Questions on comparisons of Paint Shop Pro 8 and PS7

Watch your mouth, my father does a fine job of raising me. ever heard the expression, 'Dont talk unless you know what youre talking about' ?? Yeah lets do just that.

FJBrad said:

Kari said:

Uhm, thats a tad creepy, Besides i already have a father, but
thanks anyway?

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Kari,
There's nothing worse than trying to splain something to someone
who has everything all figured out, and yet has things flying
overhead without getting it. So I won't.
Glad you already have a father, but don't know why you mentioned it
here. Wish he'd do a better job.

Member said:

FJBrad said:

Alex Reynolds said:

lol youre right about that...I just don't like the elitists to keep
the products from regular people like us.

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I never let my camera gear out of my sight (after having been
ripped off on several occasions). I have to lock my car with the
windows rolled up, even during the sweltering heat of summer. I pay
a lot of $ for insurance, locks, and encryption software, and
suffer passwords and all sorts of security hoops in my day-to-day
life. I also have to pay a lot more for software than I would if
everyone who used software had paid a similar amount for it.
You and Kari, and possibly some others seem to have a difficult
time understanding how others can be so stupid as to shell out
hundreds of $ for software.
I think there are several on this forum, besides me who would be
happy to enlighten you on our position and help you to gain a more
clear understanding of supply and demand economics, etc. It would
be much easier to explain these things face-to-face, though, so
please post your name and address so we can come over to your house
and help you.

--
FJBrad

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--



(thanks so much Todd for
this cute little picture of me, heheh)



N i k o n 4 3 0 0
You can play my game, but I'll put you to shame,
Kari

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--
FJBrad

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--



(thanks so much Todd for this cute little picture of me, heheh)



N i k o n 4 3 0 0
You can play my game, but I'll put you to shame,
Kari

I would certainly not advocate software piracy but there is a big difference between IP theft and theft to chattels - that is theft to real property or chattels has the deterring effect of enforcement. There is no real threat of enforceing software priacy - except maybe if you brag about it in a public forum...lol. Until napster got shut down it was not even clear if it constituted an exemption under the fair use doctrine like copying vhs (actually beta) tapes of movies for non-commercial use was found in the sony case. Because the crime is so novel and without the deterring effect of enforcement it is no wonder that many do not feel the same way about software piracy as they do theft to tangible property. As for PS7, they really should offer two seperate licenses on for non-commercial home use (for eductional purposes only) and a second full cost license for those using it for commerce. One thing is certain it is a little creepy that the enforcer in the group wanted the address of software piracy advocate.

Igas said:

One of the rules of dpreview is:
"We do not allow the posting of serial numbers, cracks, warez links
or anything related to the piracy of software."

Kari and Alex - please note! If I was Phil you would be out of
this forum in a flash.

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One more thing... protecting such intellectual property is quite a western type idea, an idea not universally adopted in other parts of the world. It is only a crime because the legislature and judiciary have mandated it (no doubt influenced by diverse lobbying groups). It is malum prohibitum (a regulatory crime) not malum in se (a universal crime against nature). Whatever side of the arguement you fall, note that the protection of ideas or intellectual property protection is not universally accepted norm. Whatever the economic and innovative consequences are felt in industry and commerce, it is not completely without precedent to think and feel the way the advocates of "software piracy" have expressed.

Chad Gladstone said:

• except maybe if you brag about it in a public forum...lol. Until

napster got shut down it was not even clear if it constituted an
exemption under the fair use doctrine like copying vhs (actually
beta) tapes of movies for non-commercial use was found in the sony
case. Because the crime is so novel and without the deterring
effect of enforcement it is no wonder that many do not feel the
same way about software piracy as they do theft to tangible
property. As for PS7, they really should offer two seperate
licenses on for non-commercial home use (for eductional purposes
only) and a second full cost license for those using it for
commerce. One thing is certain it is a little creepy that the
enforcer in the group wanted the address of software piracy
advocate.

Igas said:

One of the rules of dpreview is:
"We do not allow the posting of serial numbers, cracks, warez links
or anything related to the piracy of software."

Kari and Alex - please note! If I was Phil you would be out of
this forum in a flash.

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Kari said:

I have the right to defend myself when people start telling Im
wrong. And Maybe I am wrong, maybe youre wrong.

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No maybes about it, Kari. You were wrong. And the more you posted, the wronger you got.

1. You bragged about being a thief.
2. Then you taunted people who weren't.
3. Then you responded in a contentious manner to anyone who disagreed.

You've had time to cool off, but it's apparent you have no intention of apologizing to Muriel and the other well intentioned members of the NTF community you offended. I have a low tolerance for that kind of behavior, so let's make a deal. You're no longer welcome on my threads. I'll return the favor by not posting on yours.
--
Warm regards,
Uncle Frank, FCAS Charter Member, Hummingbird Hunter
Coolpix fifty seven hundred and nine ninety five
http://www.pbase.com/unclefrank

As I mentioned in my previous posting, I was deprived of income due to software piracy of software I had written. Because I didn't know that I was losing something did that mean that no crime was committed? Would that mean that if someone had something probably forgotten and lying in the attic or basement, that someone stealing it is less guilty of theft?

Although some may say that intellectual property theft is not the same as property theft because it is a regulatory crime rather than a crime against nature, then there are many cultures in the world who might say that property crime is also only regulatory, because their cultures believe that real property is communal. Take for instance the Australian aboriginals who were slaughtered, becase they did not understand "our" concept of property ownership. They would take food, crops, farm animals etc from the settler-farmers thinking that it should be there for anyone to take, only to be greeted with a volley of rifle fire. The aboriginal's homeland was stolen because they did not have a concept of ownership of it, they were both the victim and offender.

The more advanced a society become the more it should protect intellectual property. I am only new to this forum, (new to photography, having only got my first digital camera yesterday), but I am surprised there is not a total appreciation of intellectual property. I am wondering how many people here that have taken great photographs, especially if their income is derived solely from photoraphy, who would be supporting of piracy if they found great chunks of their work being stolen by other people and say used for commercial value without its author getting anything from it use. If you want to place your work in the public domain with no restrictions on it use then that is your call, but should you wish to derive income from what is legitimately you work, it should be respected.

As the world advances there is a shift to people deriving their sole income from the production of intellectual property. Unskilled manufacturing jobs are declining and earn less and less money, while knowledge workers jobs are on the increase earning more and more.

Sure software piracy is very hard to enforce but so are many other crimes, but does that mean they should be considered acceptable. Crimes such as insider trading where a party because of their position learns information that benefits then financially are appalled by society, because they know that when someone steals like this other parties are disadvantaged, (and they also do not know it). Someone stealing the content of someone university thesis and presenting it as their own work in another university would be hard to enforce so does it make it acceptable.

The concept of intellectual property and the morals of theft of it need to be taught at an early age. Technology has made theft easy, and education has not kept pace with it.

Thanks
Brian

Look, Im sorry for anyone I offended. I wasnt bragging about stealing software, I was answering the persons question who first posted. Yeah I did steal software, yeah it is wrong. But I think I have the right to answer the question and I got attacked by several people with rude remarks. I was never angry or upset in the first place so there was no need for a cool-down.

Muriel, Im sorry for being rude in response to your comment via my intellect.

And Uncle Friend, I have never had anything against you, or been rude to you. I like your photography and Ive always thought (from this short time Ive been here) that you were a smart guy. I want to apologize for whatever it was I said/did to offend you.

Apologies to everyone. Dont steal software.

Uncle Frank said:

Kari said:

I have the right to defend myself when people start telling Im
wrong. And Maybe I am wrong, maybe youre wrong.

Click to expand...

No maybes about it, Kari. You were wrong. And the more you
posted, the wronger you got.

1. You bragged about being a thief.
2. Then you taunted people who weren't.
3. Then you responded in a contentious manner to anyone who disagreed.

You've had time to cool off, but it's apparent you have no
intention of apologizing to Muriel and the other well intentioned
members of the NTF community you offended. I have a low tolerance
for that kind of behavior, so let's make a deal. You're no longer
welcome on my threads. I'll return the favor by not posting on
yours.
--
Warm regards,
Uncle Frank, FCAS Charter Member, Hummingbird Hunter
Coolpix fifty seven hundred and nine ninety five
http://www.pbase.com/unclefrank

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--



(thanks so much Todd for this cute little picture of me, heheh)



N i k o n 4 3 0 0
You can play my game, but I'll put you to shame,
Kari

Leslie Bailey said:

After all this build up I do have > a question, I recently downloaded the evaluation copy of Paint Shop > Pro 8, which I found to have excellent features. So my question is > this. For the average digital camera user what are we missing by > not having and using P.S 7, would like to hear from people who
have experience on both programs as there is about a six hundred
percent difference in price, is it six hundred percent better.
Thank you. Les Bailey

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Les,

No doubt that PS7 is the most powerful of software available to edit digital photos. I have gone from PSP7 to PSP8 after using the Beta version of PSP8. I look at it this way. I'm more interested in working with photos with as little editing as possible. PSP has all the tools I need. So far, PSP8 is quite an improvement over PSP7 which I would not have believed possible. I can see that with the pick of any tool.

For those that want to spend more time on the editing side, PS7 would be the way to go and surely a must at the pro level. I have the best of both worlds. Photos assignments from a gallery, I turn in the photos and someone else does the processing using PS7. On the other hand, the gallery tells me that they barely have to touch my photos so the post editing is very light. Same for me using PSP7/8. I can see the use of PS7 for elaborate photo jobs that have nothing to do with making a better photo from a bad one.

As to the side discussion on not purchasing software. Someone stated that everyone has some "stolen" software. That is not true. Every software that I have was purchased and is regisitered. There is no excuse for stealing software. And excuses don't excuse it. The lamest is can't afford it, need it, and besides, the corporations make too much money. Sounds like a typical Democrat excuse to me (aside from a common thief). There is no reason for anyone to disagree with me in response. You have already stated what you are.

--
Larry Gleason

Kari said:

Thank you Alex.

Oh and I am a smart girl, Im not the one who wasted 600 dollars on
a piece of software. Whos smart now?

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Kari,
You are smart....and evil.
But, people who steal, and advertise it, have a wish to get punished!
--
Daryl - hooked on cameras!
http://www.natures-paradise.net

Kari said:

I do give adobe credit, and If i had a job and that kind of money,
I would pay for it. Im just saying I dont have money, and I really
needed the program.

and Ive already gotten this lecture from my mother whos the boss of
over 4,000 graphic designers at the corporate business she
co-opperates.

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Good. She may be able to pay YOUR fine when it happens.
--
Daryl - hooked on cameras!
http://www.natures-paradise.net

Thanks, Kari. I'm sorry, too, for my overly indignant reaction to the exchanges on this thread. I've always believed that politics and religion were too volatile to discuss on the internet, or in a bar, for that matter. I guess I'll have to expand the list to include software.

How about we abandon this dreadful thread, and pretend it never happened?

--
Warm regards,
Uncle Frank, FCAS Charter Member, Hummingbird Hunter
Coolpix fifty seven hundred and nine ninety five
http://www.pbase.com/unclefrank