F
FUCK DPREVIEW!!
Guest
nt means no text
-
Welcome to the new forums! Please read this first. For known issues we are working to resolve, click here.
10D reset.....The fix all! Come on now!
- Thread starter Anthony14707
- Start date
F
FUCK DPREVIEW!!
Guest
Doug Eddleman
Forum Enthusiast
While I don't have a problem with my 10D I am not so quick to discount the possiblilty of a firmware bug based on what I have read here and examples that I have seen of pre-reset images compared to post-reset images.
I know from experience that when writing software you might spend weeks debugging, beta testing, etc. and then release it and the first user finds a bug because they used the system in a different way than you do.
I find it entirely possible that without resetting there is an uninitialized data field somewhere and the firmware doesn't know how to deal with it, causing potential problems. With an unitialized data field the effects could vary from camera to camera. Resetting the camera might initilize all parameters and the problem goes away.
While this is just speculation, I don't see how some are so quick to assume that this is just a placebo effect. My own 10D has none of the reported problems so I can't try the "fix" on mine but quite a few users have posted that it works.
Doug
I know from experience that when writing software you might spend weeks debugging, beta testing, etc. and then release it and the first user finds a bug because they used the system in a different way than you do.
I find it entirely possible that without resetting there is an uninitialized data field somewhere and the firmware doesn't know how to deal with it, causing potential problems. With an unitialized data field the effects could vary from camera to camera. Resetting the camera might initilize all parameters and the problem goes away.
While this is just speculation, I don't see how some are so quick to assume that this is just a placebo effect. My own 10D has none of the reported problems so I can't try the "fix" on mine but quite a few users have posted that it works.
Doug
F
FUCK DPREVIEW!!
Guest
LOL... ...no, it doesn't.
Btw: I owned a Minolta Dimage 7 and I can promise you that the "issues" discussed here reg. 10D AF performance have nothing to do with the AF of the Minolta 7 series cameras.
Hope this helps
Andi
Since I did not upgrade to the 10d (from the D60) I do not have a problem, I was just stating that since the 10D is a "picture taking computer", it would not be illogical for a reset of the camera's computer to 'fix" a problem.
Lewis w
Well-known member
I have the focus problem, and the area where it does acheive focus is still very soft. I tried resetting but it didn't work. Worth a try though. On the other hand, if it did work I would not have been happy - I can't afford for this to happen when I am in the field. Mine is going back I just hope they aren't all the same.
http://www.pbase.com/lewis_whyld/lewis&page=2
Lewis
http://www.pbase.com/lewis_whyld/lewis&page=2
--
Lewis
Tommy Wirestam
Forum Enthusiast
It is a well known fact for everybody who is working with programming, that memory space that is used for holding variables that you use in a program contains random data at power up. You therefor have to initialize every variable to a known value. I wouldn't be surprised if somewhere down in that little 10D computer there is an uninitialized variable, and in a not to distant future we see a firmware update from Canon.
--
Tommy
D
David Martin
Guest
Andi,
I am genuinely interested in your answer - I of course realise that the principles behind focussing on a DSLR and on the Minoltas are radically different, but nevertheless cannot understand why you are so sure that no firmware issues can arise.
On my computer at home occassionally there is a glitch. The solution would either to go off and take a master's in software engineering, followed by several moths of analysis to work out what has gone wrong, or else to re-boot which is what I do and usually sorts out the problem.
I note that whatever the other differences the Minolta also has a multi-point focussing system, one can imagine that there is processing taking part inherently in this type of system, and the same system would also be in place if you were using centre-point focussing only.
I am in no position to assert that there are problems which can be sorted out by a reset, but am at a loss to understand why you feel the very idea so ridiculous.
Even my video recorder can get upset sometimes!
Regards,
--
DaveMart
DavidP #28649
Forum Pro
Well, I don't think a reboot of the computer can really be compared to resetting parameters on the 10D.
The reboot is more analogous to simply turning the camera off and then back on.
The Unofficial Photographer of The Wilkinsons
http://thewilkinsons.crosswinds.net
Photography -- just another word for compromise
The reboot is more analogous to simply turning the camera off and then back on.
--
The Unofficial Photographer of The Wilkinsons
http://thewilkinsons.crosswinds.net
Photography -- just another word for compromise
Bill Gilbertson
Leading Member
I friend of mine had a video camera that wasn't functioning. After several people tried to figure out what was wrong, I simply removed the battery, waited a bit and reinserted it. It then worked fine. These are just special purpose computers. If all else fails, I would remove both batteries.
--
BillG - Software Engineer
--
BillG - Software Engineer
Jerry-astro
Forum Pro
Hmm, good question. You may need to take my answers with a bit of a grain of salt because I was pretty familiar with the D100 and am still very much ramping up on the 10D. That being said, image quality seems pretty similar, although the D100 also has a bit of a propensity for image softness, and there's been a ton of exchanges in the Nikon SLR forum over that. Fact is that PShop does a lot better job of sharpening than the camera's own software can, so it makes sense that the images from either camera might seem a bit soft straight out of the camera. I find that USM, properly applied, does a great job with images from both cameras.
Still getting used to the 10D's menus, buttons, etc. but find them pretty similar in usability to the D100. Again, could answer it better once I've really gotten accustomed to the Canon. Definitely getting better low light performance from the 10D (which was the primary reason I switched). Getting 5+ minute exposures with minimal noise -- perfect for the astrophotography application I'm planning for this camera over time.
Overall feel for both cameras is comfortable. The D100 is a bit lighter, but since I have a lighter lens on the 10D (Canon 24-85 vs. Tamron 24-135 on the Nikon), seems a wash. Both feel really good in the hands. Autofocus on both cameras works very well, although the Tamron lens had a tendency to hunt (the reason I didn't get it again).
Bottom line: unless you have a specific requirement which one or the other camera fulfills better, you just can't go wrong with either. I'm into SLRs again after 20+ years of P&Ss and no way am I going back. Having way too much fun.
Best,
Jerry
Still getting used to the 10D's menus, buttons, etc. but find them pretty similar in usability to the D100. Again, could answer it better once I've really gotten accustomed to the Canon. Definitely getting better low light performance from the 10D (which was the primary reason I switched). Getting 5+ minute exposures with minimal noise -- perfect for the astrophotography application I'm planning for this camera over time.
Overall feel for both cameras is comfortable. The D100 is a bit lighter, but since I have a lighter lens on the 10D (Canon 24-85 vs. Tamron 24-135 on the Nikon), seems a wash. Both feel really good in the hands. Autofocus on both cameras works very well, although the Tamron lens had a tendency to hunt (the reason I didn't get it again).
Bottom line: unless you have a specific requirement which one or the other camera fulfills better, you just can't go wrong with either. I'm into SLRs again after 20+ years of P&Ss and no way am I going back. Having way too much fun.
Best,
Jerry
D
David Martin
Guest
David,
I was not seeking to draw a precise analogy. One is firmware and tied in a lot more closely to the hardware.
Analogies aside, we don't really seem to be in disagreement, as I note from one of your other posts that at least existentially you seem to have improved the AF of your 10D by re-setting.
There are probably only half a dozen people in the world who are really au fait with the firmware of the 10D, and the rest of us may be better off to be fairly pragmatic about using it - logic, as the man said, is a way of going wrong with confidence! - especially without complete information about the characteristics of a system.
Best regards,
--
DaveMart
Stephen Waits
Senior Member
Why is it so hard for you to believe a firmware bug may indeed be present in the 10D?
Some people having problems, maybe most, are indeed user error. However, we now have people testing the camera, resetting it, retesting it, and seeing different results. Are they all making that up too?
Having been a software developer for a number of years, albeit in video games, I don't for one second believe that a "1.0.0" firmware is bug-free. But, do you???
--Steve
Pixel Warp
Senior Member
Stephen Waits
Senior Member
Andreas has been here awhile, and made quite positive contributions to the forums in the past.
And because I was curious if someone could really think that a "1.0.0" (or any release!) product could be bug-free!
--Steve
And because I was curious if someone could really think that a "1.0.0" (or any release!) product could be bug-free!
--Steve
Stephen Waits
Senior Member
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=4749319
Now, at this point, I'm switching over.. anyone naysaying this is in fact trolling and gets ignored by me.
Now if only we could get killfile support from Phil.. and FAQ support.. and automatic troll detection via a Bayesian Classifier.
--Steve
Now, at this point, I'm switching over.. anyone naysaying this is in fact trolling and gets ignored by me.
Now if only we could get killfile support from Phil.. and FAQ support.. and automatic troll detection via a Bayesian Classifier.
--Steve
Pixel Warp
Senior Member
(Not directed at you in particular, Stephen)
That's exactly the caliber of improvement that I saw with the reset! Now, salt with that crow anyone? It's hard to stomache plain...
That's exactly the caliber of improvement that I saw with the reset! Now, salt with that crow anyone? It's hard to stomache plain...
--http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=4749319
Now, at this point, I'm switching over.. anyone naysaying this is
in fact trolling and gets ignored by me.
Now if only we could get killfile support from Phil.. and FAQ
support.. and automatic troll detection via a Bayesian Classifier.
--Steve
- Chris
F
FUCK DPREVIEW!!
Guest
That's the key issue - the people reporting AF issues (and fixes) either do not have a 10D or they are newbies or trolls (it's worth checking posting history from time to time). It's up to you whether you take every line here for a truth or an opinion of some sorts. Don't forget that a false statement error does not get any better by repeating it in more postings and more threads.
Of couse, a camera can be a warranty case and be defective; if you have any doubt that the camera is defective, get in contact with Canon.
But chances are very small that you will have a defective camera. It's important that you study the manual and practise using the camera; the AF of the 10D is a very potent beast, but it's a bit more complex and it's easy to "automatically" produce "unsharp" pictures (especially for newbies not having experienced other AF SLR cameras before). One also has to distinguish between "unsharp" pictures due to focusing and "soft" images as the result of other reasons. I've seen enough posters here mixing up shallow DoF with "soft" pictures... ..another issue is the in-camera processing: The 10D standard settings - compared to other cameras - are very conservative when it comes to sharpening and auto-balancing pictures etc. that is done in-camera. With this, Canon assumes that digital SLR camera users will further process the pictures in a "workflow" subject to individual needs, especially the needs of different output medias (=the amount of sharpening depends on the media you are viewing the picture (monitor versus bubble jet print, for example)). But with the parameter settings of the 10D, you can apply as much in-camera processing as some other cameras. Check the 10D manual for details (it's available online).
If you are interested in getting feedback from actual 10D users and owners, suggest you post your questions in a new thread.
Andi
Pigasus
Leading Member
Yes, Andi. I think that a good many of the problems being reported may not be founded. Newbies aren't sure how to best use the camera and trolls are ... well just trolls. But I hear the same complaint restated by various experienced digital photographers over and over. The images out of the 10D are too soft - almost like vasoline has been smeared over the lens. This results in the images appearing OOF or lacking in contrast. Please note, this is not the same as front/back focus issue, although many might confuse the two. This softness issue has even been raised in the most recent 10D review made by Jeff at DCResource. Following his review, he heard about and tried the reset. Please read what he has to say here:
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=4749319
--
Pigasus
The pig that flies
http://www.pigasusgrove.net/gallery/
F
FUCK DPREVIEW!!
Guest
Well, in the review, he said (quote fom http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/canon/eos_10d-review/index.shtml )...
"In conclusion, I'd say that the EOS-10D produces very well-exposed images with superb color and good detail. The downside is that images are too soft (in this reviewer's opinion) at the default sharpness setting. You have two ways around this: either crank up the in-camera sharpening, or leave it as is, and do the sharpening in Photoshop instead."
That statement is absolutely correct. I remeber how shocked I was about image softness when switching from the Minolta Dimage 7 to the Canon D30. Now I'm terrified by my old Dimage 7 pics...
The funny thing is that he doesn't mention an AF issue in his review - that issue is a dpreview myth, in my opinion. His comparision shots could be caused by soooo many other factors than a systematic AF bug... ...personally, I wouldn't base any bets on these pictures.
As with other products: If you think it's defect, (try to) rule out user error and contact the manufactorer in case of any unresolved questions.
Andi
Keyboard shortcuts
- f
- Forum