Nikon's cameras more weather resistant than Canon?

Apewithacamera wrote:

It seems that both brands apply this lable regarding working operating temperature to most cameras.

Why do they make 0 the low temperature limit?

Are these companies being deceptive to us or just covering their butts?

1DX however Operating Environment 0 - 45 °C, 85% or less humidity.

If a camera can operate at well below 0 why not state it?
The specification for 0-45C relates to a lot of other specifications, and has nothing to do with whether cameras will "operate" or not.

Focus acquisition time and accuracy, aperture accuracy, shutter accuracy, and virtually everything else that involves any form of mechanical movement is almost sure to be out of specifications as the temperature goes down.
 
fudgebrown wrote:

I once had a D700 completely submerged in water in a canoe mishap. The camera survived without any issues.
While I am not saying that I don't believe you, I would definitely not take it for granted that you can submerge a camera without under water casing. You might have been lucky, that's all. In most cases, we read the opposite when this happens.

As a matter of fact, I'll be canoeing this summer in Scotland for a week, but the only camera I'll take into the canoe will be the Olympus Mju850SW, which is supposed to be submersible and has been under water several times. If the gaskets fail (the camera is old) then so be it. Not that I plan to turn over, but you never know what happens in a canoe, especially when you are not alone. The D800 will stay on board of the barge we will be using as floating hotel.
 
Apewithacamera wrote:

It seems that both brands apply this lable regarding working operating temperature to most cameras.

Why do they make 0 the low temperature limit?

Are these companies being deceptive to us or just covering their butts?

1DX however Operating Environment 0 - 45 °C, 85% or less humidity.

If a camera can operate at well below 0 why not state it?
I have used EVERY camera I ever owned since 1970 in weathers well below that, down to -30°C or even less. The chill is not a problem as long as the LCD or the batteries won't freeze. They are not stating anything sub zero because sub zero temperatures are relative to time as well, so while a few hours in -30°C is OK as long as you can survive, if I would leave the camera unattended over night it might fail, the LCD, the battery and the lubes inside might freeze. Also, if the temperature is -30°C when I leave the camera outside it might drop well below that during some period. If cameras couldn't have been used in sub zero temperatures we would not be able to take winter images.
 
Starkiller wrote:
There is a reason the 5D3 is much heavier than the 5D2: more rubber for better sealing.
...the rubber can hardly add anything to the total weight. Must be something else as well if the two cameras are significantly different in weight.
 
clarnibass wrote:

I don't think you can take a few anecdoes to mean much unfortunately... I don't see any consistent reports comparing under same conditions. In this thread someone said his Nikon had a problem when some Canons didn't... could be a coincidence... or not... who knows.

FWIW my D600 (supposed to have more or less the same weather resistance as a D800 but a bit worse built quality) worked fine in the snow a couple of weeks ago. We tons of snow (a record if I remember) but when I went out it was only snowing a little and also a bit of rain with it, not a storm. It was about -3C I think. No problems.
Of course. What did you expect? I mean, cameras don't even have to be specifically weather sealed to withstand snow. Snow is very gentle and does no harm at all, when melted it quickly evaporates, not entering the camera unless you are really unlucky. I think most people are a bit paranoid when snow comes and hide their non-sealed cameras too fast.
 
olyflyer wrote:
Johan01 wrote:

Now, I consider the D4 and 1DX to be equals in terms of weather proofing.
Based on what?
How about the models one step down such as D800, 5D3, etc?
How would you test that?

The weather sealing of the D800 works. That's all, but how to test how well it works? I had the D300s before and the Olympus E-3 before that. Both of those were fine in every weather as well and Olympus fanboys claim that Olympus is the best, but Pentax is even better... I have no experience other than those and none of the cameras were used in exactly the same weather at the same time, so there is no way to tell if one is better than the other, just that they worked well for me.
One of the very few sensible posts about weather sealing that I have ever seen.
 
The rubber O-rings aren't adding any significant weight to the 5DM3 over the 5DM2. The 5DM3 is still almost an entirely plastic camera like a Rebel, it just has a metal "shell" added after the fact that adds a lot of the weight that you're feeling. Lens mount is still screwed into plastic as well. It's that shell that gives it the feel and weight.
 
AllOtherNamesTaken wrote:

The rubber O-rings aren't adding any significant weight to the 5DM3 over the 5DM2. The 5DM3 is still almost an entirely plastic camera like a Rebel, it just has a metal "shell" added after the fact that adds a lot of the weight that you're feeling. Lens mount is still screwed into plastic as well. It's that shell that gives it the feel and weight.
Though one should add, there is no reason why 'plastic' is not a perfectly satisfactory engineering material. After all, F1 cars are made out of it.
 
Not in this case. As I said, there was snow and rain, not only snow. In addition, the small snow bits (how do you call them in English?) that landed on the camera didn't evaporate and actually melted and turned into water.

Re what did I expect... well I expected the camera to work... hopefully... or else I woudln't use it in those conditions.
 
clarnibass wrote:

Not in this case. As I said, there was snow and rain, not only snow. In addition, the small snow bits (how do you call them in English?) that landed on the camera didn't evaporate and actually melted and turned into water.

Re what did I expect... well I expected the camera to work... hopefully... or else I woudln't use it in those conditions.
Water drops are not too bad either. Surface tension means that they are quite unlikely to find their way between well engineered, closely fitting components whether on not there is an O-ring or gasket. It's when you have a film of water that capillary action can take it in, but the real problem is mist and water vapour.

This sealing stuff is mostly flannel by the camera manufacturers. It costs very little to make a camera reasonably weathertight. It's easier if they have moulded plastic construction, because the tolerances are tighter and they are not painted. In a sense, the rubber gaskets and o-rings on top end cameras are there because of the metal construction which means they don't fit together as well as the lower end cameras. The marketing departments make a virtue out of necessity, as good marketing departments always will. What is telling is that none of them give a watertight guarantee of the water-tightness of their products. If your D4 lets in water, it is no better covered than a D3200. There is no warranty at all.
 
bobn2 wrote:

Though one should add, there is no reason why 'plastic' is not a perfectly satisfactory engineering material. After all, F1 cars are made out of it.
Yeah, right... except of course for all the parts where metal is better. Engines, roll bars, wheels, axels, frames, etc etc.
 
But who knows these cars will once become plastic toys.
 
BartyLobethal wrote:

Keep that in mind. I daresay the weather sealing of any camera / lens combination is only as good as the least weatherproof component.
 
Ah, yes. Do not try this at home....

I still carry a DLSR and usually a 70-200 on my kayak, but I have a small, completely waterproof bag with a "T-zip" seal - the kind one uses for a dry suit. That combo has been dumped but everything remains completely dry.

One of these days, however.....
 
This is why you carry a backup camera. And try to be reasonable. But if you're looking for certainty, get a Point and Shoot that's passed whatever Mil-spec is relevant. DLSRs have too many potential ingress points.

Or put your camera in a dive housing. That should work.
 
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bobn2 wrote:
AllOtherNamesTaken wrote:

The rubber O-rings aren't adding any significant weight to the 5DM3 over the 5DM2. The 5DM3 is still almost an entirely plastic camera like a Rebel, it just has a metal "shell" added after the fact that adds a lot of the weight that you're feeling. Lens mount is still screwed into plastic as well. It's that shell that gives it the feel and weight.
Though one should add, there is no reason why 'plastic' is not a perfectly satisfactory engineering material. After all, F1 cars are made out of it.
 
I have a rain coat for my camera and long lens for field wildlife shooting. Cameras are water resistant, not waterproof. If I am carrying my camera and short lens I usually carry a plastic large zip lock or at least a dry towel under my jacket. Common sense also works ha ha!!!!

Larry
 
Takagi wrote:
bobn2 wrote:
AllOtherNamesTaken wrote:

The rubber O-rings aren't adding any significant weight to the 5DM3 over the 5DM2. The 5DM3 is still almost an entirely plastic camera like a Rebel, it just has a metal "shell" added after the fact that adds a lot of the weight that you're feeling. Lens mount is still screwed into plastic as well. It's that shell that gives it the feel and weight.
Though one should add, there is no reason why 'plastic' is not a perfectly satisfactory engineering material. After all, F1 cars are made out of it.
 
apaflo wrote:
bobn2 wrote:

Though one should add, there is no reason why 'plastic' is not a perfectly satisfactory engineering material. After all, F1 cars are made out of it.
Yeah, right... except of course for all the parts where metal is better. Engines, roll bars, wheels, axels, frames, etc etc.
Where 'metal' is better is a very nuanced design decision. Taking them one by one. Engines are made of a variety of materials, but mostly metal. The major reason for that in F1 is that exotic composites in the engine are banned, because they could lead to too much expense. Metal is used because it is cheaper, not better. There have been examples of composite/ceramic engines, which would almost certainly produce more power in a lighter package, once they had been developed to be reliable - but that whole process would be formidably expensive and would lead to a huge cost escalation in the sport, so is banned, as are almost all exotic metals, which would undoubtedly be 'better'. Roll bars - if you could point to a F1 car with a metal roll bar, I'd be interested to see it. Wheels certainly have been constructed of composites in the past, and are in the case of other forms of racing, but the F1 regs dictate that they must be made of magnesium alloy, again to avoid the costs of a composite war for wheels - casting or forging in metal is a much cheaper process than laying up composites. 'Axels' (I suppose coupled with Rose joints) don't exist. These cars have fully independent suspension.The suspension rods are not made of metal, but of 'plastic'. Yes, the stub axles are usually mainly 'metal', simply that the ease of machining offsets any small advantage in using composites in that area. The suspension uprights are aluminium, by regulation. No-one pretends that superior materials could not be found. 'Frames' do not exist in a modern racing car (I understand American practice often drags behind). The monocoque body/chassis is a carbon composite sandwich with a aluminium honeycomb separator. The aluminium in this case is not selected for any structural property, simply that it is the cheapest and easiest way to separate the composites.
 
rgolub wrote:

This is why you carry a backup camera. And try to be reasonable.
I'm always reasonable.
But if you're looking for certainty, get a Point and Shoot that's passed whatever Mil-spec is relevant. DLSRs have too many potential ingress points.
My point was not that. The point is that a capability not covered by warranty is effectively worthless, because it is just a name. 'Weatherproof' means nothing without a specification of which 'weather' it should be proof against. A warm breeze? And if a specification is made, as it should be, then the manufacturer should be willing to (and in some jurisdictions, is legally bound to) warrant against it. I also think you are entirely wrong about the impossibility of proofing a SLR. I have designed equipment to marine industry requirements. There are no controls on a DSLR that cannot quite easily be made completely watertight. The bayonet lens mount is the biggest issue, but that is not an insurmountable problem, by any means. Finally, on 'Mil spec'. This has nothing to do with Mil specs, this is 'Ingress Protection' rating system, which is IEC, nothing to do with the military.
Or put your camera in a dive housing. That should work.
I certainly would, since I know that no manufacturer believes sufficiently in their 'weather sealing' to be willing to guarantee it.
 

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