ISO 3200 performance

With the A77 Sony luckily gave us the choise: Accepting some noise and keep ultra fine detail, or smooth out noise at post processing and accept some loss of detail. Very good for photographers who have left the point & shoot level. :-)
Yea you can under or over expose and later PP it, but there are always side affects like more noise when pulling shadows. Overexpose and you risk clipping. The only time you SHOULD underexpose is when the DR of a scene is immense, and you need to preserve highlights.
Is that really underexposure? The concept of 'correct' exposure is sort of made up. You are more or less always making trade-offs. Perhaps you could explain the definition of 'correct' exposure?
Correct exposure is a photo that looks the way it did in real life, to human eyes. I am of the opinion that once you cross the line of reproducing your own visuals, its no longer just a photo. Where do we draw the line? Is a digital creation an actual photo? I've seen some CG that looks nearly real, more real than some actual photos after heavy NR. Reducing noise is fine, bc my eyes dont see the noise irl, so we are trying to make it a more faithful recreation of reality. But if you are trying to capture a scene to save, I would rather keep that moment true to real life. This means accurate exposure.

Tell me, if you overexpose to reduce noise, how do you know what the real lighting of the scene was later on when you are doing PP? Arent you just guessing?
If you were willing to lose shutter speed for the sake of less noise, wouldn't you just use a lower iso to begin with??
Yup. That's why some push us to stop focusing so much on ISO and rather think about exposure. Then ISO basically turns into in-camera PP.
Either way, you lose shutter speed, and a camera with better noise performance will be able to offer the same noise at a higher iso (and faster shutters along with it). THIS IS THE POINT . Every camera can do what you are talking about, but a camera with less noise to begin with will also end up with less noise.
Second, I dont know what you mean by having a choice with the a77.
I'm pretty sure he meant that you can choose the level of NR applied in PP. Nord really isn't that hard to understand, at least not for me.
doesnt that go without saying for any camera? plz tell me how the a77 is better than the a33 in this?
 
So, you are getting money from a taxpayer funded government program designed to help re-educate you for a new job... and buying a $2800 body and unknown lenses that aren't even related to your target degree? Is this correct?
ROFL dude you made me laugh. Photography equip is related, bc I can use images I shoot for web design.
What web images require a 36MP FF camera? Sure, it'd be nice but it is far from necessary. I'm sure you'd get 90% of the educational benefit for 20-30% of the cost.
Secondly, learning adobe and other editing programs will lend itself to anything I choose to do in photography.
Except that's not your degree, so... I did mechanical engineering and computer engineering, yet I did not spend $3k on a milling machine, lathe, welder, or fancy computer.
As for your lame attempt to insinuate improper funding, my PS instructor has already suggested we have a camera in order to practice what we learn on photos with a wide variety of conditions.
And so you decided a D800E is a sensible way to get pictures to practice Photoshop with? Seems a bit overkill.
And just so you know, the D800E is $3200, not that it matters much ;)
I figured I'd give the benefit of the doubt with the low price on Google and not considering lenses or accessories.
Enjoy you slt.
What SLT?
 
With the A77 Sony luckily gave us the choise: Accepting some noise and keep ultra fine detail, or smooth out noise at post processing and accept some loss of detail. Very good for photographers who have left the point & shoot level. :-)
Yea you can under or over expose and later PP it, but there are always side affects like more noise when pulling shadows. Overexpose and you risk clipping. The only time you SHOULD underexpose is when the DR of a scene is immense, and you need to preserve highlights.
Is that really underexposure? The concept of 'correct' exposure is sort of made up. You are more or less always making trade-offs. Perhaps you could explain the definition of 'correct' exposure?
Correct exposure is a photo that looks the way it did in real life, to human eyes.
So, multi-frame HDR with local exposure adjustments is appropriate (nay, required for accuracy) for anything but the most tame of scenes? That is, after all, how your eyes (and brain) work. Not to mention that we should likely throw out most high zoom lenses since they capture much more detail than our eyes do.
I am of the opinion that once you cross the line of reproducing your own visuals, its no longer just a photo. Where do we draw the line?
Certainly a whole discussion there, but it's not particularly related. I personally am more interested in a photo that captures the moment or scene than I am in using the exposure to create a crazy processed piece of art, so I think we tend the same direction on this one.
Tell me, if you overexpose to reduce noise, how do you know what the real lighting of the scene was later on when you are doing PP? Arent you just guessing?
So, lets say we 'overexpose' by 1 stop while set at ISO 800... haven't we actually underexposed by 2 stops and lifted (in camera) by 3 stops? Sort of semantics, but not really. Certainly there are times that the extra shutter speed is worth the tradeoff of the noise, but that's a separate question.
If you were willing to lose shutter speed for the sake of less noise, wouldn't you just use a lower iso to begin with??
Yup. That's why some push us to stop focusing so much on ISO and rather think about exposure. Then ISO basically turns into in-camera PP.
Either way, you lose shutter speed, and a camera with better noise performance will be able to offer the same noise at a higher iso (and faster shutters along with it). THIS IS THE POINT . Every camera can do what you are talking about, but a camera with less noise to begin with will also end up with less noise.
Yep, but the noise seems to be related to the physical exposure (shutter speed and aperture) not the ISO that was selected.
Second, I dont know what you mean by having a choice with the a77.
I'm pretty sure he meant that you can choose the level of NR applied in PP. Nord really isn't that hard to understand, at least not for me.
doesnt that go without saying for any camera? plz tell me how the a77 is better than the a33 in this?
The A77 has a higher starting point as to resolution. I won't argue whether it actually captures more detail because I don't really know, but the concept is straight forward.
 
Correct exposure is a photo that looks the way it did in real life, to human eyes. I am of the opinion that once you cross the line of reproducing your own visuals, its no longer just a photo. Where do we draw the line? Is a digital creation an actual photo? I've seen some CG that looks nearly real, more real than some actual photos after heavy NR. Reducing noise is fine, bc my eyes dont see the noise irl, so we are trying to make it a more faithful recreation of reality. But if you are trying to capture a scene to save, I would rather keep that moment true to real life. This means accurate exposure.
A photograph is not a copy of the world. It represents what the camera was pointed at. The photograph is an independent object that is interpreted by the mind of the person looking at it. We don't even have to know the scene or subject to appreciate a photograph. So where is reality?
Tell me, if you overexpose to reduce noise, how do you know what the real lighting of the scene was later on when you are doing PP? Arent you just guessing?
There is no such thing as neutral or correct exposure. The goal is to make a representation that reminds us about the scene, or that trig emotions. In most cases the photograph has much less dynamic range and higher contrast than the subject. If not the photograph would have looked dull and flat. Also a photograph is just a crop from the real world, exposed and freezed within a fraction of a second. And we look very differently at photographs compared with beeing in the place where the photograph was taken.
Either way, you lose shutter speed, and a camera with better noise performance will be able to offer the same noise at a higher iso (and faster shutters along with it). THIS IS THE POINT . Every camera can do what you are talking about, but a camera with less noise to begin with will also end up with less noise.
But then, what is the starting point? With the A77 you have less in-camera noise reduction, which means that there is more headroom for noise reduction at the post processing stage without loosing too much fine detail. So your statement is not correct.

Or did you really think that the sensor captured unaltered "true" light? he sensor is filtering light, as specified by the sensor and camera makers. There is a lot of filtering and processing going on even before the raw data is written as a file.

What matters is the end result. Not the steps involved to get there!
 
And we look very differently at photographs compared with beeing in the place where the photograph was taken.
So so true. Otherwise, why would we make white balance adjustments?

All artistic skill aside, just creating a photo that is interpreted by our eyes and brains with the same final result as the original scene would have had is quite a feat. I'm guessing this goal is what Noisey1 was referring to, but it takes a lot more than some magical correct exposure to achieve that in most interesting situations I find myself in.
 
And we look very differently at photographs compared with beeing in the place where the photograph was taken.
So so true. Otherwise, why would we make white balance adjustments?

All artistic skill aside, just creating a photo that is interpreted by our eyes and brains with the same final result as the original scene would have had is quite a feat. I'm guessing this goal is what Noisey1 was referring to, but it takes a lot more than some magical correct exposure to achieve that in most interesting situations I find myself in.
If you look at how photographs are used by contemporary art performers you will find they are using extreme detailled photographs to represent hyper-realism, and lack of technique/detail if the goal is primarily to touch personal emotions.

As photographers we have a lot to learn from these skilled and hard working prefessional artists who are exploring visual communication at a very high level.
 

Keyboard shortcuts

Back
Top