OT: Paypal scums

Hi gang,

I thought it could be interesting for many of you using PayPal and Ebay taking a look to this threads (link to the second is in this one's first message). Hope it makes you go safer in your transactions.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=4847002

At this point, I just closed my Paypal account and will never ever do business with them again.

Best,
Dioni
You don't take a photograph, you make it (Ansel Adams)

...you have to be careful in the virtual world. It's not difficult to sniff out the bad apples on ebay, those you should completely avoid. We've had our paypal account for quite awhile (couple of years) with no problems (yet!). You stated that you closed yours, have YOU had problems? People have problems with regular bank accounts, insurance premiums, creditcard transactions...these things just happen at times. Just part of dealing with the modern world.

I suppose you could just deal with cash and keep it all under your pillow or in a coffee can next to the tupperware.

What would you suggest instead of Paypal?

regards,

Robert

Dioni said:

Hi gang,

I thought it could be interesting for many of you using PayPal and
Ebay taking a look to this threads (link to the second is in this
one's first message). Hope it makes you go safer in your
transactions.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=4847002

At this point, I just closed my Paypal account and will never ever
do business with them again.

Best,
Dioni
You don't take a photograph, you make it (Ansel Adams)

Click to expand...

I'm with Robert. I've used Paypal for several years now, and have ran thousands of dollars in transactions through it, and not one single incident. Couldn't be happier.

One bad case doesn't warrant abolishing the entire site, IMO.

JCF

Robert Whiteman said:

I suppose you could just deal with cash and keep it all under your
pillow or in a coffee can next to the tupperware.

What would you suggest instead of Paypal?

regards,

Robert

Dioni said:

Hi gang,

I thought it could be interesting for many of you using PayPal and
Ebay taking a look to this threads (link to the second is in this
one's first message). Hope it makes you go safer in your
transactions.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=4847002

At this point, I just closed my Paypal account and will never ever
do business with them again.

Best,
Dioni
You don't take a photograph, you make it (Ansel Adams)

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

I've never had a problem with PayPal, but now I know that if I'm to have it at some point, they will not be defending me even if what happened is their fault or someone's else. If someone steals my CC and uses it, my CC company has an insurance to protect me, so I'm liable for the first 300€ (around $350), and that's it.

In the case of that thread, the error IMHO is PayPal's, since they accepted a not good CC. Now, the seller, to whom they have charged some fees for service, is claim responsible for that.

I do not wish to make business with someone who charges me fees for nothing. From now on, when I want to buy something, I'll use just my CC. If I wanna sell it, I'll get a wire transfer. I will feel safer that way.

Best,
Dioni
You don't take a photograph, you make it (Ansel Adams)

I definitely see your point. I guess it comes down to convenience. People are much quicker to send me my money when I sell something on Ebay if they can just pony up a credit card. Plus, it beats going down to your local grocer or wherever to get the money on a wire.

I also make it pretty clear that I also accept cashiers checks or money orders. Perhaps one thing you could do is state that you demand a 10-day waiting period if you accept a CC.

JCF

Dioni said:

I've never had a problem with PayPal, but now I know that if I'm to
have it at some point, they will not be defending me even if what
happened is their fault or someone's else. If someone steals my CC
and uses it, my CC company has an insurance to protect me, so I'm
liable for the first 300? (around $350), and that's it.

In the case of that thread, the error IMHO is PayPal's, since they
accepted a not good CC. Now, the seller, to whom they have charged
some fees for service, is claim responsible for that.

I do not wish to make business with someone who charges me fees for
nothing. From now on, when I want to buy something, I'll use just
my CC. If I wanna sell it, I'll get a wire transfer. I will feel
safer that way.

Best,
Dioni
You don't take a photograph, you make it (Ansel Adams)

Click to expand...

By his own admission, he allowed someone to pick up the D60 in person, rather than shipping it to the confirmed address. If he had shipped it, he would have been protected. He should also have gotten a look at the real ID of the person picking up the camera, as well as keeping copies of e-mails.

Anthony

Dioni said:

Hi gang,

I thought it could be interesting for many of you using PayPal and
Ebay taking a look to this threads (link to the second is in this
one's first message). Hope it makes you go safer in your
transactions.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=4847002

At this point, I just closed my Paypal account and will never ever
do business with them again.

Best,
Dioni
You don't take a photograph, you make it (Ansel Adams)

Click to expand...

The thing is this, if PayPal is going to run this sort of business, and lets note, they make a good deal of money doing it, they should cover this, especially when they issued the guy funds. Here you have this large business making all that money and look how they treat someone that their own service helped defraud.

I find it hard to believe that they would even treat someone like this.

The guy seems fairly willing to loose his money though, that seems awfully odd.

It is interesting to see how these things work. His big mistake was giving them the money back if in fact the whole story is as it was presented.

Just got to be careful!
Mark

Anthony said:

Anthony

Dioni said:

Hi gang,

I thought it could be interesting for many of you using PayPal and
Ebay taking a look to this threads (link to the second is in this
one's first message). Hope it makes you go safer in your
transactions.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=4847002

At this point, I just closed my Paypal account and will never ever
do business with them again.

Best,
Dioni
You don't take a photograph, you make it (Ansel Adams)

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

--
--
Be friendly to your fellow forum user, prefix your messages:

[PIC] for posting pictures [EQP] for equipment related posts
[LENS] for discussion on lenses [HLP] for when you need help
[ADV] Advice being seeked [CHLG] Challenges, Photo Assignments
[RQST] Requests, favors, etc.
[OPIN] for expressing your opinion, thoughts and Philosophy

Thanks!
Mark

Fuji S2 Pro - Tamron's 19-35, 90 Macro, 28-300 XR and Nikon 70-200VR
Fuji S2 Pro - Tamron's 19-35, 90 Macro, 28-300 XR and Nikon 70-200VR
S2 Pics @ http://www.kcastronomy.com/FujiS2Pro/Page.html

I think you're over reacting. The reason the seller got ripped off is because he did not follow Paypal's rules. Had he shipped to the a verified Paypal address, the seller would not have been responsible, and would have been able to keep the money.

The real victim is the guy who's credit card was stolen, and used to set up a false account. He was never a paypal member, yet still managed to get ripped off. In other words, even if you cancel your Paypal account, so long as you still have credit cards, this can happen to you.

I have sold many items on Ebay using Paypal. I simply make it clear in the auction that I will only sell to a verified Paypal account, and I only ship to the confirmed Paypal address. I do not accept pickups in person, not only for this kind of fraud, but simply for the fact that I don't want some stranger knowing exactly where I and my gear live.

Dioni said:

Hi gang,

I thought it could be interesting for many of you using PayPal and
Ebay taking a look to this threads (link to the second is in this
one's first message). Hope it makes you go safer in your
transactions.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=4847002

At this point, I just closed my Paypal account and will never ever
do business with them again.

Best,
Dioni
You don't take a photograph, you make it (Ansel Adams)

Click to expand...

Dioni said:

Hi gang,

I thought it could be interesting for many of you using PayPal and
Ebay taking a look to this threads (link to the second is in this
one's first message). Hope it makes you go safer in your
transactions.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=4847002

At this point, I just closed my Paypal account and will never ever
do business with them again.

Best,
Dioni
You don't take a photograph, you make it (Ansel Adams)

Click to expand...

Hi Dioni

Thanks for the heads up....but I have dealt with Ebay and Paypal for 2 or 3 years and never had a problem...bought and sold for thousands of dollars! Sorry to say that I have had more problems with my Bank than Paypal. Can't say anything bad about ebay or paypal, of course you have to be vigilant as to whom you buy from.....
Boris
http://public.fotki.com/borysd/
--
Kodak Instamatic

Dioni,

It is clearly stated in there policy that Paypal is not responsible for loss of an item if it is not sent to a confirmed address. The seller did not follow the rules. It's NOT Paypal's problem.

Yes, Paypal accepted a stolen card number, but could have easily reversed the transaction had the seller not hastely allowed the buyer, against Paypal's policy, to pick up the item. The transaction could not have takin place had the seller inforced the confirmed address rule. The fault is with the seller.

Dioni said:

I've never had a problem with PayPal, but now I know that if I'm to
have it at some point, they will not be defending me even if what
happened is their fault or someone's else. If someone steals my CC
and uses it, my CC company has an insurance to protect me, so I'm
liable for the first 300€ (around $350), and that's it.

In the case of that thread, the error IMHO is PayPal's, since they
accepted a not good CC. Now, the seller, to whom they have charged
some fees for service, is claim responsible for that.

I do not wish to make business with someone who charges me fees for
nothing. From now on, when I want to buy something, I'll use just
my CC. If I wanna sell it, I'll get a wire transfer. I will feel
safer that way.

Best,
Dioni
You don't take a photograph, you make it (Ansel Adams)

Click to expand...

The seller broke the rules! It is clearly stated in Paypal's policy that in order to qualify for seller protection, you must ship using a trackable service, to a confirmed address. The seller did not follow those rules, and got burned.

Mark Abraham said:

I find it hard to believe that they would even treat someone like
this.

The guy seems fairly willing to loose his money though, that seems
awfully odd.

It is interesting to see how these things work. His big mistake
was giving them the money back if in fact the whole story is as it
was presented.

Just got to be careful!
Mark

Anthony said:

Anthony

Dioni said:

Hi gang,

I thought it could be interesting for many of you using PayPal and
Ebay taking a look to this threads (link to the second is in this
one's first message). Hope it makes you go safer in your
transactions.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=4847002

At this point, I just closed my Paypal account and will never ever
do business with them again.

Best,
Dioni
You don't take a photograph, you make it (Ansel Adams)

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

--
--
Be friendly to your fellow forum user, prefix your messages:

[PIC] for posting pictures [EQP] for equipment related
posts
[LENS] for discussion on lenses [HLP] for when you need help
[ADV] Advice being seeked [CHLG] Challenges, Photo Assignments
[RQST] Requests, favors, etc.
[OPIN] for expressing your opinion, thoughts and Philosophy

Thanks!
Mark

Fuji S2 Pro - Tamron's 19-35, 90 Macro, 28-300 XR and Nikon 70-200VR
Fuji S2 Pro - Tamron's 19-35, 90 Macro, 28-300 XR and Nikon 70-200VR
S2 Pics @ http://www.kcastronomy.com/FujiS2Pro/Page.html

Click to expand...

I agree it's like you say for one case, which IMO does not mean PayPal is not liable on it, since they accepted the CC and charged a fee. But check this one out:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=4764447

Best,
Dioni
You don't take a photograph, you make it (Ansel Adams)

bobbuilder said:

The real victim is the guy who's credit card was stolen, and used
to set up a false account. He was never a paypal member, yet still
managed to get ripped off. In other words, even if you cancel your
Paypal account, so long as you still have credit cards, this can
happen to you.

Click to expand...

I agree the real CC owner is a victim, but that does not mean the seller is not a victim also. Anyway, if my CC get stolen and used to create a PayPal account, used at the same time to buy whatever, I will be liable for just a small part of the deal (around 200€ if I'm not wrong). My CC company insurance will take care of the rest.

Best,
Dioni
You don't take a photograph, you make it (Ansel Adams)