Help with Understanding Auto-bracketing and its relation to HDR

MachLite · Feb 27, 2014

Dear all,

I've tried frantically to search for info pertaining to auto-bracketing and HDR but the more I read, the more confused I get. :-(

Would be pleased to seek some clarifications:

1. Do most people use auto-bracketing for HDR shots?

2. I came across this in a camera manual but I don't really get what this means:
"Exposure bracketing: 3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV" -- Could someone shed some light please?

What's the difference between the above and this: "3 continuous exposures selectable, in 0.3 or 0.7-stop increment"?

And what would be the difference between the above 2 and this: "3 shots +/- 2 EV, 1/2 or 1/3-stop increments"

3. I'm keen to buy the D5300 with a view to emphasise on taking HDR photos. The D5300 specifications page says exposure bracketing is in 3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV.
(a) I'd like to ask if such a setting would be appropriate for taking HDR photos via auto-bracketing?

(b) I'm currently using a Sony A55 which has 3 continuous exposures selectable, in 0.3 or 0.7-stop increment. However, I find this to be a major hindrance because the auto-bracketing function only allows me to take shots with at best, a 0.7 EV difference (e.g. -0.7 EV, 0, 0.7 EV), which isn't significant enough to make HDR shots look nice. How different is the D5300 in auto-bracketing compared to the Sony A55?

4. Any advantages shooting manually over using auto bracketing?

Thanks in advance!

leno · Feb 27, 2014

MachLite said:
Dear all,

I've tried frantically to search for info pertaining to auto-bracketing and HDR but the more I read, the more confused I get. :-(

Would be pleased to seek some clarifications:

1. Do most people use auto-bracketing for HDR shots?

If they find it works for them but it is down to the situation a lot will want more control

MachLite said:
2. I came across this in a camera manual but I don't really get what this means:
"Exposure bracketing: 3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV" -- Could someone shed some light please?

What's the difference between the above and this: "3 continuous exposures selectable, in 0.3 or 0.7-stop increment"?

And what would be the difference between the above 2 and this: "3 shots +/- 2 EV, 1/2 or 1/3-stop increments"

I can't do the math but try and think of it as 3 stops on a dial, it could be 3 4 5 or A B C or -1 0 +1. They are just increments one below middle, one at middle and one above.

MachLite said:
I can't do the math but try and think of it as 3 stops on a dial, it could be 3 4 5 or A B C or -1 0 +1. They are just increments one below middle, one at middle and one above.

3. I'm keen to buy the D5300 with a view to emphasise on taking HDR photos. The D5300 specifications page says exposure bracketing is in 3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV.
(a) I'd like to ask if such a setting would be appropriate for taking HDR photos via auto-bracketing?

Yes may be, that's why one reason it has the function but manual also works

MachLite said:
Yes may be, that's why one reason it has the function but manual also works.

(b) I'm currently using a Sony A55 which has 3 continuous exposures selectable, in 0.3 or 0.7-stop increment. However, I find this to be a major hindrance because the auto-bracketing function only allows me to take shots with at best, a 0.7 EV difference (e.g. -0.7 EV, 0, 0.7 EV), which isn't significant enough to make HDR shots look nice

I would suggest that you might need to put more effort in they is no magic auto button for HDR

MachLite said:
.

How different is the D5300 in auto-bracketing compared to the Sony A55?

4. Any advantages shooting manually over using auto bracketing?

Yes you can take more than 3 shots.

MachLite said:
Thanks in advance!

John Deerfield · Feb 27, 2014

MachLite said:
Dear all,

I've tried frantically to search for info pertaining to auto-bracketing and HDR but the more I read, the more confused I get. :-(

Would be pleased to seek some clarifications:

1. Do most people use auto-bracketing for HDR shots?

I can't say what most people do, but if I was shooting HDR, I would be auto-bracketing my shots for the sake of simplicity.

MachLite said:
2. I came across this in a camera manual but I don't really get what this means:
"Exposure bracketing: 3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV" -- Could someone shed some light please?

Well, this is somewhat basic to exposure? With most cameras you can set your exposure increments to either one-third or one-half exposure adjustments. If set to one-third adjustments, it takes you "3-clicks" to move one f/stop. If set to one-half, it takes two clicks to move one f/stop. A camera set to one-third f/stops could bracket images in third stops up to whatever limitation the camera has. Meaning that if the camera only goes to plus or -1 one stop, you could choose +/- .03, .06, or 1.0 adjustments. If the camera went to two stops, the your choices increase to +/- 1.3, 1.6, 2.0. And so on.

MachLite said:
What's the difference between the above and this: "3 continuous exposures selectable, in 0.3 or 0.7-stop increment"?

I don't know, I haven't seen a camera that has only a .07 (roughly two-thirds a stop) adjustment.

MachLite said:
And what would be the difference between the above 2 and this: "3 shots +/- 2 EV, 1/2 or 1/3-stop increments"

That is what I explained above. Typically bracketing is "3-shots". Most cameras bracket these three shots as "normal" followed by negative EV, and finally positive EV (although there are cameras that allow for many other variables). Taking the above into consideration, that camera could bracket 3 shots in any increment up to a 2 f/stop range. IE: +/- .3, .6, 1, 1.3, 1.6, 2. So, you could have "normal", -2 and +2 EV differences.

MachLite said:
3. I'm keen to buy the D5300 with a view to emphasise on taking HDR photos. The D5300 specifications page says exposure bracketing is in 3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV.
(a) I'd like to ask if such a setting would be appropriate for taking HDR photos via auto-bracketing?

Sure. The only limitation would be the amount of EV, meaning if you wanted something greater than a 2 stop (or whatever the camera limitation is) range or more than a 3-shot auto bracket.

MachLite said:
(b) I'm currently using a Sony A55 which has 3 continuous exposures selectable, in 0.3 or 0.7-stop increment. However, I find this to be a major hindrance because the auto-bracketing function only allows me to take shots with at best, a 0.7 EV difference (e.g. -0.7 EV, 0, 0.7 EV), which isn't significant enough to make HDR shots look nice. How different is the D5300 in auto-bracketing compared to the Sony A55?

I would be surprised to learn that the A55 limits you to less than a stop EV bracketing, but I suppose I have heard of stranger things. I don't own a 5300 but I do own several Nikons and I am fairly confident in saying that the 5300 will allow for 3-shot bracketing at any increment up to 2 stops.

MachLite said:
4. Any advantages shooting manually over using auto bracketing?

Only in that you can now choose any exposure variable you want.

scorrpio · Feb 27, 2014

MachLite said:
Dear all,

I've tried frantically to search for info pertaining to auto-bracketing and HDR but the more I read, the more confused I get. :-(

Would be pleased to seek some clarifications:

1. Do most people use auto-bracketing for HDR shots?

Yes, it is a pretty good way to do HDR since it allows taking three images of the same scene in a minimal amount of time and not changing any settings on the camera in between. Minimal chance for camera movement, minimal chance for subject change between shots.

MachLite said:
2. I came across this in a camera manual but I don't really get what this means:
"Exposure bracketing: 3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV" -- Could someone shed some light please?

Bracketing in general has two parameters: range and increment. Range is how far above and below 0 you can go. Increment is by how much you change it with a single click of a dial. The above says you can set your increment to either 1/3 or 1/2 of a stop. Omission of range usually means you can do your bracketing to the same limits as you can do exposure compensation. D5300 allows +/- 5EV compensation, so that is probably the limit on bracketing as well. I am not too familiar with Nikon exposure system, but I believe you have to take dialed exposure compensation into account. I.e. if your compensation is set to -1, you can bracket at most 4 stops, so camera takes shots at -5, -1, +3 EV.

MachLite said:
What's the difference between the above and this: "3 continuous exposures selectable, in 0.3 or 0.7-stop increment"?

These numbers appear to be simply rounded fractions. That is 1/3 = 0.3333333... or 0.3 rounded to 1st decimal. 2/3 = 0.666666... or 0.7 rounded.

So that essentially makes your Sony bracketing: +/- 2/3EV, 1/3-stop increment. Gotta say, that's pretty useless. You can just shoot RAW and easily pull it 1 or more stops either way.

MachLite said:
And what would be the difference between the above 2 and this: "3 shots +/- 2 EV, 1/2 or 1/3-stop increments"

The difference is explicitly specified range: +/-2 2Ev. If you set your increment to 1/2 stop, the most you can 'expand' your bracketing is 4 clicks.

MachLite said:
3. I'm keen to buy the D5300 with a view to emphasise on taking HDR photos. The D5300 specifications page says exposure bracketing is in 3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV.
(a) I'd like to ask if such a setting would be appropriate for taking HDR photos via auto-bracketing?

It really depends on the scene contrast.

MachLite said:
(b) I'm currently using a Sony A55 which has 3 continuous exposures selectable, in 0.3 or 0.7-stop increment. However, I find this to be a major hindrance because the auto-bracketing function only allows me to take shots with at best, a 0.7 EV difference (e.g. -0.7 EV, 0, 0.7 EV), which isn't significant enough to make HDR shots look nice. How different is the D5300 in auto-bracketing compared to the Sony A55?

4. Any advantages shooting manually over using auto bracketing?

Main advantage is you can make sure your + shot gets all the shadow detail, and your - shot gets all the highlights. Or you can take as many shots in whatever increments you think you need.

MachLite said:
Thanks in advance!

MachLite · Feb 27, 2014

Thanks for the help people!

Truth be told, I'm still kind of confused.

COMPARING THIS:
"Exposure bracketing: 3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV" (Nikon D5300)

WITH THIS:
"3 continuous exposures selectable, in 0.3 or 0.7-stop increment" (Sony A55)

which would allow for larger increments in EV?

I know that for the A55, the maximum 0.7 increment means that at best, difference in EV can only be 0.7EV. So for example, (0.3 EV, 1 EV, 1,7 EV) or (-2.7 EV, 2 EV, 2.7 EV). (Pls correct me if I'm wrong)

What about the D5300?

I'm thinking the increments must be higher than the A55 else D5300 users will definitely be making a hell lot of noise just as what A55 users are doing, but this isn't the case.

John Deerfield · Feb 27, 2014

MachLite said:
Thanks for the help people!

Truth be told, I'm still kind of confused.

COMPARING THIS:
"Exposure bracketing: 3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV" (Nikon D5300)

WITH THIS:
"3 continuous exposures selectable, in 0.3 or 0.7-stop increment" (Sony A55)

which would allow for larger increments in EV?

I might suggest downloading and reading the user manuals. The .7 stop increment on the Sony is for flash bracketing. If both cameras are set to one-third stop (I don't know if the Sony allows for 1/2 stop EV adjustments), then the bracketing is the same on both cameras: a range of +/- 2-stops in one-third increments.

MachLite said:
I know that for the A55, the maximum 0.7 increment means that at best, difference in EV can only be 0.7EV. So for example, (0.3 EV, 1 EV, 1,7 EV) or (-2.7 EV, 2 EV, 2.7 EV). (Pls correct me if I'm wrong)

This is wrong. Refer to page 119 of the Sony manual.

MachLite said:
What about the D5300?

What about it? It's a range of 2-stops in one-third (or one half depending on how you have your camera set up) increments. The only difference I see with the Sony is that I don't see where you can set the Sony to 1/2 stop increments.

scorrpio · Feb 27, 2014

MachLite said:
Thanks for the help people!

Truth be told, I'm still kind of confused.

COMPARING THIS:
"Exposure bracketing: 3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV" (Nikon D5300)

WITH THIS:
"3 continuous exposures selectable, in 0.3 or 0.7-stop increment" (Sony A55)

which would allow for larger increments in EV?

I know that for the A55, the maximum 0.7 increment means that at best, difference in EV can only be 0.7EV. So for example, (0.3 EV, 1 EV, 1,7 EV) or (-2.7 EV, 2 EV, 2.7 EV). (Pls correct me if I'm wrong)

What about the D5300?

I'm thinking the increments must be higher than the A55 else D5300 users will definitely be making a hell lot of noise just as what A55 users are doing, but this isn't the case.

Think of bracketing separately from whatever your meter/settings or exposure compensation is. Whatever is in the middle is the '0'. Like kitchen scales, where you reset to zero after putting the empty cup on - no matter how heavy the cup itself, the scale shows 0, so when you add flour to the cup, just the weight of the flour is shown.

It would appear that Sony gives you only 2 bracketing settings: 0.3 (1/3rd stop) over and under, and 0.7 (2/3 stop) over and under. If you set Nikon to use 1/3 increments, you can also set to 1/3 over and under., 2/3 over and under, but you can go further: +/- 1 stop, or 1 1/3 or 1 2/3 etc. Or setting 1/2 increment, you can go 0.5, 1, 1.5 etc over and under.

On my 60D, it is very nicely represented on the screen:

Engaging bracketing drops down the secondary scale from the current exposure position. On this screen, set exposure compensation is 0, and bracketing is set to +/- 2 stops (out of maximum 3). The increments are set to 1/3

thebustos · Feb 27, 2014

MachLite said:
I know that for the A55, the maximum 0.7 increment means that at best, difference in EV can only be 0.7EV. So for example, (0.3 EV, 1 EV, 1,7 EV) or (-2.7 EV, 2 EV, 2.7 EV). (Pls correct me if I'm wrong)

This is wrong on your camera. 3 shots at 0.7EV would give you (-0.7EV, 0EV, +0.7EV). Bracketing gives you one image at 0EV and one at -EV and + EV depending on what you set the increment to. The D5300 seem to let you also set an extra stop or two of EV. So you could have (-1.7EV, 0EV, +1.7EV) if i understand what the other poster said correctly.

I'm sure what it's like on other cameras but Sony cameras do bracketing with a negative and positive EV shot when doing three shots and two negative and two positive EV shots when doing 5 shots.

For instance the A77 lets you do increments of 0.3, 0.5, and 0.7 EV with either 3 or 5 shots, and increments of 2.0 or 3.0 EV with 3 shots. So if you did 0.7 EV with 5 shots you would get (-1.4EV, -0.7EV, 0EV, 0.7EV, 1.4EV).

For HDR purposes you can do things using auto bracketing or manually. Which ever works best for you. When doing it manually, there's a great chance that you might move the camera making it difficult or impossible to line up the exposure in post. However you might be able to expose more accurately for the shadows and highlights doing it manually. Whatever works best for you.

The options on your A55 seem pretty typical of entry level model bracketing options. The D5300 gives you slightly more options, but it should being a new camera whereas yours is about 4-5 years old. I might also look at getting a remote shutter release of some sort to prevent camera shake which may be relevant in some situations.

Mystery member · Feb 27, 2014

MachLite said:
Thanks for the help people!

Truth be told, I'm still kind of confused.

I know that for the A55, the maximum 0.7 increment means that at best, difference in EV can only be 0.7EV. So for example, (0.3 EV, 1 EV, 1,7 EV) or (-2.7 EV, 2 EV, 2.7 EV). (Pls correct me if I'm wrong)

You seem to be confusing the overall range of possible adjustments, say ±2.0, with the increments available for specifying the bracketing. e.g. with this example it could be -0.3/0.0/+0.3, right up to -2.0/0.0/+2.0.

MachLite · Feb 27, 2014

thebustos said:
MachLite said:

I know that for the A55, the maximum 0.7 increment means that at best, difference in EV can only be 0.7EV. So for example, (0.3 EV, 1 EV, 1,7 EV) or (-2.7 EV, 2 EV, 2.7 EV). (Pls correct me if I'm wrong)

Click to expand...

This is wrong on your camera. 3 shots at 0.7EV would give you (-0.7EV, 0EV, +0.7EV). Bracketing gives you one image at 0EV and one at -EV and + EV depending on what you set the increment to. The D5300 seem to let you also set an extra stop or two of EV. So you could have (-1.7EV, 0EV, +1.7EV) if i understand what the other poster said correctly.

I'm sure what it's like on other cameras but Sony cameras do bracketing with a negative and positive EV shot when doing three shots and two negative and two positive EV shots when doing 5 shots.

For instance the A77 lets you do increments of 0.3, 0.5, and 0.7 EV with either 3 or 5 shots, and increments of 2.0 or 3.0 EV with 3 shots. So if you did 0.7 EV with 5 shots you would get (-1.4EV, -0.7EV, 0EV, 0.7EV, 1.4EV).

For HDR purposes you can do things using auto bracketing or manually. Which ever works best for you. When doing it manually, there's a great chance that you might move the camera making it difficult or impossible to line up the exposure in post. However you might be able to expose more accurately for the shadows and highlights doing it manually. Whatever works best for you.

The options on your A55 seem pretty typical of entry level model bracketing options. The D5300 gives you slightly more options, but it should being a new camera whereas yours is about 4-5 years old. I might also look at getting a remote shutter release of some sort to prevent camera shake which may be relevant in some situations.

Mystery member · Feb 27, 2014

MachLite said:
You mentioned that "The D5300 seem to let you also set an extra stop or two of EV. So you could have (-1.7EV, 0EV, +1.7EV) if i understand what the other poster said correctly."

How does this work? In the specifications page, Nikon says that exposure bracketing is in 3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV. Assuming I'm taking 3 shots AEB with 1 EV as the base exposure, the MAXIMUM increment I can get is 0.5 EV, which means that my shots will turn out to be (0.5 EV, 1 EV, 1.5 EV)?

No, it seems that you are not reading the replies properly. There's two settings in general:

The maximum range of the bracket.
The size of the steps within that range.

For example, my Lumix will allow a maximum of ±1.0 bracketing, but you can also set to 0±0.3 or 0±0.7

Other camera will have different limits and some will shoot 5 bracket shots. This is not a very difficult subject, so I hope you catch on soon.

Andy JO · Feb 28, 2014

Machlite,

I would say that auto-bracketing is the "goto" technique for most HDR photography.

I appreciate that it it complicated when you start out - I think the forum members above will have responded far much articulately than I could. However, if you are still confused, here is a link to a bunch of tutorials that could be useful for you -

http://digital-photography-school.com/?s=HDR+tutorial

You could also use Youtube for HDR tutorials as you will need software as well - there are a bunch of programs that you could try from Photomatix to autohdr or plug-ins for Lightroom such as enfuse. You can even do HDR from burst mode of from your camera's video mode with a hdrinstant (in that case you don't even need to use bracketing).

I hope this helps

MachLite · Feb 28, 2014

WryCuda said:
MachLite said:

You mentioned that "The D5300 seem to let you also set an extra stop or two of EV. So you could have (-1.7EV, 0EV, +1.7EV) if i understand what the other poster said correctly."

How does this work? In the specifications page, Nikon says that exposure bracketing is in 3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV. Assuming I'm taking 3 shots AEB with 1 EV as the base exposure, the MAXIMUM increment I can get is 0.5 EV, which means that my shots will turn out to be (0.5 EV, 1 EV, 1.5 EV)?

Click to expand...

No, it seems that you are not reading the replies properly. There's two settings in general:

The maximum range of the bracket.

The size of the steps within that range.

For example, my Lumix will allow a maximum of ±1.0 bracketing, but you can also set to 0±0.3 or 0±0.7

Other camera will have different limits and some will shoot 5 bracket shots. This is not a very difficult subject, so I hope you catch on soon.

Argh, sorry people, I'm kind of slow with grasping this.

Ok I'm not really sure what the maximum range of the bracket of the D5300 is, but it does state the size of the steps (3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV).

As I'm looking to take HDR photos with AEB, my main concern is whether I would get a large EV difference between my shots (e.g. +2EV, 0 EV, -2 EV) as opposed to a maximum of (-0.5EV, 0 EV, 0.5EV)?

Perhaps some numerical illustrations might aid substantially?

Mystery member · Feb 28, 2014

MachLite said:
Ok I'm not really sure what the maximum range of the bracket of the D5300 is, but it does state the size of the steps (3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV).

±5 EV in increments of 1/3 or 1/2 EV According to the following...

Read more on NikonRumors.com: http://nikonrumors.com/2013/10/17/nikon-d5300-additional-coverage.aspx/#ixzz2ucQoQluU

You appear to be confusing the size of the EC steps with how finely you can set those steps.

I had a look at the User Manual for my 7100, and the matching information isn't easy to find in print (particularly the range). You could easily check it out by looking at the menu items in the actual camera. The 7100 can do 5x ECs, BTW.

MachLite · Feb 28, 2014

WryCuda said:
MachLite said:

Ok I'm not really sure what the maximum range of the bracket of the D5300 is, but it does state the size of the steps (3 shots in steps of 1/3 or 1/2 EV).

Click to expand...

±5 EV in increments of 1/3 or 1/2 EV According to the following...

Read more on NikonRumors.com: http://nikonrumors.com/2013/10/17/nikon-d5300-additional-coverage.aspx/#ixzz2ucQoQluU

You appear to be confusing the size of the EC steps with how finely you can set those steps.

I had a look at the User Manual for my 7100, and the matching information isn't easy to find in print (particularly the range). You could easily check it out by looking at the menu items in the actual camera. The 7100 can do 5x ECs, BTW.

Thanks for the reply.

Yes, I'm quite confused with the size of the EV steps.

Would it be possible to get an AEB shot of (-3 EV, 0EV, 3EV) on a D5300?

hdr · Feb 28, 2014

MachLite said:
... Yes, I'm quite confused with the size of the EV steps.

Would it be possible to get an AEB shot of (-3 EV, 0EV, 3EV) on a D5300?

Since the D5300's specs say "±2 (3 frames at 1/3 EV, 1/2 EV steps)", it should not be possible to set it to ±3EV.

If I am buying a camera for HDR work, I will definitely go for one with ±3EV capability, 3 or 5 shots being secondary to my choice.

MachLite · Feb 28, 2014

May I ask then what is the maximum +/- EV the D5300 can go?

Thank you.

dsjtecserv · Feb 28, 2014

MachLite said:
May I ask then what is the maximum +/- EV the D5300 can go?

Thank you.

As hdr wrote:

"Since the D5300's specs say "±2 (3 frames at 1/3 EV, 1/2 EV steps)", it should not be possible to set it to ±3EV."

That means you can set it to up to two stops different from the center in each direction. You also set it for something less than 2 stops. You choices are limited to increments of either 1/3 or 1/2 stop, depending on your setting. So you could, for instance, set it to ±1 1/3 stop. Or ±1 2/3 stop. Or, if you have the increment set to 1/2 stops, ±1.5 stops.

The folks above have explained this clearly in several different ways. Its time for you to both get out your manual and start tying things out with you camera, since it works essentially the same on all cameras that have auto-bracketing.

Dave

--
http://www.pbase.com/dsjtecserv

MachLite · Feb 28, 2014

dsjtecserv said:
MachLite said:

May I ask then what is the maximum +/- EV the D5300 can go?

Thank you.

Click to expand...

As hdr wrote:

"Since the D5300's specs say "±2 (3 frames at 1/3 EV, 1/2 EV steps)", it should not be possible to set it to ±3EV."

That means you can set it to up to two stops different from the center in each direction. You also set it for something less than 2 stops. You choices are limited to increments of either 1/3 or 1/2 stop, depending on your setting. So you could, for instance, set it to ±1 1/3 stop. Or ±1 2/3 stop. Or, if you have the increment set to 1/2 stops, ±1.5 stops.

The folks above have explained this clearly in several different ways. Its time for you to both get out your manual and start tying things out with you camera, since it works essentially the same on all cameras that have auto-bracketing.

Dave

hdr · Feb 28, 2014

MachLite said:
...Am I right to say that the furthest the D5300 can go is +/- 2EV?

Assuming the base exposure is 1EV, the highest possible AEB difference would be (-1EV, 1EV, 3EV)? ...

Yes.

No. It is -2EV, EV, +2EV, which means two stops on either side of EV.

--
Depth haz been the mizzing dimenzion for long enough, but still, few are bothered with 3D.
Enjoy Free-Viewing Colorful 3D Without Glasses:- http://www.singaporegallery.com

Help with Understanding Auto-bracketing and its relation to HDR

Active member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Active member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Forum Pro

Active member

Forum Pro

Active member

Active member

Forum Pro

Active member

Senior Member

Active member

Senior Member

Active member

Senior Member

Keyboard shortcuts