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Sony future strategy just announced...

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To me, the "real" news is:
  • 7 or 8 new e-mount lenses
  • Lens business is growing to roughly 20 to 25 % of their still business, so they can no longer spit on it (hence the acceleration)
Expensive lenses are a problem indeed, but I think that we are migrating to some extent from interchangeable lens to interchangeable camera. For the price of a decent lens, I will be able to purchase one decent FF or two aps-c cameras, thereby doubling the focal lengths of each of my lenses: 20/30, 55/73, 90/135, 135/200, 200/300 mm...

Next step might be a super compact e-mount camera with a 1" sensor (28 Mpx, the next generation sensor for the RX100mIV) and a crop factor of 2.7. There they might make a light and strong zoom à la RX10 for birdies.

But in a shrinking market, they'll have to be innovative, otherwise their business will collapse as it did with some of their other segments.

Exciting times to come ...
 
REDMASTA said:
They mentioned the FE lenses and full frame cameras and how they are increasing profit and will focus on building this line.

8 new lens in 2016 for the FE line and none for APSC, possibly discontinuing one going by their numbers. Not a good sign.

Wish they would focus more on high end ultra compact versions of the nex5/a5100 for aps-c and leave the larger bodies for full frame.

This would make for a nice product differentiation, no need to kill off the apsc line all together. Sony is really lacking a high end ultra compact ilc camera. The a5100 is nice but def not high end as it lacks many features and needs a better compact kit lens.
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I think high-end compacts may eat into the lower end of APS-C E-mount. As smartphones get better, they raise the bar on compacts. It used to be that something like a Canon S90 was high end.. then it turned into the RX100, then the RX100m3, then the LX100. As smartphones get multiple sensors and lenses or sliding lenses, I suspect that cameras at the level of the original RX100 will become the new minimum for standalone cameras; anything less won't sell much due to those amped-up smartphones. (Specialized cams like waterproof or superzoom will still sell, though.)

Personally I am waiting for the RX100m4 which may have a MFT sensor coupled with a stabilized 24-70 (FE equivalent)/1.8-2.8 zoom, EVF, and touchscreen. It might lose a bit of pocketability, but as long as it was still very compact, that would become an ILC-replacer for my wife.

Me, I need more specialized lenses sometimes so I'm holding out for an a6000 with IBIS, better EVF, touchscreen, and full metal mount. 4K video and better AF wouldn't hurt, either.
 
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What I want, and what I see..

a6000 newbie w/18-55, 55-210 Kit....Would love a new lens that's in the 18-200, 15-85 range, and high IQ, not cost 1K. but we are in the minority w/this mirrorless aps-c compact system. that's why non Canon M3 in the USA..

My observations are all over the USA where I do travel photography. What do I see?

I see "serious" or "enthusiast" photographers w/their DSLR-s, nikon and canon, full and crop. I see more and more Sony FF's. of course, that's 10% of the picture takers. The other 90% are cellphones. I rarely see compact mirrorless out in the field. Rarely see point and shoots anymore That's the market.



Maybe we think, well, if Sony, Canon,Fuji etc really push and market NEX, A6000, M3, more users. No. Average people will not spend the $$ or more importantly the time to learn this. they keep their Iphones...So the only market is getting people to either replace their DSLR's or add something compact to carry around like I and many others have.

I think one of the big draw backs on E(APS-C) lenses is that Sigma doesnt enter the market, and Tamron is barely in there. Sony can get away w/charging what they want. Even when Tamron comes up w/a lens, it's very low volume and still expensive...eg 18-200...about 750.00 usd. that's ridiculous. Comp. lens for APS-C is about 300.00

that's the deal.
 
REDMASTA said:
They mentioned the FE lenses and full frame cameras and how they are increasing profit and will focus on building this line.

8 new lens in 2016 for the FE line and none for APSC, possibly discontinuing one going by their numbers. Not a good sign.

Wish they would focus more on high end ultra compact versions of the nex5/a5100 for aps-c and leave the larger bodies for full frame.

This would make for a nice product differentiation, no need to kill off the apsc line all together. Sony is really lacking a high end ultra compact ilc camera. The a5100 is nice but def not high end as it lacks many features and needs a better compact kit lens.
Click to expand...
The question is what is missing from APS-C? Canikon has no APS-C specific 70-200 or longer quality/fast teles, same thing with Sony and currently by far the best body for FE 70-200 is A6000.

How small/cheap are fast and high quality primes from Fuji for example? To me they look like more equally/more expensive than Sony FE lenses and not very small. Samsung 50-150/2.8 is more expensive than Sony FE 70-200 etc.
 
lescrane said:
I think one of the big draw backs on E(APS-C) lenses is that Sigma doesnt enter the market...
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Not counting the three Sigma E-mount primes as entering the market?
 
missed it. give me my sigma18-200 and I'm happy.
 
REDMASTA said:
They mentioned the FE lenses and full frame cameras and how they are increasing profit and will focus on building this line.
Click to expand...
Yes it does. Lets face it, there is more money in the FE line right now then there is in the APS line, so their focus does make sense, bussiness wise.
REDMASTA said:
8 new lens in 2016 for the FE line and none for APSC, possibly discontinuing one going by their numbers. Not a good sign.
Click to expand...
Did you know that you can mount the FE lenses on your APS-c E-mount camera without adapter, without loss of functionality? You can use the Batis lenses from Zeiss even on your old Sony Nex 3 camera without problems! So what are you complaining about?
REDMASTA said:
Wish they would focus more on high end ultra compact versions of the nex5/a5100 for aps-c and leave the larger bodies for full frame.
Click to expand...
We have the nice A5000, A51000 and A6000 compact APS-c cameras, and successors will come, as there will come new APS-C E-mount lenss at some point. sony will not stop their best selling mirrorless camera lines (Yes the A5xxx and A6000 cameras out sell the A7x cmaeras by a lot). Remember that the people who buy these cameras are potentional A7x buyers too...
REDMASTA said:
This would make for a nice product differentiation, no need to kill off the apsc line all together. Sony is really lacking a high end ultra compact ilc camera. The a5100 is nice but def not high end as it lacks many features and needs a better compact kit lens.
Click to expand...
People are seeing a management presentation, but they don't here the manager giving the presetation with the story he (or she) tells. And the people are telling what they think they see in the presentation.

The presentation is not telling what producs will come to the market tomorrow, it is telling about a strategy sony is using to go to the future. It shows on what they will focus the comming year. And yes the FE line will get more attention then the APS-line as it needs more attention, it misses a lot of lenses the APS line allready has. Some of the FE lenses comming in the future will have their equivalent in the E-mount allready, other lenses will only com in FE mount (like longe telelenses and special lenses (like T&S, or macro lenses) as these lenses are sold in to low numbers to make them for both sensor sizes. Other lenses will only come in APS line, like a 16-50 f/2.8 or a 16-35 f/1.8.

New APS cameras will come, maybe not in the same yearly update as in the past, the market is changing, and so must Sony, but new APS cameras will come, Sony needs them to get to their goal!
 
Rhawi Dantas said:
Magnar W said:
Looks that there is no bright future for the A-mount/Minolta mount. I think they are more or less skipping this platform.

On the other hand, the future of the E-mount sounds very promising!
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It does make sense to focus on one mount, being that E and FE.
I just hope that Sony pull a rabbit out of the hat and make a DSLR like body with support for both Alpha and E-mount without the need of an adapter.
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you cant mount an e mount lens on an a mount camera because of the flange distance. you can mount an amount lens on the e mount, but you will always have to have an adapter to get the lens the correct distance from the sensor. there is no way to make a camera that can take both types of lenses with no adapter

Rhawi Dantas said:
--
Portfolio : http://dantas.photography
Streets of Helsinki : http://streetsofhelsinki.dantas.photography
Flickr : https://secure.flickr.com/photos/rhawidantas/sets/
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Why is it that everytime SAR runs something, it seems to be only a matter of minutes before someone pushes a link to the site? One would think that the slides had an accompanying narrative. And perhaps there are other slides. Even then, looking at the slides, one would think there is no future for the RX-1 series, the RX-10 series (they're not pictured), the APS-C E-Mount, the A-Mount, the E mount camcorders, etc. Nice information, yes. Complete information? I have no idea. Everything Andrea said about the slides are his opinion on what they mean, which may or may not be true. So who knows what Sony is really going to do.
 
It's only a big deal if someone wants to make it a big deal.

But the solution is very, very simple. Instead of complaining on the internet about a system that won't give you what you want, find a system that gives you what you want and go with that.

That's what I did when I added the A6000 and some very good and very reasonably priced lenses to my kit.
 
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Pieterbaan said:
REDMASTA said:
They mentioned the FE lenses and full frame cameras and how they are increasing profit and will focus on building this line.
Click to expand...
Yes it does. Lets face it, there is more money in the FE line right now then there is in the APS line, so their focus does make sense, bussiness wise.
Pieterbaan said:
8 new lens in 2016 for the FE line and none for APSC, possibly discontinuing one going by their numbers. Not a good sign.
Click to expand...
Did you know that you can mount the FE lenses on your APS-c E-mount camera without adapter, without loss of functionality? You can use the Batis lenses from Zeiss even on your old Sony Nex 3 camera without problems! So what are you complaining about?
Pieterbaan said:
Wish they would focus more on high end ultra compact versions of the nex5/a5100 for aps-c and leave the larger bodies for full frame.
Click to expand...
We have the nice A5000, A51000 and A6000 compact APS-c cameras, and successors will come, as there will come new APS-C E-mount lenss at some point. sony will not stop their best selling mirrorless camera lines (Yes the A5xxx and A6000 cameras out sell the A7x cmaeras by a lot). Remember that the people who buy these cameras are potentional A7x buyers too...
Pieterbaan said:
This would make for a nice product differentiation, no need to kill off the apsc line all together. Sony is really lacking a high end ultra compact ilc camera. The a5100 is nice but def not high end as it lacks many features and needs a better compact kit lens.
Click to expand...
People are seeing a management presentation, but they don't here the manager giving the presetation with the story he (or she) tells. And the people are telling what they think they see in the presentation.

The presentation is not telling what producs will come to the market tomorrow, it is telling about a strategy sony is using to go to the future. It shows on what they will focus the comming year. And yes the FE line will get more attention then the APS-line as it needs more attention, it misses a lot of lenses the APS line allready has. Some of the FE lenses comming in the future will have their equivalent in the E-mount allready, other lenses will only com in FE mount (like longe telelenses and special lenses (like T&S, or macro lenses) as these lenses are sold in to low numbers to make them for both sensor sizes. Other lenses will only come in APS line, like a 16-50 f/2.8 or a 16-35 f/1.8.

New APS cameras will come, maybe not in the same yearly update as in the past, the market is changing, and so must Sony, but new APS cameras will come, Sony needs them to get to their goal!
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I agree. Makes sense from a business perspective to focus on full frame lenses.

And considering all the lenses available from Sony, Sigma, Samyang, what is lacking for APSC e-mount really? Maybe only a >200mm lens, but that is lacking on FF also, and would it make sense to release one long, expensive lens for APSC only? Who would buy it that won't buy one FF that also works perfectly on APSC?

As long as the bodies are updated I wouldn't say APSC is dead.

--
https://www.flickr.com/photos/128287224@N03/
 
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GoneMirrorless said:
GoneMirrorless wrote:They like everyone also forcast fewer sales. That's why higher prices are so important.
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A potential problem is that camera buyers may not "cooperate" with this strategy, by buying higher priced cameras. The strategy could lead to lower-than-forecast sales/profits.
 
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Of course APS-C isn't dead.

They sell a lot more APC-C E-mount bodies than FF E-mount bodies, and certainly will continue to produce them to keep market share and provide lower-cost entry into the E-mount system.
 
We should remember that Sony offers some killer tiny APC-C emount cameras - like the A5100 and A6000.

There is zero chance of them abandoning these market-leading camera designs for much larger FF bodies.
 
morec said:
And considering all the lenses available from Sony, Sigma, Samyang, what is lacking for APSC e-mount really? Maybe only a >200mm lens, but that is lacking on FF also, and would it make sense to release one long, expensive lens for APSC only? Who would buy it that won't buy one FF that also works perfectly on APSC?

As long as the bodies are updated I wouldn't say APSC is dead.
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Yep.

APS-C E-mount has all the APS-only lenses it really needs at this point. From here on, FF lenses are more than enough for both FF and APS-C E-mount.

Realistically one doesn't need more than a tiny handful of lenses for a super-compact APS-C system. If someone needs and wants more specialized glass, the FF mount makes sense, especially with A7 bodies now selling in the $700 range.

E-mount does need some good supertelephotos, but those can and should be FF E-mount lenses as there is absolutely no advantage to APS-only long lenses.
 
mdcromer said:
mdcromer said:
And considering all the lenses available from Sony, Sigma, Samyang, what is lacking for APSC e-mount really? Maybe only a >200mm lens, but that is lacking on FF also, and would it make sense to release one long, expensive lens for APSC only? Who would buy it that won't buy one FF that also works perfectly on APSC?

As long as the bodies are updated I wouldn't say APSC is dead.
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Yep.

APS-C E-mount has all the APS-only lenses it really needs at this point. From here on, FF lenses are more than enough for both FF and APS-C E-mount.
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Exactly.
mdcromer said:
Realistically one doesn't need more than a tiny handful of lenses for a super-compact APS-C system.
Click to expand...
Exactly.
mdcromer said:
E-mount does need some good supertelephotos, but those can and should be FF E-mount lenses as there is absolutely no advantage to APS-only long lenses.
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Exactly.
 
I saw a total of 20 e mount lenses. That's 8 new ones for early 2016 - or sooner. It looks like these will probably be full frame lenses. It also looks like they are after a more advanced user market and leaving the P&S, etc, to the smart phone market . . . as well they should. Camera phones are rapidly becoming the camera everyone carries and uses. Most serious photographers want something better.

It looks to me like Sony is going right after the Canon/Nikon camera market. As both have a huge inventory of great lenses, this will not be an easy task. I can't help but wonder what will become of smaller volume manufacturers. I suspect they will die off like Packard, Pontiac, Edsel, and Kodak.
 
Steve Bingham said:
I saw a total of 20 e mount lenses. That's 8 new ones for early 2016 - or sooner. It looks like these will probably be full frame lenses. It also looks like they are after a more advanced user market and leaving the P&S, etc, to the smart phone market . . . as well they should. Camera phones are rapidly becoming the camera everyone carries and uses. Most serious photographers want something better.
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Not probably, but definitely. Take a closer look at the powerpoint slide. Its say 20 FE lens lineup by 2016. That means the 8 news lens are all FE full frame lens.

There is no mention of E-mount (APS-C) lens, and releasing 8 FE lens this aggressively by early 2016, also means there is no time to release any E-mount (APS-C) specific lens.

Bildschirmfoto-2015-05-27-um-08.55.15-700x400.png

Steve Bingham said:
It looks to me like Sony is going right after the Canon/Nikon camera market. As both have a huge inventory of great lenses, this will not be an easy task. I can't help but wonder what will become of smaller volume manufacturers. I suspect they will die off like Packard, Pontiac, Edsel, and Kodak.
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Yup. Sony FF is what is drawing a Canon shooter (like me) and a Nikon shooter (like you) into the fold.
 
Look at some of the great pictures people have posted over the years with super-zooms on the Cyber-Shot site. great (expensive) camera does not make a great or even good photographer. I have seen some excellent work by Full-Frameres, but also have seen some who have wasted their money. Like complaints that the DOF is not as "good' as with their P/S camera.
 
007peter said:
Not probably, but definitely. Take a closer look at the powerpoint slide. Its say 20 FE lens lineup by 2016. That means the 8 news lens are all FE full frame lens.
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Technically, it says 'over 20 lenses for FE, and over 70 total lenses. So that doesn't mean there will only be 8 more FE, or 7 more total...just that there will be at LEAST that many. It doesn't close the door entirely on there being other lenses released than the FE lenses...just that the FE lenses are the primary focus to build up at this time.

Admittedly it's unlikely, but not definite.
 
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