said:
Nope A7S still has better low light sensitivity and can do full pixel read out in full frame for HD and 4K via an external recorder. The A7RII can only do full pixel read out in crop mode
Click to expand...
This.

Add in the new AF, IBIS and internal 4k on the new body and the A7sII will be a hot commodity. Full pixel readout in 4k, recorded internally, while shooting FF would be huge.

Build it.
 
True - but how is it different from A7rii? What will distinguish the A7sii from the rii to make up for having much lower pixel count? Maybe 960fps 4K would be it???
 
The Straw Man said:
npires said:
Nope A7S still has better low light sensitivity and can do full pixel read out in full frame for HD and 4K via an external recorder. The A7RII can only do full pixel read out in crop mode
Click to expand...
This.

Add in the new AF, IBIS and internal 4k on the new body and the A7sII will be a hot commodity. Full pixel readout in 4k, recorded internally, while shooting FF would be huge.

Build it.
Click to expand...
I think the A7S is CDAF only on its large pixel sensor. I guess it's a technical question of how portable A7RII's AF system is to the A7S concept.
 
Alpha Photo said:
True - but how is it different from A7rii? What will distinguish the A7sii from the rii to make up for having much lower pixel count? Maybe 960fps 4K would be it???
Click to expand...
Well the faster readout from the new sensor would lend itself to higher framerates in 4k and 1080p. Cleaner 4k would be the big thing with full sensor readout - no moire or aliasing when shooting FF. Right now you have to shoot crop on the A7rII to get that.
 
Alpha Photo said:
True - but how is it different from A7rii? What will distinguish the A7sii from the rii to make up for having much lower pixel count? Maybe 960fps 4K would be it???
Click to expand...
Full pixel read out HD and 4K internally.
 
This is interesting, because I just saw an interview with product manager Kenta Honjo at the A7RII release that got me thinking.

Loading…

www.newsshooter.com

In it he talks about how the A7RII is all of the other A7 cameras rolled into one, saying "before we had specialty cameras...", which suggests this is the camera to do everything.

Then he says, "the sensor technology goes even beyond that with the RX100" going into how the on chip DRAM allow that camera to do 960fps video for super slow motion.

My take is that he can't tip the company's hand on what the A7SII will be capable of, but indirectly he's done just that. Given the substantially lower megapixel count, the A7SII will be able to do even more with the stacked sensor/copper wire technology, upping fps for video, eliminating the rolling shutter, etc.

Add in the hybrid AF for full integration with the existing A-mount SSM line.

Could we also see... touch screen?

I'm sure there are a lot of people more knowledgeable about video who can shine a light on what that increased data processing will mean on the new camera.

It certainly isn't dead, but they won't say anything more until enough of the A7RII sales are in the bag.
 
7rii already has internal 4K. Is full pixel full frame read-out such a biggie, that it would justify having only 12MP instead 42? Is that a fair trade-off? I really wonder...
 
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