10D stalls S2 Pro purchase...

SteveX · Mar 1, 2003

I am wanting a DSLR to use for Architectural Photography. I was preparing to purchase an S2 Pro, but then got a look at info on the new Canon 10D. What really caught my eye is the $1499 price vs. the Fuji $2399 price...as the S2 Pro is at my upper limit of spendable budget for a DSLR body. This is what i would get for each system, Canon or Fuji:

Canon 10D body kit - $1499
Canon battery grip - $160
extra battery - $35
1 gig microdrive - $200
Sigma 15-30mm lens - $600
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Total cost - $2494

or

Fuji S2 Pro body kit - $2399
Qimage for raw conversion - $40
8 AA rechargables & charger - $50
MB-16 grip - $70
1 gig microdrive - $200
Sigma 15-30mm lens - $600
(Nikon 12-24mm lens instead of Sigma, if it ends up being similar price)
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Total cost - $3359

I may not be able to get my hands on a 10D till May, who knows... the D60 availability was a nightmare, I tried to get one last summer, before the S2 came out, with no luck whatsoever! So the availability of the Canon camera concerns me.

I like the following about the Canon: the Magnesium body of the 10D over plastic, the "single" battery source over the dual source with CR123s, a grip that fits without jury rigging (designed for the specific camera), 1/3 EV steps over 1/2, 1/200 flash sync over 1/125th, capability of saving in camera 6mp raw files vs being restricted to 12mp raws (which i would plan to downsample to 6mp in computer), more raws can be saved on a 1 gig microdrive this way. The COST!! $865 less than the Fuji setup.

Here is what i like about the S2 Pro: Ability to shoot a 12mp file when needed (with its slightly higher discernable resolution), the compatibility of the new 12-24 Nikkor lens (giving a 18mm-36mm FOV on the S2), The S2 is available for purchase now! I like the reduction of moire' and jaggies that the S2 Raw files give, but they seem to have more noise over in camera jpegs...at least according to Mr. Askey. Overall, i think 10D and S2 noise levels are about an even match now.

If Canon is having problems meeting the demand for an $8000 SLR......How are they gonna meet the MUCH LARGER demand for $1500 unit?? In my opinion Canon really messed up big time with the D60 sales projections and lost lots of potential sales, including my purchase this past summer. They might lose another sale again, i can't get the D60 fiasco out of my mind.

I wanted the S2, but now that i know about that 10D, i'm not so sure anymore.....If I only never discovered the 10D on Thursday lol I have no exisiting SLR lenses, so a current stock of Nikon or Canon mount lenses do not apply to my decision. Can anyone here give me additional good reasons why I should spend $865 less for an 10D setup, and risk waiting months to get the camera?

Steve

I.J. Smith · Mar 1, 2003

Hi Steve. The d60 supply was a fiasco...took me four months to get mine. I have to believe that this was an embarrassment to Canon and I expect them to come out smoking with this one. Just my 2 cents.

orlandoom · Mar 1, 2003

your post makes no sense. the s2 has been available for a long time now so why have you not purchased one. if you are worried about getting the 10d go for the s2 tomorrow and free up one 10d for those sure of what they want.

Dave Knadler · Mar 1, 2003

Like so many of these kind of posts, your answer lies in your question. The S2 is available now, the D10 is not. If you need a camera now, the choice is clear. If you do not, the $900 saving is something to consider. Hard to clarify things more than that.

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http://www.pbase.com/davek/

Danny lee · Mar 1, 2003

If you need a camera now buy a D60 its a great camera and people are falling over themselves trying to sell them. I have a feeling we are going to hear a good bit of griping and complaining from people who no longer have a camera to use. Sure eventually the 10d will be in abundant supply with its better autofocus and a few other nice improvements. But that may be a few months.

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Danny Lee

Simon-Ph · Mar 1, 2003

If can be w/out a camera for 1 month, then the decision is easy -- 10D definitely, if you trust that it will be as good as S2 if not better. With the $900 saved, you can forget the Sigma and consider the Canon 16-35 L instead. Or stay with the Sigma and have $900 to spend. Hmmm, imagine what I can do with $900 -- Gitzo explorer tripod, Acratech ballhead, Big Ed3 grip, extra battery, 512 mb cf card, and still have enough to pay annual fee at pBase.com.

But the more important decision is: do you want to be tied into the Canon EF or Nikon lens mount.

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Simon-Ph

peacefoto · Mar 1, 2003

the 1.6X is a bigger drawback compare to S2 and D100's 1.5X. Also nikon has the 12-24/4 lens to provide 18mm super-wide on your S2/D100... If your primary interest is architecture, S2/D100 is the only way to go at the moment. Also don't buy anything until PMA, i'm sure both D100 and S2 price willl drop significantly after PMA - if those guys want to compete with 10D. OTOH if you don't need super-wide capability, 10D is a GREAT camera!

i shoot a lot of architecture too, that's why i haven't bought any D-SLR yet. But a 12-24 super-wide + D100 or S2 is a great solution. Otherwise I need to buy the canon 1Ds which is the price of all above cameras combined...

Michael Martin · Mar 1, 2003

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canon is not having trouble meeting the demand of the 1Ds

Erik Lindahl · Mar 1, 2003

Most of the difference is just rounding. If you compare the actual sensor sizes the Nikon/Fiju ones come down to something like 1.55 while the D60/10D is 1.57 or 1.58. Insignificant, IMHO.

Cheers,

Erik

PSource · Mar 1, 2003

Dear Steve,

I'm currently an owner of a S2 and a former user of the D60/30. I really like both cameras and I'm sure you will not be disappointed by both. If you want I write me an email and I could share some insights with you on the S2

Thanks
J

Thys · Mar 1, 2003

Steve

The advantage you have of Canon over Nikon for architectural photography is the availability of 3 T/S lenses, including the 24mm. On the Nikon side, you will be able to get the new 12-24, but expectations are that it will be an expensive lens :~$1000 and it will bind you to their 1.5x crop factor in future. My advise is, get into the EF mount now with a 10d - it seems as if Canon at least, is striving to give us FF ability in future - with Nikon you'll have to rely on third parties to make it for them.
With digital, the camera bodies are here today, gone tomorrow, but lenses stay.

Regards
Thys

Steven Noyes · Mar 1, 2003

Just a thought.

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Something different.
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Bill Leddon · Mar 1, 2003

Sorry I'm answering this question with a question. I havn't shot arch. interiors for a while now. I'm getting ready to purchase a DSLR soon and am concidering the Canon 1Ds. I am wondering if the Canon tilt shift wide angle wouldn't be the best lense to purchase for us. I had 4 x 5 but didn't shoot seriously with it. Did all my interiors w. medium format.
Bill Leddon

marianco · Mar 1, 2003

Nikon apparently made the new 12-24 lens work only on the Nikon's digital cameras. It apparently won't work with the S2 Pro since the lens mount is a film-camera mount. Thus the problem is that future Nikon lenses may not work with the S2 Pro. This has given me strong second thoughts about purchasing a Nikon-based system such as the S2 Pro.

PSource · Mar 1, 2003

I'm not sure where you got your information from. But according to a fellow forum user in the Fuji SLR forums it's possible to use the new 12-24 lens. Anyways, isn't the lens mount for the D100 same as the S2 (N80 based)?

David Giacomini · Mar 1, 2003

If you are doing architectural photography then you might also want to look at the assortment of tilt shift lenses. Canon has a 24mm 45mm and 90mm while Nikon only has the one 85mm TS lense. They are all excellent lenses but the Nikon on a non FF DSLR might not be great for architectural. Keep in mind the 1.6 multiplier so the 24mm becomes a 38.4mm on the 10D and the 85mm Nikon TS lense becomes 127.5mm which in my mind is too tight for architectural work. I do mostly product photography so the 85mm Nikon on a FF camera is perfect. With the 10D, I would get the 45mm Canon TS lense (equivalent to 72mm) which is also perfect for my needs. Even if you don't get the TS lense now, at least you know it will be available.

Just one more thing to consider.
David

SteveX · Mar 2, 2003

The 24mm TS works out to be 38.4mm on the 10D, which in my opinion is too narrow a field of view for architecture shooting. That lense mated with a 1Ds would be great though!! But, i cannot even consider the 1Ds as it is far too expensive for me at this time. Even the 1D is too much money and too low resolution, i want to be able to make decent 31"x 20.5" prints, which i have successfully made with D60 images downloaded off the net.

David Martin · Mar 2, 2003

....So you buy a 10D, or if that's not available when you want it a D60. Any lenses you buy now you can cary over to your FF camera when you upgrade in a couple of years time, and the D10/D60 is a great backup.

When you're rich you buy one of the tilt lenses and you've got a perfect set-up. How would you develop the Fuji set-up?

PS The D60 would be fine for architecture - the building isn't going anywhere so who cares if the AF is slow.
Regards,
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DaveMart

xsy · Mar 2, 2003

The lens mount came from the F100 while the AF module came from the F/N80. Can't see why the 12-24 won't work though.

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xsy

SteveX · Mar 2, 2003

Search the Fuji Forum about 12-24 / S2 compatibility. Someone on there attached the lense to their S2 at a trade show and posted the pictures they took. That person said the lense worked on the S2 with no problem. Apparentley the Nikon rep was a little reluctant to let the guy put the lense on his S2.........but, he let him do it.

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