The Sony RX1 AF is fine

harold1968

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It's very accurate. When low contrast mixes with low light it can have difficulties like many other systems.
The lens is actually very big and heavy. It extends back almost to the focal plane (see google for photo of lens construction, very interesting).

The focus is slower then my D800E and OM-D but faster then the X100 and X-pro.

I encourage folk to try before you buy.

I understand its an expensive camera but its no compromise approach to IQ and size have caused some compromises. I would remind folk that the ME/M9 has only one exposure mode (diffused elliptic spot) and only aperture priority and manual.

Interestingly I have used it consistently successfully for action (moving street). It just takes consideration, as a photographer should use with any camera (as demonstrated admirably in other posts here).

I have used many cameras with slower focus very successfully.
This camera is only limited by the photographer

I use spot focus (by switching to moveable focus spot mode). I also use the camera with focus illuminator turned off. I have found it works well in low light. My technique with any camera is to find an area of good contrast to focus on if possible. I see no reason to change this technique as super sharp focus is essential for my style of photography. Saying that the RX1 rarely has difficulty with anything I throw at it.

In summary this camera is an absolute gem. It performs at f2 and ISO 3200 excellently. At ISO 800 it is the first camera I have used with close to pixel perfect quality.
(I tend only to use lenses wide open or at f8-f11).

Despite the lacklustre packaging, the camera impresses on its own. The controls and construction are way above most other cameras I have used.

I will publish my initial summary findings shortly, but there are ample reviews on the Internet to view.

Suffice to say this camera goes everywhere with me, including work each day.
 
Very well said.

I haven't said any more about the RX1's autofocus simply because it works for me in exactly the same manner and with the same technique you describe. I use the flexible spot focus for the majority of my work.

Occasionally, with static portraits or at social events, I'll also entrust the camera with face detection AF. It's uncanny how often the RX1 nails the focus on the closer eye, even when the face in question is not facing the camera directly.






harold1968 wrote:

It's very accurate. When low contrast mixes with low light it can have difficulties like many other systems.
The lens is actually very big and heavy. It extends back almost to the focal plane (see google for photo of lens construction, very interesting).

The focus is slower then my D800E and OM-D but faster then the X100 and X-pro.

I encourage folk to try before you buy.

I understand its an expensive camera but its no compromise approach to IQ and size have caused some compromises. I would remind folk that the ME/M9 has only one exposure mode (diffused elliptic spot) and only aperture priority and manual.

Interestingly I have used it consistently successfully for action (moving street). It just takes consideration, as a photographer should use with any camera (as demonstrated admirably in other posts here).

I have used many cameras with slower focus very successfully.
This camera is only limited by the photographer

I use spot focus (by switching to moveable focus spot mode). I also use the camera with focus illuminator turned off. I have found it works well in low light. My technique with any camera is to find an area of good contrast to focus on if possible. I see no reason to change this technique as super sharp focus is essential for my style of photography. Saying that the RX1 rarely has difficulty with anything I throw at it.

In summary this camera is an absolute gem. It performs at f2 and ISO 3200 excellently. At ISO 800 it is the first camera I have used with close to pixel perfect quality.
(I tend only to use lenses wide open or at f8-f11).

Despite the lacklustre packaging, the camera impresses on its own. The controls and construction are way above most other cameras I have used.

I will publish my initial summary findings shortly, but there are ample reviews on the Internet to view.

Suffice to say this camera goes everywhere with me, including work each day.
 
No it's Not!

With all respect when i pay 2700$ for A camera i want it to deliver, this is not a landscape camera or studio camera; it’s a street photography camera it was made for low light.



The AF is not fine and sony should fix it just like what fuji did with X100 and Xpro1
 
aalaref wrote:

No it's Not!

With all respect when i pay 2700$ for A camera i want it to deliver, this is not a landscape camera or studio camera; it’s a street photography camera it was made for low light.

The AF is not fine and sony should fix it just like what fuji did with X100 and Xpro1
I don't want to say anything more about the AF that I have not already said (although I am curious about what you think is not fine about it, as I think its very fine), however I bought this camera for buildings, landscape and travel as well as street

I haven't found a flaw with any of these, really

I will be publishing pictures when I post my review to illustrate this

my keeper rate is far higher then the X100 and not lower then the OM-D when the correct technique is used.
 
viztyger wrote:

Very well said.

I haven't said any more about the RX1's autofocus simply because it works for me in exactly the same manner and with the same technique you describe. I use the flexible spot focus for the majority of my work.

Occasionally, with static portraits or at social events, I'll also entrust the camera with face detection AF. It's uncanny how often the RX1 nails the focus on the closer eye, even when the face in question is not facing the camera directly.
 
Docno wrote:
viztyger wrote:

Very well said.

I haven't said any more about the RX1's autofocus simply because it works for me in exactly the same manner and with the same technique you describe. I use the flexible spot focus for the majority of my work.

Occasionally, with static portraits or at social events, I'll also entrust the camera with face detection AF. It's uncanny how often the RX1 nails the focus on the closer eye, even when the face in question is not facing the camera directly.
 
It's slow and not accurate it misses a lot or will not focus in low light where is suppose to be the King of low light !

in good light there is no problem where all cameras perform the same but the low light is the real test and will show you how will is the camera even DPreview mentioned that on there review



I do love my RX1 the IQ is amazing but it focus weakness make me think 100 times before i decide to take it for a photo shoot
 
.... or there is a fair degree of sample variation out there in the first batch shipped




but I had no difficulty focusing on the barb wire on the left side and it was very low light at dusk in Iceland
but I had no difficulty focusing on the barb wire on the left side and it was very low light at dusk in Iceland

Again with focus on the gate
Again with focus on the gate

I managed to lock focus on the bonnet of the car pretty quickly though I did recall the AF hunting a tad before it did the job. Moving the green AF point around was pretty easy to with a simple press of the multi dial on the back of the camera.
I managed to lock focus on the bonnet of the car pretty quickly though I did recall the AF hunting a tad before it did the job. Moving the green AF point around was pretty easy to with a simple press of the multi dial on the back of the camera.

That said, I am not much of an AF user when I shoot so perhaps someone else who relies on it a great deal may find an AF that does not respond immediately a little tedious. I shall keep trying mine out and report back.

AF gripes aside, the camera is pretty user friendly and the IQ really has to be seen to be believed. I am looking on an iMac 27" screen and the detail and rendering of the OOF is so sweet it hurts. Though as as much as when I scratched the LCD after 3 days, it needed replacing. That's life as they say.

Anyway please permit me to share a couple of images from the camera that is not technical-related - just to enjoy if you will.

Shot in RAW and converted in LR4
Shot in RAW and converted in LR4

I went to the beach but did not get a suntan at all - south coast of Iceland
I went to the beach but did not get a suntan at all - south coast of Iceland

Handheld at 0.4 sec f/22 to blur the surf and then I had to hightail out of there quick smart - the RX1 was dripping wet from the sea spray (no, I am not in the habit of babying my gear) and I just gave up trying to wipe it dry every couple of minutes. Didn't hurt it any though at the end of the day
Handheld at 0.4 sec f/22 to blur the surf and then I had to hightail out of there quick smart - the RX1 was dripping wet from the sea spray (no, I am not in the habit of babying my gear) and I just gave up trying to wipe it dry every couple of minutes. Didn't hurt it any though at the end of the day

Anyway, I hope this is some encouragement (or otherwise) to those people on the fence as to whether they may wish to part with a large chunk of cash for this small little beauty. Your call.

David
Australia
 
Docno wrote:

Because I'm very rarely able to get the closest eye in focus with AF and face detect. In fact, I consider myself lucky if the AF gets the eyes in focus at all... now I rely on DMF, which is a bit of a pain. Do you have any examples and tips to share...?
I'm finding face detection quite reliable for posed shots or where the subject isn't moving around. Of course I need to remember to set multiple AF area first as face detection doesn't lock on in any other AF area mode.


I've posted a 100% crop of the eyes from an F2.0 portrait shot here (scroll down):





Face detection AF also locked onto the eye in the second photo of this post, despite the head being turned sideways:

 
viztyger wrote:
Docno wrote:

Because I'm very rarely able to get the closest eye in focus with AF and face detect. In fact, I consider myself lucky if the AF gets the eyes in focus at all... now I rely on DMF, which is a bit of a pain. Do you have any examples and tips to share...?
I'm finding face detection quite reliable for posed shots or where the subject isn't moving around. Of course I need to remember to set multiple AF area first as face detection doesn't lock on in any other AF area mode.

I've posted a 100% crop of the eyes from an F2.0 portrait shot here (scroll down):

http://bmupix.com/reviews/2013/1/29/rx1-user-report-with-raw-samples


Face detection AF also locked onto the eye in the second photo of this post, despite the head being turned sideways:

http://bmupix.com/home/2013/1/1/happy-new-year


--
Björn http://www.bmupix.com
That first shot is impressive. Perfect focus. My RX1 will not do that. For the second shot ... well, I didn't even know that face detection works in profile. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to work as well on my camera.

b9b7dfd92e2a4d92ba645b15b12f39e2.jpg
 
No it's Not!

With all respect when i pay 2700$ for A camera i want it to deliver, this is not a landscape camera or studio camera; it’s a street photography camera it was made for low light.



The AF is not fine and sony should fix it just like what fuji did with X100 and Xpro1
But don't you know the "fixed" X100 and X-Pro 1 AF is no better than the current version RX1?
 
The AF on my RX1 is fine. In my first few hypercritical weeks of ownership, I was concerned that the AF was slow and unreliable in low light. Having used the RX1 as intended (street photography, environmental portraiture) in New Orleans this past weekend, I no longer have issues with the AF. It worked quite well and sufficiently quickly in all lighting conditions, whether using multi-area AF on a brightly-lit street or center AF in a dim bar. I cannot comment on face detection as I did not use that, nor did I use the "tracking" (control wheel button) AF, although I might experiment with those as an option to focus and recompose.
 
While I would welcome a firmware update aimed at overall AF performance, I find that it works pretty decently for a CDAF camera. Note: I did not try tracking anything. I really never do..even with my DSLR.

I recently shot (handheld) at a musical theater performance (read that as not great light overall - some very low and some very high). I got a keeper rate of about 90-95% (not counting stupid user errors). It does have trouble finding a lock on occasion, but that's gonna happen with any CDAF system - regardless of price. Relating it, specifically, to the OM-D (which I owned): the OM-D is BLAZING in comparison...but even it failed to lock on occasion in lower light situations. IQ, however, is absolutely no contest. So we're clear, the RX1 wins...big time.
 
The AF issue has been beaten to death.

Its characteristics have been described in 6001 ways; now 6002.

Either you can/will work with it or you can't/won't.

Acceptable AF does not cut it for me at this price point but if a significant update is offered my interest would increase considerably....

Happy to see the beautiful pics of those that enjoy the current iteration.
 
DFPanno wrote:

The AF issue has been beaten to death.

Its characteristics have been described in 6001 ways; now 6002.

Either you can/will work with it or you can't/won't.

Acceptable AF does not cut it for me at this price point but if a significant update is offered my interest would increase considerably....

Happy to see the beautiful pics of those that enjoy the current iteration.
everyone has individual needs

the AF is beyond what i need

There is alot of FUD about the AF, so its nice to clear the air occasionally
 
I have yet to handle an RX1 - I greatly look forward to having the opportunity sooner than later. From everything I've read the AF is not all that different from the X-Pro / X-E1. For some types of shooting that's more than wonderful. For other types of shooting that's some distance from adequate, let alone wonderful. I suspect I'd be very happy with it for a lot of my shooting and greatly dis-satisfied with it for other types of shooting. As was the case with my X100 and is the case with my X-Pro. But the X100 and X-Pro do have a very useful distance scale, usually electronic but physical on the new 14mm lens, so that when AF isn't cutting it, one can use age-old zone focus techniques and render the AF speed irrelevant. I do most street shooting with zone focus even when I've got blazing fast AF because I'd rather be thinking about the subject matter than what part of the composition needs to be in focus. So I rate a distance scale of some sort (I'm not even that picky about the implementation - just give me SOMETHING!) as roughly as important in a camera as the lens and the sensor. Why the RX1 doesn't see fit to offer this simple little software solution in a camera this optically wonderful and electronically sophisticated is well beyond me. And will probably keep me from buying one of these great little cameras. Focus peaking is a great tool for achieving critical manual focus, but distances scales are an essential tool for using manual focus in an entirely different and useful way. But there is none. Damn shame, that.

I have a Ricoh GXR with the 28mm lens module. Unbelievably slow auto-focus - you could get a cuppa coffee while you wait. Never bothered me in the least. Because Ricoh saw fit to give their cameras the best and handiest zone focus implementation in the business (they call it snap focus, but its just s shortcut to zone focus). If Sony would just do some minimal version of the same thing with this camera, all of my objections would dry up in one fell swoop. And, yeah, I know there are work-arounds, but they're a pain in the butt - I've used them often enough with m43 cameras before Olympus came out with its excellent 12 and 17mm lenses with the snap focus rings built in, and I've tried them in the RX100, and the workarounds suck. Just give me a simple little distance scale, PLEASE!


-Ray
-------------------------
 
Ray Sachs wrote:

I have yet to handle an RX1 - I greatly look forward to having the opportunity sooner than later. From everything I've read the AF is not all that different from the X-Pro / X-E1. For some types of shooting that's more than wonderful. For other types of shooting that's some distance from adequate, let alone wonderful. I suspect I'd be very happy with it for a lot of my shooting and greatly dis-satisfied with it for other types of shooting. As was the case with my X100 and is the case with my X-Pro. But the X100 and X-Pro do have a very useful distance scale, usually electronic but physical on the new 14mm lens, so that when AF isn't cutting it, one can use age-old zone focus techniques and render the AF speed irrelevant. I do most street shooting with zone focus even when I've got blazing fast AF because I'd rather be thinking about the subject matter than what part of the composition needs to be in focus. So I rate a distance scale of some sort (I'm not even that picky about the implementation - just give me SOMETHING!) as roughly as important in a camera as the lens and the sensor. Why the RX1 doesn't see fit to offer this simple little software solution in a camera this optically wonderful and electronically sophisticated is well beyond me. And will probably keep me from buying one of these great little cameras. Focus peaking is a great tool for achieving critical manual focus, but distances scales are an essential tool for using manual focus in an entirely different and useful way. But there is none. Damn shame, that.

I have a Ricoh GXR with the 28mm lens module. Unbelievably slow auto-focus - you could get a cuppa coffee while you wait. Never bothered me in the least. Because Ricoh saw fit to give their cameras the best and handiest zone focus implementation in the business (they call it snap focus, but its just s shortcut to zone focus). If Sony would just do some minimal version of the same thing with this camera, all of my objections would dry up in one fell swoop. And, yeah, I know there are work-arounds, but they're a pain in the butt - I've used them often enough with m43 cameras before Olympus came out with its excellent 12 and 17mm lenses with the snap focus rings built in, and I've tried them in the RX100, and the workarounds suck. Just give me a simple little distance scale, PLEASE!

-Ray
-------------------------
there is a distance scale

it come up on the screen in both MF and DMF mode

you should take a look at in a shop to see if adequate for your needs




best rgds
 
A general consensus that the RX1 AF is as good as the RX100.

I find the RX100 a delight in large part because the AF works so damn well in low light social settings.

I am not intersted in any aspect of manual focus. Been there; done that.
 
harold1968 wrote:
there is a distance scale

it come up on the screen in both MF and DMF mode

you should take a look at in a shop to see if adequate for your needs
Well, that's great news! I had understood it didn't. The RX100 doesn't have one anywhere and the Nex I used to have didn't have anything of the sort. And I didn't see anything about it in the manual. And others had indicated it didn't have one. If its even close to accurate, I could work with it very happily.

I'm supposed to demo a copy along with the X100s when it becomes available, so I'll get to check it out in more detail. But this gives me much more to look forward to...

Thanks,


-Ray
-------------------------
 

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