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FayeFaithM

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Hi All,

I am new to photography and am really excited about the journey of learning all the things I can do with a DSLR camera.Right now it's just a hobby, but eventually, I would love to be able to shoot weddings and engagement shoots, or anything with people really.

I had a couple questions because I am so new, still trying to figure things out.

First question, I love the type of photo with a slight over exposed background. Is that something most people do with their camera, if so, what would the settings be around to get that sort of affect? Or is it something that is done by editing afterwards.

Also, when shooting for lets say a portrait, engagement photo shoot, what do you think an average good shutter speed is?

The difference between ONE SHOT, Al FOCUS, Al SERVO?

Metering Mode?

I saw on youtube a lot of Wedding Photographers shooting in AV mode. I always heard that a photographer should be set on Manual Mode. Does it depend on the location and type of Photo? What do you usually shoot in.

Thanks so much in advance for your help. I am extremely new, but its all I can think about sometimes, especially just driving down the street, can see so many photo ops and great locations, except I can never transfer it on my camera how I have it in my head! But I am going to continue to practice! Sorry if my questions are such "newbie" questions, but I am just getting started and am trying to learn as much as I can with books and youtube. Any helpful advice is greatly appreciated! I am currently practicing on my kids ( who are so done with being my models lol) and flowers. My camera I am using is a Canon Rebel T5, with an 18-55mm Lens.
 
Solution
D
A dSLR is an excellent tool for beginners to learn to master photography, both technique and developing the 'eye', so you've started on the right track. Don't let the technical grind you down too much. Without wishing to dent your enthusiasm, slow down your desire to adsorb it all in one go.

The basics of photography technique starts with understanding exposure. It's a simple juggling trick between three things: ISO (sensitivity to light), aperture (window to let in light) and shutter speed (length of exposure to light).

Read up a little on those things (I recommend Micheal Freeman, if you like books), there's a wealth of internet info too, both written & youtube (but be careful to avoid the nerds with their jargon and over-analytical...
tedolf said:
Andy Cam said:
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Andy Cam said:
tedolf said:
tedolf wrote:
Would you hire a photographer for your wedding who was completely self taught?

Yes or no?

Yeah, I thought so.
Click to expand...
It's no industry secret that nearly all successful commercial wedding photographers are entirely self-taught.
Click to expand...
Please provide substantiating documentation to back this fascinating "fact" up. From what I've seen on these forums and elsewhere, many wedding photographers get their start by first serving as apprentices or backup photographers to more experienced professionals, to learn the nuances of the trade. For example:

Learn How To Be A Wedding Photographer

Wedding Photographer Education and Career Info
Click to expand...
You expect me to provide 'substantial' documentation? How about you also ask the dude who claims nobody would hire a self-taught wedding photographer to support their claim with documentation?

They also claim they've never met a wedding photographer who is self-taught. That just goes to show their limited experience.

OK, I'll humor you. I won't bother with the documentary evidence as I don't consider you worth my time. Instead here's a list of just three of the most famous and successful wedding photographers ever, and you go find yourself some substantial documents confirming if they are self-taught or trained and/or qualified (I'll give you a hint - you picked the wrong side to argue with).

Gary Fong
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Wow! I mean WOW! How can you be so darn arrogant? I mean, I give you 4 wedding photographers. 3 who are self-taught. and you pick up on the one who isn't self-taught and mistake another who isn't a wedding photographer then completely dismiss the other two.

WOW...you should be a politician. You are bad enough at lying and can't admit you may be wrong. And you are full of it
tedolf said:
From Gary's own biography:

" I knew this wedding photographer. This man who's now featured in the most famous wedding magazine in the world. It was if the universe was giving me an unforgettable sign. It was something I could not ignore so out of curiosity I pursued Rocky and I became his assistant and friend. Eventually Rocky trained me to become a wedding photographer."

Emphasis added for your convenience.
Click to expand...
CORRECT! That one was easy for you to google, wasn' it Ted? I'm inclusive...I happily admit some wedding photographers are trained. AND others are not. I am not completely ignorant to the case being either or, unlike you and King Lewis III
tedolf said:
tedolf said:
Joe Buissink
Click to expand...
Joe is coy about his background but it is known in the industry that he assisted and worked for other photographers before starting out on his own. This is not unusual as the photographers that trained him are currently competing against him and he does not want to give them free publicity.
Click to expand...
Struggled to google this one , huh? But I love your completely made up BS excuse to compensate!!!!
tedolf said:
tedolf said:
Jasmine Starr
Click to expand...
I don't know any thing about her
Click to expand...
Really Ted? She came up blank on the google? Try bing? She is one of the most prolific photographer bloggers there are. Given, she does come across as false time-to-time (you'd get on)
tedolf said:
and neither do you.
Click to expand...
??????????? Why do you keep transfering your personal experiences on others? are you ill?
tedolf said:
tedolf said:
and I must just add, not so famous but very successful, Michael Greenberg - as he's a personal favorite.
Click to expand...
You mean the guy who took photography classes in high school, attended the Main Photographic Workshops school and did darkroom work under Mary Ellen Mark?

That guy?
Click to expand...
NO, NOT that guy. If you are going to replace real experience and knowledge with google for a brain then do try not to misgoogle stuff. Does the M.Greenberg you refer to look like a wedding photographer? NO? Try googling the wedding photographer of same name.

Emphasis added for your convenience.
tedolf said:
tedolf said:
tedolf said:
I am amazed that you say people should choose a photographer with no qualifications. Who in their right mind would want to hire an unqualified photographer
Click to expand...
Christina Aguilera, Jennifer Lopez, Steven Spielberg, and a whole heap of other people willing to fork out +$150k because they have the brains and finance to put experience and talent before people with a deluded sense of ability just coz they have letters after their name
tedolf said:
(or mechanic or attorney or dentist or painter or anything)? Sorry, but this makes no sense at all.Erm,
Click to expand...
That's because you've been raised and misled to believe your college time and qualifications mean more than jack sht in the real world
Click to expand...
Why do you think that "training" is solely limited to college?
Click to expand...
WOW. You do get a kick out of twisting people's words into your own twisted formulae don't you
tedolf said:
Have you ever heard of "apprenticeship"?

Every plumber, carpenter, mason, etc. is trained this way.
tedolf said:
tedolf said:
tedolf said:
Are you married, by any chance, Ted?
Click to expand...
Which brings up the question: are YOU?
Click to expand...
No, she ran away at the altar when i asked to see the photographers credentials. :D :D
Click to expand...
That is because you were foolish enough to hire Tedolph as the photographer!
Click to expand...
People who occasionly refer to themselves in the third party are being selfdepreciative. People who do it all the time suffer delusions of grandeur. Looking at your frequency and everything else about your manner I think it's pretty obvious which way applies here.

I shall just call you Gollum. Or do you prefer Shmeegle?
 
Last edited:
Andy Cam said:
tedolf said:
Andy Cam said:
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
tedolf wrote:
Would you hire a photographer for your wedding who was completely self taught?

Yes or no?

Yeah, I thought so.
Click to expand...
It's no industry secret that nearly all successful commercial wedding photographers are entirely self-taught.
Click to expand...
Please provide substantiating documentation to back this fascinating "fact" up. From what I've seen on these forums and elsewhere, many wedding photographers get their start by first serving as apprentices or backup photographers to more experienced professionals, to learn the nuances of the trade. For example:

Learn How To Be A Wedding Photographer

Wedding Photographer Education and Career Info
Click to expand...
You expect me to provide 'substantial' documentation? How about you also ask the dude who claims nobody would hire a self-taught wedding photographer to support their claim with documentation?

They also claim they've never met a wedding photographer who is self-taught. That just goes to show their limited experience.

OK, I'll humor you. I won't bother with the documentary evidence as I don't consider you worth my time. Instead here's a list of just three of the most famous and successful wedding photographers ever, and you go find yourself some substantial documents confirming if they are self-taught or trained and/or qualified (I'll give you a hint - you picked the wrong side to argue with).

Gary Fong
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Wow! I mean WOW! How can you be so darn arrogant? I mean, I give you 4 wedding photographers. 3 who are self-taught. and you pick up on the one who isn't self-taught and mistake another who isn't a wedding photographer then completely dismiss the other two.

WOW...you should be a politician. You are bad enough at lying and can't admit you may be wrong. And you are full of it
Andy Cam said:
From Gary's own biography:

" I knew this wedding photographer. This man who's now featured in the most famous wedding magazine in the world. It was if the universe was giving me an unforgettable sign. It was something I could not ignore so out of curiosity I pursued Rocky and I became his assistant and friend. Eventually Rocky trained me to become a wedding photographer."

Emphasis added for your convenience.
Click to expand...
CORRECT! That one was easy for you to google, wasn' it Ted? I'm inclusive...I happily admit some wedding photographers are trained. AND others are not. I am not completely ignorant to the case being either or, unlike you and King Lewis III
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Joe Buissink
Click to expand...
Joe is coy about his background but it is known in the industry that he assisted and worked for other photographers before starting out on his own. This is not unusual as the photographers that trained him are currently competing against him and he does not want to give them free publicity.
Click to expand...
Struggled to google this one , huh? But I love your completely made up BS excuse to compensate!!!!
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Jasmine Starr
Click to expand...
I don't know any thing about her
Click to expand...
Really Ted? She came up blank on the google? Try bing? She is one of the most prolific photographer bloggers there are. Given, she does come across as false time-to-time (you'd get on)
Andy Cam said:
and neither do you.
Click to expand...
??????????? Why do you keep transfering your personal experiences on others? are you ill?
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
and I must just add, not so famous but very successful, Michael Greenberg - as he's a personal favorite.
Click to expand...
You mean the guy who took photography classes in high school, attended the Main Photographic Workshops school and did darkroom work under Mary Ellen Mark?

That guy?
Click to expand...
NO, NOT that guy. If you are going to replace real experience and knowledge with google for a brain then do try not to misgoogle stuff. Does the M.Greenberg you refer to look like a wedding photographer? NO? Try googling the wedding photographer of same name.

Emphasis added for your convenience.
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
I am amazed that you say people should choose a photographer with no qualifications. Who in their right mind would want to hire an unqualified photographer
Click to expand...
Christina Aguilera, Jennifer Lopez, Steven Spielberg, and a whole heap of other people willing to fork out +$150k because they have the brains and finance to put experience and talent before people with a deluded sense of ability just coz they have letters after their name
Andy Cam said:
(or mechanic or attorney or dentist or painter or anything)? Sorry, but this makes no sense at all.Erm,
Click to expand...
That's because you've been raised and misled to believe your college time and qualifications mean more than jack sht in the real world
Click to expand...
Why do you think that "training" is solely limited to college?
Click to expand...
WOW. You do get a kick out of twisting people's words into your own twisted formulae don't you
Andy Cam said:
Have you ever heard of "apprenticeship"?

Every plumber, carpenter, mason, etc. is trained this way.
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Are you married, by any chance, Ted?
Click to expand...
Which brings up the question: are YOU?
Click to expand...
No, she ran away at the altar when i asked to see the photographers credentials. :D :D
Click to expand...
That is because you were foolish enough to hire Tedolph as the photographer!
Click to expand...
People who occasionly refer to themselves in the third party are being selfdepreciative. People who do it all the time suffer delusions of grandeur. Looking at your frequency and everything else about your manner I think it's pretty obvious which way applies here.

I shall just call you Gollum. Or do you prefer Shmeegle?
Click to expand...
Off the meds again today, Andy?

The whole discussion about wedding photography had to do with how a normal person (not a gifted genius / savant) could best learn wedding photography. The advice given was to read books, take a class or two, and serve as an assistant to a professional for a while, so as to learn the ropes first hand. That is NOT bad advice, and is entirely consistent with what many, many threads on this site have suggested. However, your claiming that people should forgo any sort of training and just figure it out by trial and error, totally by themselves, runs counter to what most of the others here think.

I do disagree with Tedolf in that if I were choosing a wedding photographer, I would be more interested in seeing numerous samples of their work, good references, and other means that demonstrate their demonstrated QUALIFICATIONS to do the job; I would not outright reject a photographer should they turn out to be self-trained. That said, I think the chances of finding an "average" pro who has not had SOME sort of training (including serving as assistant to a pro when first starting out) would be pretty slim.

Sincerely
 
Andy Cam said:
tedolf said:
Andy Cam said:
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
tedolf wrote:
Would you hire a photographer for your wedding who was completely self taught?

Yes or no?

Yeah, I thought so.
Click to expand...
It's no industry secret that nearly all successful commercial wedding photographers are entirely self-taught.
Click to expand...
Please provide substantiating documentation to back this fascinating "fact" up. From what I've seen on these forums and elsewhere, many wedding photographers get their start by first serving as apprentices or backup photographers to more experienced professionals, to learn the nuances of the trade. For example:

Learn How To Be A Wedding Photographer

Wedding Photographer Education and Career Info
Click to expand...
You expect me to provide 'substantial' documentation? How about you also ask the dude who claims nobody would hire a self-taught wedding photographer to support their claim with documentation?

They also claim they've never met a wedding photographer who is self-taught. That just goes to show their limited experience.

OK, I'll humor you. I won't bother with the documentary evidence as I don't consider you worth my time. Instead here's a list of just three of the most famous and successful wedding photographers ever, and you go find yourself some substantial documents confirming if they are self-taught or trained and/or qualified (I'll give you a hint - you picked the wrong side to argue with).

Gary Fong
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Wow! I mean WOW! How can you be so darn arrogant? I mean, I give you 4 wedding photographers. 3 who are self-taught. and you pick up on the one who isn't self-taught
Click to expand...
Caught you, didn't I?
Andy Cam said:
and mistake another who isn't a wedding photographer then completely dismiss the other two.

WOW...you should be a politician. You are bad enough at lying
Click to expand...
I think I am pretty good at it.
Andy Cam said:
and can't admit you may be wrong.
Click to expand...
Why would anyone ever do something like that?

Andy Cam said:
And you are full of it
Click to expand...
It is very common.
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
From Gary's own biography:

" I knew this wedding photographer. This man who's now featured in the most famous wedding magazine in the world. It was if the universe was giving me an unforgettable sign. It was something I could not ignore so out of curiosity I pursued Rocky and I became his assistant and friend. Eventually Rocky trained me to become a wedding photographer."

Emphasis added for your convenience.
Click to expand...
CORRECT! That one was easy for you to google, wasn' it Ted? I'm inclusive...I happily admit some wedding photographers are trained. AND others are not. I am not completely ignorant to the case being either or, unlike you and King Lewis III
Click to expand...
Heh, heh.....

got you didn't I?

So if you knew he was not self trained, why did you use him as an example?

Who is dissembling now?
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Joe Buissink
Click to expand...
Joe is coy about his background but it is known in the industry that he assisted and worked for other photographers before starting out on his own. This is not unusual as the photographers that trained him are currently competing against him and he does not want to give them free publicity.
Click to expand...
Struggled to google this one , huh?
Click to expand...
Yeah, I did struggle.

It was hard!
Andy Cam said:
But I love your completely made up BS excuse to compensate!!!!
Click to expand...
Pretty good, huh?

But, it is actually true.
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Jasmine Starr
Click to expand...
I don't know any thing about her
Click to expand...
Really Ted? She came up blank on the google? Try bing? She is one of the most prolific photographer bloggers there are. Given, she does come across as false time-to-time (you'd get on)
Click to expand...
Actually, I never heard of her.
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
and neither do you.
Click to expand...
??????????? Why do you keep transfering your personal experiences on others?
Click to expand...
Because it is easy.
Andy Cam said:
are you ill?
Click to expand...
Well, now that you mention it.......
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
and I must just add, not so famous but very successful, Michael Greenberg - as he's a personal favorite.
Click to expand...
You mean the guy who took photography classes in high school, attended the Main Photographic Workshops school and did darkroom work under Mary Ellen Mark?

That guy?
Click to expand...
NO, NOT that guy. If you are going to replace real experience and knowledge with google for a brain then do try not to misgoogle stuff. Does the M.Greenberg you refer to look like a wedding photographer?
Click to expand...
Yeah, sort of.
Andy Cam said:
NO?
Click to expand...
Yes?

Andy Cam said:
Try googling the wedding photographer of same name.
Click to expand...
Hmmm......

Set me see.......
Andy Cam said:
Emphasis added for your convenience.
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
I am amazed that you say people should choose a photographer with no qualifications. Who in their right mind would want to hire an unqualified photographer
Click to expand...
Christina Aguilera, Jennifer Lopez, Steven Spielberg, and a whole heap of other people willing to fork out +$150k because they have the brains and finance to put experience and talent before people with a deluded sense of ability just coz they have letters after their name
Andy Cam said:
(or mechanic or attorney or dentist or painter or anything)? Sorry, but this makes no sense at all.Erm,
Click to expand...
That's because you've been raised and misled to believe your college time and qualifications mean more than jack sht in the real world
Click to expand...
Why do you think that "training" is solely limited to college?
Click to expand...
WOW. You do get a kick out of twisting people's words into your own twisted formulae don't you
Click to expand...
Yes.
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Have you ever heard of "apprenticeship"?

Every plumber, carpenter, mason, etc. is trained this way.
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Andy Cam said:
Are you married, by any chance, Ted?
Click to expand...
Which brings up the question: are YOU?
Click to expand...
No, she ran away at the altar when i asked to see the photographers credentials. :D :D
Click to expand...
That is because you were foolish enough to hire Tedolph as the photographer!
Click to expand...
People who occasionly refer to themselves in the third party are being selfdepreciative. People who do it all the time suffer delusions of grandeur.
Click to expand...
There is no delusion involved.

The granduer is a fact!
Andy Cam said:
Looking at your frequency and everything else about your manner I think it's pretty obvious which way applies here.
Click to expand...
See above.
Andy Cam said:
I shall just call you Gollum. Or do you prefer Shmeegle?
Click to expand...
Prince of Darkness?

Tedolph,

The Great
 
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Andy Cam said:
tedolf said:
Andy Cam said:
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Andy Cam said:
Joseph T Lewis III said:
tedolf wrote:
Would you hire a photographer for your wedding who was completely self taught?

Yes or no?

Yeah, I thought so.
Click to expand...
It's no industry secret that nearly all successful commercial wedding photographers are entirely self-taught.
Click to expand...
Please provide substantiating documentation to back this fascinating "fact" up. From what I've seen on these forums and elsewhere, many wedding photographers get their start by first serving as apprentices or backup photographers to more experienced professionals, to learn the nuances of the trade. For example:

Learn How To Be A Wedding Photographer

Wedding Photographer Education and Career Info
Click to expand...
You expect me to provide 'substantial' documentation? How about you also ask the dude who claims nobody would hire a self-taught wedding photographer to support their claim with documentation?

They also claim they've never met a wedding photographer who is self-taught. That just goes to show their limited experience.

OK, I'll humor you. I won't bother with the documentary evidence as I don't consider you worth my time. Instead here's a list of just three of the most famous and successful wedding photographers ever, and you go find yourself some substantial documents confirming if they are self-taught or trained and/or qualified (I'll give you a hint - you picked the wrong side to argue with).

Gary Fong
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Wow! I mean WOW! How can you be so darn arrogant? I mean, I give you 4 wedding photographers. 3 who are self-taught. and you pick up on the one who isn't self-taught and mistake another who isn't a wedding photographer then completely dismiss the other two.

WOW...you should be a politician. You are bad enough at lying and can't admit you may be wrong. And you are full of it
Joseph T Lewis III said:
From Gary's own biography:

" I knew this wedding photographer. This man who's now featured in the most famous wedding magazine in the world. It was if the universe was giving me an unforgettable sign. It was something I could not ignore so out of curiosity I pursued Rocky and I became his assistant and friend. Eventually Rocky trained me to become a wedding photographer."

Emphasis added for your convenience.
Click to expand...
CORRECT! That one was easy for you to google, wasn' it Ted? I'm inclusive...I happily admit some wedding photographers are trained. AND others are not. I am not completely ignorant to the case being either or, unlike you and King Lewis III
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Joe Buissink
Click to expand...
Joe is coy about his background but it is known in the industry that he assisted and worked for other photographers before starting out on his own. This is not unusual as the photographers that trained him are currently competing against him and he does not want to give them free publicity.
Click to expand...
Struggled to google this one , huh? But I love your completely made up BS excuse to compensate!!!!
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Jasmine Starr
Click to expand...
I don't know any thing about her
Click to expand...
Really Ted? She came up blank on the google? Try bing? She is one of the most prolific photographer bloggers there are. Given, she does come across as false time-to-time (you'd get on)
Joseph T Lewis III said:
and neither do you.
Click to expand...
??????????? Why do you keep transfering your personal experiences on others? are you ill?
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Joseph T Lewis III said:
and I must just add, not so famous but very successful, Michael Greenberg - as he's a personal favorite.
Click to expand...
You mean the guy who took photography classes in high school, attended the Main Photographic Workshops school and did darkroom work under Mary Ellen Mark?

That guy?
Click to expand...
NO, NOT that guy. If you are going to replace real experience and knowledge with google for a brain then do try not to misgoogle stuff. Does the M.Greenberg you refer to look like a wedding photographer? NO? Try googling the wedding photographer of same name.

Emphasis added for your convenience.
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Joseph T Lewis III said:
I am amazed that you say people should choose a photographer with no qualifications. Who in their right mind would want to hire an unqualified photographer
Click to expand...
Christina Aguilera, Jennifer Lopez, Steven Spielberg, and a whole heap of other people willing to fork out +$150k because they have the brains and finance to put experience and talent before people with a deluded sense of ability just coz they have letters after their name
Joseph T Lewis III said:
(or mechanic or attorney or dentist or painter or anything)? Sorry, but this makes no sense at all.Erm,
Click to expand...
That's because you've been raised and misled to believe your college time and qualifications mean more than jack sht in the real world
Click to expand...
Why do you think that "training" is solely limited to college?
Click to expand...
WOW. You do get a kick out of twisting people's words into your own twisted formulae don't you
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Have you ever heard of "apprenticeship"?

Every plumber, carpenter, mason, etc. is trained this way.
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Joseph T Lewis III said:
Are you married, by any chance, Ted?
Click to expand...
Which brings up the question: are YOU?
Click to expand...
No, she ran away at the altar when i asked to see the photographers credentials. :D :D
Click to expand...
That is because you were foolish enough to hire Tedolph as the photographer!
Click to expand...
People who occasionly refer to themselves in the third party are being selfdepreciative. People who do it all the time suffer delusions of grandeur. Looking at your frequency and everything else about your manner I think it's pretty obvious which way applies here.

I shall just call you Gollum. Or do you prefer Shmeegle?
Click to expand...
Off the meds again today, Andy?

The whole discussion about wedding photography had to do with how a normal person (not a gifted genius / savant) could best learn wedding photography. The advice given was to read books, take a class or two, and serve as an assistant to a professional for a while, so as to learn the ropes first hand. That is NOT bad advice, and is entirely consistent with what many, many threads on this site have suggested. However, your claiming that people should forgo any sort of training and just figure it out by trial and error, totally by themselves, runs counter to what most of the others here think.
Click to expand...
What I find even more amazing is how offended the OP was by the notion that reading some books, taking a class and assisting an actual wedding photographer might be a good path to becoming one.

Now that I think about it, that is outrageous!

Cleary a preposterous idea. I mean this is the Age of the InterWeb, right?
Joseph T Lewis III said:
I do disagree with Tedolf in that if I were choosing a wedding photographer, I would be more interested in seeing numerous samples of their work, good references, and other means that demonstrate their demonstrated QUALIFICATIONS to do the job; I would not outright reject a photographer should they turn out to be self-trained.
Click to expand...
This is just an academic argument in that you really would be very hard pressed to even find any successful professional wedding photographer with good references, portfolio, etc. who was self trained.

I have never met one.
Joseph T Lewis III said:
That said, I think the chances of finding an "average" pro who has not had SOME sort of training (including serving as assistant to a pro when first starting out) would be pretty slim.
Click to expand...
Well, we appear to agree.

So all of this argument has really been about how many angels can fit on the head of a pin.

No wonder the OP left.

Joseph T Lewis III said:
Sincerely

--
Tom
Click to expand...
TEdolph
 
I literally laughed out loud when I saw this.

Tedolph, you must be a lawyer with photography as a hobby!

Thanks for the tips. I appreciate it.

Few things I been reading and would like to clarify. Maybe I gave off a wrong impression or maybe you assumed. Maybe a little of both!

I have three books, thanks for the advice on me reading them, I am doing just that. That's why I got them!

I tend to look for more answers on youtube because I am a visual learner. It's difficult for me to read instructions and then understand it right away. That's why I go on youtube looking for a visual explanation!

Good news though, recently just got an Ebook that after an explanation it comes with a video to explain everything in full detail and show their explanation, best 10 bucks I spent!

In regards to a photography class. YES, this is great. I would LOVE to go to a photography class and plan on doing just that! I never said I was against this. I recently had a baby though and will have to wait a few months until she is ready to be with out me for more than just a couple of hours! In a few months though, I plan on taking a ton!

In regards to working with a photographer. YES! What better way to become a wedding photographer then to learn from one?! I plan on trying to do this as well! But again, not that its your business, but just had a baby and this too will have to wait! Maybe after those photography classes!

Tedolph. I just got a camera and I don't want to wait till I can take a photography class to start using it to take great pictures. MY way of learning may not be the way YOU learned, but that doesn't make it the wrong way of learning.

Good Luck to you Tedolph!

-Faye
 
(all the previous yada yada yada deleted to save bandwidth)

Let me give a simple example of how in my own pitiful attempts at photography, simply observing an experienced real estate photographer for an hour taught me several things that would probably have taken me months (or more) to stumble across on my own. I wasn't his apprentice or anything; I was just the property owner who watched what he did, and asked a few questions, when he took the MLS photos for a condo I was selling. Here's what happened:

The guy had a tripod mounted Nikon full frame dslr. He had a flash on the camera, another one mounted somehow down on the tripod underneath the camera (not positive about this but pretty sure), and a third flash held by his wife. Using those flashes he got very good, quite even illumination, even in the rather long living area with big windows on the end.

He would tell his wife how to stand, in order to balance the lighting. He'd move her back and forth, right and left. He would also of course make sure to position her so that she did not appear in any of the photos. They worked together very well as a team.

When he took photos of the outside of the building, there was a contractor out front doing some work, with a white work van parked in the middle of the driveway. The photographer managed to get around this unsightly distraction, by deftly positioning his camera so that the nice wooden sign (the one with the condo name and street number) at the front of the property completely obscured the worker and van, when he took his shot. He did it so that the sign was displayed rather dramatically, with the building towering behind it.

When he took pics of the patio area out back, he pointed out he was going to use HDR to get photos that were appealing, even though the day was dreary and cloudy.

When he did the post processing on the images that night, he superimposed a nice action shot from a baseball game, over the screen of my HDTV in the living room that would otherwise have been a blank gray. He also Photoshopped the part of the entry way overhang that was being replaced, so that it matched the surrounding areas instead of showing yellow banded unpainted sheetrock.

So, in an hour, I learned a bit about:

-Importance of tripod for absolutely steady images, along with forcing the photographer to more carefully compose his shots

-Use of multiple flashes

-How to work with an assistant

-Use of HDR to give "pop" to photos taken on a dreary day

-Use of another item to cover up a distracting object, and at the same time turn that photo into one that dramatically highlighted something that might not otherwise even been seen

-Concept of using Photoshop to overlay blank gray TV screen with vivid color image, thereby making the entire living room scene seem more natural and "homey"

Let me be the first to acknowledge that these were not amazing, heretofore unheard of techniques; far from it. Rather, they were just the normal little everyday things the guy did while taking photos of a real estate listing. Could I have figured it out on my own? Probably. My point is simply that I found it extremely helpful to SEE these things being done, and the lessons learned have stuck with me. I'm better off from having watched him and pestered him with a few questions, than if I hadn't.

If I learned several useful things in an hour by watching a pro, by extension shouldn't it stand to reason that most rookie wedding photographers would learn even more, if they worked as assistants to an experienced wedding photographer for a few weeks / months, under varying conditions and situations?

Please note that I am in no way insisting that only people who've assisted professional wedding photographers can do a good job. What I AM saying is that IMHO, if the opportunity presents itself, it makes more sense for a novice to apprentice themselves to an established pro (while at the same time experimenting around and building their skill set), as opposed to just trying to figure everything out by trial and error.

Purely FYI

--
Tom
 
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FayeFaithM said:
I literally laughed out loud when I saw this.

Tedolph, you must be a lawyer with photography as a hobby!

Thanks for the tips. I appreciate it.

Few things I been reading and would like to clarify. Maybe I gave off a wrong impression or maybe you assumed. Maybe a little of both!

I have three books, thanks for the advice on me reading them, I am doing just that. That's why I got them!

I tend to look for more answers on youtube because I am a visual learner. It's difficult for me to read instructions and then understand it right away. That's why I go on youtube looking for a visual explanation!

Good news though, recently just got an Ebook that after an explanation it comes with a video to explain everything in full detail and show their explanation, best 10 bucks I spent!

In regards to a photography class. YES, this is great. I would LOVE to go to a photography class and plan on doing just that! I never said I was against this. I recently had a baby though and will have to wait a few months until she is ready to be with out me for more than just a couple of hours! In a few months though, I plan on taking a ton!

In regards to working with a photographer. YES! What better way to become a wedding photographer then to learn from one?! I plan on trying to do this as well! But again, not that its your business, but just had a baby and this too will have to wait! Maybe after those photography classes!

Tedolph. I just got a camera and I don't want to wait till I can take a photography class to start using it to take great pictures. MY way of learning may not be the way YOU learned, but that doesn't make it the wrong way of learning.
Click to expand...
Welcome back....
FayeFaithM said:
Good Luck to you Tedolph!
Click to expand...
We missed you!

Remember, all this stuff is just my opinion.
FayeFaithM said:
-Faye
Click to expand...
Tedolph
 
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FayeFaithM said:
I literally laughed out loud when I saw this.

Tedolph, you must be a lawyer with photography as a hobby!

Thanks for the tips. I appreciate it.

Few things I been reading and would like to clarify. Maybe I gave off a wrong impression or maybe you assumed. Maybe a little of both!

I have three books, thanks for the advice on me reading them, I am doing just that. That's why I got them!

I tend to look for more answers on youtube because I am a visual learner. It's difficult for me to read instructions and then understand it right away. That's why I go on youtube looking for a visual explanation!

Good news though, recently just got an Ebook that after an explanation it comes with a video to explain everything in full detail and show their explanation, best 10 bucks I spent!

In regards to a photography class. YES, this is great. I would LOVE to go to a photography class and plan on doing just that! I never said I was against this. I recently had a baby though and will have to wait a few months until she is ready to be with out me for more than just a couple of hours! In a few months though, I plan on taking a ton!

In regards to working with a photographer. YES! What better way to become a wedding photographer then to learn from one?! I plan on trying to do this as well! But again, not that its your business, but just had a baby and this too will have to wait! Maybe after those photography classes!

Tedolph. I just got a camera and I don't want to wait till I can take a photography class to start using it to take great pictures. MY way of learning may not be the way YOU learned, but that doesn't make it the wrong way of learning.

Good Luck to you Tedolph!

-Faye
Click to expand...
Hi Faye

Great post. It appears that this thread is ending on a positive note with the OP happy, and that is the way things are supposed to go (but unfortunately sometimes do not).

It sounds like you are on the right track. I (and everyone else, I'm sure) wish you all the best. Be sure and post some images for us, as you progress in your photography.
 
I agree! I never said I didn't want to take photography classes or become a second shooter for a wedding photographer. What better way to learn wedding photography then by a wedding photographer?! They can tell you tips and advice on what they do for such a fast pace environment! Until I get the opportunity, I am trying to learn as much as I can in other ways!

Thanks for the input!
 
FayeFaithM said:
I agree! I never said I didn't want to take photography classes or become a second shooter for a wedding photographer. What better way to learn wedding photography then by a wedding photographer?! They can tell you tips and advice on what they do for such a fast pace environment! Until I get the opportunity, I am trying to learn as much as I can in other ways!

Thanks for the input!
Click to expand...
I know you didn't, Faye. My responses were to that other person (the same one who said photographers with qualifications were to be avoided). He was the one who sneered at the concept of training, or apprenticeships to a seasoned professional. I don't know what got him so spun up...I guess it was when I challenged his stating as fact "nearly all good wedding photographers are entirely self trained". Oh well.

Again, good luck to you, your photography, and the baby!
 
Hi Faye

Here's a link to a recent post from someone who had expressed interest in doing photography for pay, especially weddings. Don't know if you will have the time to put into it that he does (given your duties as a mom) but it does serve to further substantiate the idea that apprenticing one's self to a professional photographer to better learn the trade is a viable concept.

By the way, in the referenced thread's initial post, the guy was afraid he would suffer burnout if he did work for hire. It appears that is happily not at all the case.

Read the Post *** Update Tom ***

In case the link does not work, here's a cut and paste of what the individual said:

"Well not even a half a year later I've got paid gigs looming. I accosted a dozen or so good wedding photographers in town and while most blew me off, a few let me carry their bags and shoot unpaid. One was so impressed with my drive, motivation, and images that I will be getting paid as a second shooter this month. I think I'll keep on this path for a while--building my portfolio, less pressure than the primary photog, getting exposure to the biz, and making a little extra cash. I love the rush of a wedding and I certainly am not backing down from photographing my own kids and other interests--both of which I have done since starting this endeavor.

The biggest burnout and logistical challenge I've found is in managing files, backing up, and cleaning gear. It feels like quite a chore, but I certainly haven't lost love for the hobby as both a craft and a passion."
 
That sounds like good advice. I used old studio black/white cameras, with separate light meters, years ago, but l've probably forgotten every thing about speeds, apertures, how much light, the numbers to set the speed & light exposure for; I need to go and buy a good beginner's digital manual. Is that the book you just suggested?

I'm not looking to photograph weddings & people running, sports,ect. I like set-ups that sit still, even portraits. (well, i did a beach at sunset, with a Fuji throwaway camera, that was ffun!)My cat, close up, posing.(that might take faster speed, heh heh.)I am also a painter,I am used to painting people sitting.

.Thank you for all the information, I can use it too. Very decent of you! :)
 
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