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US B&H Pricing Litmus test.

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Russell Evans

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Small Prime System trying for 24mm, 35mm, 50mm, 85mm equivalency with 180° fisheye, with 14/5-100/105mm zoom coverage

Pentax
Pentax K-5 Digital SLR Camera $1,099.00
Pentax DA 10-17mm f/3.5-4.5 $649.95
Pentax DA 15mm f/4 $649.95
Pentax DA 21mm f/3.2 $649.95
Pentax FA 35mm f/2 $475.00
Pentax DA 55mm f/1.4 $799.95
Sigma 10-20mm f/4-5.6
Pentax DA 17-70mm f/4
Total $5,402.75

Olympus
Olympus OM-D E-M5 $999.99
Panasonic Lumix G Fisheye 8mm f/3.5 $629.00
Olympus M. Zuiko Digital ED 12mm f/2.0 $799.99
Olympus M.Zuiko Digital 17mm f/2.8 $299.99
Panasonic Leica DG Summilux 25mm f/1.4 $539.00
Olympus M. Zuiko Digital ED 45mm f/1.8 $399.99
Panasonic Lumix G 7-14mm f/4.0 $888.98
Panasonic 14-50mm f/2.8-3.5 $844.95
Total $5401.89

Fast zoom systems with 24-200mm equivalent zooms

Pentax
Pentax K-5 Digital SLR Camera $1,099.00
Pentax DA 16-50mm f/2.8 $1,499.95
Pentax DA 50-135mm f/2.8 $1,599.95
Total 4,158.9

Nikon
Nikon D700 DSLR Camera $2,199.00
Nikkor 24-85mm f/2.8-4.0D IF $669.95
Nikkor 80-200mm f/2.8D $1,109.00
Total $3,877.95

Canon EOS 5D Mark II $2,199.00
Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM $1,399.00
Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM $1,449.00
Total $5,047

Thank you
Russell
 
Interesting comparison, Russell. I think you've put your finger on why the DA* zooms won't stay at MSRP, and you've also made a good case for someone who wants a budget FF system and doesn't need to get the latest Canikon models. I'm not so sure I'd compare the K-5 to the older FF models though. I'd want to see it matched up with the D7000 and 7D with comparable lenses. Also, the DA*16-50 is probably no longer the fast zoom of choice for many, having been at least matched in IQ by the
 
Small Prime System trying for 24mm, 35mm, 50mm, and 85mm equivalency with 180° fisheye

Pentax
Pentax K-5 Digital SLR Camera $1,099.00
Pentax DA 10-17mm f/3.5-4.5 $649.95
Pentax DA 15mm f/4 $649.95
Pentax DA 21mm f/3.2 $649.95
Pentax FA 35mm f/2 $475.00
Pentax DA 55mm f/1.4 $799.95
Total 4,323.8

Olympus
Olympus OM-D E-M5 $999.99
Panasonic Lumix G Fisheye 8mm f/3.5 $629.00
Olympus M. Zuiko Digital ED 12mm f/2.0 $799.99
Olympus M.Zuiko Digital 17mm f/2.8 $299.99
Panasonic Leica DG Summilux 25mm f/1.4 $539.00
Olympus M. Zuiko Digital ED 45mm f/1.8 $399.99
Total $3 667.96

Wide and walkabout zoom 14/15-100/105mm

Pentax
Pentax K-5 Digital SLR Camera $1,099.00
Sigma 10-20mm f/4-5.6 $479.00
Pentax DA 17-70mm f/4 $599.95
Total $2177

Olympus
Olympus OM-D E-M5 $999.99
Panasonic Lumix G 7-14mm f/4.0 $888.98
Panasonic 14-50mm f/2.8-3.5 $844.95
Total $2,733.81

Fast zoom systems with 24-200mm equivalent zooms

Pentax
Pentax K-5 Digital SLR Camera $1,099.00
Pentax DA 16-50mm f/2.8 $1,499.95
Pentax DA 50-135mm f/2.8 $1,599.95
Total 4,158.9

Nikon
Nikon D700 DSLR Camera $2,199.00
Nikkor 24-85mm f/2.8-4.0D IF $669.95
Nikkor 80-200mm f/2.8D $1,109.00_
Total $3,877.95

Canon
Canon EOS 5D Mark II $2,199.00
Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM $1,399.00
Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM $1,449.00
Total $5,047

Thank you
Russell
 
The Nikon "fast zoom" for the second list is actually the 24-70/2.8, BH priced at $1,886.95 -- not the cheaper zoom you listed.

That bumps the Nikon price considerably.
 
Neither is quite comparable to the DA*16-50. The 1st is a little slower, no SR or WR. The 2nd is closer spec's but appears to be quite a bit better than the DA*. Sometimes there just aren't good equivalencies.
 
klavrack said:
I'm not so sure I'd compare the K-5 to the older FF models though. I'd want to see it matched up with the D7000 and 7D with comparable lenses.
Click to expand...
Without going completely to third party lenses on the Nikon D7000, it's cheapest to get 24-200mm coverage with the D700 on Nikon. At least as far as I can tell on the B&H site and my limited knowledge of Nikon. When you go completely third party on one, then to be fair, you should go completely third party on all. It is then simply a matter of the difference between bodies, because the same lenses are probably available for all the mounts.

Canon seems to have one lens that would work out less on APS-C so I'll put that up for you.

Pentax
Pentax K-5 Digital SLR Camera $1,099.00
Pentax DA 16-50mm f/2.8 $1,499.95
Pentax DA 50-135mm f/2.8 $1,599.95
Total $4,158.9

Canon
Canon EOS 7D SLR $1,599.00
Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM $1,179.0
Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM $1,449.00
Total $4,227

Thank you
Russell
 
Russell Evans said:
Wide and walkabout zoom 14/15-100/105mm

Pentax
Pentax K-5 Digital SLR Camera $1,099.00
Sigma 10-20mm f/4-5.6 $479.00
Pentax DA 17-70mm f/4 $599.95
Total $2177

Olympus
Olympus OM-D E-M5 $999.99
Panasonic Lumix G 7-14mm f/4.0 $888.98
Panasonic 14-50mm f/2.8-3.5 $844.95
Total $2,733.81
Click to expand...
I'd rather look at it this way (the compact Oly 9-18 is far more practical than the larger and more expensive Panny 7-14):

Pentax
Pentax K-5 Digital SLR Camera $1,099
Pentax DA 17-70mm f/4 $599
Pentax DA 10-17mm f/3.5-4.5 $649
Total $2,347

Olympus
Olympus OM-D E-M5 $999
Olympus 12-50mm f/3.5-6.3 (bundled) $300
Olympus 9-18mm f/4-5.6 $599 (Adorama price)
Total $1,898

Noteably, the E-M5/12-50 provides a MUCH better video result if that matters. Also, it's a weather-sealed combo while the Pentax lenses referenced are not. Adding to that, for walking around, the Pentax kit weighs twice as much (1,545g vs 791g).
 
bkpix said:
The Nikon "fast zoom" for the second list is actually the 24-70/2.8, BH priced at $1,886.95 -- not the cheaper zoom you listed.
Click to expand...
Sure, but you can argue one stop DOF, and one stop better ISO performance for the 135 format sensor, so I think it is still valid.

Pentax
Pentax K-5 Digital SLR Camera $1,099.00
Pentax DA 16-50mm f/2.8 $1,499.95
Pentax DA 50-135mm f/2.8 $1,599.95
Total $4,158.9

Nikon
Nikon D700 DSLR Camera $2,199.00
Nikkor 24-70mm f/2.8 $1,886.95
Nikkor 80-200mm f/2.8D $1,109.00
Total $5,194.95

Canon
Canon EOS 5D Mark II $2,199.00
Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM $1,399.00
Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM $1,449.00
Total $5,047

Thank you
Russell
 
I think the conclusion is that dSLR is an expensive to own now.... the price to get into it is indeed high. ^^

Lee
 
Just to confuse things further:

Nikon D7000--$1199
AF-S 17-55/2.8--$1424

SIGMA 50-150/2.8--$1099 (it would be nice to see that offered in a Pentax mount)

Seems to me that's the closest to the K-5, DA* zoom package. There are no Nikkor fast zooms in a range close to the Pentax 50-135. Going to the 70-200/2.8 range opens up a number of options, including very expensive Canikons and moderate Sigma and Tamrons.

I think the bottom line is that if someone wants fast zooms by the camera brand, Pentax is out of the running at the new DA* prices. However, if one wants to consider 3rd party lenses, primes or mid-level zooms (e.g.-55-300), the K-5 is still competitive with the Canikon asp-c models at the new prices. But again, I doubt that they'll keep the DA* zooms at MSRP, particularly with the perceived sdm issues.

I thought very hard about switching to the D7000 last summer before getting my K-5. Besides being too lazy to get rid of my Pentax lenses and too in love with my Vivitar 105 macro to give it up, I just couldn't see a D7000 package that fit my needs as well as the K-5.
 
Oh the glories of bean counters! The world for some is about the beans, then time passes the beans don't matter any more, because we all fall down, down around the mulberry bush.

I would just keep the old K200d and if I needed a big badass camera with monster zoom I'd put a grip on the K5 and get a 24-70 2.8 sigma.. Be a nice setup in the range I use most. Then for the long end the DA* 300 F4. I'd be happy camper if big and heavy highperformance lenses were my style. Only the ain't.

DA 15,21,35,75 ltd's DFA 100 2.8 WR, K200 F4 and DA*300.

That would do me fine, maybe the K3 or whatever it's called in a year and half..

Lot's of posiiblities with pentax, without the 16-50 or the 50-135, both good lens that will be available at reasonable prices one way or another..

Brent

--
Reflections, understandings, discoveries and intimations..
 
I meant to use the faster Sigma 10-20mm f3.5 as its price of $649.00 is close to the DA 12-24mm f4 price of $699.00, so that people that wanted all first party, or those that wanted closer focal lengths, or even those that wanted non variable apertures, would be covered. This plays into my reason for picking the Panasonic Lumix G 7-14mm f/4.0 as well. Sorry for the mix up, busy with other things as well.

Wide and walkabout zoom 14/15-100/105mm equivalency

Pentax
Pentax K-5 Digital SLR Camera $1,099.00
Sigma 10-20mm f/3.5 $649.00
Pentax DA 17-70mm f/4 $599.95
Total $2347.95

Olympus
Olympus OM-D E-M5 $999.99
Panasonic Lumix G 7-14mm f/4.0 $888.98
Panasonic 14-50mm f/2.8-3.5 $844.95
Total $2,733.81

Thank you
Russell
 
the conclusion is that right now you have to be nuts to buy anything else other than D700... was not the case in the past, but right now it is pretty clear cut

--
common sense is anything but common
 
Russell

I hope I'm not hijacking your post, nor I'm not too far from your intend of this post, but while everybody is complaining about DA*'s let me do a more "average" system:

Pentax:
K-5 ---> $1099
17-70 f/4 ---> $600
55-300 f/4~5.8 ---> $430
50 f/1.4 ---> $360
Flash 540 ---> $390
Total: $2879

Nikon:
D7000 ---> $1199
16-85 f/3.5~5.6 ---> $650
70-300 f/4.5~5.6 ---> $587
50 f/1.4 ---> $350
Flash SB700 ---> $327
Total: $3113

How many people will go Pentax to save 8%?

-+-+-+-
Farhad
 
I actually would invite everyone to post a setup they would want or have, priced out on the different systems. Doesn't matter the country or the store (as long as it is one you would actually buy from). I think it would be really interesting to see these all in one thread. I'm really interested in the EU and Japanese market. It probably will be an eye opener for everyone.

Thank you
Russell
 
I like that idea.
 
Russell Evans said:
bkpix said:
The Nikon "fast zoom" for the second list is actually the 24-70/2.8, BH priced at $1,886.95 -- not the cheaper zoom you listed.
Click to expand...
Sure, but you can argue one stop DOF, and one stop better ISO performance for the 135 format sensor, so I think it is still valid.
Click to expand...
Then you should go with 24-105f4L & 70-200f4L on the 5D to get Pentax's equivalent setup... which will bring you in the $4200 price range.
Russell Evans said:
Pentax
Pentax K-5 Digital SLR Camera $1,099.00
Pentax DA 16-50mm f/2.8 $1,499.95
Pentax DA 50-135mm f/2.8 $1,599.95
Total $4,158.9

Nikon
Nikon D700 DSLR Camera $2,199.00
Nikkor 24-70mm f/2.8 $1,886.95
Nikkor 80-200mm f/2.8D $1,109.00
Total $5,194.95

Canon
Canon EOS 5D Mark II $2,199.00
Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM $1,399.00
Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM $1,449.00
Total $5,047

Thank you
Russell
Click to expand...
 
I would go with the more expensive 35mm f1.4 setup. By the next year, the wife will think $459 is cheap and I might get away with another lens.

Pentax
Pentax K-5 Digital SLR Camera $1,099.00
Pentax DA 16-50mm f/2.8 $1,499.95
Pentax DA 50-135mm f/2.8 $1,599.95
Total $4,158.9

Nikon
Nikon D800 Digital SLR Camera $2999.95
AF-S NIKKOR 50mm f/1.4G $459.00
Total $3,458.95

Nikon
Nikon D800 Digital SLR Camera $2999.95
AF-S NIKKOR 35mm f/1.4G $1,649.95
Total $4,649.9

Thank you
Russell
 
Hello, Russell
Russell Evans said:
I would go with the more expensive 35mm f1.4 setup. By the next year, the wife will think $459 is cheap and I might get away with another lens.

Pentax
Pentax K-5 Digital SLR Camera $1,099.00
Pentax DA 16-50mm f/2.8 $1,499.95
Pentax DA 50-135mm f/2.8 $1,599.95
Total $4,158.9

Nikon
Nikon D800 Digital SLR Camera $2999.95
AF-S NIKKOR 50mm f/1.4G $459.00
Total $3,458.95

Nikon
Nikon D800 Digital SLR Camera $2999.95
AF-S NIKKOR 35mm f/1.4G $1,649.95
Total $4,649.9
Click to expand...
Could you please compare the price of a K-5 and the whole Pentax lens range with that of a D800, body-only? (a pinhole being easy to make, from the body cap).
I'm curious which is cheaper.

Thank you,
Alex
 
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