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No screw drive in the A37... Sony does a nikon

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  • lighter body
  • smaller body
  • easier and cheaper to manufacture
  • no need for backward compatibility so simpler to design
  • reduce mechanical stuff that Sony doesn't like -- electronics are better
  • reduce sales of used screw-drive Minolta, KM, Sony, Sigma, Tamron, Tokina, etc. lenses and increase sales of new Sony lenses with motors
  • Sony makes more money
All are good things. Next step is move it up the line.
 
Wise decision - do we want to live in the stone age or do we want progress...

This is a modern solution leaving old and unfunctional technology behind. Hooray :-) !
 
mike_2008 said:
phiri said:
FreeRadical009 said:
I really, really, really, really, really hope Sony is not that stupid to remove the screw drive off the entry level cameras. While it's true that most users of that kind of cameras never go beyond the kit lens or lenses (like the DT 55-200mm or 75-300mm), it would severely limit the options of lenses they can mount and use with AF.

It's also true that users of that kind of cameras rarely bother with MF, so if they mount a Minolta lens and they got to focus it by hand, they won't like the idea.

Sony shouldn't be so arrogant to think that entry level users would only mount Sony lenses, it's easier to find a cheap Minolta than a cheap Sony.

If I ever need a back up body in an emergency and I can only find an A37, that means I'm royally screwed, since so far, all my lenses are screw driven.

If Nikon hadn't removed the motor from their entry level models, a lot of users could actually use their Nikon legacy lenses, which sometimes are found for cheap rather than the new and expensive ones. I know three dudes that haven't bothered getting another lens for their Nikons because they can't afford the new models and the old ones they could afford, but none of them want to deal with the MF at weddings.

Sony, seriously, if you're going to copy Nikon, let it be the good things: image processing, NR, JPEG output, in camera options, copyright coding in the EXIF, that kind of stuff.

If you're just going to be "Nikon lite", I might as well just go to Nikon for crying out loud.
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on this one I will back Sony. I dont think it will hurt the company in any way. These kind of sentiments were there when Nikon introduced the D40 which could only AF with AF-S lensaes. I dont think it has hurt Nikon in any way. I dont think there is any advantage in putting a feature in a camera when most users will only use the kit lens or superzoom if they upgrade
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LOL, if nikon does it then it must be OK, eh phiri? BTW the sony 18-250 superzoom is a screw-driven lens, so this will not work. Perhaps sony are planning an imminent replacement.

--
IQ is not judged exclusively by high iso noise performance
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No, that is not what imean. But you have to recognize that for the entry level cameras, sonys are a bit more pricey and that maybe one of the reasons. So any measure that can be taken, without affecting image quality in order to reduce the price, then it has to be done. I bought my first dslr because it was the cheapest. Of course i was only debating between two brands.
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/39182144@N03/
 
FreeRadical009 said:
The logical next step for most new users when they want to upgrade their lens, is to improve reach, so:

DT 18-200mm = screw driven

DT 18-250mm = screw driven

Sony 75-300mm = screw driven

Tamron 18-200mm = screw driven

They may jump for the Tamron 18-270mm, which I assume would let them get away with it, since it uses a built it motor, but that's 1 out of 5 options I've listed.

While I'm not saying this scenario and that list are the axiomatic constant, it usually is the most popular list people look at. I don't recall right now if Sigma's options in that range have HSM or if they screw driven.

Sony's lens line up is not as vast as we all would like, some Minolta lenses cover the holes in the line up, but removing the ability to use them would severely limit the options available for them to use properly. One thing I've always liked of Sony cameras is that they all are 100% backward compatible with the lenses released ever since 1985. Screw driven, xi lenses, SSM, SAM are all supported by any camera, from the A900 to the A100, even a cheap A230 can use all those lenses.

There are users out there who buy cheap bodies but spend good amounts of money on lenses, and some of those are still screw driven, so unless Sony plans to upgrade all the line up amazingly fast to SAM or SSM, they are better off letting things as they are.

On the other hand, wasn't the A35 released just recently? Why would Sony introduce its replacement already? I know that the entry level gets refreshed sooner than the top level, but wouldn't this be... I don't know, too soon?
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My fault. I did not realize that Sony has such few internal focussing lenses. I just took it for granted that that is what sony has been producing since it took over Minolta
--
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yanisha said:
  • lighter body
  • smaller body
  • easier and cheaper to manufacture
  • no need for backward compatibility so simpler to design
  • reduce mechanical stuff that Sony doesn't like -- electronics are better
  • reduce sales of used screw-drive Minolta, KM, Sony, Sigma, Tamron, Tokina, etc. lenses and increase sales of new Sony lenses with motors
  • Sony makes more money
All are good things. Next step is move it up the line.
Click to expand...
That is certainly one way of seeing the world.

I'm just glad we don't all see it that way...

Regards,
Mike
--
Wait and see...
 
yanisha said:
  • lighter body
  • smaller body
  • easier and cheaper to manufacture
  • no need for backward compatibility so simpler to design
  • reduce mechanical stuff that Sony doesn't like -- electronics are better
  • reduce sales of used screw-drive Minolta, KM, Sony, Sigma, Tamron, Tokina, etc. lenses and increase sales of new Sony lenses with motors
  • Sony makes more money
All are good things. Next step is move it up the line.
Click to expand...
Yes, all the same reasons why nikon did it. At the low end price is more important than backwards compatibility, that's for sure. I wouldn't like to see this spreading up the range too quickly though.

--
IQ is not judged exclusively by high iso noise performance
 
Trollmann said:
Wise decision - do we want to live in the stone age or do we want progress...

This is a modern solution leaving old and unfunctional technology behind. Hooray :-) !
Click to expand...
the possible problem being that though they may be old, there is absolutely nothing unfunctional about, for instance, my km 100 2.8 macro, my minolta 28-70G, my minolta 200, 300 and 600 etc etc etc - my list of perfectly functionable screw-drive lenses goes on and on

i have no doubt that such comments will result in cries of "welcome to the party" from the ovf die-hards - who feel that they are being unfairly left behind by sony. that should be fun
--
i know what i know, which is a fraction of what i don't
 
After realizing that the older style lenses were lousy for video, I dumped my 18-250 and am hanging on to my 50 1.4 because it's such a great portrait lens (and complements my 85 2.8 SAM, which is okay for video). Does this mean the 50 1.4 (Sony) won't work on the A37, if the rumor is true?

However, I have an A33, which is used when more portability is needed, and was thinking about moving to the A37. Don't know; I still have a Minolta 50 1.7 which I am attached to. Kinda regret not picking up an A35 I saw for $399...reason being that it didn't have the articulated LCD. A57 is too big, and too similar to my A77.

However, I have to echo a couple of others in that I do understand why, if true, Sony has made this decision.
 
I don't think that Sony will eliminate the screw drive. Rumor only. Can't imagine Sony stooping down to Nikon's level!
--

Sony SLT-A77 / Rokinon 8mm / Sigma 10-20 f4.0-5.6 / Sigma 18-250 f3.5-6.3 / Sigma 50-500 f4.5-6.3 OS / Minolta 70-210 f4.0 / Minolta 50 f1.7 / Kenko MC4 AF 1.4 / Sony HVL- F56AM flash Karl Scharf
 
May be its not a A3x series ,but a new entry level A2x SLT like the OVF A2xx models.
 
Karl Scharf said:
I don't think that Sony will eliminate the screw drive. Rumor only. Can't imagine Sony stooping down to Nikon's level!
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....
Actually the Sonyalpharumors rumor says:

“The A37 is not compatible with Minolta lenses, only with SAM and SSM lenses!“ ,

It says nothing about eliminating the screw drive ! It could be something electronic...

Anyway, it's a rumor and I hope Sony doesn't do that, there are still many great Minolta lenses out there at low costs, perfect for newbies.

... Lucas

--
Always having fun with photography ...

http://www.lucaspix.smugmug.com/

 
One of the main selling points for me buying an entry level Sony DSLR as opposed to the Nikon or Cannon was the idea of getting older Minolta lenses for cheap, and the in body stabilization...

After getting a few not so cheap Minolta and Tamron lenses, I find I'm "invested" in this "system". And I upgraded to an A77 as soon as they came out.

When I see Sony's for sale locally on craigslist, at least 50% have a Minolta lens. Some with only a Minolta lens.

And, they'd be introducing confusion in the marketing. Buying a new camera, I did some** research, but was honestly a bit confused about what would and wouldn't work on what cameras. I had an old Nikkor 35mm and went into the camera store and asked the gentleman there about reusing it's lenses, and got a whole story full of if's, and's and but's with a AI, AIS, etc, and some model numbers I've long since forgotten.....

And, aren't they still make brand new screw drive lenses? do they even have a 200+ mm SAM lens? (I doubt many persons are gonna buy a new A37 to match up with a 300mm G prime SSM). They don't really even have a basic range of lenses to support a move like this.
 
Some of us have been expecting this to happen - if not immediately, then soon. It's inevitable.
 
Still don't you think they need a little more distance between the lowest entry models and the midrange? if they are going to have a 2, 3, 5, 7 and 9 series cameras (a-la Minolta) then is it really so bad that the bottom end not have a focus motors? we have a rash of users here that are buying SLR's only to stick a superzoom on them permanently. this gives them a cheaper option and they still retain the bragging rights that they have a ILC camera in front of their friends.

If one of those users is savy enough to realize the potential then they will spend the extra dosh on what they need
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cplunk said:
And, aren't they still make brand new screw drive lenses? do they even have a 200+ mm SAM lens? (I doubt many persons are gonna buy a new A37 to match up with a 300mm G prime SSM). They don't really even have a basic range of lenses to support a move like this.
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Mmm I went to http://www.dyxum.com/lenses and the advanced search to search for AF in-lens drive lenses and it showed me 43 lenses of which most are in production. Fair enough some HSM are probably not finding their way to beginner cameras. Anyway you might be surprised but Sony is a company and hence needs to make profit by selling. Sony does not make money out of second hand lens sales so it could not care less about us. Yeah screw them I think, although at the same time they need to keep the old-timers happy to but they won't be buying A37s (in general).

--
http://frenske.zenfolio.com
 
It seems like they've been working towards it.

It's more reasonable with SAM versions of 18-55/55-200 plus 35/50/85mm primes. Those are the lenses most likely to be purchased by buyers of entry level cameras.

The big question will be how far up the line they go with it. I wonder if the A57 move to the bigger A65 style body is part of it; small body w/o AF motor, larger body with AF motor. They can't go too far up the line because of the number of important current lenses that lack SAM/SSM (never mind the legacy user base). For now, it would seem unreasonable to go beyond the 3x series, but who knows if it will impact the 5x series in the future.
  • Dennis
--
Gallery at http://kingofthebeasts.smugmug.com
 
yanisha said:
  • lighter body
  • smaller body
  • easier and cheaper to manufacture
  • no need for backward compatibility so simpler to design
  • reduce mechanical stuff that Sony doesn't like -- electronics are better
  • reduce sales of used screw-drive Minolta, KM, Sony, Sigma, Tamron, Tokina, etc. lenses and increase sales of new Sony lenses with motors
  • Sony makes more money
All are good things. Next step is move it up the line.
Click to expand...
Well if you are going to be wrong you may as well jump in with both feat.

I fail to see how a camera body that won't work with the majority of lenses on offer is a good idea. Sony do not have enough lenses to in the line up to ditch screw drive as you suggest and lenses like the 35 F1.4 would likely disappear forever and CZ would have to re-engineer the 16-80, 85 and 135.

They would need new fisheye, 20mm & 28mm lenses. The 16-105, 18-250, 75-300, 50 and 100 macros and many other lenses would become obsolete.

So if Sony wants to encourage doubt in the long term viability of people lens collections then "moving it up the line" is the thing to do.
 
Frenske said:
cplunk said:
And, aren't they still make brand new screw drive lenses? do they even have a 200+ mm SAM lens? (I doubt many persons are gonna buy a new A37 to match up with a 300mm G prime SSM). They don't really even have a basic range of lenses to support a move like this.
Click to expand...
Mmm I went to http://www.dyxum.com/lenses and the advanced search to search for AF in-lens drive lenses and it showed me 43 lenses of which most are in production. Fair enough some HSM are probably not finding their way to beginner cameras. Anyway you might be surprised but Sony is a company and hence needs to make profit by selling. Sony does not make money out of second hand lens sales so it could not care less about us. Yeah screw them I think, although at the same time they need to keep the old-timers happy to but they won't be buying A37s (in general).

--
http://frenske.zenfolio.com
Click to expand...
And I can't imagine why they would be too concerned about Sigma's sales.

Doing search on Dyxum, Sony has 7 zooms with SAM or SSM, none of them super zooms. Anything over 200mm is "G SSM", and without those, there are 4 zooms and 3 primes. Tamron has 2, a 70-300 and 18-270, which would make up for Sony. And Zeiss shows 3, but were's back on the "G SSM" story of who's going to buy those with an entry level camera (and another 3 Zeiss lenses are listed with in body focus).

Maybe some people would buy it with this limited selection, but I'm not sure it'll be enough to make it a success. If they were going to mount a superzoom and call it good, none of the Sony superzooms appear to have SAM or SSM, only Tamron and Sigma sell those. It just wouldn't make sense unless they at least put a SAM motor in the 18-250.
 
Frenske said:
Sony does not make money out of second hand lens sales so it could not care less about us. >
Click to expand...
no, but - to labour the point - they presumably will hope to make money out of new advanced bodies. a great many existing users that have extensive collections of both old and new minolta/sony glass will be interested in buying those new bodies. they'll be much less inclined to splash the cash if they find that their lenses suddenly won't auto-focus any more. manual focus isn't for everyone

like others, i expect that the screw-drive, like the ovf, will eventually become extinct, but it is unlikely to happen wholesale overnight, certainly not until there is a full range of ssm/sam lenses without any gaps. at worst, sony may have given everyone a heads-up for the future, and folks should perhaps think twice about spending their $$$'s on that second-hand 600 f4. at best, of course, it's nothing but idle rumour
--
i know what i know, which is a fraction of what i don't
 
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