Lenni Vilen wrote:
Biggs23 wrote:
Lenni Vilen wrote:
Biggs23 wrote:
Lenni Vilen wrote:
Mirrorless cameras offer several advantages over mirrorfull cameras:
- Higher framerates much easier and cheaper to achieve
- Higher quality wide angle lenses
What mirrorless cameras are faster frame rate than 11? I know of the SLT Sony's that are faster but are there mirrorless cameras other than those that I'm unaware of?
What wide angle lenses rival the 14-24mm f/2.8 Nikkor? I don't know of any...
Nikon-1 series shoots 60 frames per second. Try to flap mirror at that rate. And that is only today. In the future the difference will be larger as mechanical parts don't get much faster while electronic ones do.
Regarding lenses - you oviously ignored my earlier reply to you: plenty of Laica's and other M-mount lenses. They not only rival that Nikkor but are
far superior to it.
Sorry, I should have said, "What mirrorless cameras are faster frame rate than 11
when shooting RAW?'
Next, I didn't ask about non-native primes. I want to know what
native zoom is available in a mirrorless mount without an adapter that's equal or superior to the 14-24? Name one please.
Well, you didn't ask any of these questions, did you? How will you modify the questions the next time if I answer these two? And Leica M does not need an adapter to use Leica M lenses and Leica M certainly is mirrorless - and for
zoom they have Leica Tri-Elmar-M 16-18-21 f/4. Don't know any current mirrorless which go more than 10 fps with raw though. But tomorrow's will go much more than that while tomorrows mirrorfull will still be limited to pretty much what today offers.
Also,
I stated - as you kindly quoted - that
mirrorless cameras can achieve higher framerates much easier and much more cheaply - what sub-1200 euro mirrorfull camera goes 60fps on JPG or 10 fps in raw? (Ok, I don't know how much Sony's top SLT is and it does 12 fps, but it's kind of special case due to the non-moving mirror.)
Since you like the question game,
let me ask you two two questions to see if you can undermine my original statement:
- Can you name SLR wide angle lenses equal or superior to Leica's top of the line wide angles?
- Can you name an SLR which provides mirrorless framerates at similar price range?
What are the technical limitations to performance for framerates and lens designs for mirrorless or mirrorfull cameras? Maybe I should answer this myself:
- Mirrorfull framerates are near maximum (for mirrored viewfinder operation) - it is very expensive to make them faster and impossible to make them much faster because of the mechanical parts
- Mirrorless framerates will go up lots, especially once global shutter and stacked design becomes available for large sensors
For lenses:
- Mirrorfull wide angles (upto normals, depending on aperures) need to be inverse teleconverter design - more complex, more expensive, mose quality control issues due to complexity, less quality for the price
- Mirrless wide angles - no such limitations - if a lens can be made to mirrorfull, it can be cloned to mirrorless and additionally a better back/buck ratio option in smaller package is available
Oh, btw, I just noticed that
you think that Sony SLT cameras are mirrorless - they are certainly not. They do certainly have a mirror (no secondary mirror though AFAIK), thus should be classified as mirrorfull cameras and certainly have none of the inherit lens advantages of mirrorless.
So, to summarize, there are no mirrorless cameras that can match current traditional dSLR's in frame rate and there are no existing wide angle zooms that can match what is available for traditional dSLR's, such as the 14-24mm f/2.8 Nikkor. So your initial claim was false.
All of a sudden you are making price a concern, while in the same breath arguing that we should consider the Leica lenses and cameras you mention as competitors. You can't have it both ways. Either the Leica is a valid comparison and price doesn't matter or price does matter and you have to eliminate the Leica stuff, leaving virtually nothing that's anywhere close to equal to dSLR gear.
To answer your specific questions, yes I can.
A1: Carl Zeiss makes several wide angles equal to the Leica's mentioned.
A2: The D4 and 1DX both provide superior RAW capture frame rate at prices that are comparable to the Leica setup you've been comparing. (I'm sure there are others, too, but I think two is enough to answer your question.)
Last, I know EXACTLY what Sony SLT cameras are. I owned several for quite a while and know exactly how they work.
