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Still no super-wide rectilinear prime!

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Make that two. There's also the Samyang 12mm f/2.0 for ~$310.
 
Samyang 10

Voigtlander 10.5

Kowa 8.5

So, the thread topic is wrong
 
Astrotripper said:
And there's also a 8.5mm f/2.8 from Kowa - but that's a bit big and expensive lens, probably not the thing you are looking for.
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I'm intrigued by that one, even if I prefer AF. It's sharp and does take filters (enormous, but still. ..)

Cheers,

Rick

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You can be too; ask about our 12-step program.
 
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Astrotripper said:
10mm f/2.8 - and it's not even that pricey or big

And there's also a 8.5mm f/2.8 from Kowa - but that's a bit big and expensive lens, probably not the thing you are looking for.
Click to expand...
The Samyang 10/2.8 is not pricey, but it is quite large relative to native lenses. It's meant for APS-C DSLRs, so its much larger than it needs to be for mirrorless cameras (compare to the tiny Samyang 12/2 and 7.5/3.5 designed for mirrorless). This is due to the flange distance of DSLRs, these ultrawides need to use a telecentric design which makes them much bigger. Plus, you have the added size/weight of the required adapter.

The 10/2.8 is 580g, or roughly twice the weight of the Panasonic 7-14/4, which is only one stop slower but much wider. The Olympus 9-18/4.5-6 is and weighs roughly 1/4th what the Samyang weighs, at 155g. It's also wider, and at the one end, only one stop slower. The Oly is about the same cost as the Samyang.

The Kowa makes a bit more sense, but it is still larger/heavier at 440g, and not as wide as the 7-14. At least this one is designed for M43/mirrorless and is relatively wide at 17mm equiv.
 
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Eric Nepean said:
MatsP said:
Eric Nepean said:
MatsP said:
Eric Nepean said:
10mm f/2.8 - and it's not even that pricey or big

And there's also a 8.5mm f/2.8 from Kowa - but that's a bit big and expensive lens, probably not the thing you are looking for.
Click to expand...
The Samyang 10/2, 8 is very sharp in the center but quite soft at the edges according to lenstip.com. That's a pity, it makes it less useful for architecture and landscape.
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Indeed. However, they tested it on APS-C camera, so with smaller 4/3 sensor, you only use a portion of the image. This should improve situation in regards to both soft corners and vignetting (which is also quite severe wide open on APS-C sensor).

Either way, you get what you pay for. The upcoming Olympus 7-14/2.8 will certainly offer better quality, but will also cost 3 times as much as this Samyang.
Click to expand...
Yes it was tested on an aps camera. The mft sensor is indeed smaller but not that much smaller that we can be sure there's a significant difference regarding edge sharpness. Otherwise it seems to be a very good lens.
Click to expand...
17.3mm wide vs 24mm wide. 3.35mm (14%) missing on each vertical edge. Less than 0.5mm on the horizontal edges. But this makes big difference in the corners. And if you decide to use 3:2 aspect in M43, then the margin on the horizontal edges will also be the same 14%
Eric Nepean said:
The coming 7-14 will obviously be very expensive, so a good not too expensive UW prime would be very welcome. I had the mft 9-18 but sold it mainly because it was a little soft in the edges, hoping that I would be able to afford the 7-14, but now I doubt that.
Click to expand...
As Olympus brings in their 7-14/F2.8, Panasonic may drop the price on the 7-14/F4, which by all accounts is an excellent lens. If that goes under $900 I will may well buy it.

I expect the 7-14/2.8 will be about double the weight of the 7-14/4.
Click to expand...
 
MatsP said:
MatsP said:
MatsP said:
MatsP said:
MatsP said:
MatsP said:
10mm f/2.8 - and it's not even that pricey or big

And there's also a 8.5mm f/2.8 from Kowa - but that's a bit big and expensive lens, probably not the thing you are looking for.
Click to expand...
The Samyang 10/2, 8 is very sharp in the center but quite soft at the edges according to lenstip.com. That's a pity, it makes it less useful for architecture and landscape.
Click to expand...
Indeed. However, they tested it on APS-C camera, so with smaller 4/3 sensor, you only use a portion of the image. This should improve situation in regards to both soft corners and vignetting (which is also quite severe wide open on APS-C sensor).

Either way, you get what you pay for. The upcoming Olympus 7-14/2.8 will certainly offer better quality, but will also cost 3 times as much as this Samyang.
Click to expand...
Yes it was tested on an aps camera. The mft sensor is indeed smaller but not that much smaller that we can be sure there's a significant difference regarding edge sharpness. Otherwise it seems to be a very good lens.
Click to expand...
17.3mm wide vs 24mm wide. 3.35mm (14%) missing on each vertical edge. Less than 0.5mm on the horizontal edges. But this makes big difference in the corners. And if you decide to use 3:2 aspect in M43, then the margin on the horizontal edges will also be the same 14%
MatsP said:
The coming 7-14 will obviously be very expensive, so a good not too expensive UW prime would be very welcome. I had the mft 9-18 but sold it mainly because it was a little soft in the edges, hoping that I would be able to afford the 7-14, but now I doubt that.
Click to expand...
As Olympus brings in their 7-14/F2.8, Panasonic may drop the price on the 7-14/F4, which by all accounts is an excellent lens. If that goes under $900 I will may well buy it.

I expect the 7-14/2.8 will be about double the weight of the 7-14/4.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
SFXR said:
"I suspect we will see a warmed-up 12 mm, this time faster than f/2.8"

There already is one. The Olympus 12mm f2. Please get your facts straight if you expect people to attend to your rant.
Click to expand...
Since Olympus said they would come out with a faster 12mm than the current one, the new lens will indeed be a warmed-up lens. Please get your facts straight.
 
Astrotripper said:
10mm f/2.8 - and it's not even that pricey or big

And there's also a 8.5mm f/2.8 from Kowa - but that's a bit big and expensive lens, probably not the thing you are looking for.
Click to expand...
I have considered those, but there is still the comparatively large size. Between the two I'd actually prefer the 8.5 mm lens. In a pinch, it might work, but it's not an ideal solution.
 
TheEye said:
I have been hoping for a 9 or 10 mm rectilinear prime lens for what seems like an eternity. The 10.5 mm Nokton is nice, but I don't want to lug that brick around. F/2.8 would suffice for my purposes. I suspect we will see a warmed-up 12 mm, this time faster than f/2.8, rather than a wider lens. I am getting desperate here!
Click to expand...
 
Gidday Tom

I note that the Samyang is not all that smaller/lighter than my FTs 7-14, and doubt that it's in quite the same optical class ...

I have already suggested the FTs 9-18.

What about the FTs 11-22? f/2.8 at the wide end; takes 72 mm filters; about the same size/weight as my 14-54. Both of the latter handle well on my E-M1 (as does my 7-14 ... ).

Only my 50-200 MkI + TC-14 + MMF-3 feels a tad unwieldy, primarily due to its length, but also its weight. Manageable, but I have ordered a knock-off grip, 2 batteries and car/wall charger from China, primarily for the 50-200 ...
 
Has anyone considered a wide angle adapter, fitted to the front of something like a 17/2.8 or 20/1.7? Yea, I know that many of these are presumed to have less than optimal optical performance; but this reminds me of the Oly 15-8 body cap lens, and how I created a "development taste" in Silky Pix that corrects for that lens's CA and field curvature; surely some improvement could be had with using a wide angle adapter and doing some customer correction to the files in post. It wouldn't add that much size or weight to the lens, and you wouldn't lose any speed. Just a thought.

~Joe
 
d3xmeister said:
I never really needed a zoom for uwa, so I would buy a 7mm prime if it gets released. I don't care about filters or the aperture, but it has to be small and light, I would not buy a prime if it's not significantly smaller than the 7-14mm.
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Exactly. In addition, small and light more important than aperture.

Dave
 
No one has mentioned the Hyperprime. Not as big as the 2 other 10s & takes filters. So far only 1 serious review on the web & it says the 10 is as sharp as the Oly 12 f2.

Unless some bad bad news is published in the next month or so, I'll be buying one soon.
 
tradesmith45 said:
No one has mentioned the Hyperprime. Not as big as the 2 other 10s & takes filters. So far only 1 serious review on the web & it says the 10 is as sharp as the Oly 12 f2.

Unless some bad bad news is published in the next month or so, I'll be buying one soon.
Click to expand...
Could you provide a link to that review? Sounds interesting.
 
Sergey Borachev said:
There is at least one superwide rectilinear prime lens, the Olympus 12mm!

Back in the 135mm film days, any lens wider than the 50mm up to 28mm is generally called a wide angle lens. Any lens from 24mm and wider up to 21mm were usually referred to as super wide. Any lens even wider would be ultra wide and unaffordable to mortals, 18 or 15mm. I believe these general those lose definition should be followed to avoid confusion. A M43 lens with12mm FL is equivalent to 24mm and therefore a super wide.

In M43, there are still no ultra wide rectilinear primes from Olympus or Panasonic, and also no AF ultra wide primes from anyone.
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I own the 12mm prime and its a great lens, in terms of sharpness it beats the Canon 24mm F/1.4 hands down. When paired with the E-M5II it will actually out resolve a Canon full frame camera, however... The inherent issue is that it is not an ultra wide angle lens by modern standards.

People try to conflate the 35mm SLR standards with modern digital cameras and this is just not possible. 24mm is not that wide when you can now get affordable 18mm lenses if not 14mm lenses.

I have the Olympus 9-18 and its only just wide enough to cause the surreal disconnect that you get from viewing a scene that is wide enough for your eyes to see in terms of angle of view.
 
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Hithertoo said:
Sergey Borachev said:
There is at least one superwide rectilinear prime lens, the Olympus 12mm!

Back in the 135mm film days, any lens wider than the 50mm up to 28mm is generally called a wide angle lens. Any lens from 24mm and wider up to 21mm were usually referred to as super wide. Any lens even wider would be ultra wide and unaffordable to mortals, 18 or 15mm. I believe these general those lose definition should be followed to avoid confusion. A M43 lens with12mm FL is equivalent to 24mm and therefore a super wide.

In M43, there are still no ultra wide rectilinear primes from Olympus or Panasonic, and also no AF ultra wide primes from anyone.
Click to expand...
I own the 12mm prime and its a great lens, in terms of sharpness it beats the Canon 24mm F/1.4 hands down. When paired with the E-M5II it will actually out resolve a Canon full frame camera, however... The inherent issue is that it is not an ultra wide angle lens by modern standards.

People try to conflate the 35mm SLR standards with modern digital cameras and this is just not possible. 24mm is not that wide when you can now get affordable 18mm lenses if not 14mm lenses.

I have the Olympus 9-18 and its only just wide enough to cause the surreal disconnect that you get from viewing a scene that is wide enough for your eyes to see in terms of angle of view.
Click to expand...
What affordable 14mm lens are you alluding to? Just curious what system really has better/cheaper wide or ultra wide lenses... The Samyang 12mm on E mount sticks out in my mind, being a truly affordable bright UWA prime (18mm EFL). Beyond that I haven't seen a lot of cheaper UWAs for mirrorless systems, let alone APS-C DSLR. That might be one area where FF benefits from easier design logistics, dunno.
 
tradesmith45 said:
No one has mentioned the Hyperprime. Not as big as the 2 other 10s & takes filters. So far only 1 serious review on the web & it says the 10 is as sharp as the Oly 12 f2.

Unless some bad bad news is published in the next month or so, I'll be buying one soon.
Click to expand...
I wasn't aware of that one. Thanks for brining it up. I will look into it.
 
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