Canon's pincer movement

  • Thread starter Thread starter Hap Mullenneaux
  • Start date Start date
"Prosumer" cameras were dealt the deathnell blow this week with the
announcement of the Canon 10D. Next year (perhaps this) DSLR's
will come down to a pricepoint that it would be stupid to waste
your money on a prosumer model when a true DSLR costs the same
thing. There will always be a market for point and shoots, but not
for prosumer cameras.
No way Doc! Even though there are times I drag my gear out the G2 is always with me.

But that sony? Nah, it defeats the portability, portability is why I bought the G2.
Good image, good lens, total control of all functions and small.

Just like the range finders of that film sub-culture.
 
Petteri, I've read a lot of your posts about the new DSLRs. I respect your knowledge and most times I agree with you but in this discussion I think I'm leaning more towards Dave's viewpoint.

I think the crowd here at dpreview is far from representative of the averege buyers of digital cameras, at least from the prosumer level and downwards. The rest of my family and several friends shoot with digital cameras but almost exclusively in P-mode and the occasional movie clip. They think my Oly E-100 is a lot of fun because of its big zoom range. It's a great camera for candids even though it's only got 1.3MP. They mainly have compacts because they don't want to invest the kind of money a prosumer zoom camera costs. If they could have a 6-8x zoom in a compact package at a low price they'd take that over a DSLR any day. They just want to turn on the camera and shoot, not bother with changing lenses or carry them around. Their printing requirements are 4x6, 6x8, and the occasional 8x10. If they could get a decent 16x20 I'm sure they'd be happy to have the option but rarely (if ever) use it. They also don't want to mess around with Photoshop, the "Instant Fix" and "Redeye Fix" in the accompanying software package is all they want to deal with.

I think these people represent a much more common market segment than those of us here at dpreview who currently own prosumer cameras but are lusting after a DSLR.

Regards, Maxven
Myself, I'm a 602 owner, and I'm eagerly awaiting Fuji's
announcement of a successor. It's kinda funny, but the only camera
that has caught my interest in all the PMA hoopla is the Sony V1.
Looks like I might be going in the opposite direction - even
lighter and more compact.

Gotta be honest with you, we're both starting to repeat ourselves.
It's all just speculation on our parts anyway. I enjoyed
discussing this with you, but I think I'll bow out now. Take care.

--
BigWaveDave
 
Why has Canon packed so much into it's S series?
Why didn't Canon replace the Pro 90IS?
Why has Canon brought the price of DSLR's down so fast?
The latest announcements suggest a master plan. Canon hasn't gone
after the bulky fixed lens prosumer cameras like the Sony F717
because that market is slated for extinction. Canon has been
lowering the entry price for DSLR's ever since it introduced the
D30. It's aggressive pricing is not only giving it command of the
DSLR market, it is eliminating the market below it. Meanwhile we
see full featured S series cameras rivaling the G3 in image
quality. The price gap between the pocket point and shoot and the
digital SLR is closing. Soon the only digitals that will make
sense will be cheap P&S, pocket P&S, and SLR. Sounds just like
the current state of 35mm film cameras, doesn't it? Remember how
the bulky fixed lens 35mm rangefinders like the Canonet were pushed
out by affordable SLR's?
Look at the recent Canon announcements. We have the cheap P&S in
the A series, the pocket P&S in the S series, and the new 10D.
There is still enough room between the S50 at $600 and the 10D at
$1,500 street price for a G3 type camera to exist for awhile. In
the long run, however, Canon would rather introduce you to its fine
family of lenses.
Just my two bits,
Hap
--
 
BigWaveDave wrote:
[snip]
With the recent acquistion by Konica, it seems the gloom and
doomsayers have taken over the Minolta forum. But take a look at
the Sony and the Fuji forums. The 717 and 602 enjoy a healthy,
loyal following.

Myself, I'm a 602 owner, and I'm eagerly awaiting Fuji's
announcement of a successor. It's kinda funny, but the only camera
that has caught my interest in all the PMA hoopla is the Sony V1.
Looks like I might be going in the opposite direction - even
lighter and more compact.
Nothing wrong with that. I was a happy ZLR user for years. There is a specific mission for ZLEV's, and I'm sure they'll stick around and continue to improve.
Gotta be honest with you, we're both starting to repeat ourselves.
It's all just speculation on our parts anyway. I enjoyed
discussing this with you, but I think I'll bow out now. Take care.
I was thinking the same thing when writing the previous reply. We'll see how things look in a year. Only one thing is certain: the stuff available then will be cheaper and better.

Cheers, Petteri
--
http://www.seittipaja.fi/index/
 
Maxven wrote:
[snip description about PnS market segment]
I think these people represent a much more common market segment
than those of us here at dpreview who currently own prosumer
cameras but are lusting after a DSLR.
That is certain. However, there's one other thing about them: they like to take pictures, but they don't like to carry equipment. Point-and-shoot ZLR's didn't really catch on in that crowd because they aren't pocketable. Same applies to ZLEV's.

Petteri
--
http://www.seittipaja.fi/index/
 
I would love an $1100 camera with a 28-200 35mm zoom range and a
sensor that is twice the linear dimensions of the current models.
One could have excellent image quality and convenience in one
machine. Something like a Dimage 7hi with a larger, less noisy
sensor.

To end up with the same focal length range on the 10D is going to
cost big bucks... especially with L glass. You're going to need a
17mm lens at the wide end, and possibly a couple more good zooms to
complete the range. The 10D doesn't have a focus assist lamp. That
will be another reason for people to pick up a shoe mount flash
from Canon too.

Doesn't look like $1500 to me. Maybe $3000 - $3500.
Let's look at this in terms of trade-offs. Let's suppose you could get the Pentax *ist for $1200. Then let's add one lens: I'll pick their f/2 35 mm at ca $280 (a pretty bright, very high quality "normal" lens). That's about the $1500 you set as your price cap.

Now, let's compare it to a good ZLEV: completely at random, I'll pick the Minolta D7i sitting on my desk. What would the trade-offs be by swapping the D7i for the *ist with 35 mm?

Losses:
  • Flexibility in choice of focal lengths (very significant)
  • Portability (marginal; the cameras are very, very close to the same size and weight)
  • EVF/LCD live preview, tiltable EVF
  • Increased maintenance (need to keep sensor clean of dust)
Gains:

+ Four stops more sensitivity (ISO 1600 roughly equivalent to ISO200, one stop more from the lens)
+ Real control over depth of field
+ Significantly improved image quality
+ Much better responsiveness
+ Much better viewfinder
+ Significantly better battery life

+ Possibility to upgrade the system later, while keeping existing components (including used market!)

IMO what this boils down to is this: you trade-off flexibility in choice of focal lengths to gain flexibility in exposure, creative control, and responsiveness.

Are the trade-offs worth it? That depends entirely on what you shoot and how you shoot it... but I suspect that for most serious amateurs, they are.

Petteri
--
http://www.seittipaja.fi/index/
 
I wouldn't drop my D7i but had there been a DSLR out like the D10 last August, I would have saved a little longer and bought one and a reasonably priced prime lens.

I think Canon is shooting for two separate markets with the D10. Olympus did very well with folks buying their Exx cameras and all the tcons, mcons, etc. Will the D10 and a third party lens be that much more expensive than the e20 was last October? I don't think so. And since the D10 is a slight upgrade to the D60, isn't Canon also shooting for the same market as Nikon, Fuji, and Sigma and their entry-level DSLR's?
Looks like a very clever marketing ploy to appeal to two separate markets.

Someone who would pay $1000 to $1299 for a D7i, CP5700, F717, E20 might not be willing to spend $2000 PLUS more for a lens, even a cheap lens...but they might be willing to spend $2000 for a DSLR AND an affordable lens.

Canon seems very smart to price the D10 at $1500 or so (I know, MSRP $1999 but some retailers have them for $1499 already).
They're going for the middle market....
JB
BigWaveDave wrote:

[snip]
Maybe you're right. However, check out the Minolta forum: maybe
it's just that the gripers are most vocal, but it looks like most
of the folks over there would be willing to drop their D7's, 7i's,
and 7Hi's like hot potatoes if Minolta came up with an affordable
D-SLR (so they could use their existing glass) or anyone at all
came up with a compact SLR (if they don't have any Minolta glass).
I don't know how representative the sample is, but it sure means
something .
 
Very good analysis, Caterpillar. I think you've read the market very well.

Regards, Maxven
As the price goes down, it will the prosumer P&S who will get the
squeeze. Sony's no. 1 market leadership, even without having a DSLR
shows where the revenue is squewed (It makes for a nice Pareto
chart). I find it odd (being a graduate of TM) all the hype and
noise by the users of DSLR as if it is the driver of the long term
strategic goals of the players. DSLRs may drive the technology, but
so far, it is the consumer level that help offset and finance the
R&D for the 8-up mpix, which will trickle down in 2-3 years down
the road.

The is the same reason why Kodak did not update their DC-4800
series. The competition in the P&S where Gx's, 7xx's, 602s, 5050s
now dominate is simply too fierce and yet the margins are thin. And
yet, Kodak has their other foot on the R&D for DSLR. A very fine
balancing act for most companies.

But the technical issues of higher mpix and larger CCDs are really
there. I read different fori where people bash the camera companies
for not coming out with 5 mpix or why no FF sensors. It is not
difficult solving the problems of high end cameras and yet lower
donw the cost rapidly. The noise issues of the 14n, the foveon
delay of the x3, etc shows the technical prowess and difficulties
required to deliver products on time and a low cost, which are
difficult to do. It's not that these companies don't read the
posts, but many have opted to service the "lower" requirements of
the masses for the simple reason that it is a battle of market
share where it matters most and which will readily reflect in the
year-end books.

But they also know they have to do R&D in the high end, where at
times there is little if no profit at all. But this high end is the
hope of the futre. They know the trickle down learning they gain
which can be used inthe consumer level at a later date.

These companies will not stop or re-do their long term strategy
just because somebody cried 1.5 x FOV. They know the market is
small and the technical issues are still high. It's not that they
are not doing anything about it, but they are not rushing to bring
out products till they get it right. They know that the worst that
they can do is not not being able to ship, but to ship with a
faulty product. That is as close as you can get to a kiss of death
in terms of products.

Right now, 6mp is the level where a good balance of quality meet.
It is safe to say that a sub-$1000 dslr is possible within the
year. And the one that delivers it first will achieve a great
psychological blow even if the lenses are not from Nikon or Canon.

It will be proven, as some have stated here, that the market for a
low end DSLR, with a single zoom lens (28-80mm equiv) will sell
well, and it will be the G3's, 5050, 5000/5700 etc which will get
the squeeze. They will have to go down in price or else exit this
segment.

Meanwhile, the Samsung's and their like will be attacking the entry
level. Reducing price, adding features further.

In 2-3 years what will be left will be a variety of entry level
P&S, a limited prosumer P&S (others will exit this segment
altogether) while dslr will avg at U$700-800 in a 6mp-8mp range,
built-in pop flash, bundled with a simple 28-50 or 35-70mm af zoom
if one wants one, using usb 2.0., or blue tooth, 1gb of CF will be
standard. 2-3 fps in 8-12 continuous frames will be the norm.

The prof segment will get their 12-24mp dslr at between
U$1,500-2,500. What I would be curious is whether the 35mm format
or FF will survive this future. Another curious thing would be how
Foveon will evolve in this changing market. I bet they would have
more success in the consumer, if not P&S segment/cum video. Lenses
will still be expensive, and hopefully somebody will sell AA
lithium-ion batteries with their own chargers. Heck, maybe we will
need to call DSLRs something else as one company finally removes
the folding mirror and used LCD screens altogether in an
interchangeble lens format.

What I would even venture to speculate is that Sony may even bring
out their own dslr. They may be forced into this position simply
because their P&S prosumer is already squeezed from the top and
they need to make the jump. They do have the CCD and other
complementary technologies to do this. For Sony, they might
maintain the 7xx series as their P&S midlevel, while the P series
while target multiple niches in the consumer/entry level market.
You will have a P&S for the yuppie, the teenager, the 7-10 year
old, or whatever they can think of.

In the end, in whatever shape or form the market will settle, if
this rate of change is maintained, it will only benefit all users,
whether professionals or not. The era of the sub-1,000 dollars DSLR
has arrived.
--
  • Caterpillar
 
I think these people represent a much more common market segment
than those of us here at dpreview who currently own prosumer
cameras but are lusting after a DSLR.
That is certain. However, there's one other thing about them: they
like to take pictures, but they don't like to carry equipment.
Point-and-shoot ZLR's didn't really catch on in that crowd because
they aren't pocketable. Same applies to ZLEV's.

Petteri
Well, maybe we do agree to a point then. The camera style I think there's still room for is something like the Olympus C-7XX-series and the S602 style camera. They're not compact cameras but still small enough to fit into a jacket pocket or a purse.

Regards, Maxven
 
First of all, there is plenty of reason for the 717/G3.
I see a world of difference between the two - Try finding the right
bag to carry the F717 around in and for an extra 1X zoom, the F717
looks a little bulky! The G3 fits nicely in a small compact case.
The 717 has a TTL viewfinder though. I wouldn't want to use a non-TTL viewfinder.
They are
smaller and lighter and have other features that are lacking in the
SLR cameras.
Oh puhleese - if you can find something lacking on the D10 please
let me know. It sounds exceptionally well specified to me....OK no
hologram AF night focus but tell me one other feature it lacks?
Live LCD display
Tiltable LCD display
Silent operation
Easily handheld at much lower shutter speeds
Video mode
Gobs of DOF and sufficient DOF wide open
Compact size with a very good zoom range

--
my favorite work: http://www.pbase.com/sdaconsulting/favorite_work
 
Well Petteri, you've hit my trouble right on the head. I've got an E-20 with a Wcon08B and a B-300. With the Wcon08B attached I've got a zoom range of 28-112mm. If I don't need to go that wide I stick with the normal 35-140mm. However, that wide angle is very important for me to have. If I were stuck with 35mm as the widest I'd have bought a different camera. Ideally I'd like to go even wider to 20 or 24mm.

If I get a DSLR my ISO problems and buffer problems will be solved. I'll also be able to get a decent long zoom for reasonable money. However, what do I do about the wide side? The E-20 + Wcon08B cost me $1,200. The cheapest WA zoom is Sigma's 15-30mm and I won't be able to use a polarizer or IR filter with it as I often do for my WA shots. Canon's 16-35mm is well over $1,000 and their new WA lens is supposed to be around $800.

For a system with a good WA I'll need to spend those $800 plus another $500 or so for a medium range zoom. That's more than twice the price of my current setup.

Regards, Maxven
Let's look at this in terms of trade-offs. Let's suppose you could
get the Pentax *ist for $1200. Then let's add one lens: I'll pick
their f/2 35 mm at ca $280 (a pretty bright, very high quality
"normal" lens). That's about the $1500 you set as your price cap.

Now, let's compare it to a good ZLEV: completely at random, I'll
pick the Minolta D7i sitting on my desk. What would the trade-offs
be by swapping the D7i for the *ist with 35 mm?

Losses:
  • Flexibility in choice of focal lengths (very significant)
  • Portability (marginal; the cameras are very, very close to the
same size and weight)
  • EVF/LCD live preview, tiltable EVF
  • Increased maintenance (need to keep sensor clean of dust)
Gains:
+ Four stops more sensitivity (ISO 1600 roughly equivalent to
ISO200, one stop more from the lens)
+ Real control over depth of field
+ Significantly improved image quality
+ Much better responsiveness
+ Much better viewfinder
+ Significantly better battery life
+ Possibility to upgrade the system later, while keeping existing
components (including used market!)

IMO what this boils down to is this: you trade-off flexibility in
choice of focal lengths to gain flexibility in exposure, creative
control, and responsiveness.

Are the trade-offs worth it? That depends entirely on what you
shoot and how you shoot it... but I suspect that for most serious
amateurs, they are.

Petteri
--
http://www.seittipaja.fi/index/
 
I'll keep my Sony 717/next version and get a dSLR system as well.
There are a ton of things that the 717 can do that a dSLR can't
(and vice-versa).
Such as...? (Yep, there are the nightvision widgets... but apart
from that?)
Live, tiltable LCD which I use most of the time

More usable DOF just about everywhere (particularly important shooting macro if you want available light macro)
Handholdable to very low shutter speeds
Silent operation
Video mode for impromptu shots of the kids
Much smaller, more compact package
Live histogram

WYSIWYG views through viewfinder/LCD (you see the dynamic range captured by the imager and it's always in DOF preview mode).
Flash Synch to 1/2000 second

--
my favorite work: http://www.pbase.com/sdaconsulting/favorite_work
 
Well Petteri, you've hit my trouble right on the head. I've got an
E-20 with a Wcon08B and a B-300. With the Wcon08B attached I've got
a zoom range of 28-112mm. If I don't need to go that wide I stick
with the normal 35-140mm. However, that wide angle is very
important for me to have. If I were stuck with 35mm as the widest
I'd have bought a different camera. Ideally I'd like to go even
wider to 20 or 24mm.
If I get a DSLR my ISO problems and buffer problems will be solved.
I'll also be able to get a decent long zoom for reasonable money.
However, what do I do about the wide side? The E-20 + Wcon08B cost
me $1,200. The cheapest WA zoom is Sigma's 15-30mm and I won't be
able to use a polarizer or IR filter with it as I often do for my
WA shots. Canon's 16-35mm is well over $1,000 and their new WA lens
is supposed to be around $800.
For a system with a good WA I'll need to spend those $800 plus
another $500 or so for a medium range zoom. That's more than twice
the price of my current setup.
Then it's simple enough: the trade-off isn't worth it for you. The point is to find the tools that are best suited for the job you want to do.

I checked out some prices, and 20 mm primes are available at prices that aren't utterly outrageous. That winds up to about 30 mm equivalent -- not ultra-wide, but still pretty wide. I'm reasonably happy with 28 mm, so I think I could live with 30.

Petteri
--
http://www.seittipaja.fi/index/
 
I'll keep my Sony 717/next version and get a dSLR system as well.
There are a ton of things that the 717 can do that a dSLR can't
(and vice-versa).
Such as...? (Yep, there are the nightvision widgets... but apart
from that?)
Live, tiltable LCD which I use most of the time
Check.
More usable DOF just about everywhere (particularly important
shooting macro if you want available light macro)
In my book, the DoF is one of the biggest limitations of these cameras.
Handholdable to very low shutter speeds
Longer than a D-SLR with IS lens? Are you sure?
Silent operation
Check.
Video mode for impromptu shots of the kids
Check. (I admit that my reaction to this feature is "yech" though.)
Much smaller, more compact package
Smaller than a 10D, sure, but about the same as an *ist (with a WA to short tele prime).
Live histogram
Check.
WYSIWYG views through viewfinder/LCD (you see the dynamic range
captured by the imager and it's always in DOF preview mode).
Check.
Flash Synch to 1/2000 second
Check.

Matthew -- thanks for the list, but I think you misunderstood my question. (I admit I didn't phrase it very clearly.) I'm interested to know what these features permit you to do photographically that a D-SLR wouldn't. I'm looking at it from the use point of view. For example, what kind of photograph does flash sync at 1/2000 permit you to take that flash sync at 1/250 doesn't?

Petteri
--
http://www.seittipaja.fi/index/
 
Excellent analysis! I would be suprised if it takes 2-3 years for fruition though. I'm guessing 18 months to 2 years.
As the price goes down, it will the prosumer P&S who will get the
squeeze. Sony's no. 1 market leadership, even without having a DSLR
shows where the revenue is squewed (It makes for a nice Pareto
chart). I find it odd (being a graduate of TM) all the hype and
noise by the users of DSLR as if it is the driver of the long term
strategic goals of the players. DSLRs may drive the technology, but
so far, it is the consumer level that help offset and finance the
R&D for the 8-up mpix, which will trickle down in 2-3 years down
the road.

The is the same reason why Kodak did not update their DC-4800
series. The competition in the P&S where Gx's, 7xx's, 602s, 5050s
now dominate is simply too fierce and yet the margins are thin. And
yet, Kodak has their other foot on the R&D for DSLR. A very fine
balancing act for most companies.

But the technical issues of higher mpix and larger CCDs are really
there. I read different fori where people bash the camera companies
for not coming out with 5 mpix or why no FF sensors. It is not
difficult solving the problems of high end cameras and yet lower
donw the cost rapidly. The noise issues of the 14n, the foveon
delay of the x3, etc shows the technical prowess and difficulties
required to deliver products on time and a low cost, which are
difficult to do. It's not that these companies don't read the
posts, but many have opted to service the "lower" requirements of
the masses for the simple reason that it is a battle of market
share where it matters most and which will readily reflect in the
year-end books.

But they also know they have to do R&D in the high end, where at
times there is little if no profit at all. But this high end is the
hope of the futre. They know the trickle down learning they gain
which can be used inthe consumer level at a later date.

These companies will not stop or re-do their long term strategy
just because somebody cried 1.5 x FOV. They know the market is
small and the technical issues are still high. It's not that they
are not doing anything about it, but they are not rushing to bring
out products till they get it right. They know that the worst that
they can do is not not being able to ship, but to ship with a
faulty product. That is as close as you can get to a kiss of death
in terms of products.

Right now, 6mp is the level where a good balance of quality meet.
It is safe to say that a sub-$1000 dslr is possible within the
year. And the one that delivers it first will achieve a great
psychological blow even if the lenses are not from Nikon or Canon.

It will be proven, as some have stated here, that the market for a
low end DSLR, with a single zoom lens (28-80mm equiv) will sell
well, and it will be the G3's, 5050, 5000/5700 etc which will get
the squeeze. They will have to go down in price or else exit this
segment.

Meanwhile, the Samsung's and their like will be attacking the entry
level. Reducing price, adding features further.

In 2-3 years what will be left will be a variety of entry level
P&S, a limited prosumer P&S (others will exit this segment
altogether) while dslr will avg at U$700-800 in a 6mp-8mp range,
built-in pop flash, bundled with a simple 28-50 or 35-70mm af zoom
if one wants one, using usb 2.0., or blue tooth, 1gb of CF will be
standard. 2-3 fps in 8-12 continuous frames will be the norm.

The prof segment will get their 12-24mp dslr at between
U$1,500-2,500. What I would be curious is whether the 35mm format
or FF will survive this future. Another curious thing would be how
Foveon will evolve in this changing market. I bet they would have
more success in the consumer, if not P&S segment/cum video. Lenses
will still be expensive, and hopefully somebody will sell AA
lithium-ion batteries with their own chargers. Heck, maybe we will
need to call DSLRs something else as one company finally removes
the folding mirror and used LCD screens altogether in an
interchangeble lens format.

What I would even venture to speculate is that Sony may even bring
out their own dslr. They may be forced into this position simply
because their P&S prosumer is already squeezed from the top and
they need to make the jump. They do have the CCD and other
complementary technologies to do this. For Sony, they might
maintain the 7xx series as their P&S midlevel, while the P series
while target multiple niches in the consumer/entry level market.
You will have a P&S for the yuppie, the teenager, the 7-10 year
old, or whatever they can think of.

In the end, in whatever shape or form the market will settle, if
this rate of change is maintained, it will only benefit all users,
whether professionals or not. The era of the sub-1,000 dollars DSLR
has arrived.
--
  • Caterpillar
 
...........are the restricting factor and their cost will never
allow a DSLR to be competitive with that of a high end one lens
camera like the 717. The 717 type cameras will always have features
and advantages that are just not possible in a heavy/bulky,costly
DSLR camera. They will both be available for many years to come.
Especially if Sony wants it to be.
I don't think anyone's saying they'll stop making them. They're just saying that the ZLEV market will shrink dramatically. There's definitely a niche for a compact, versatile camera with the excellent image quality that these cameras provide... but the niche will be a lot smaller than what they're currently occupying.

Petteri
--
http://www.seittipaja.fi/index/
 
Matthew -- thanks for the list, but I think you misunderstood my
question. (I admit I didn't phrase it very clearly.) I'm interested
to know what these features permit you to do photographically
that a D-SLR wouldn't. I'm looking at it from the use point of
view. For example, what kind of photograph does flash sync at
1/2000 permit you to take that flash sync at 1/250 doesn't?
From a photographic point of view, I find the live LCD to be the most compelling feature.

It's just loads easier to compose looking at a rectangle (with live, proper DOF and exposure) versus looking THROUGH a viewfinder. When you look at a relatively large and flat-appearing rectangle you see the picture, somehow looking through a viewfinder I'm looking at the scene as an observer instead of looking at a picture of a scene. This is highly personal of course, I'm sure others don't have this problem. To me, the live LCD is like a "ground glass". As my serious photography is landscape perhaps this makes more sense.

The fact that the EFV/LCD display images with the captured dynamic range and the captured aperture is another huge advantage for me.

The fact that the sensor has more DOF is an advantage to most of my landscape work.

The tiltable LCD makes shooting eye-level images of kids far easier (as well as birds and other small wildlife).

Fast flash synch means more flash range and the ability to use much cheaper flash units without multistrobe capability.

IS would be pretty useless for me in most shooting situations as I almost always am limited by subject motion instead of camera shake.

A silent shutter is crucial for certain types of wildlife photography and event and performance photography.

More DOF makes handheld and available light macro work much more feasible. I almost always prefer available light images because (to me) they look more natural and real.

Video is a great feature to have when shooting friends and family, even though I do not shoot video artistically.

--
my favorite work: http://www.pbase.com/sdaconsulting/favorite_work
 
Matthew -- thanks for the list, but I think you misunderstood my
question. (I admit I didn't phrase it very clearly.) I'm interested
to know what these features permit you to do photographically
that a D-SLR wouldn't. I'm looking at it from the use point of
view. For example, what kind of photograph does flash sync at
1/2000 permit you to take that flash sync at 1/250 doesn't?
From a photographic point of view, I find the live LCD to be the
most compelling feature.

It's just loads easier to compose looking at a rectangle (with
live, proper DOF and exposure) versus looking THROUGH a viewfinder.
When you look at a relatively large and flat-appearing rectangle
you see the picture, somehow looking through a viewfinder I'm
looking at the scene as an observer instead of looking at a picture
of a scene. This is highly personal of course, I'm sure others
don't have this problem. To me, the live LCD is like a "ground
glass". As my serious photography is landscape perhaps this makes
more sense.
I can see that. If you're shooting mostly off a tripod, too, the stability issue isn't as important (I find it difficult to hold a camera stable if I'm looking at the LCD). There are definite advantages to an EVF, but I still feel slightly depressed every time I switch from looking through the OVF of my AE-1 to the EVF of my D7i.
The fact that the EFV/LCD display images with the captured dynamic
range and the captured aperture is another huge advantage for me.
Hm. My problem is that the EVF/LCD can be a bit misleading in this sense. I find the live histogram much more useful (and I could easily live with the quick review histogram that D-SLR's provide).
The fact that the sensor has more DOF is an advantage to most of my
landscape work.
That, too, I can understand.
The tiltable LCD makes shooting eye-level images of kids far easier
(as well as birds and other small wildlife).
I find the tiltable EVF on my Minolta useful mostly if I'm shooting off a tripod that I've placed at a low level (which I don't do that often). Otherwise I prefer squatting or kneeling and looking through it normally -- here the stability issue rears up its ugly head again.
Fast flash synch means more flash range and the ability to use much
cheaper flash units without multistrobe capability.
Could you clarify this a bit further? I'm still trying to think of a situation where I'd want flash sync at 1/1000, and the only one I can think of is fill-in in really bright sunlight (and even then I could probably swing it with 1/250).
IS would be pretty useless for me in most shooting situations as I
almost always am limited by subject motion instead of camera shake.
In that case, a D-SLR would do just as well, wouldn't it? The subject motion limitation is the same for both cameras.
A silent shutter is crucial for certain types of wildlife
photography and event and performance photography.
Yep. Do you do that type of stuff a lot?
More DOF makes handheld and available light macro work much more
feasible. I almost always prefer available light images because
(to me) they look more natural and real.
Hear hear. I avoid using the flash like the plague. However, a D-SLR could probably get you the same, deep DoF -- because it's more sensitive. Suppose you need to go with ISO200 and wide-open on your Sony. On a D-SLR, you could bump the ISO to 1600 for approximately equal noise, and stop down three stops. That'll give you plenty of DoF.
Video is a great feature to have when shooting friends and family,
even though I do not shoot video artistically.
I'll take your word for it. :-)

Petteri
--
http://www.seittipaja.fi/index/
 

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