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EM-5 owner thoughts on the EM5-II

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Gakuranman

Gakuranman

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Like most of us here, I've just finished reading about the latest developments from Olympus and the announcement of the E-M5-II. I've been with m43 since the E-P1 and consistently moved up as the format matured.

I currently own the E-M5 (my second body after smashing the first - a lesson in not leaving camera equipment and a metal tripod on the back seat of a car) and have been a very happy user. For me, the E-M5 marked the point when Olympus m43 offerings finally matched and beat Panasonic and could rival equivalent DSLR models in performance and image quality.

I've held the E-M1 in hand and been wowed by its ergonomics as well as all the bells and whistles but the lack of a significant jump in image quality and mediocre video means I haven't found reason to upgrade yet. So, the E-M5-II was of interest...

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After reading some reviews and viewing samples however, I'm left feeling like the E-M5-II is not quite there for me as an advanced user. Several points stand out as being significant 'deal breakers'.

Video: While it's obvious Olympus is now finally taking this seriously with a variety of video framerates and other pro features, the video processing and final image quality still pales in comparison to the GH-4. The difference can be seen clearly on dpreview's sample preview: http://www.dpreview.com/previews/olympus-om-d-e-m5-ii/5

Sensor-jump: The magnificent image stabilisation that I've come to depend on so much, while apparently improved and offering 'steadicam'-like stabilisation for video, leaves much to be desired in actual use. Robin Wong's video shows horrible jumping around of the image, in contrast to what should be smooth transitions if we're comparing it to a steadicam. Undoubtedly, that the 5-axis technology can even stabilise the video this much is a huge feat, but as an end user I can't see myself using it with the sensor-jump problem. Perhaps Robin is just really bad at making smooth transitions? I find that hard to imagine...

Watch at fullscreen in full HD:

40MP Images: An interesting feature, but one really limited to studio photography and perfectly still landscapes. I don't personally have a use for this, as I would only think to take a 40MP still if I knew I had a winning image. For professionals who have scouted locations and are shooting for a particular coveted image however, this is definitely a cool feature to enable shooting much larger images without a bigger and heavier camera.

***************

I'm being ultra-critical here though. If I were looking to buy into m43 as a first time user or upgrade from the PL series, there would be no question that it's the right camera. The top-plate re-design looks amazing, and all the trickle-down E-M1 features are nice-to-have. Olympus Japan are also offering a trade-in system where new buyers can sell their existing E-M5 or other Olympus camera when buying the E-M5-II. I might be tempted to do this, but there's no information on the sort of money I might make back on selling the E-M5, and from experience I doubt it would be better than aftermarket sales anyway.

So I'm still really on the fence waiting for the next generation E-M2/E-M1-II. I can't forget how great the E-M1 felt in my hands when I tried one. Ergonomically it's much better than my E-M5 (and probably the E-M5-II), but without a significant jump in image quality or GH-4 level video, it too doesn't feel worth the upgrade. We can reasonably expect the next flagship Olympus camera to have 4k mode and probably match the GH-4. Maybe then can even figure out smooth video transitions..?

Right now then, I eagerly await 2016 and the E-M2/E-M1-II. Unless of course, somebody wants my E-M5 at a decent price! :)
 
Robin made the point of saying he's a real newbie when it comes to video. He doesn't normally shot video and admits he doesn't know anything about video shooting techniques. I watched the video and I think the jumps were Robin's bad technique and not the camera's fault. In my experience it takes a few days of seriously playing with video to get the hang of it.

The Camera Store guys liked the video from the camera apparently much better than DPR did and they are usually very critical about video on most cameras.

The apparent ability to refocus during the shooting of a video using the touch screen and have it slowly and smoothly change the focus without a lot of searching is certainly better than the E-M5 and a feature I would find very useful.

I'm not one to easily or quickly switch cameras but I'm liking the new features of the Mark II a lot over my E-M5.

****
 
I'm not seeing anything I need in the E-M5 MKII that warrants a reason to upgrade.
  • I can and already do sensor shift with bigger files and better results.
  • I don't shoot video and if I did shoot video I would be more interested in the GH4
  • The GH4 has scaling for C mount lenses meaning you can get out of the lens trap of Micro Four Thirds when it comes to video and actually go out and get yourself some cinema lenses.
  • There is no lens hell with the GH4 when you want to go wider than 14mm, there is lens hell when you want to do the same with an OM-D
  • The GH4 fits cinema lenses the OM-D does not.
It resolves perhaps one thing over the E-M5 and that's really just the fact it has an electronic shutter mode which resolves shutter shock on lenses such as the 40-150. It doesn't offer anything else of significance to the general photo shooter.

The stabilised video is very good, as is the 60fps shooting mode, however, it doesn't have the one thing the GH4 has to make video a killer option on these bodies as a Super 16 replacement and that's the ability to mount C mount lenses without vignette.

It still rates a poor second behind the GH4, if you don't understand why that's the case for video, well you don't understand video.
 
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And I suspect that most folks looking at the Mk II will have as primary interests the stills capabilities. I agree with you: it's not GH-4 competition, but I don't think Oly is trying to position it as such. Robin Wong is typical; outstanding still photographer who's just now starting to play with video. That combination will accelerate over time, and we have the GH-4 to thank for that.

It's a nice camera, but I'm putting my next $1,000 to the 12-40. Honestly, the only thing I'd like to have is the newer VF. With my RRS grip/baseplate/L plate, my E-M5 just snuggles into my hand. Feels very natural. I don't think it's going to cause the stir the E-M5 did, but it's an excellent upgrade in a variety of ways. I hope they sell a bunch of them.
 
Pretty much with you. One of the things I was really hoping for in the E-M5 successor was a really useable CAF system. The ii is a very nice camera. Vastly better video, but I'm not a real video guy so that's mostly wasted on me. I don't see anything suggesting significant improvements in sensor output. Certainly a very nice camera with some very nice upgrades, but I'm not sure it will get me pull my wallet out. I'll keep an open mind.
 
I'm just saying if I had an E-M5, which I do, I'd be more tempted to compliment it with a GH4 and not an OM-D E-M5 MKII. All of the shortcomings of the E-M5 can be overcome by using slightly different techniques except for the 60fps video.
  • If I'm wanting video capability as I may well do next, I'd find it better money well invested in a Panasonic GH4.
  • If I'm wanting larger images I'd be more interested in learning how to do stitching and photo stacking which costs me nothing.
Sure I don't get the instant gratification of sensor shift, but the instant gratification of sensor shift can be put next to the instant gratification of sweep panorama, where both will deliver inferior results vs. learning how to stack images and stitch images.
  • I can still put together a larger photo by stitching images rather than one photo that is much of the same.
  • I can create a canvas with photo stitching that you could never imagine with this 40megapixel trick.
  • The limit of this stitching technique is one photo, the limit of stitching in software is a canvas as big as you like if you have enough computer hardware to render a file as you so wish.
I'm not meaningfully derisive towards the OM-D MKII for any particular reason. It just really doesn't offer a whole lot that represents going into stores and spending $1200 on if you already have an OM-D. You would be better off spending that money on a body that could do something meaningful like a GH4 that can mount C mount lenses and does 4K or on an EM1 which you can use to mount Four Thirds lenses, if you have that specific need.

I just don't see the specific need to upgrade to the MK II unless you like walking out in the street with $1200 and setting it on fire just to see the reaction of people walking down the street. You can get better value with newer lenses, or a body which compliments the capabilities of the OM-D such as the Panasonic GH4, or OM-D E-M1.

some men aren't looking for anything logical like money. They can't be bought bullied, reasoned or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

some men aren't looking for anything logical like money. They can't be bought bullied, reasoned or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.
 
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That's good to know ****. I hope we see some better video out of more experienced shooters so that we know it's at least possible to work around the issue. I'm still not entirely sure this is all user error though, seeing the way the image jumps to try and compensate for camera movement. It's very suggestive of the sensor moving to accommodate.
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Website: http://gakuran.com
Haikyo / Urbex: http://gakuran.com/category/haikyo-ruins/
 
I actually just bought an E-M5 at $599.00. I did a lot of research on M43 before getting the camera and was looking for the best lens body combination I could find for under $1,500. I have been shooting mainly Nikon full frame with a D800 and D600 but was looking for a capable small camera I can carry anywhere for travel and general street photography. I was torn between the E-M5 and the E-M10. I wanted to have the extra money to spend on the 12-40 f2.8. I settled on the E-M5 because I felt the weather sealing and build quality outweighed the feature enhancements of the E-M10. I got the E-M5 with the 12-40 along with the RSS grip literally days before the announcement of the E-M5II.

Looking at the specifications of the newer model, I'm happy with my decision. I saved $500 over the newer model and have a camera with about the same image quality and with an outstanding lens to boot. The features mentioned don't provide me with anything substantially over what I have to produce the image I want, and I had $500 to put to a great lens. I could understand why someone would want the latest and greatest, but you really have to ask yourself if those new features are really going to help you produce better pictures. and be worth the substantial extra investment. In my case, the answer is no
 
I've been happy with my E-M5 (other than some ergonomic and cheap knob issues). When they started publishing the rumors about the E-M5 II, I thought to myself, "you're kidding, right....same sensor, same MP's - why bother?"

But since it was released and we now know all the features - not to mention (IMO) the improved appearance of the camera, along with additional knob placement, etc., I've reconsidered my initial views. So I will eventually sell off the E-M5 and get this E-M5 II. Of course, it won't be for another 6 months or so (I love for a camera to be out awhile so that issues can be reported with subsequent firmware updates being released...if that were the case).

I'm still not a video user - never have been, and I don't think I'll do so in the foreseeable future. But like anything else, that could change. But for the moment, video is not a game changer for me personally, and I suspect quite a few other people are in the game just for the still image shooting only.

Nope - I think the E-M5 is stirring up quite alot of interest - even among E-M1 users. It should sell well. And I've been saying it ever since they initially released the E-1 back in 2004 or so...Olympus is innovative - you've got to hand that to them.
 
mring1 said:
And I suspect that most folks looking at the Mk II will have as primary interests the stills capabilities. I agree with you: it's not GH-4 competition, but I don't think Oly is trying to position it as such. Robin Wong is typical; outstanding still photographer who's just now starting to play with video. That combination will accelerate over time, and we have the GH-4 to thank for that.

It's a nice camera, but I'm putting my next $1,000 to the 12-40. Honestly, the only thing I'd like to have is the newer VF. With my RRS grip/baseplate/L plate, my E-M5 just snuggles into my hand. Feels very natural. I don't think it's going to cause the stir the E-M5 did, but it's an excellent upgrade in a variety of ways. I hope they sell a bunch of them.
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I agree that Robin is new to videography, but with his years of photography skills, he does know how to hold a camera steady, whether taking stills or video. Learning how to shoot video is another ball game for sure, but as far as holding the video cam steady, he doesn't need to acquire new skills in that department. The jiggling effect he is encountering, is not from him, but the camera. I have done a lot of videography over the years with numerous cams, and if video is what you want to do, then get the proper equipment. As far as image stabilization is concerned, you will never get a proper stable hand held video clip from one of these cameras. In my experience, there is not a better consumer video stabilization system out there that can compete with Sony's balanced optical system. There is nothing like it on the market today - period! Check out this video of how it works. If you really want a camera to produce exceptional video, then look no further. With this system, you can practically run with this cam and get stable video. I don't care what still camera you use for video, it won't compare with this:


Cheers

Wayne
 
Speaking for ergonomics one can get the nice Grip for his EM5 mkI and seriously upgrade it without loose all that money of a trade to upgrade.

Speaking for the rest of the new MKMII for sure is a more capable camera but not any better from the mkI and thats why Olympus didn't dare to say it EM6, although is a diferent camera though.

Shutter speed 1/8000 for sure a serious upgrade but I can do it for 1/4000 too with ISO LOW or one of my ND filters. is there any serious hobbyist without some ND filters....?

Focus Peaking, I can do it without it too.... Bottom line I think this is a function for video shooters and I am not.

EVF it has a better one... EM5 has a really good one too... so...?

400 mpxls...? I don't think I need them...

Flip around screen... well I use a plastic pany G5 for these special occasions and really I have a love/hate relationship with them.

Timelapse/HDR/wifi etc.... there are so many solutions available... who cares...??

So whats left..? well its new tiny flip around flash yes really worth an upgrade from mkI to mkII, and the centered to the lens tripod mount I suppose and some accessories like its metal plate grip... but I can wait 2-3 years... until then I hope to find this new tiny flash in a good price...

--
www.spiridakis.gr
 
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Spiridakis Michael said:
Speaking for ergonomics one can get the nice Grip for his EM5 mkI and seriously upgrade it without loose all that money of a trade to upgrade.

Speaking for the rest of the new MKMII for sure is a more capable camera but not any better from the mkI and thats why Olympus didn't dare to say it EM6, although is a diferent camera though.

Shutter speed 1/8000 for sure a serious upgrade but I can do it for 1/4000 too with ISO LOW or one of my ND filters. is there any serious hobbyist without some ND filters....?

Focus Peaking, I can do it without it too.... Bottom line I think this is a function for video shooters and I am not.

EVF it has a better one... EM5 has a really good one too... so...?

400 mpxls...? I don't think I need them...
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You forgot to say that you can do this too, if you wanted, with Photoacute, for instance.
 
Gakuranman said:
That's good to know ****. I hope we see some better video out of more experienced shooters so that we know it's at least possible to work around the issue. I'm still not entirely sure this is all user error though, seeing the way the image jumps to try and compensate for camera movement. It's very suggestive of the sensor moving to accommodate.
--
Website: http://gakuran.com
Haikyo / Urbex: http://gakuran.com/category/haikyo-ruins/
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Here ya go:

Loading…

johnbrawley.wordpress.com

LONG review of the E-M5II from the standpoint of a working cinematographer. TL;DR: Flawed, but good enough for serious work.
 
Gakuranman said:
That Sony is great!

I found this video which really highlights the issues with the E-M5-II:


--
Website: http://gakuran.com
Haikyo / Urbex: http://gakuran.com/category/haikyo-ruins/
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That was a very nicely done video regarding IS of the MKII. Although improved, it will not equal that of the Sony with its balanced optical steadyshot system. The down side, of course, is having to carry around a second camera, but if video is important to you, then its a minor inconvenience. In my books, I will go with the Sony camcorder for video simply because if it produces video the best it can be at a consumer level. Here's another one for you. My wife owns a small Sony HX9V. In my estimation from all the video shot with it, it produces a much better steady shot video than what I have seen from the MKII. Bottom line - get the right tool for the job. If you are keen on video, then get a video camera. Its as simple as that.

Wayne
 
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M43 Dude said:
  • The GH4 has scaling for C mount lenses meaning you can get out of the lens trap of Micro Four Thirds when it comes to video and actually go out and get yourself some cinema lenses.
  • There is no lens hell with the GH4 when you want to go wider than 14mm, there is lens hell when you want to do the same with an OM-D
  • The GH4 fits cinema lenses the OM-D does not.
Click to expand...
You've completely lost me, dude.

Are you saying that C mount is the only mount for cinema lenses? You ever heard of PL mount? You ever heard of SpeedBooster? You ever heard of Rokinon 10mm f/2.8? What?

I don't think of C Mount as the mount for cinema lenses. I think of it as a mount for cheap old video lenses. PL mount is the mount for cinema lensees, for both 16mm and 35mm film, and they work just great on any MFT camera.
 
Do we know if the following will work:

-Myset customizations on the mode dial?

-automatic zoom assist for 17mm f1.8 manual snap ring focus? I knwo that this does not work for the EM10 or EM1 for this particular lens but hoping....

-auto shut off of EVF(and keeping it off) when articulated screen in use?

-comments on the eyecup vs the original Em-5 one that seems to either fall off or break (i have the ep-11 now and its rock solid!)

-sensitivity setting for EVF to trigger. Shooting from the hip does not work really well for street shooting...i suppose with the articulated screen we have a bit of a challenge to keep things discreet. =)

-bkting mapped to a button

-

...Basically everything that i was looking for in a firmware update that never came for the EM-5 but was hoping.

Me, myself and I are tempted but actually do not like the fully articulated screen, the required change in at least part of the grip, the continual use of the triangle rings and lugs. Lack of PD sensors that would have likely helped improve C-AF.

I do like the higher rez EVF (yay!), better 5-way IBIS (unsure how it works but seems to be more robust), the meatier default grip, the better control dials and buttons, locks for dials, and the 2 way switch. Some of those things i would definitely benefit from.

that all said....to lay out another 1100? i just bought a 17mm f1.8 and woudl like to get a few more primes so, no, not the time to shell out for another body. I will live with my EM-5 for at least another year or two. =)
 
cornellra said:
....to lay out another 1100? i just bought a 17mm f1.8 and woudl like to get a few more primes so, no, not the time to shell out for another body. I will live with my EM-5 for at least another year or two. =)
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The sensor-shift feature is very interesting, but I really (really) don't want a hard-drive full of 63MP files.

If on the other hand, Olympus offered 2x2 binning in-camera to produce a 16(15.75)MP 12-bit "raw" output, that would make the E-M5-II very interesting.

BartyL
 
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