5DII to M9 In need of urgent help with lenses

I have sold off my Canon stuff 5DmkII, 20D, 35/1.4L, 35/2.0, 50/1.4, 135/2.0L, 400/5.6L, 16-35/2.8L II, 70-200/4.0L IS, 2 flashes and 4 older Canon lenses. With some savings I can now finally get the Leica M9 and lenses I have dreamed about for years.

Main use is to document familys life, people, travel, nature, architecture, our 9 year son activities, indoor and outdoor sports tennis, golf, football (soccer) and floorball.

I need urgent help choosing 3 or 4 Leica lenses before shops reopen on tuesday morning after Easter.

Lenses with a * are available for delivery at this moment, but this is not normal and will likely change fast.

M9 + 3 Lenses
Leica Super-Elmar-M 18/3,8 Asph * - or - Leica Super-Elmar-M 21/3,4 Asph *
Leica Summilux-M 35/1,4 Asph * - or - Leica Summicron-M 35/2,0 Asph *
Leica APO-Summicron 90/2

M9 + 4 Lenses
Leica Super-Elmar-M 18/3,8 Asph * - or - Leica Super-Elmar-M 21/3,4 Asph *
Leica Summicron-M 28/2,0 Asph *
Leica Summilux-M 50/1,4 Asph
Leica APO-Summicron 90/2

Please argument for and against the suggested combinations of lenses.

Other than FLs please discuss over the differences in rendering styles and other characteristics, like beautiful sunstars and micro contrast and more.

-The Cron 28 seems to be a little more contrasty, is this true?
-Super-Elmar 18mm vs 21mm what are the real differences other than FL?
-Smaller 35 Cron vs 35 Lux a really hard choice. Both are available right now!
-Skip 35mm and opt for 28 Cron + 50 Lux insted?
-Any more advice?

Real hard choices that I have to make before Tuesday morning.

Thanks in advance!

Happy Easter
Pierre

I am actually surprised people ask this question because if you have shot with a digital camera in the past, your preference in lenses will not change. I was using a lot of normal to telephoto during my Nikon D3 days, and I continue to use those on my Leica today. As much I admire people who use the 35mm and even 28mm and wider as their daily lens, I simply don't quite reach for these lenses as much as others. For me, I most used lens are the 50 f/2.8 elmar, and the 90 f/4 elmar macro during the day, and in the evenings, the the 50 f/1.4 Summilux. I have the 35 F/2 Summicron and the 16-18-21 WATE that I hardly use. As an exercise to reach outside my comfort zone, I would sometimes mount the wider angle lenses to force me to see things in a different way.

As Leica lenses are quite an investment, I would urge you to go with what you're familiar with and reserve a copy at a reputable store and wait for it's arrival. In the mean time, buy either a used older Leica original as there are many around, or a Voigtlander for a play lens until the actual lens of choice arrives. Don't be forced to buy a lens just because its available.

Pierre from Sweden said:

-Skip 35mm and opt for 28 Cron + 50 Lux

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That would be a well balanced choice - with one body on hand I prefer a 28/50 combo.

However I would advise adding a second body instead of many extra lenses ( if not two m9s consider a M6 or M7 as the second )
For a long time I have found the 21/35/50 trio on two bodies works well.

As I was shooting indoors a lot the 35 summilux became the got-to lens as it's balance of speed and depth of field trumped the 28 and 50 in close up action.

The 18 and 21 require an extra finder which makes them a bit trickier to use if your are transitioning from a SLR - you don't want to overload with too many changes at once.

As the 90 is not that long, for sports you may want to fall back to a crop sensor DSLR.

Pierre from Sweden said:

With some savings I can now finally get the Leica M9 and lenses I have dreamed > about for years.

Click to expand...

As a devoted Leica M9 shooter, I would urge you very strongly to hold off on purchasing any Leica gear just now, and instead have a look at the new Fuji X-Pro 1. You can get the camera body, the three available lenses, the grip, and a couple of extra batteries for 1/3 of what you would pay for a reasonable Leica setup.

I currently own a Leica M9 with Leica 28mm f/2, 35mm 1994 pre-ASPH 'King of Bokeh', 50mm f/2, and 90mm f/2 lenses; I also have a Voightlander 50mm f/1.1. I love my Leica, but I've been playing around with the Fuji X-Pro 1 for the last couple of weeks (.jpgs only, I'm awaiting LightRoom 4 support to really use the camera with RAW), and I have to say that it's a very impressive camera - especially at the price.

If you don't like the X-Pro 1, you can resell it pretty easily and get back most of your investment, as it's a hot commodity, right now. And if you do like it, you'll have saved yourself a considerable amount of money, plus getting autofocus and amazing low-light capabilities.

For someone who does not have a pre-existing investment in Leica gear, with the X-Pro 1 now available plus Leica's upcoming announcements of new products on 10May12, it just doesn't make sense to drop a ton of cash on Leica at this point in time, IMHO. Pick up the Fuji, play with it, and then see what Leica announce in May before you spend a huge amount of money on a camera/lens system which excels in many ways, but is on the verge of being eclipsed by Fuji and/or a putative new Leica M-series body.

Thanks for your advice Gerigo,

3 good reasons why I want a small lens set all at once:
My son is growing up fast

My family is planning for a vacation once in a lifetime to Hawaii in june this summer.

I asked before at this camera store and was told that waiting time for luxes was 6 months to one year.
Same store told me that waiting time for Cron 28 and Cron 35 4-6 months.

This was why until yesterday I had given up on getting any Leica lens or camera for this year and instead was ready to by a Nikon D800E and Zeiss 21/2.8, Zeiss 35/2.0, Zeiss 100/2.0, Nikkor 70-200/2.8. A lot heavier and bulkier and the D800E is made for AF, manual focus of Zeiss is not fast.

I prefer having full control setting fucus, iso, time and aperture. I have used Leicas but that was 3o years ago. I need to know what you think of the lenses in my list.

I can imagen that the 28 con will be good getting the rich colors of Hawaii greens, reds and breaking see against red hot lava pouring in to the sea.

I have seen some pics at Fred miranda can a 35 Lux give the same contrasty look of the 35 cron?

This is my state of decision, as you see only 90 cron is 100% decided.

18 Super Elmar 70% decided (Better for architecture?)

21 Super Elmar 80% decided (Is it even better corrected than the 18?)

28 Cron (Are the colors richer in this 28 Cron compared to 35 Lux? How is the micro contrast?)

35 Cron 50% decided

35 Lux 90% decided (I need at lest 1 fast lens and 35 and 50 are both favorites.)

50 Lux 50% decided (Would love to have this lens but it is not to be found anywhere and have endless waiting time.)

90 Cron 100% decided.

This the fist time ever that I have seen any store here having a 35 Lux in the store.

Estimations of my six most used and favorite Canon lenses last year, in order of use:
35% = 35/1.4L
30% = 50/1.4
20% = 70-200/4.0L IS
8% = 16-35/2.8L II (Architecture and some landscape)
4% = 400/5.6L (Wildlife)
3% = 135/2.0L (Used for indoor sports)

Best Regards
Pierre

Get a good Summicron or Summilux 50mm or 35mm and stick it on the camera and take the rest of your money and put it in the bank to earn interest. Maybe over the following year or so you might find you could use another lens, who knows.

Concentrate instead on making worthwhile images. And forget about this 'micro-contrast' 'richer colors' 'magic rendition' rhetorical nonsense. It's mumbo-jumbo talk for people more into the equipment than the image itself. It's for the marketing department and for the hobbyists who stand around and drool over the gear. And guess what, you actually don't need a bag full of expensive lenses to make good images. You're only being made to think that. Don't forget that there's nothing worse than a sharp picture of a fuzzy concept (as a very well-known photographer once said.)

Seriously. Put one good lens on the camera and start making some work. You'd be amazed at what you can do, and the liberation it can give you.

And the M system is good for certain things but using it as a replacement for a DSLR isn't one of them (sports? action? close-up? precise in-camera framing? forget it.....) Get the M9 with one lens for now and hold on to the Canon for the stuff that the M system simply wasn't built for nor intended to do.

But if you feel more complete by buying all that stuff, then I'll be the first to thank you. You're helping Leica amass funds that they will hopefully use for research and development on a much better sensor for a new M.

SphericalAberration, thanks for the good advice.

I agree the 28 Cron and 50 Lux combo is good balanced kit of most used focals.

My logics is to have as few lenses as possible and having the 35 Lux as the only main lens and adding a 90 tele and a 21 wide or a 18 wide will be a good 3 lens set up.

The 35 Lux can substitute the 28 Cron and the 50 Lux in focals, but can the 35 Lux substitute 28 and 50 in rendering styles too? Will I miss anything other than focal lenghs? Drawing style and colors of the 28 Cron, or exceptional clarity of the 50 Lux?

This will end with me having 5 lenses
One wide 18mm or 21mm
One tele 90mm
and
28 Cron for the rendering and FL
50 Lux for potraits and fast lens
35 Lux as main lens and fast lens
5 lenses? This is one lens to many!

The 50 Lux is not available and this will be the deciding factor as I need it in two months time.
I can crop the 35 to the 50.
The 28 Cron is to near the 35 Lux.

Leading me to the conclusion:

The 21 Super Elmar, 35 Lux and 90 Cron is my 3 lens best combo for this family vacations to Hawaii. Only the 90 Cron is hard to find at this moment.

Any comments on my choice of lenses? Is my reasoning ok?

Happy Easter
Pierre

Pierre from Sweden said:

Is my reasoning ok?

Click to expand...

No. Buying an M9 right now is not smart, per my previous post. Wait until the Leica announcements next month, take a look at the Fuji X-Pro 1.

Even if you still decide to go with the Leica, there may be a new M10 or somesuch next month with better low-light capabilities. You could either get the new body while it's still new (always the best strategy with digital bodies), or pick up a used M9 body at a discount.

But from now at least until 10May12, it just isn't smart to newly invest in the Leica M-system. Wait and see, and look hard at the Fuji.

It could really be your only lens, but even in a large kit i think this is an essential lens if you can afford it.

Because the rangefinder doesn't zoom, there really is a narrow band of focal lengths that work to best advantage on an m9, and 35 is the sweet spot. The 35/1.4 is as good as the cron, only a little larger, and the extra stop falls right at the crux of the m9's iso usability--i can easily get usable exposures in a dim restaurant at 35 and 1.4, where even my 28/2 is struggling. The 35/14 is crucial for real life available light shooting, which comprises a lot of family photos.

Although i have used or owned a smattering of other lenses, i am currently happy (and fortunate) to have a 3 lens kit in the 28/2, 35/1.4, and 50/1.4. Previously i would have said this was overkill, and it was only by chance that i ended up with the 35 in addition to the others--but i am so glad that i did. I shoot them all for different reasons and for distinctly different effect; as it turns out, they are not "too close". The 35 is by far the most versatile, and if i had to choose just one, there is no question that would be it. The 28 is my favorite, with a hard to describe look that is distinctive and seductive: loads of detail, but fabulously delicate, never harsh or brittle. The 50 is one of the most perfect lenses i have ever used, and makes a wonderful portrait lens; i find that i treat it practically as a telephoto most of the time, while the 35 is my normal, and of course 28 for wide.

I can understand wanting to get everything while it is available, but i do suspect that you won't really need more than 2-3 lenses. Of course you can always resell them at minimal loss.

I think it is a reasonable decision to move to a leica system for your situation. It is much better for travel than a dslr, and generally better at everyday carry-everywhere use as well. When your kids play sports, you may want a midrange crop dslr and telephoto, but otherwise you can do everything. I disagree with another poster about trying to get into an xpro1; availability aside, the focus system is likely to prove frustrating with kids. One could argue for waiting to buy until we see what leica announces may 10, but, one, you should snap up lenses you're interested in now, and two, even if an m10 is announced, i doubt you could get one anytime soon. Better to be using your m9 right away, getting better at it, and practice before your vacation than to wait and see.

Some specific notes: the 28 cron is not "more contrasty" than the 28/2.8. The 28/2.8 is a little gem, ideal for landscapes and such, but the cron is better for people and as i've said simply beautiful.i wouldnt pass it up.

I am not sure why you need the superwide, but be aware that using them with a rangefinder can be awkward. For family photos, one would rarely really want to go wider than 28.

The 90 is Spectacular, but you may find yourself using it less than you think. Contrary to another commenter, rf shooting isnt the same as slr shooting, and dont be surprised if your favored focal lengths change. Slrs encourage you to see like the lens does; rfs encourage you to see what your eyes see, and capture that. Extreme angles of view become less seductive; and, the smaller camera makes it easier to work closer to your subjects. When i was shooting cnon my principle lens was 50mm, but when i switched to the m9, i moved towards the 35, framing similarly but working closer.

Hope you enjoy your camera whatever you decide--

Pierre from Sweden said:

Any comments on my choice of lenses? Is my reasoning ok?

Click to expand...

Mostly. I think you're worried too much about 'covering' a wide spread of focal lengths. See my other post.

I'd get the 28 and the 35 now.

I'd seriously look at the Zeiss line up as well as a way to cut cost on the focal lengths you're the least likely to use and sometimes get even better performances than the Leica lenses (the 50mm planar comes to mind - although for that precise focal length you seem interested in the 50 lux which seems substantially superior to either the Zeiss 50s or the 50 cron). That's a good way to cover a lot of focal lengths for substantially less money than Leica lenses. You may also be interested in buying those used Leica lenses.

Right now I'd also try if possible to buy the M9 used. This way you can resell it later on for its likely upcoming replacement at a minimal cost and still get a M ready for your June vacation.

disambiguated,

Thanks for your warning on the imminent M10 and good advice.

I have a X100 that I have enjoyed for over a year and my expensive Canon DSLR was left collecting dust. Now It is all sold off and I only have the Fuji X100. Love this little camera! I was the only camera I took for last years vacation to Disneyland, Florida and Washington DC.Took som 5000 pics in 4-5 weeks 90% fully manually. The only thing I miss is real manual focus and the AF is not very fast and hunts but only when the light gets and contrast is low. I also sometimes miss a tele for nature or people and a wider lens for architecture but for 80% of the time the 35mm is all I really need.

The X-Pro 1 as lovely as it seems to be, it is not an option for me, not FF, not fast very AF and no real manual focus solution. I really love the hybrid viewfinder though! Same as in my X100

The X100 is very good but its not FF and it can not mount Leica lenses.
Leica M9 has no competition for these two reasons.

Yes I know a M10 may be here very soon but I doubt i can have one delivered to this year or has Leica done it right this time (like Apple always do) having manufactured at least 10.000 M10s before the 2012May10 so that they can deliver it to us before this summer and not next year?

M9 and M9-P are in stock in great abundance everywhere and have been so for a long time now. So I am getting only the 3 or 4 lenses first, and I will wait to get the M9 or M9-P until after the May10 to se what happens.

Happy Easter
Pierre

Fogsville,
Thanks for your good advice!

Yes this is exactly what I have done using my X100 exclusively for over a year and fund it to be a very pleasing experience not to lug 1-2 DSLR and multiple lenses. I actually did nearly the same the year before taking my 5DII and a 50/1.4 for a 5-6 weeks long vacation by car touring 7-8 countries in Europe with my family.

Getting only hard to get lenses first and a M camera after the May10 announcements.

Happy Easter
Pierre

Hello,

No offence. But when looking at your previous post on other forums, it looks like a very impulsive purchase. May be you should wait a bit or just try out before buying?

Happy easter.

Danik

disambiguated,

Yes it is smart to wait until after 10May, I will do that.

Thanks for the suggestion!
Pierre

Hi

For 10 years I have lived and travelled around the world with an M6, a 35 Lux and a 90 Cron, and that worked very well. So I don't see anything wrong with your choice. If I had to add a wide in this configuration it would be the 21; I would get the 18 with your 4 lenses option - 18, 28, 50, 90.

Something else to consider, although you said you're 100% set on the 90/2... It's a pretty heavy lens, each time I was using it I thought that I should rather have bought the 90/2.8... May work for you but I suggest you handle it before you buy if weight is your priority.

Good luck anyway

Pierre from Sweden said:

The X-Pro 1 as lovely as it seems to be, it is not an option for me, not FF, not fast very AF and no real manual focus solution.

Click to expand...

The APS-C sensor size doesn't matter - this camera has sufficiently high resolution, and low-light capabilities beyond just about anything on the market today. Don't let sensor-size bigotry cause you exclude the X-Pro 1 on this basis alone.

;>

The AF works fine in daylight, and reasonably well in dark situations. And just as Fuji improved the X100 AF, I'm pretty sure they'll be improving it on the X-Pro 1, as well (no idea why they didn't just do it right the first time, heh).

Finally, you can use M-mount lenses on the X-Pro 1 with an adaptor - third-party adaptors are already available.

Do play with one, at least, before you spend a whole lot of money on Leica. Once Lightroom supports the X-Pro 1, I'm really going to put it through its paces, and if it does well, I may in fact sell all my Leica gear in favor of it.

xtoph,
My sincere thanks to you for the great wright up and many excellent advices!!

The 35/1.4 could really be my only lens, as the X100/ 35 (23mm) Fujinon has been for a year now.

Specialty lenses for 10-20% of my pics:

The 18 or 21mm is for architecture, cramped places, inside churches and for landscape.
The 90mm is for some general extra reach and portraits.

80% or more of the time will use the 35 Lux.

• I am now 100% decided on 35 Lux and 90 Cron.

• I can't make up my mind between the two ultra wides 18mm and 21mm, any suggestions here?

• One last question on the 20 Cron. How does the 28 Cron compare in contrast to the 35 Lux?

For Indoor and outdoor sports and for nature I will get a Nikon DSLR, a 70-200/2.8 and a longer tele for wildlife/birds.

Tanks again for your time

Happy Easter
Pierre

I am more than happy with my set at the moment, M9, 35cron, 90 cron and 21/3.4

I dont like the 50 focal length that much, 28 is not wide and not normal enough so i picked 35, both cron and lux are fine. 90 cron is impeccable. 21/3.4 is a gem but i hate the external viewfinder.

Pierre from Sweden said:

xtoph,
My sincere thanks to you for the great wright up and many excellent advices!!

The 35/1.4 could really be my only lens, as the X100/ 35 (23mm) Fujinon has been for a year now.

Specialty lenses for 10-20% of my pics:

The 18 or 21mm is for architecture, cramped places, inside churches and for landscape.
The 90mm is for some general extra reach and portraits.

80% or more of the time will use the 35 Lux.

• I am now 100% decided on 35 Lux and 90 Cron.

• I can't make up my mind between the two ultra wides 18mm and 21mm, any suggestions here?

• One last question on the 20 Cron. How does the 28 Cron compare in contrast to the 35 Lux?

For Indoor and outdoor sports and for nature I will get a Nikon DSLR, a 70-200/2.8 and a longer tele for wildlife/birds.

Tanks again for your time

Happy Easter
Pierre

Click to expand...

olivier_777,
Thanks for your time and valuable contribution.

I really do not like CA.
I want the 90/2.0 not for the large aperture but for the APO = Less or no CA.

Perhaps the 90/2.5 Summarit will do fine as an alternative?

The Summarit is half the price and at 360g it is 140g less weight. But it is no APO.
I think I will go for the APO 90/2.

Happy Easter
Pierre