Any low-light hope for the E-20 shooting in clubs?...

I have the E-20 and the Olympus flash. I do fashion photography and I have recently started shooting in clubs. Last night on New Year's I shot at an event called Barry's Ball (some pics on my website below) and was having a hard time focusing. There was minimal light and even though I had the flash, I could not lock in. The viewfinder and LCD were pretty dim. I ended up setting the focus to manual wide and shooting crowd shots. I would have preferred close-ups but could not do it.

So...any solutions? I know the E-20 is not great in low-light but I wonder if there is some sort of light attachment that is available. One that ideally would work with the flash and provide some fill light, just enough so I could get focus. I hate to get a whole new camera just for club shooting...however...what IS a good digital camera for shooting something like this? Maybe 2-4 megapixels. A unit that is perfect for this type of nighttime club photography.

Any suggestions would be great. Obviously I would like to use the E-20, but other alternatives are good to know.

Thanks!

--
http://www.franklinmcmahon.com/

Frank,

I have to plead partial ignorance here....I thought I had heard something about the focus assist on the FL-40 with certain Oly cameras---just not the E-series. Here is a thread where it is discussed:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1008&message=3890979

I did a quick search for "focus assist FL-40" on the Olympus Talk forum and it has been discussed several times. If it will work with some of the older cameras, you should be able to get one pretty cheap, as some of them have been discontinued.

Hope this helps,

Bill Goosie

Frank McMahon said:

I have the E-20 and the Olympus flash. I do fashion photography and
I have recently started shooting in clubs. Last night on New Year's
I shot at an event called Barry's Ball (some pics on my website
below) and was having a hard time focusing. There was minimal light
and even though I had the flash, I could not lock in. The
viewfinder and LCD were pretty dim. I ended up setting the focus to
manual wide and shooting crowd shots. I would have preferred
close-ups but could not do it.

So...any solutions? I know the E-20 is not great in low-light but I
wonder if there is some sort of light attachment that is available.
One that ideally would work with the flash and provide some fill
light, just enough so I could get focus. I hate to get a whole new
camera just for club shooting...however...what IS a good digital
camera for shooting something like this? Maybe 2-4 megapixels. A
unit that is perfect for this type of nighttime club photography.

Any suggestions would be great. Obviously I would like to use the
E-20, but other alternatives are good to know.

Thanks!

--
http://www.franklinmcmahon.com/

Click to expand...

Bill Goosie said:

Frank,

I have to plead partial ignorance here....I thought I had heard
something about the focus assist on the FL-40 with certain Oly
cameras---just not the E-series. Here is a thread where it is
discussed:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1008&message=3890979

I did a quick search for "focus assist FL-40" on the Olympus Talk

Click to expand...

Bill,

Thanks for the link..but what should I be looking for in this thread? I didn't see a mention of the problem I am having. Also...what is "focus assist FL-40"? Is it a device? Light? Feature? Technique?

Thanks for any help!

Frank

Frank,

Like I said, most of what I remember is pretty suspect. With that in mind, it seems that the FL-40 has the capability of providing a focus assist beam that will enable you to shoot in near dark conditions using a compatible camera (C-5050 for example). The original poster shot a group of photos using it that way, and provided a link to it on Pbase. Check out the photos he took at ISO 400 and the accompanying notes on his site. Further down in the thread, he alludes to using the focus assist:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1008&message=3893348

Here is another post, but once again it lacks specifics about how the flash actually provides the light:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1008&message=4037910

And one more:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1008&message=3855754

In your first post you asked about some type of fill light to enable focusing. If the FL-40 provides focus assist with one of the less expensive cameras, then you should be able to get the shots you want in the fast paced club environment.

There may be other cameras besides Olympus that work well in low-light, fast paced environments. If, so, you wouldn't have the TTL with the FL-40. That's why I offered this suggestion--you have full TTL compatibility and focus assist without changing flash units.

As I said before, unfortunately I don't have first hand knowledge of how it works--I have only seen it discussed. Hopefully someone with more experience will jump in.....

Hope that helps,

Bill Goosie

Frank McMahon said:

Bill Goosie said:

Frank,

I have to plead partial ignorance here....I thought I had heard
something about the focus assist on the FL-40 with certain Oly
cameras---just not the E-series. Here is a thread where it is
discussed:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1008&message=3890979

I did a quick search for "focus assist FL-40" on the Olympus Talk

Click to expand...

Bill,

Thanks for the link..but what should I be looking for in this
thread? I didn't see a mention of the problem I am having.
Also...what is "focus assist FL-40"? Is it a device? Light?
Feature? Technique?

Thanks for any help!

Frank

Click to expand...

Only one problem. The E series disables the FL-40s focus assist beam.

Bill Goosie said:

Frank,

Like I said, most of what I remember is pretty suspect. With that
in mind, it seems that the FL-40 has the capability of providing a
focus assist beam that will enable you to shoot in near dark
conditions using a compatible camera (C-5050 for example). --

Click to expand...

John

John,

Exactly....that's why I suggested something along the lines of a C-3040 or another Oly camera that would work with the FL-40......

John Burns said:

Bill Goosie said:

Frank,

Like I said, most of what I remember is pretty suspect. With that
in mind, it seems that the FL-40 has the capability of providing a
focus assist beam that will enable you to shoot in near dark
conditions using a compatible camera (C-5050 for example). --

Click to expand...

John

Click to expand...

Bill Goosie said:

Exactly....that's why I suggested something along the lines of a
C-3040 or another Oly camera that would work with the FL-40......

John Burns said:

Bill Goosie said:

Frank,

Like I said, most of what I remember is pretty suspect. With that
in mind, it seems that the FL-40 has the capability of providing a
focus assist beam that will enable you to shoot in near dark
conditions using a compatible camera (C-5050 for example). --

Click to expand...

John

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Nobody tried to find a workaround for this? There should be a way to activate the assist light with an Exx.
Theoretically.....
--
E10-WCON08B-TCON14B-LiPO grip-FL40.
Canon EOS D30-speedlite 420EX-Grip-some lenses

It's not that the Exx disables the FL-40's (and other flashes) IR assist, it doesn't enable it. The flash unit will only enable the IR assist when the camera requests it (while it's focusing), but the Exx cameras don't request it because they have their own IR assist.

rob van den broek said:

Bill Goosie said:

Exactly....that's why I suggested something along the lines of a
C-3040 or another Oly camera that would work with the FL-40......

John Burns said:

Bill Goosie said:

Frank,

Like I said, most of what I remember is pretty suspect. With that
in mind, it seems that the FL-40 has the capability of providing a
focus assist beam that will enable you to shoot in near dark
conditions using a compatible camera (C-5050 for example). --

Click to expand...

John

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Nobody tried to find a workaround for this? There should be a way
to activate the assist light with an Exx.
Theoretically.....
--
E10-WCON08B-TCON14B-LiPO grip-FL40.
Canon EOS D30-speedlite 420EX-Grip-some lenses

Click to expand...

--
dgrogers

http://www.pbase.com/drog

John Burns said:

Only one problem. The E series disables the FL-40s focus assist beam.

Click to expand...

Hmmm. Is there a work around? And is this beam actual light? I'd love to use my exisiting setup and not have to buy another Olympus camera.

--
http://www.franklinmcmahon.com/

Well now I am looking at the 5050 since I can use my flash. Does anyone have one? How does it photograph is very low light? Can you focus? How is the LCD? Is it bright and does it look like what you are looking at (as opposed to the E-10/20's LCD which looks very black in dim light).

Any help would be great. Also...does using the external FL-40 with the 5050 shine a light out you can see to help focus. I am trying to figure out what the 5050+flash does that the E-20+flash does not in low light situations.

Thanks!

Frank

I would think it would be nice if there was a software fix for this but it might not even be something that works with the E-10 system or worse, confuses it... Hence it's disabled.

Frank McMahon said:

John Burns said:

Only one problem. The E series disables the FL-40s focus assist beam.

Click to expand...

Hmmm. Is there a work around? And is this beam actual light? I'd
love to use my exisiting setup and not have to buy another Olympus
camera.

--
http://www.franklinmcmahon.com/

Click to expand...

Frank,

There are a lot of threads in the Oly Talk Forum about the 5050. I own a C-700, which doesn't have IR assist, and hooked it up to my FL-40 (just for you).

It emits a single red beam that lasts a few seconds when you half-press the shutter button. You have to make sure that the flash is aimed at the center of your focus target. If you are centered, it will enable the camera to focus on that spot.

I took a picture that way in complete darkness at about 12 feet---and it worked!

Here is one review of the C-5050:

http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/olympus/c5050z-review/index.html

So far, they have all been favorable. I saw one at Circuit City, and it looks to be very well constructed. I am debating between a C-5050 and an E-20 as an additional camera. Only time will tell how that comes out.

Bill Goosie

Frank McMahon said:

Well now I am looking at the 5050 since I can use my flash. Does
anyone have one? How does it photograph is very low light? Can you
focus? How is the LCD? Is it bright and does it look like what you
are looking at (as opposed to the E-10/20's LCD which looks very
black in dim light).

Any help would be great. Also...does using the external FL-40 with
the 5050 shine a light out you can see to help focus. I am trying
to figure out what the 5050+flash does that the E-20+flash does not
in low light situations.

Thanks!

Frank

Click to expand...

Guvner.. said:

I would think it would be nice if there was a software fix for this
but it might not even be something that works with the E-10 system
or worse, confuses it... Hence it's disabled.

Click to expand...

I fought this battle with my previous camera/flash combination -- the Canon Pro90 and 420EX flash. Short version -- it ain't gonna happen. The E20 has no internal focus assist lamp therefore the circuitry isn't in the camera to tell it when to turn the assist on. If the signal isn't there in the first place, there is nothing in the camera to activate it on the FL40.

The only problem with my theory however is the report that it works when the FL40 is hooked up to the C700, which also lacks its own AF assist light. But the short answer is, it ain't gonna happen with the E20.

--
Todd Walker
Olympus E20, Olympus C3020Z
http://twalker.d2g.com

Frank

Have you thought of using a laser pointer, mounted maybe to the side of the cam? You can pretend that it's a laser sight like they have on high-tech rifles, allowing you better aim. That might work a bit like the Sony Hologram Assist, if you can get it into that square in the middle of the viewfinder.

It might take a bit of work (you may need a flexible arm, or need to mount it very close and parallel to the lens), but it may work. Or a small maglite might do the trick.

-SS

hello,
I am not a pro, but here's what I do.

if possible, i use my small maglite always being on my keyring, to light the target, manual focus, then shoot. this works only if you have time for it. in a night club this is not applicable.

you mentioned the biggest problem is with the close-ups. if the target is not more than 5 meters away (15feet, I think), in most cases the infrared autofocus should work. But it's slow. I mean, when you half-press the shutter, sometimes you have to wait for about 200-500 milliseconds for the autofocus. during this time, your target must be in the focus circle in the middle of the viewfinder, plus the target distance must remain constant. otherwise you lose focus.

you can try with manual focus, but you need a LOT of practise in low light environment.

there's another trick, which involves working with the AEL button: point your camera at the wall (that won't move anywhere), for example 3 meters away, and half-press the shutter button. then compose your picture, but make sure the distance is the same as you measured from the wall (in this example 3 meters). when you ready, press AEL once, then shoot. (AEL is required because you have already set the focus with the help of the wall, but you need to do a new exposure metering on the target.)

if you are happy with 3 meters, then switch to manual focus and don't touch the focus ring. in this case the camera remains focused at 3 meters, and you don't need to do the hocuspocus with the shutter button and AEL button.

Another trick: turn on the LCD, and press the Info button so that the bottom of the LCD shows the target distance. Set your aperture to 4 to 11 (preferably around 5.6). set your target distance by manual focus and shoot. (this i call "blind" focus.)

i have an E-10 and i can say that the infrared autofocus does a great job when your target is not moving.

hope this helps.