-
Welcome to the new forums! Please read this first. For known issues we are working to resolve, click here.
Canon's mirrorless system camera: first picture!
- Thread starter sapperlot
- Start date
Shorthand
Senior Member
Almost certainly touchscreen-based UI.
The sensor is 3:2 in aspect ratio so again its almost certainly APS-C ... maximizing usefulness with existing Canon lenses was clearly a big priority.
Shorthand
Senior Member
The mirrorless technology isn't mature yet ... but its getting closer and closer with each generation of body (less lag, better AF, etc.).
The fact that the mirrorless segment has grown so quickly indicates clearly to me that one day soon mirrorless ILC's will surpass DSLRs in volume ... DSLRs (or translucent-mirror designs) won't go away, but they'll be a niche body intended mainly for action photography using larger telephoto lenses ... eventually not even then --- you'll just have big handles to attach to your tiny but high-end camera body.
However, that date (when DSLRs no longer have a niche) is probably 15 years out ... this won't happen overnight.
The rangefinder is back to stay now that you can do phase-detect AF on-sensor.
H
howardroark
Guest
Well, the market cares very little about what you think....or what I think. I don't care anything about mirrorless cameras, but I understand why some people like them. My G1 X is mirrorless, as is every point and shoot I've ever owned. The mirror in a DSLR is only going to exist as long as a 100% pentaprism viewfinder is cheaper and better than an EVF or an LCD. A pentaprism with 100% coverage is huge and heavy. It exists through necessity, not good will, love, or charity.
I don't see doing away with DSLRs for a long time, but rest assured they'll lose favor some day.
Oh, and there are some very significant differences between how various camera bodies work. For example, the learning curve on a DSLR focus system is pretty steep coming from a point and shoot. Depth of field plays into that as much as the peculiarities of Phase Detect AF systems. Some people want a lot of DoF, some people want less. Some people want to control their focus, some people don't care to learn how.
I don't see doing away with DSLRs for a long time, but rest assured they'll lose favor some day.
Oh, and there are some very significant differences between how various camera bodies work. For example, the learning curve on a DSLR focus system is pretty steep coming from a point and shoot. Depth of field plays into that as much as the peculiarities of Phase Detect AF systems. Some people want a lot of DoF, some people want less. Some people want to control their focus, some people don't care to learn how.
M
meland
Guest
Actually, regardless of the Canon DSLR figure, mirrorless has a 23.5% share of all DSLRs produced, which I would suggest is not too shabby. And yes you are right, that is about half of Canon's DSLR market share.
M
meland
Guest
Katy, I think it might be better for you to wait for subsequent models. This one is probably not for you.No EVF
No Swivel Screen
No Built in Flash
What else is missing I wonder?
This camera had better be cheap, and great Image quality)
katy
tkbslc
Forum Pro
If they weren't selling well enough to be a threat, why would Canon and Nikon bother to make competing products?
ProfHankD
Veteran Member
The 3 features I care about:
1. Ability to mount and effectively use just about any lens in front of a good APS-C sensor (ideally, a real 1.5X APS-C sensor , but I guess Canon's usual 1.6X would be close enough).
2. Highly competitive pricing.
3. Ability to run something like CHDK inside and tethering to a computer outside.
I expect #1, I doubt #2, and I'm praying for #3.
In the meantime, I'll have to make due with my NEX bodies, which do #1 and even #2 rather well.
1. Ability to mount and effectively use just about any lens in front of a good APS-C sensor (ideally, a real 1.5X APS-C sensor , but I guess Canon's usual 1.6X would be close enough).
2. Highly competitive pricing.
3. Ability to run something like CHDK inside and tethering to a computer outside.
I expect #1, I doubt #2, and I'm praying for #3.
In the meantime, I'll have to make due with my NEX bodies, which do #1 and even #2 rather well.
It's not EF mount it is EF-M. Just like EF-S is a different mount than EF and EF-S cannot mount on a EF mount SLR such as 35mm film or 35mm digital (what people call "full frame"). We will find out probably on Monday or Tuesday about the compatibility of lenses.
ooja3k
Member
I thought it was already confirmed that along with the camera they were introducing an adapter that would allow compatibility with EF-S lenses... Maybe I am wrong..
M
meland
Guest
Nothing has been confirmed yet - although an EF / EF-S adapter would certainly make a lot of sense.
Will Frost
Forum Enthusiast
aman74
Senior Member
Common sense is lost on him.
Shorthand
Senior Member
I would be utterly confounded if the adapter didn't support EF-S lenses. The only difference between them is that the EF-S lenses can extend behind the mounting plane because the APS-C mirror box is smaller. (A FF mirror would slap many EF-S lenses.)
We'll get all of the details Monday morning, but this one is not really in doubt.
yes, E-mount male end will with within EF-mount female with quite a
lot of space to spare around it; and 2mm thickness would give plenty
of room to develop a possible adapter (I've quite a few legacy glass to
EF-mount adapters less thick than 2mm
),jpr2
--
~
street candids (non-interactive):
http://www.flickriver.com/photos/qmusaget/sets/72157609618638319/
music and dance:
http://www.flickriver.com/photos/qmusaget/sets/72157600341265280/
B&W:
http://www.flickriver.com/photos/qmusaget/sets/72157623306407882/
wildlife & macro:
http://www.flickriver.com/photos/qmusaget/sets/72157600341377106/
interactive street:
http://www.flickriver.com/photos/qmusaget/sets/72157623181919323/
Comments and critique are always welcome!
~
Personal assessment only based on these pics, from a current NEX-5N user and G11 owner:
1) Apparent 1.6x crop factor = a good thing. Thank Canon they didn't go the way of the Nikon 1. Not quite as good as 1.5x
, but negligible difference and sensible given Canon's legacy.2) A real hotshoe = a definite good thing.
3) No screen articulation = a definite bad thing. Even prosumer cameras are now coming with articulated screens, as they do indeed open up quite the range of shooting possibilities.
4) No provision for an EVF = a bad thing, but probably related to #2. That said, m43 does do real hotshoe + EVF port, so it is certainly not a technical exclusion.
5) The lens mount seems to have quite the diameter, at least from these pics. Real-life will tell how big it (and attendant non-pancake lenses) really is.
6) 3:2 screen = a couple of people have complained that the NEX's 16:9 screen isn't as efficient with screen real estate as it could be. I haven't found it to be an issue, so I guess this might be a matter of taste.
7) Soapbar shape = is a classical shape, but not really ergonomic. Even though I see (seemingly, nobody knows until handled) well-thought-out ergonomic touches, like the rubber finger grip, the corner relief to angle the shutter button, etc... I still like a real grip. Going back-and-forth between my 5N and G11, even with the former's 55-210 (a large lens), it is obvious that the real grip allows me quite the latitude and confidence to handle the camera in unconventional ways and to get that unusual shot angle. I often dangle the 5N off of two fingers (obviously with strap on neck) even with large lenses. To me, an ergonomic-ized soapbar is a de-merit relative to a full-out ergonomic shape, i.e. a real grip.
8) Mode selector turn-dial around the shutter button = terrible. First, its paltry number of modes (auto, camera, movie) is an announcement of the camera's P&S intentions. Second, this is an utter waste of a prime control location. The trigger finger wheel and and the thumb wheel (whether back or shoulder-located) are perfect for use to adjust aperture/shutter-speed/ISO/etc. in the course of shooting, esp. in the case of having your face pressed-up to use an EVF/OVF. Yes, not applicable to this particular camera, but this is a bad precedent that is being set, which will lead to control inconsistency in the future. Read on...
All-in-all, I think that for the most part, this is a smart and well-thought-out move for Canon. This is obviously a camera that is intended as a supplement to a dSLR, or at least takes second-fiddle to one. Or it is a casual (snapshot, Ashton Kucher) camera. It is a smart first-step for a company that is so entrenched in dSLRS that it and its mortal competitor (Nikon) pretty much defines "dSLR".
If it does well-enough, Canon has all the room in the world to bring out a more out-and-out dSLR-equivalent/replacement model (with "serious" ergonomics and probably an EVF), as it is starting off with a 1.6x APS-C sensor/mount that won't be handicapped relative to its competitors (Sony, m43) the way Nikon's 1 system is.
The criticism of the index finger wheel is that one of Canon's strengths is consistency/conservatism (that is, relative to Sony, who is known for innovation/weirdness, two sides of the same coin), two sides of the same coin. If and when Canon brings out their out-and-out dSLR-equivalent/replacement MILC following the success of this camera (which is likely), that location will be needed for a real control. It would've been smart for Canon to anticipate that and make consistency in controls a strength. But they seemed to have missed that one.
I can't speak for other NEX users, but I think it's great that large-sensor MILCs are making headway into the mainstream. And competition will make everyone stronger.
tocar
Senior Member
Mirrorless cameras are a bit overhyped. The question is which niche of camera users are they made for? Looks more like modifying the GX1 with interchangeable lens and touch screen control. If Canon modified the GX1 with the SX40's long zoom I would rather get that instead.
Keyboard shortcuts
- f
- Forum