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lwr83

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Good Evening,

This is my first post, so please be gentile. I currently own a FujiFilm HS20EXR and am trying to decide if the camera is the problem (and hence requires an upgrade), or if it is me. I realise there is a huge difference between a bridge camera and a DSLR, but please stick with me whilst I explain...

lurches hashed the HS20EXR before a trip to SE Asia in Dec 11 in the hope it would let me take improved photos of general scenery and landscapes in particular. I did a bit of research and the camera seemed to match my requirements at the time. My experience has been slightly disappointing, the daytime captures were okay, although not as good as I had hoped, but I found it nearly impossible to capture a decent shot in low light. This was a shame as I had really wanted to capture some of the sunsets of temples in Cambodia (Angkor Wat etc). To be honest, I have messed around with some of the ISO settings etc in a hope to improve the quality, but have not achieved very much.

so here is the question....

I am not looking to take up photography as a hobby as such at the moment (ie go to particular locations to take photos), but I would like to improve my ability to capture what I see when I travel and go on holiday. I have contemplated purchasing a Nikon D5100 or D5200 and spend some time getting to grips with that system. But in the back of my mind, I am concerned that actually, it is just that I have not put enough effort in to the camera I have. For what I want to achieve, camp the bridge camera I have enough (more practise required!), or is throwing some cash around on a D5100 etc the only way forward. I go on honeymoon in a few months as would really like to focus my efforts in preparation to produce a quality memory bank of photos from that.

Thank you to anyone who takes the time to respond, really appreciated. If there are other suggestions, please just say, I am a complete novice.

P.S. Can anyone suggest a good "Photography for Dummies Guide", ideally on Kindle!
 
lwr83 said:
lwr83 wrote:

Good Evening,

This is my first post, so please be gentile. I currently own a FujiFilm HS20EXR and am trying to decide if the camera is the problem (and hence requires an upgrade), or if it is me. I realise there is a huge difference between a bridge camera and a DSLR, but please stick with me whilst I explain...

lurches hashed the HS20EXR before a trip to SE Asia in Dec 11 in the hope it would let me take improved photos of general scenery and landscapes in particular. I did a bit of research and the camera seemed to match my requirements at the time. My experience has been slightly disappointing, the daytime captures were okay, although not as good as I had hoped, but I found it nearly impossible to capture a decent shot in low light. This was a shame as I had really wanted to capture some of the sunsets of temples in Cambodia (Angkor Wat etc). To be honest, I have messed around with some of the ISO settings etc in a hope to improve the quality, but have not achieved very much.

so here is the question....

I am not looking to take up photography as a hobby as such at the moment (ie go to particular locations to take photos), but I would like to improve my ability to capture what I see when I travel and go on holiday. I have contemplated purchasing a Nikon D5100 or D5200 and spend some time getting to grips with that system. But in the back of my mind, I am concerned that actually, it is just that I have not put enough effort in to the camera I have. For what I want to achieve, camp the bridge camera I have enough (more practise required!), or is throwing some cash around on a D5100 etc the only way forward. I go on honeymoon in a few months as would really like to focus my efforts in preparation to produce a quality memory bank of photos from that.

Thank you to anyone who takes the time to respond, really appreciated. If there are other suggestions, please just say, I am a complete novice.

P.S. Can anyone suggest a good "Photography for Dummies Guide", ideally on Kindle!
Click to expand...
Apologies for some of the appalling grammar, the iPad strikes!
 
Well, to be blunt, I would say the problem is with you. A camera is simply a tool you use to record light. That's it. End of the Lesson. All cameras essentially function the same way. Now yes, a DSLR will provide better low light images insomuch as you can use a higher ISO and have less noise in the image. But the knowledge of how to go about getting the exposure you want is going to be the same regardless of the camera. There aren't any shortcuts or magic cameras. You either take the time to learn how exposure works, how a camera (any camera) creates an image or you simply take what you get. Let me see if I can give you an illustration.... imagine you have a hand held tape recorder recording an interview near some train tracks. Suddenly a train whistle blows. At this point in the recording you won't be able to hear your interviewee over the sound of the train whistle. We all know this. The reason is that the dynamic range is just to high. We wait for the train whistle to subside and then continue. The dynamic range has changed. Sound is a form of energy. Light is a form of energy. This is what your camera records. And there can be times when the dynamic range of the scene exceeds what the camera can record, no different than the audio analogy. Now I am not suggesting that you upset with your images because the scene had too much dynamic range for the camera (although that is certainly a possibility), but I do want to illustrate that you either take the time to learn photography or just be happy with your snapshots. Buying better and better cameras isn't the answer. Why? Because the light you are recording isn't changing!
 
lwr83 said:
lwr83 wrote:

Good Evening,

This is my first post, so please be gentile. I currently own a FujiFilm HS20EXR and am trying to decide if the camera is the problem (and hence requires an upgrade), or if it is me. I realise there is a huge difference between a bridge camera and a DSLR, but please stick with me whilst I explain...

lurches hashed the HS20EXR before a trip to SE Asia in Dec 11 in the hope it would let me take improved photos of general scenery and landscapes in particular. I did a bit of research and the camera seemed to match my requirements at the time. My experience has been slightly disappointing, the daytime captures were okay, although not as good as I had hoped, but I found it nearly impossible to capture a decent shot in low light. This was a shame as I had really wanted to capture some of the sunsets of temples in Cambodia (Angkor Wat etc). To be honest, I have messed around with some of the ISO settings etc in a hope to improve the quality, but have not achieved very much.

so here is the question....

I am not looking to take up photography as a hobby as such at the moment (ie go to particular locations to take photos), but I would like to improve my ability to capture what I see when I travel and go on holiday. I have contemplated purchasing a Nikon D5100 or D5200 and spend some time getting to grips with that system. But in the back of my mind, I am concerned that actually, it is just that I have not put enough effort in to the camera I have. For what I want to achieve, camp the bridge camera I have enough (more practise required!), or is throwing some cash around on a D5100 etc the only way forward. I go on honeymoon in a few months as would really like to focus my efforts in preparation to produce a quality memory bank of photos from that.

Thank you to anyone who takes the time to respond, really appreciated. If there are other suggestions, please just say, I am a complete novice.

P.S. Can anyone suggest a good "Photography for Dummies Guide", ideally on Kindle!
Click to expand...
I would say, you would be wasting money buying into a "system", ie, interchangeable lenses, if you only need a simple P&S. Learning, & getting the best out of, a DSLR, requires a measure of commitment to learn about light, & settings like ISO shutter speed & aperture, the right lenses to use for different types of photography, how to get the best out of flash etc. Buying the camera is just the beginning. There are books that teach photography in a simple way, I got the Digital Photography for Dummies myself 18 months ago, & it's not a bad place to start. Bryan Petersons Understanding Exposure is a popular read, but not sure if it's relavent for what you require from a camera. Good luck, & welcome to the forum.
 
lwr83 said:
lwr83 wrote:

Good Evening,

This is my first post, so please be gentile. I currently own a FujiFilm HS20EXR and am trying to decide if the camera is the problem (and hence requires an upgrade), or if it is me. I realise there is a huge difference between a bridge camera and a DSLR, but please stick with me whilst I explain...

lurches hashed the HS20EXR before a trip to SE Asia in Dec 11 in the hope it would let me take improved photos of general scenery and landscapes in particular. I did a bit of research and the camera seemed to match my requirements at the time. My experience has been slightly disappointing, the daytime captures were okay, although not as good as I had hoped,
Click to expand...
If you cannot get a good capture in daylight, it is likely not the camera's fault.
lwr83 said:
but I found it nearly impossible to capture a decent shot in low light. This was a shame as I had really wanted to capture some of the sunsets of temples in Cambodia (Angkor Wat etc).
Click to expand...
You need to understand the limitations of the equipment, and how to overcome the limitations.
lwr83 said:
I am not looking to take up photography as a hobby as such at the moment (ie go to particular locations to take photos), but I would like to improve my ability to capture what I see when I travel and go on holiday. I have contemplated purchasing a Nikon D5100 or D5200 and spend some time getting to grips with that system. But in the back of my mind, I am concerned that actually, it is just that I have not put enough effort in to the camera I have. For what I want to achieve, camp the bridge camera I have enough (more practise required!), or is throwing some cash around on a D5100 etc the only way forward.
Click to expand...
While a DSLR has better image quality, you can still take bad photos with them. Understanding light and exposure is required regardless of what camera you use.
 
Welcome to the forum :-)

It's more likely a combination of you and the camera, rather than one or the other.

Your camera is capable of decent results in good light, but is not so good in low-light situations. This is because of the small sensor mainly. Every step up in ISO creates more noise.

Have you tried shooting in RAW, and then converting the RAW files yourself?

That would produce better results if done with the right software, and is not difficult to do.

Some situations require the use of a tripod - do you have one?

Do you have a 'protection' filter on your lens? If so, try taking it off and see if the results are better.
 
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Thank you for the quick responses. I completely understand all of the points with respect to a camera being a tool to capture an image, and if you do not know how to use the tool effectively, then you will never be able to produce great results. I do not expect an upgrade in camera to change the quality of picture I obtain without any effort on my part. What I think I have worked out, is regardless of whether I stick with the bridge, or upgrade, I need to put some time in to understanding how to get the best results. I guess what I am really asking, is if my HS20EXR has enough manual control for me to improve my results (with my caveat that it is at present a memory capturing exercise rather than an overtly creative practice), or whether I should upgrade and learn on a more comprehensive system? Will either way be any easier?

I am sure I will quickly get the photography bug!

Once again, thank you.
 














Not only are these images from a bridge camera(s), they are from Fuji Bridge cameras.

The first two are from a much older Fuji, the S6000, the last is from an S200EXR.

Both cameras have an easy to use exposure compensation feature which can help you get the exposure the way you want. Most cams these days have this.
 

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lwr83 said:
lwr83 wrote:

Thank you for the quick responses. I completely understand all of the points with respect to a camera being a tool to capture an image, and if you do not know how to use the tool effectively, then you will never be able to produce great results. I do not expect an upgrade in camera to change the quality of picture I obtain without any effort on my part. What I think I have worked out, is regardless of whether I stick with the bridge, or upgrade, I need to put some time in to understanding how to get the best results. I guess what I am really asking, is if my HS20EXR has enough manual control for me to improve my results (with my caveat that it is at present a memory capturing exercise rather than an overtly creative practice), or whether I should upgrade and learn on a more comprehensive system? Will either way be any easier?

I am sure I will quickly get the photography bug!

Once again, thank you.
Click to expand...
It does have all the features it needs for you to improve your skills. I would take a new look at the camera if I were you, and explore ways in which you could get more out of it.

As it is capable of outputting RAW files, you have the possibility of improving your images with some relatively simple image editing.

The basics of photography lie in the interplay of Aperture, Shutter Speed, ISO, and Composition. An understanding of those is what helps to get the best out of any camera. 'Auto' mode is fine - it's there to be used, but it is limiting. Your camera has the features you need to work with those directly.

For low light, buy a tripod or monopod, or lean against a wall or a bar...

If you have a cheap 'protection' filter on your lens, take it off, but do use a lens hood.

Shoot in RAW and convert the files yourself - even if you convert without any adjustment, the results will probably be better.

Spend time on composition.

Above all else, have fun.
 
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A good way (IMO) to see what your camera is capable of is to just do a flickr search and then order by 'interestingness': http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=HS20EXR&s=int

In terms of your problems with the camera, you don't really state what the issue is as to what is 'wrong' with the photos?
  • If the problem is blur from camera shake, get and use a tripod.
  • If the problem is blown out skies, use a split ND filter or exposure bracketing and then blend the exposures later.
  • If the problem is blur from subject movement, then raise the ISO, add more light (flash), or purposefully use the blur as part of your photo.
  • If the problem is boring composition, then a new camera definitely won't help with that. There are plenty of tutorials around on the web as well as books that will help with that.
Dave
 
As DavidKennard says, what do you see wrong with your pictures? Why not post one or two?

I took this one with a 2006 Canon Powershot A720. Believe me, it's got a lower spec than your Fuji.

Sorry, no temples around here
Sorry, no temples around here

--
Albert
Every photograph is an abstraction from reality.
 
Thank you all for your assistance. I think I really need to get to grips with what I have before I decide the equipment does not meet my requirements. The trouble I think I have is the Fuji documentation is pretty poor at explaining how to change settings, a digital photography guide is my next stop...
 
It certainly sounds like you need to get to grips with the basics of exposure. Even so, posting a pic and saying what you see wrong with it would help us to help you. It's possible that there is something wrong with your camera, but nobody can tell without seeing some images.

See if you can just set everything to automatic and take a few shots in similar conditions to what you expect to encounter on holiday. Then you can start trying adjustments to one setting at a time to see what effect it has.
 
I don't know your camera, but I think that all non-interchangeable lens cameras like that have to compromise in some way. A camera with a large zoom & small sensor will not be good in low light. I think even the best small sensor cameras are just not that good in low light without a flash. Even a camera with a fast zoom (good for low light), like my Samsung EX1 was not be that good in low light. But I think any camera should be able to take a half-decent landscape photo if you keep the iso at base iso. That might mean having to use a tripod or resting the camera on something rather than hand-holding it though.

If you want a large zoom range and good low light performance, I think you either need an interchangeable lens camera or two cameras, one for each purpose. A DSLR is I think a good choice if the bulk doesn't bother you because you can have a large zoom lens on when you want and change to a faster lens for darker situations. Faster lenses tend to have shorter zoom ranges.

But one thing I would advise about the Nikon (if you go for it) would be to learn the Zone system if you don't know it already. This is because Nikons are really designed to be used with the viewfinder and the meter is the only thing you have to judge your exposure. The live-view implimantation is poor on Nikon. You may find Canon, Sony or one of the u4/5 cameras quicker to learn on because their live-view is much better implimented.
 
lwr83 said:
lwr83 wrote:

lurches hashed the HS20EXR before a trip to SE Asia in Dec 11 in the hope it would let me take improved photos of general scenery and landscapes in particular. I did a bit of research and the camera seemed to match my requirements at the time. My experience has been slightly disappointing, the daytime captures were okay, although not as good as I had hoped, but I found it nearly impossible to capture a decent shot in low light. This was a shame as I had really wanted to capture some of the sunsets of temples in Cambodia (Angkor Wat etc). To be honest, I have messed around with some of the ISO settings etc in a hope to improve the quality, but have not achieved very much.
Click to expand...
My Fuji is a couple generations older than yours, mine being the S200EXR that I believe someone else mentioned, too. I've been very happy with mine, but I keep it in DR mode all the time for the improved dynamic range. I also keep it at ISO 100 unless I am using the 800% setting for DR, which requires ISO 200 to operate. There is also an SN mode for low light, but I must say I've been very happy with low-light shots just keeping it in DR mode.

Looking at a few reviews, your experience does not seem uncommon, with both Trusted Reviews and What Digital Camera saying they were underwhelmed by the image quality. The latter magazine also said that keeping it in one of the 8 mp EXR modes made a substantial improvement. Camera Labs put it this way:

"While the FinePix HS20 EXR's image quality wasn't on a par with the Sony Cyber-shot HX100V or Canon PowerShot SX30IS at their maximum resolutions, the HS20 has the unique advantage of its EXR modes which reconfigure the sensor pixels to improve noise or dynamic range - albeit with a drop in resolution to 8 Megapixels. This is the compromise you have to decide upon. If you want the best quality images at the maximum resolution, the competition will beat the HS20, but if you're willing to effectively lose half of your total Megapixels, then the HS20 will comfortably out-perform its rivals on noise and dynamic range. And it's important to note you can't match this performance on other cameras by simply reducing their resolution, as Fujifilm is doing cleverer pixel-grouping on the HS20." http://www.cameralabs.com/reviews/Fujifilm_FinePix_HS20_EXR/verdict.shtml

I would recommend spending some time with the special modes your camera offers, particularly the DR mode, stick with lower ISO settings, use a tripod for low light conditions, and bracket the exposures. You may like what you get, but if not, you'll at least have given the camera every chance before going with something else.

I would also recommend asking in the Fujifilm Finepix Talk forum how other users have maximized their results with this camera, and if it ultimately satisfied them.
 
lwr83 said:
lwr83 wrote:

Good Evening,

This is my first post, so please be gentile. I currently own a FujiFilm HS20EXR and am trying to decide if the camera is the problem (and hence requires an upgrade), or if it is me. I realise there is a huge difference between a bridge camera and a DSLR, but please stick with me whilst I explain...

lurches hashed the HS20EXR before a trip to SE Asia in Dec 11 in the hope it would let me take improved photos of general scenery and landscapes in particular. I did a bit of research and the camera seemed to match my requirements at the time. My experience has been slightly disappointing, the daytime captures were okay, although not as good as I had hoped, but I found it nearly impossible to capture a decent shot in low light. This was a shame as I had really wanted to capture some of the sunsets of temples in Cambodia (Angkor Wat etc). To be honest, I have messed around with some of the ISO settings etc in a hope to improve the quality, but have not achieved very much.

so here is the question....

I am not looking to take up photography as a hobby as such at the moment (ie go to particular locations to take photos), but I would like to improve my ability to capture what I see when I travel and go on holiday. I have contemplated purchasing a Nikon D5100 or D5200 and spend some time getting to grips with that system. But in the back of my mind, I am concerned that actually, it is just that I have not put enough effort in to the camera I have. For what I want to achieve, camp the bridge camera I have enough (more practise required!), or is throwing some cash around on a D5100 etc the only way forward. I go on honeymoon in a few months as would really like to focus my efforts in preparation to produce a quality memory bank of photos from that.

Thank you to anyone who takes the time to respond, really appreciated. If there are other suggestions, please just say, I am a complete novice.

P.S. Can anyone suggest a good "Photography for Dummies Guide", ideally on Kindle!
Click to expand...
Basically the problem you have is that in order to take shots hand held you need a certain shutter speed(or the movement from your hands will blur the shot), as light level drops this becomes too long and to balance it out your camera increases the ISO(sensitivity) of the sensor. Really this is the wrong way to shoot landscapes with any camera but on a compact espeically quality degrades very quickly as ISO increases.

What you need is a tripod to hold the camera steady and allow you to take longer exposures plus of course a camera that allows you to override auto settings enough to create long exposures. This will allow you to shoot at low ISO even in poor light and so increase the quality of your pictures.

For a smaller camera this tripod need not even be that large or expensive.
 
Last edited:
lwr83 said:
lwr83 wrote:

Good Evening,

This is my first post, so please be gentile. I currently own a FujiFilm HS20EXR and am trying to decide if the camera is the problem (and hence requires an upgrade), or if it is me. I realise there is a huge difference between a bridge camera and a DSLR, but please stick with me whilst I explain...

lurches hashed the HS20EXR before a trip to SE Asia in Dec 11 in the hope it would let me take improved photos of general scenery and landscapes in particular. I did a bit of research and the camera seemed to match my requirements at the time. My experience has been slightly disappointing, the daytime captures were okay, although not as good as I had hoped,
Click to expand...
Were your day time exposures slightly over exposed or slightly out of focus? If so, my guess is that you were shooting in Auto-mode (or P-mode) with default settings.

For a reason I can't comprehend, all of the non-DSLR cameras I've tried, overexpose day time images using the default zero exposure compensation. Try setting your exposure compensation to -1/3 for day time shooting. ..... Even better, since I believe the HS20 EXR has a live histogram, learn how to set exposure compensation using the histogram for every shot. Very quick and easy to do.

Also, were you using multi-area auto focus where the camera decides with multiple boxes what to focus on? If so, try setting your camera to spot focus and use the half press, reframe method to get the best auto focus on your intended subject. With this method you set the small focus rectangle in the center of your viewfinder (or screen) on your subject's face, half press the shutter to lock focus, reframe the scene for the composition you want, then snap the picture. ..... Using multi-area focus, you're letting the camera decide what to focus on instead of you deciding.

Learning how to lock exposure is another valuable technique but no need to worry about that initially. Do learn how to do it later on though.
lwr83 said:
but I found it nearly impossible to capture a decent shot in low light. This was a shame as I had really wanted to capture some of the sunsets of temples in Cambodia (Angkor Wat etc).
Click to expand...
For sunsets, there are two very important things to do.
  1. Never use auto white balance, as it will make sunsets look pinkish. Try setting white balance to daylight or cloudy. This is very important to get the beautiful red/gold sunset tones.
  2. You have to underexpose. The easiest way to do that is to use negative exposure compensation like -1 or whatever negative setting works at the time.
You don't have to wait for a sunset to experiment. Put a full screen image of a sunset on your computer screen and try suggestions 1 and 2 above. I think you will see a marked difference.
lwr83 said:
To be honest, I have messed around with some of the ISO settings etc in a hope to improve the quality, but have not achieved very much.
Click to expand...
No need to mess with ISO settings for sunsets.

Sorry if you were already aware of the my suggestions,
Sky
 
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