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Eagle Eye Game: Sony Zeiss FE 35mm f2.8 vs Sigma 30mm f2.8 on A7
- Thread starter privater
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privater
Well-known member
The left one is from Sigma, Right one is Zeiss.so, now, which is which ?
Flickr full size file:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/privaterbok/sets/72157638868682015/
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Hin Man
Senior Member
My friend, I have my fair share of doubts on the FE 35mm f/2.8. After my recent trial similar to yours, I get the Sigma 60mm f/2.8 and I have not tested it thoroughly but the Sigma 60 on A7 with about 1.3x CIZ is very usable as well. At f/2.8, the sigma is very sharp for portrait.
The downside of the CIZ usage has some quality loss, I think but the worst is the rectangular focusing box that appear in CIZ as if the estimate is over a large area and I use DMZ with manual focus to confirm for final focus. Do you see the same problem on AF with a rectangular green box?
I downloaded the Adobe Lens Profile Creator hoping that I can create a customized lens profile for both the Sigma 30 and 60 to work on FF mode on my A7, but so far I have no luck in knowing how to use the lens profile creator -- it comes up blank and not intuitive for first timer, I will update how it goes. Without CIZ, I use the scaling function as you suggested for about 120 and + vignette for about 60. But that is very similar to CIZ at 1.2.
The big question that I have to ask -- are you going to keep your FE 35. The FE 35 is a wonderful lens but given the 8 times price over the Sigma, had I known this beforehand, I might have stayed away from the FE 35.
Hope you can share your thought process. If you like the Sigma 30, I highly recommend the Sigma 60mm. My black copy arrived two days ago and I will suggest to consider the silver copy as the black copy looks very plain and finger print magnets on the focusing ring.
Cheers,
Hin
The downside of the CIZ usage has some quality loss, I think but the worst is the rectangular focusing box that appear in CIZ as if the estimate is over a large area and I use DMZ with manual focus to confirm for final focus. Do you see the same problem on AF with a rectangular green box?
I downloaded the Adobe Lens Profile Creator hoping that I can create a customized lens profile for both the Sigma 30 and 60 to work on FF mode on my A7, but so far I have no luck in knowing how to use the lens profile creator -- it comes up blank and not intuitive for first timer, I will update how it goes. Without CIZ, I use the scaling function as you suggested for about 120 and + vignette for about 60. But that is very similar to CIZ at 1.2.
The big question that I have to ask -- are you going to keep your FE 35. The FE 35 is a wonderful lens but given the 8 times price over the Sigma, had I known this beforehand, I might have stayed away from the FE 35.
Hope you can share your thought process. If you like the Sigma 30, I highly recommend the Sigma 60mm. My black copy arrived two days ago and I will suggest to consider the silver copy as the black copy looks very plain and finger print magnets on the focusing ring.
Cheers,
Hin
Hin Man
Senior Member
I just updated to LR 5.3 and instead of CIZ or use of scaling/vignette, I shoot in raw with both of my Sigma 30 and 60. Using the lens profile correction for both raw files, the default lens profile correction seem to work very well for the A7, I only need to minor tune on vignette after 'Enable lens profile correction' in the Basic tab. I suggest that you give the raw files a try on LR 5.3 and and enable lens profile correction.
Cheers,
Hin
Cheers,
Hin
Mouth wide open with tongue on floor!The left one is from Sigma, Right one is Zeiss.so, now, which is which ?
Flickr full size file:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/privaterbok/sets/72157638868682015/
Thanks for the tests! Just picked one up on Craigslist for $100.The left one is from Sigma, Right one is Zeiss.so, now, which is which ?
Flickr full size file:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/privaterbok/sets/72157638868682015/
Hin Man
Senior Member
Can you share with us your editing? I find that shooting in raw and with lens profile correction in LR 5.3, the change involves just changing the vignette in the plus direction. I just get Sigma 60 and I have all the sigma baffles removed and that help quite a bit for the 30 and 60. With lens profile correction enabled in LR 5.3, the workflow is even easier. It is easier to work on Sigma 30 and 60 while I see more black vignette on the Sigma 19. I have hoods on both 30 and 60 but I can't use the hood on the 19. The results are most satisfying on the 60, followed by 30 and 19 need much more work.Thanks for the tests! Just picked one up on Craigslist for $100.The left one is from Sigma, Right one is Zeiss.so, now, which is which ?
Flickr full size file:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/privaterbok/sets/72157638868682015/
Cheers,
Hin
--
learning: http://www.techtheman.com
personal: http://hintheman.blogspot.com/
What do you remove exactly and how?Can you share with us your editing? I find that shooting in raw and with lens profile correction in LR 5.3, the change involves just changing the vignette in the plus direction. I just get Sigma 60 and I have all the sigma baffles removed and that help quite a bit for the 30 and 60.Thanks for the tests! Just picked one up on Craigslist for $100.The left one is from Sigma, Right one is Zeiss.so, now, which is which ?
Flickr full size file:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/privaterbok/sets/72157638868682015/
I'm a little surprised ! What RAW developer did you use to produce the two images. How do you explain the gross artefacts which the right-hand image has ? These artefacts cannot be down to the lens but indicates some sub-optimal processing in the RAW developer or any subsequent treatment. These kind of artefacts are normally associated with imperfect sharpening.
Crop from right image showing odd artefacts. Note the 'H''s & criss-cross lines
Crop from right image showing odd artefacts. Note the 'H''s & criss-cross lines
Looks like Moire to me .
Hin Man
Senior Member
What do you remove exactly and how?Can you share with us your editing? I find that shooting in raw and with lens profile correction in LR 5.3, the change involves just changing the vignette in the plus direction. I just get Sigma 60 and I have all the sigma baffles removed and that help quite a bit for the 30 and 60.Thanks for the tests! Just picked one up on Craigslist for $100.The left one is from Sigma, Right one is Zeiss.so, now, which is which ?
Flickr full size file:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/privaterbok/sets/72157638868682015/
rear baffle removed from Sigma 30mm f/2.8
The rear baffle on the Sigma block off the light to sensor and you get a bit better results in taking out three screws on the back and remove the baffle on the back. Please take caution in storing your baffle and screws, I use a zipper back for storage. And be aware of risks with reflection and dirt getting into the lens. It is a very easy operation as long as you have the small screwdriver. Removing baffles on Sigma help while removing baffle on FE 50mm f/1.8 does not make much of a difference. You can see the visual difference in the LCD or EVF in shooting without the baffle.
There are two ways that I have tried shooting in full frame mode without auto-crop
1. Use Clear Image Zoom and dial in about 1.2x to 1.3x magnification
This only work in jpg mode. You can to find the menu for 'Optical Zoom' and change it in menu to 'Clear Image Zoom' and I customize my AEL key to 'Zoom'. It is essentially a digital crop and CIZ claims to have intelligent pattern matching in up-scaling to the original resolution. I am no expert, please look up clear image zoom to know all the plus and minus
2. Shoot raw and make use of lens profile correction, PP to your liking
I find shooting raw and let LR 5.3 works its magic is better approach. A few trial seem to work out quite alright for Sigma 60 and 30. Not great on 19 as the vignette is more obvious, scaling in manual lens correction is needed. For Sigma 30 and 60, after default lens correction from LR 5.3, I only need vignette positive adjustment whereas scaling is almost not needed
3. Lightroom Flat Field PLugin
I have downloaded the plugin and so far I have not managed to make use of it to correct lens shading.
Cheers,
Hin
--
learning: http://www.techtheman.com
personal: http://hintheman.blogspot.com/
Surely his target is a printed card and what you are seeing here is bitingly sharp resolution, resolving the dots of the printed item, and even creating moiré from them
David
Can you share with us your editing? I find that shooting in raw and with lens profile correction in LR 5.3, the change involves just changing the vignette in the plus direction. I just get Sigma 60 and I have all the sigma baffles removed and that help quite a bit for the 30 and 60. With lens profile correction enabled in LR 5.3, the workflow is even easier. It is easier to work on Sigma 30 and 60 while I see more black vignette on the Sigma 19. I have hoods on both 30 and 60 but I can't use the hood on the 19. The results are most satisfying on the 60, followed by 30 and 19 need much more work.Thanks for the tests! Just picked one up on Craigslist for $100.The left one is from Sigma, Right one is Zeiss.so, now, which is which ?
Flickr full size file:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/privaterbok/sets/72157638868682015/
Cheers,
Hin
--
learning: http://www.techtheman.com
personal: http://hintheman.blogspot.com/
That came out of the camera uncropped and I used the lens profile of Sony 20mm f2.8. I didn't mess with the vignette at all. I just sharpened it, some NR in LR, and exported at a lower resolution to fit the iPad.
I took off the rear plastic cover on the lens though.
Hin Man
Senior Member
Thanks for your help. If you shoot in raw and update the latest LR 5.3, I see both the Sigma 30 and 60mm profile. If you like the Sigma 30, you should consider the Sigma 60.That came out of the camera uncropped and I used the lens profile of Sony 20mm f2.8. I didn't mess with the vignette at all. I just sharpened it, some NR in LR, and exported at a lower resolution to fit the iPad.Can you share with us your editing? I find that shooting in raw and with lens profile correction in LR 5.3, the change involves just changing the vignette in the plus direction. I just get Sigma 60 and I have all the sigma baffles removed and that help quite a bit for the 30 and 60. With lens profile correction enabled in LR 5.3, the workflow is even easier. It is easier to work on Sigma 30 and 60 while I see more black vignette on the Sigma 19. I have hoods on both 30 and 60 but I can't use the hood on the 19. The results are most satisfying on the 60, followed by 30 and 19 need much more work.Thanks for the tests! Just picked one up on Craigslist for $100.The left one is from Sigma, Right one is Zeiss.so, now, which is which ?
Flickr full size file:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/privaterbok/sets/72157638868682015/
Cheers,
Hin
--
learning: http://www.techtheman.com
personal: http://hintheman.blogspot.com/
I took off the rear plastic cover on the lens though.
Thanks,
Hin
--
learning: http://www.techtheman.com
personal: http://hintheman.blogspot.com/
I've realised on further reflection that the artefacts which I was seeing are most certainly introduced by the card printer & the letter shapes are probably some form of secret trademark ID.
Hin Man
Senior Member
You are good! I have not thought of that. The other not-so-good guess is on the green cast from the FE 35mm f/2.8 and I probably don't want to go that route. The sigma is quite an amazing lens series. I got my Sigma 60mm f/2.8 and I have been using it for 1+ day on my A7. Some crop is needed but its vignette is similar to the Sigma 30 and I will think the Sigma 60 is easier to work on with lesser vignette on corners.I've realised on further reflection that the artefacts which I was seeing are most certainly introduced by the card printer & the letter shapes are probably some form of secret trademark ID.
Here is a crazy crop as in 1/10th of the original shot with Sigma 60 + A7 + big crop
with Sigma 60mm f/2.8, baffle removed, f/5.6, A7, big crop
original, no cropping and editing, shot in raw, vignette on corners
Original @ f/8.0, sigma 60mm f/2.8, baffle removed, no editing and cropping
Raw, Lens profile correction in LR 5.3, big crop
shot with Sigma 60mm f/2.8 on NEX 5N @ f/3.5
shot with Sigma 60mm f/2.8 on NEX 5N @ f/3.5
Cheers,
Hin
--
learning: http://www.techtheman.com
personal: http://hintheman.blogspot.com/
Some very good results ! Your cockerel photos are a timely warning that example photos posted here are sometimes misleading as to image sharpness & resolution , the crop looks very good but the whole image only so-so.
PS - I look at that Kodak camera & weep tears for the demise of a once famous camera company....
PS - I look at that Kodak camera & weep tears for the demise of a once famous camera company....
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