Decision help--Pentax, Nikon

I've been shooting with a K10D for, well, a long time. And I've been in need of an upgrade for quite a while--my autofocus has actually been broken for a few years, and the repair is more expensive than the camera is worth (I have by necessity become quite proficient at manual focusing, to the point where I really enjoy having the control). There are plenty of reasons to upgrade--autofocus is the least of it. Anyway, I have people who want sessions with me, who are waiting for me to get this figured out, so there's now a time crunch. Couples, families, little ones. I enjoy sunset backlighting and indoor window light. Bright, dark, I'm an ambient light sort of girl. And well, I thought upgrading my camera would be easy--K5II, right? So I got one, and I liked it well enough, but then I realized just how much money I was about to invest into a system without any thought for the other options, and I quite frankly didn't love the K5II enough to keep it blindly like that.

So I got a Nikon D7000 and a Canon 60D (no contest with that one. I should've gotten a 7D for comparison's sake, but my credit card has its limits. Still, much as I enjoyed the 7D layout when I handled it in the store I don't think its low light performance is up to snuff for the sort of work I like to do.)

Here's what I liked about the K5II: Low light performance was beyond stellar, especially compared to the D7000, which is also known for decent low light performance. I love that there's a focus confirmation beep even while using manual lenses, and from what I understand this is brand specific to Pentax (Nikon seems to have a little light for focus confirmation, but it's subtle and I have to say I'm a fan of the beep). The controls all seem under my fingers, right where they ought to be, save the green button which is--come on!--a bit of an uncomfortable stretch for my small hands. I do like the grip--the way it rests in my hand is very comfortable and secure feeling. I also actually liked the video performance over the competition, probably because of the in-body SR, because I wasn't using stabilized lenses for the big two, but possibly also because I was using my lovely Pentax 50/1.7M. (That lens is kind of incredible, and I have yet to find a lens that matches it for color reproduction and sharpness and just that extra indefinable something. I've tried the Nikon 50/1.4g and the Canon 50/1.8 and neither holds a candle to it. If anyone knows of other lenses with a bit 'o magic in them like this one, please tell me! The Sigma 50/1.4 does seem to come close, and oh the creamy bokeh, but I worry about it's reliability. I digress. Next conversation will be lenses please, okay?) I took some shots using the K5II and the Sigma 50/1.4 that exemplify absolutely everything I want in my work. And this is a bitty thing, but that K5II shutter click has such a lovely sound to it. Here's what I don't like about Pentax--no full frame, no support in local shops anywhere in four states around me, no lenses or bodies to be found except online. I am worried that moving into the world of working pro with this camera is going to be a bad idea for that reason alone. And one more thing: I don't like using the camera as much as I like using the Nikon. Yeah, I'm sure it'd grow on me. I can adapt to anything. I bought the K10D sight unseen and got used to it, grew with it, etc. And honestly the perks of the K5II over the D7000 are a great fit for me. But the tactile and visual part of making photographs is important, and after holding the Nikon D7000 in my hands, I can't seem to bring myself to want the K5II, no matter how good it is for me. The heart wants what it wants, I guess.

Here's what I don't like about the D7000: the lack of shake reduction, the higher noise levels at high ISO's, and the placement of the ISO button (also the aforementioned lack of focus confirmation beep for manual only lenses, but I can learn to trust myself because I'm pretty good with manual focus after all that practice). It's fast, it's got dual card slots, it's got a good forward track to full frame (and damn I like those upper level Nikons that even get the ISO button up in the right spot!). And did I mention Nikon is everywhere? I'm not one to be swayed to trends, or to do things just because everyone else is doing them, and I've always rooted for the underdog. I WANT Pentax to suceed, but I feel like I need to weigh my own professional success here, and I'm not sure Pentax is going to be the wisest move. Am I wrong here? Service, rentals, lenses, support--the big two have all of that readily available everywhere. Pentax, four states around me, it's pretty much a wasteland. Every female photographer I know seems to shoot with Nikon, which could be a good reason to go with it since teaming up and swapping lenses could be a thing in the future. But I do tend to shoot solo, and I'm not all that interested in weddings, so maybe that's a moot point for me anyway?

I don't want to jump ship on Pentax, so I guess I just want to make sure I'm thinking of all the angles first. I like to be thorough. Are any of you using your K5II's professionally? Should I be too? Can you talk me into it? Thanks in advance, and please go easy on me. I'm new here.

You made a comment about Pentax not having a FF as a negative. Seeing as you've held onto a k10D for years now with broken AF and aren't currently looking at FF, I am thinking Pentax has some time left to get one together before you will be in the market again for it.

Not sure what to say :^)

You are putting a lot of thought into this. I put a lot of thought into things as well.

The only thing I can think of is to compartmentalize the K10. You got your use out of it and that is done. Going forward is separate and sounds like enough of a change to just start over with your evaluation and comparison.

The K10 met your needs in the past. Doesn't mean a Pentax will now. Now is a bit down the road from where you were with the K10.

Your favorite lens is a feature as is the manual focus confirmation. Of course. You may be able to use the M50 on.. Canon, I think? Maybe it is Nikon or both..?

Sounds to me that between the type of shooting you do (low light and indoor natural light) and the fact you already have some Pentax lenses ( and you are right the Pentax 50 mm f1.7 is a GREAT lens) that the Pentax is your best choice. If you were primarily shooting high speed sports then maybe not . . .but then if you were probably would have changed from Pentax a long time ago.

I don't see keeping the K 5 can be a mistake. It is a great camera packed with features and has absolutely fantastic low light/high ISO capabilitiess. TAke the others back and enjoy the getting on with the Pentax.

Nikon is a great brand, but there is one reason I would never buy a Nikon. I just love playing with legacy manual focus glass (of which the SMC Pentax Takumars are among the greatest). You can't use them on a Nikon unless you get an adapter that *contains an optical element* (reducing optical quality). Game over. In-body stabilization is another huge thing you will be giving up with a Nikon or Canon. (if you want it back you need to pay for it again with each IS lens purchase).

You really will not believe the jump in quality between your K10 and a K-5 (or K-5 ii), both in low light AF (or focus assist) and in high ISO performance. The K-5 and K-5 IIs are gobsmackingly great cameras.

If you are uncomfortable when not following the crowd, get a Canon or a Nikon, but I wonder how many of them would have really chosen the camera they did if they had compared/considered Pentax.

You have a point with the lenses, not with the FF as you don't consider it anyway. With Pentax you can re-use the lenses of the K-10.
For a professional the shutter sound is important. The Pentax shutter is very silent. I do not know about the Nikon you consider, but when I shoot pictures without being noticed, people are awakened by the Nikons around me. Also the Nikon-photographers show off as photographers because the camera's are very big; that is not and advantage, also not for the professional. I am not a professional but the pictures from my K5 are often qualified by others as 'professional'.

All arguments in favor of Nikon are valid. I think you will enjoy your choice independent what you take.

What sort of money do you have in Pentax lenses? What would it cost to get the lenses you need for the Nikon system? If you have a fairly substantial set of Pentax lenses, that could make a significant difference in the total cost of the one versus the other.

If you'll be doing much flash photography, the Nikon flash system is superior to the Pentax system, especially for complex setups involving multiple flashes. There is also better professional support services (repair, rental lenses, etc.) available, and somewhat more of an upgrade path at present--though it's not exactly clear to me what sort of specific benefits you may actually find with an upgrade. That, of course, does depend on what kind of photography you're doing and where you're most limited.

This being a Pentax forum and all, you'll undoubtedly get a lot of advice saying that the Pentax is the best and don't consider anything else. The truth, of course, is that both the K5II and the D7000 are very, very good camera bodies, and both are perfectly capable of superb results. I don't think you can go too far wrong with either one. You've done a lot of research and testing; I'd suggest simply making a decision and then resisting the urge to second-guess. Either way would not be a bad option.

Hope my ramblings help your thinking a little!

I appreciate all the responses so far. I should add a couple things to my original post. 1) I'm only not looking at FF right now for financial reasons. I am hoping to make enough money with my work that I'll be able to upgrade to FF soon. 2) I do not have a large investment in lenses for the K10D. That M50/1.7 is really it for anything worth writing home about, and I think we all know its value is more in its substance than $. Do those two things change anyone's opinion?

Yes, I'm definitely over thinking this.

DrewE said:

DrewE wrote:

If you'll be doing much flash photography, the Nikon flash system is superior to the Pentax system, especially for complex setups involving multiple flashes.

Click to expand...

This presumably really means flash photography using multiple flashguns?

Studio work with multiple studio flash heads is different, and I don't think there is much difference what camera you use. In my use, all the camera has to do is trigger the flash, not control it.

mmm, she's an ambient light sort of girl...

I think she means she has a style and this style does not include other than ambient light.

DSLRs are only machines, tools, made for do photography. My advice is to decide for the one that can help you the most to get "the shoot". Don´t pay attention to superficial sparks. OTOH, go for the Nikon, and be prepare, or maybe not, to pay for the comming back. Well, you can´t go too wrong with each one you choose.

The K5IIs is the best choice IMHO counting that:

-You love the control with MF lenses, Canikon's AF wouldn't really count that much and the -3EV AF of the new SAFOX X is not shabby either.

-Legacy lenses, tons and tons of legacy lenses.

-The form factor.

-Excellent lowlight capability even compared to the D7100

-With the lack of an AA filter, if you don't really print larger than 24x36, there is very little real world difference with the final out put vs the current line up of FF

SRose said:

SRose wrote:
....
I don't want to jump ship on Pentax, so I guess I just want to make sure I'm thinking of all the angles first. I like to be thorough. Are any of you using your K5II's professionally? Should I be too? Can you talk me into it? Thanks in advance, and please go easy on me. I'm new here.

Click to expand...

Regarding professional photographers... yes, there are pros using the Pentax K-5 IIs. In fact if you wander over to Pentax Forums and look for a poster named "Alison", you'll find one right away. She says she loves her K-5 IIs as a professional camera.

SRose said:

SRose wrote:

I appreciate all the responses so far. I should add a couple things to my original post. 1) I'm only not looking at FF right now for financial reasons. I am hoping to make enough money with my work that I'll be able to upgrade to FF soon. 2) I do not have a large investment in lenses for the K10D. That M50/1.7 is really it for anything worth writing home about, and I think we all know its value is more in its substance than $. Do those two things change anyone's opinion?

Click to expand...

From what I read in the OP, and now what I read above, it appears to me that you want to go with Nikon but are afraid to make your own decision. Maybe this will help you: Pentax does not make a FF camera right now. That might change come September. We will see.

I say, go with your gut feeling and don't look back.

Good luck.

Ron

SRose said:

And one more thing: I don't like using the camera as much as I like using the Nikon.

Click to expand...

This one sentence is all I need to know: go with Nikon. You have to *LOVE* using Pentax cameras and/or lenses to justify the very legitimate disadvantages you mention in your post.

Just out of curiosity, where is the green button on the K-5 II? I can't find a good control layout diagram in an admittedly cursory Internet search.

(Also considering a K-5 II, so this thread is of great interest.)

I understand the 30 euros or dollars for that lens are no big argument, but do not forget you have shake reduction with it for free due to the camera. With Nikon you pay for it with every lens. Please choose what you literally like.

Found a clear photo of the back of the camera, though still no diagram--I'm assuming that's the green button on the back below and to the right of the viewfinder.

yardcoyote said:

yardcoyote wrote:

Found a clear photo of the back of the camera, though still no diagram--I'm assuming that's the green button on the back below and to the right of the viewfinder.

Click to expand...

Yep - that's the green button ... between the thumb wheel & the AF button

Well, i've been there this year also, but me it was for wildlife photography. I was a Pentax (and stil a Pentax) shooter for over 25 years but wanted a faster camera and lens for my wildlife and decided to go with a Canon 7D and 400mm/5.6L and i'm now switching slowly to Canon for my serious kit.

I still own a K20D and K-01 and will keep my favorite lenses. So for you i think you should consider cameras but lenses are the "big" part of a system, DSLR comes and go very fast now and you can update to a better performing DSLR (high ISO) in 1 year or so.

So your priority is to look at both brand lens selection and choose the one that fits your needss better, and also if you want to be Pro a brand that is easily available is certainly a plus and it's one of the reason i bought in Canon system for my wildlife photography, even if the 7D is different than my K20D i'm now more confident with it.

So good luck and hope you will make the best choice for you, i know it's hard on the heart to let go a beloved Pentax system