30" monitors

@mike in london: You mentioned that certain software didn't work with your Wacom tablet. Did you mean calibration software? I've never heard of that kind of conflict. What was the problem?

Hi gammaray,

Thanks for the reply. I concur - there are many people who have no idea what these displays are meant for. I still see lengthy diatribes against wide gamut for example. And these are hardly meant for gaming IMHO. So yes, I see your point.

I believe there are significant differences between revisions when it comes to the scanline issue. Of course, I have just read many discussions and have not seen this first hand. Thing is, I would purchase this mainly for the 14 bit LUT and the resulting smooth gradients. I think my head would explode if there were any horizontal or vertical artefacts in the image.

Currently I am using my HP LP245w that calibrates pretty well but has some posterization in the gradients after profiling. I just long for more screen real estate and silky smooth gradients. I am willing to pay a bit more to get these. It just means I would have to wait a little longer.

Earthlight

thegammaray said:

The problem with internet forum reviews of high-end equipment is that many people are uneducated about the items they review.

For example, the horizontal lines problem. AFAIK, horizontal lines are inherent in the technology used by the recent Dell Ultrasharps. If you're sitting/standing an appropriate distance from the monitor, you won't see them; if you're too close, they're bound to be annoying. You're correct that lemons exist, but those won't be fixed by firmware revisions.

Likewise, ghosting will always be a problem with IPS panels. Either the manufacturer heavily corrects it (resulting in complaints of over-correction), or they don't (resulting in complaints of ghosting). Meh.

On the other hand, your strategy of waiting for the new revision can't hurt as long as you don't need the display for work. Also, you have a higher chance of getting a good sale price.

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thegammaray said:

@mike in london: You mentioned that certain software didn't work with your Wacom tablet. Did you mean calibration software? I've never heard of that kind of conflict. What was the problem?

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It was a conflict withe the QT written software and the Wacom mouse but not pen. Odd!
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This monitor seems widely available and yet I cannot find a single review. Strange.

Earthlight

There's a user review on the HardOCP forums. There's also a super-brief user review of the 24" version in the same forum. For the record, I would put zero trust in those, though the first does post calibration results.

Thanks gammaray, I have seen that one and it is promising. I have the HP LP 2475w that he compares the new monitor to. If indeed the performance was equal then I guess I would be a happy camper. I have had no issues with mine in over 5 years of use.

The last time I was on a lookout for a monitor people were raging over the usefulness or madness of wide gamut but it was easy to find a quality monitor.

Now the more I google the more I read about QC issues even with the hi-end manufacturers. Something has happened. Is it the overall downward slope of the desktop machine?

Earthlight

thegammaray said:

There's a user review on the HardOCP forums. There's also a super-brief user review of the 24" version in the same forum. For the record, I would put zero trust in those, though the first does post calibration results.

http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1785570

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Love, Love, Love, my Dell U3014. Sorry you got a bad sample - mine is flawless.

Regards,
Mike

Hi Michael,

Nice to hear you have a good sample. Which revision is it? A03?

How is the backlight bleeding when viewing a black blank screen? Any sign of the scanline issue?

This user reports heavy bleeding on a A03 revision:


Thanks!

Earthlight

Michael Firstlight said:

Love, Love, Love, my Dell U3014. Sorry you got a bad sample - mine is flawless.

Regards,
Mike

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Earthlight said:

The last time I was on a lookout for a monitor people were raging over the usefulness or madness of wide gamut but it was easy to find a quality monitor.

Now the more I google the more I read about QC issues even with the hi-end manufacturers. Something has happened. Is it the overall downward slope of the desktop machine?

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I'm not convinced anything has gone downhill. Many sources indicate many problems; many conversations about few sources don't indicate many problems. For example, plenty of forum threads mention the 3014 scanline issue, but most seem based on the same couple sources (e.g. HardOCP :S ). My overarching point is that people aren't very discerning with regards to information sources, which would account for what seems to be an industry trend.

I dunno.

More specific to your situation, does the Z30i offer internal LUT calibration? I don't see it mentioned on the HP website. You mentioned you were dissatisfied with the gradients on your 24" HP.

EDIT: I should be clear that the 3014 is the only GB-LED display I've ever used; I don't know for sure if the gradients on the Z30i would be noticeably worse without internal LUT calibration.

thegammaray said:

I'm not convinced anything has gone downhill. Many sources indicate many problems; many conversations about few sources don't indicate many problems. For example, plenty of forum threads mention the 3014 scanline issue, but most seem based on the same couple sources (e.g. HardOCP :S ). My overarching point is that people aren't very discerning with regards to information sources, which would account for what seems to be an industry trend.

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Yes, it is just a gut feeling that I have. I have googled this somewhat extensively and read all the amazon reviews, dell forum commentary and numerous other sources. Is it scientific, of course not. Just a gut feeling. And yet, apparently many people are of the opinion that lately there has been a such a development.

thegammaray said:

Dunno.

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Neither do I. But where there is smoke... I am just trying to avoid any hassles. Lord knows I have enough as it is.

thegammaray said:

More specific to your situation, does the Z30i offer internal LUT calibration? I don't see it mentioned on the HP website. You mentioned you were dissatisfied with the gradients on your 24" HP.

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Yes, the gradients after profiling bother me. But it is a simple 8-bit graphics card calibrated display so I feel it is well within specs and other than that it has been a reliable performer.

So, I would hate to pay good money and then play the good sample bad sample lottery.

It seems the HP does not have the 14 bit LUT which would be a little disappointing. But if otherwise it is a solid performer I guess I could live with that... I dunno. I guess if I got that mad screen real estate and reliable, balanced performance I guess I could work my way around any gradient stepping much like I have so far. After all, there are many low bit displays that are way way worse. So bad as to be completely unusable to me.

thegammaray said:

EDIT: I should be clear that the 3014 is the only GB-LED display I've ever used; I don't know for sure if the gradients on the Z30i would be noticeably worse without internal LUT calibration.

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When calibrated and using a colour aware browser, do you have smooth gradients in the Lagom.nl gradient test:

http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/gradient.php

I don't. I don't have any huge steps but loads on minuscule steps that are somewhat annoying. I calibrate with the Spyder 4 Elite and use the iterative gray balance optimization (the exact name escapes me right now) but still.

Without profiling it is smoother but then the display is otherwise all over the place. My uncalibrated IPS tablet displays totally smooth gradients there although with an annoying black crush.

Earthlight

Earthlight said:

Earthlight wrote: When calibrated and using a colour aware browser, do you have smooth gradients in the Lagom.nl gradient test:

http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/gradient.php

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I meant do you get smooth gradients after calibrating traditionally via the graphics card?

Have you tried the 14 bit lut calibration?

Thanks!

Earthlight

My Dell U3014 monitor is flawless also. Rev A02 from May 2013.

I remind some people had problems with Rev A01. Mine presented no problems so far. I am surprised apparently Rev A03 also present problems...

Regards,

It is intriguing that there seem to be issues in all of the revisions but not in every sample. I am glad to hear you got a good performer!

Earthlight

Osvaldo Cristo said:

My Dell U3014 monitor is flawless also. Rev A02 from May 2013.

I remind some people had problems with Rev A01. Mine presented no problems so far. I am surprised apparently Rev A03 also present problems...

Regards,

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Earthlight said:

I meant do you get smooth gradients after calibrating traditionally via the graphics card?

Have you tried the 14 bit lut calibration?

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I haven't tried calibrating via the graphics card, so I'm not sure. I jumped straight to the internal LUT since I have the compatible colorimeter.

thegammaray said:

Earthlight said:

I meant do you get smooth gradients after calibrating traditionally via the graphics card?

Have you tried the 14 bit lut calibration?

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I haven't tried calibrating via the graphics card, so I'm not sure. I jumped straight to the internal LUT since I have the compatible colorimeter.

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And with that you get silky smooth gradients on that page (Lagom.nl)?

Earthlight said:

It is intriguing that there seem to be issues in all of the revisions but not in every sample. I am glad to hear you got a good performer!

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.

"not in every sample"

This is typical in monitors from companies other than NEC or EIZO. Something like a box of Cracker Jacks.... a surprise in every box.

.

that HP has learned their lesson and started to include an OSD monitor menu. One that offers RGB sliders for adjustments during calibration.

The ZR30w and ZR27w have no OSD menu, no RGB sliders.

.

I'm under the impression that it has an OSD menu but we'll see. The lack of reviews is puzzling.

Unfortunately, the answer's not that simple. >:[

If I open that image in a color-managed image viewer (Irfanview in my case) or color-managed image editor (Lightroom in my case), the gradient looks beautiful. However, I can't for the life of me get Firefox to respect my color profile correctly.

Thanks gammaray! This is really interesting!

To see if there are any differences on my system I just opened the Lagom.nl gradient in Firefox, PS CS5 and LR 5. Here are the results:

Firefox: some banding, pretty much equal throughout the whole gradient. Some pretty noticeable, sharp steps/lines there too.

PS CS 5: The png online is untagged so:

• assigning sRGB: almost identical to Firefox, just some minor differences in the locations of the little steps in the gradient.
• assigning aRGB: smoother, some greenish, magentaish tones creeping out
• Leaving as is, no color management: smoother, some greenish, magentaish tones creeping out (my working space is aRGB).

LR5: smoother, some greenish, magentaish tones creeping out

All images were wiewed 100%.

My guess is the png is in sRGB originally.

Earthlight

Ps: the black test and white test also look better in LR and PS than in Firefox. Something is going on in FF that I do not understand.

thegammaray said:

Unfortunately, the answer's not that simple. >:[

If I open that image in a color-managed image viewer (Irfanview in my case) or color-managed image editor (Lightroom in my case), the gradient looks beautiful. However, I can't for the life of me get Firefox to respect my color profile correctly.

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