What's the Difference: P/S vs. Mirrorless.

Greg A A · May 12, 2014

This is absurd. Are you afraid of your own shadow? For at least the US there are no laws against DSLR that don't apply to mirrorless. No hassle unless you are pointing it in someones face to make you a paparazzi. A typical security guard couldn't tell the difference between an A7R and a D3300. Ah.. you have Nikon, the security guard is going to get you. This is a ploy to make you fear owning a DSLR so you can spend more money on a mirrorless with minimal benefit.

007peter said:
Vinylly said:

Neither has mirrors and neither are dslr or 'bridge cameras'. A Canon s 120 has almost as much manual control as a mirrorless which is bigger.

Click to expand...

I know you're being disparaging against mirror-less, and the truth is there isn't much difference other than:

1. Big Sensor (not counting the expensive $700+ Sigma DP or Fuji XS)

2. Interchangeable lens

That being said, I still prefer a Mirrorless over DSLR in today's DSLR-Hostile environements. I live in LA/OC, and I can no longer walk about in public my canon dSLR + 70-200 f/4 without being assaulted by security guards. People just assume you're a paparazzi unless you have your children/wife with you in a dance recital, or sport events.

LOL Silly nonense... never had any problem with a DSLR. You have every right to be anywhere with a DSLR as a mirrorless. Mirrorless are designed to look like a DSLR just smaller. This is nothing other than scare tactics by the mirrorless crowd.

Vinylly · May 12, 2014

So the $2,000 Leica X Verio and the $2,800 Sony RX1R with fixed lenses are just expensive P/S except for the sensor size.

Vinylly · May 13, 2014

The Sony RX1 already has a FF sensor and it's P/S.

EinsteinsGhost · May 13, 2014

Vinylly said:
The Sony RX1 already has a FF sensor and it's P/S.

That leads us to the question: What is P/S camera? Is any camera with a fixed lens a P/S camera?

Vinylly · May 13, 2014

Actually, you are right, there is a hostility toward large DSLR's which we have experienced: An example. Our family went to a Barnham and Baily Circus. My son-in-law had a big Nikon DSLR camera with a big zoom lens. I had my little NEX 7 with kit zoom. The guard let me pass but would not allow my son-in-law through. He had to take his camera back to the car. After that he bought a Canon S110. I think his big DSLR now occupies the closet.

brianj · May 13, 2014

EinsteinsGhost said:
EinsteinsGhost said:

The Sony RX1 already has a FF sensor and it's P/S.

Click to expand...

That leads us to the question: What is P/S camera? Is any camera with a fixed lens a P/S camera?

P&S is a mode of shooting, not a camera type, any camera can be used in P&S mode, just turn it to AUTO. What the question should ask is what is the difference between a fixed lens camera and a mirrorless. In fact all non DSLR cameras are mirrorless.

Brian

Lab D · May 13, 2014

jackdan said:
Lab D said:

brianj said:

Lab D said:

http://camerasize.com/compact/#190,475,491,ha,f

The Canon s120 body is larger than some mirrorless cameras.

Click to expand...

Lucky they don't show them with lenses mounted or it would be a different story.

Brian

Click to expand...

You cut off where I mentioned, "that F/5.7 lens on a P&S is nothing to be proud of."

Click to expand...

Possibly because that is incorrect information. according to Camera Labs review, "the S120 may lay claim to being the World's slimmest camera with an f1.8 lens at the time of writing,"

F/1.8 - F/5.7. It is a 5x zoom and most of it is closer to f/5.7. Did you not read the review you mentioned??

PicOne · May 13, 2014

Vinylly said:
Actually, you are right, there is a hostility toward large DSLR's which we have experienced: An example. Our family went to a Barnham and Baily Circus. My son-in-law had a big Nikon DSLR camera with a big zoom lens. I had my little NEX 7 with kit zoom. The guard let me pass but would not allow my son-in-law through. He had to take his camera back to the car. After that he bought a Canon S110. I think his big DSLR now occupies the closet.

Synonyms of Interchangeable: identical, alike, uniform, undifferentiated, indistiguishable

Shoulda been "Changeable". People like to use fancy words I guess. Who wants a collection of interchangeable lenses?

Greg A A · May 13, 2014

Vinylly said:
Actually, you are right, there is a hostility toward large DSLR's which we have experienced: An example. Our family went to a Barnham and Baily Circus. My son-in-law had a big Nikon DSLR camera with a big zoom lens. I had my little NEX 7 with kit zoom. The guard let me pass but would not allow my son-in-law through. He had to take his camera back to the car. After that he bought a Canon S110. I think his big DSLR now occupies the closet.

Pure mirrorless scare tactics. Anything to try to keep mirrorless in business.

jackdan · May 13, 2014

Lab D said:
jackdan said:

Lab D said:

brianj said:

Lab D said:

http://camerasize.com/compact/#190,475,491,ha,f

The Canon s120 body is larger than some mirrorless cameras.

Click to expand...

Lucky they don't show them with lenses mounted or it would be a different story.

Brian

Click to expand...

You cut off where I mentioned, "that F/5.7 lens on a P&S is nothing to be proud of."

Click to expand...

Possibly because that is incorrect information. according to Camera Labs review, "the S120 may lay claim to being the World's slimmest camera with an f1.8 lens at the time of writing,"

Click to expand...

F/1.8 - F/5.7. It is a 5x zoom and most of it is closer to f/5.7. Did you not read the review you mentioned??

Tit for Tat. Just a taste of your own medicine.

Interesting how your f/5.7 lens has now turned out to be an f/1.8 - f/5.7 lens. You referred to the s120 lens, which is f/1.8 - f/5.7 as "that F/5.7 (sic) lens", by omitting the range, which started at f/1.8 you deliberately misrepresented the lens and now you are trying to employ a logical fallicy called moving the goal posts. The goal posts remains the fact that you tried to pass off a f/1.8 - f/5.7 lens as as a fixed f/5.7 only. Anything else you say will be simply be another attempt to move the goal posts.

rxbot · May 14, 2014

Electronic viewfinder, interchangeable lens, all P&S are mirrorless not all mirrorless have viewfinders, some have fixed lens like GR ,Nikon A, Sony RX 10 or RX 1.

jrtrent · May 14, 2014

KCook said:
Also, a compact with zoom will make you fuss with a tiny lug next to the shutter button to control the zoom. Most zoom lenses for mirrorless cameras (but not all) have you twist a ring on the lens barrel for zoom, the same as a DSLR zoom lens.

I suppose it depends on what a person considers "fussy." I appreciate a manual zoom ring, too, but one of my favorite zoom features has turned out to be the step-zoom feature on my Ricoh and Nikon compact cameras. Long accustomed to single focal length prime lenses, I love being able to program in any combination of focal lengths I like: 28, 35, 50, 85, 105, 135, 200, and 300mm (on the Ricoh CX3; the Nikon P7100 tops out at 200mm). I generally keep mine set to start up at 50mm, with 85mm available as my only other, and seldom-used, option, but any combination a person wants can be made instantly and easily available by bumping that little lug.

alpha90290 · May 14, 2014

Vinylly said:
Actually, you are right, there is a hostility toward large DSLR's which we have experienced: An example. Our family went to a Barnham and Baily Circus. My son-in-law had a big Nikon DSLR camera with a big zoom lens. I had my little NEX 7 with kit zoom. The guard let me pass but would not allow my son-in-law through. He had to take his camera back to the car. After that he bought a Canon S110. I think his big DSLR now occupies the closet.

I believe the guard thought that your son-in-law is a Paparazzi.

In many places, they allow smaller camera to go in but not the DSLR.

jrtrent · May 14, 2014

007peter said:
. . . I know this post is meant to be disparaging, but make my next camera a Point/Shoot like Shining Red or even Girly pink. At least I can walk about enjoying photography without being assaulted.

I haven't had issues with security guards, but when using a DSLR, I have been confronted by just ordinary people around me at local parks or just walking around town, being asked in an angry tone, "What are you taking pictures for?" or "Who told you you could take pictures here?" On the other hand, a small compact like the Contax i4R got reactions like, "What a cute camera!" and "Take my picture!" Unfortunately, the i4R was also the only camera I've had stolen from me.

My preference is to use a DSLR (love that viewfinder), and when I'm out on vacation, at typical, touristy places, it's never an issue, but when carried where people live or work, there has been a definite, negative reaction. It's understandable--the forward-jutting profile of most dslr's, caused by the pop-up flash on the prism, the large handgrips, and the zoom lenses (even the humble kit zoom), do create an "aggressive" look to the camera, almost like you're pointing a weapon. A shirt-pocketable compact, especially those with folded optics so the lens doesn't need to protrude at all, doesn't seem to draw people's attention or ire.

jackdan · May 14, 2014

Lab D said:
jackdan said:

Lab D said:

brianj said:

Lab D said:

http://camerasize.com/compact/#190,475,491,ha,f

The Canon s120 body is larger than some mirrorless cameras.

Click to expand...

Lucky they don't show them with lenses mounted or it would be a different story.

Brian

Click to expand...

You cut off where I mentioned, "that F/5.7 lens on a P&S is nothing to be proud of."

Click to expand...

Possibly because that is incorrect information. according to Camera Labs review, "the S120 may lay claim to being the World's slimmest camera with an f1.8 lens at the time of writing,"

Click to expand...

F/1.8 - F/5.7. It is a 5x zoom and most of it is closer to f/5.7. Did you not read the review you mentioned??

per Camera labs review:

"Like most smaller enthusiast class compacts, the S120 may start with a bright focal ratio at the wide end, but quickly slows down as you zoom-in. You'll only enjoy f1.8 at the widest 24mm equivalent, as just nudging the zoom into 27mm slows it to f2. The next stop at f2.8 occurs at 34mm, followed by f4 at 55mm, f5 at 96mm and finally f5.7 at 120mm."

http://www.cameralabs.com/reviews/Canon_PowerShot_S120/

DJF77 · May 14, 2014

You can use any camera as a point and shoot, including top end mirrorless and DSLR. if you want to experiment with creativity then you don't want a P&S.

007peter · May 14, 2014

jrtrent said:
007peter said:

. . . I know this post is meant to be disparaging, but make my next camera a Point/Shoot like Shining Red or even Girly pink. At least I can walk about enjoying photography without being assaulted.

Click to expand...

I haven't had issues with security guards, but when using a DSLR, I have been confronted by just ordinary people around me at local parks or just walking around town, being asked in an angry tone, "What are you taking pictures for?" or "Who told you you could take pictures here?" On the other hand, a small compact like the Contax i4R got reactions like, "What a cute camera!" and "Take my picture!" Unfortunately, the i4R was also the only camera I've had stolen from me.

My preference is to use a DSLR (love that viewfinder), and when I'm out on vacation, at typical, touristy places, it's never an issue, but when carried where people live or work, there has been a definite, negative reaction. It's understandable--the forward-jutting profile of most dslr's, caused by the pop-up flash on the prism, the large handgrips, and the zoom lenses (even the humble kit zoom), do create an "aggressive" look to the camera, almost like you're pointing a weapon. A shirt-pocketable compact, especially those with folded optics so the lens doesn't need to protrude at all, doesn't seem to draw people's attention or ire.

Same here, my preference is DSLR (when I can get away with it) In Asia, I can walk-about all day without being assault by anyone. But here in the USA, people are PARANOID, and SECURITY GUARD are AxxHxxx

This video are very close to my own confrontations:

My problem is that photographer are treated like a terrorist. They presumme GUILTY until proven innocent

Trafford · May 14, 2014

rxbot said:
Electronic viewfinder, interchangeable lens, all P&S are mirrorless not all mirrorless have viewfinders, some have fixed lens like GR ,Nikon A, Sony RX 10 or RX 1.

I was watching an advert for a Carburettor-less car on my Vacuum tube-less TV this morning.

Camley · May 14, 2014

Vinylly said:
Neither has mirrors and neither are dslr or 'bridge cameras'. A Canon s 120 has almost as much manual control as a mirrorless which is bigger.

There is certainly a spread of "mirror less" cameras which is a good thing.

Sensor size is one difference between P&S and mirror less (although even this is becoming a bit blurred theses days).

When people say mirror less, then generally mean cameras with interchangeable lenses and more controls to fine tune the images.

Perhaps the biggest differences are price and image quality when the sun isn't shining!

crashpc · May 15, 2014

jackdan said:
Tit for Tat. Just a taste of your own medicine.

Interesting how your f/5.7 lens has now turned out to be an f/1.8 - f/5.7 lens. You referred to the s120 lens, which is f/1.8 - f/5.7 as "that F/5.7 (sic) lens", by omitting the range, which started at f/1.8 you deliberately misrepresented the lens and now you are trying to employ a logical fallicy called moving the goal posts. The goal posts remains the fact that you tried to pass off a f/1.8 - f/5.7 lens as as a fixed f/5.7 only. Anything else you say will be simply be another attempt to move the goal posts.

Lol is this some kind of recession? :-D

What's the Difference: P/S vs. Mirrorless.

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